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If my Dreadknight is assaulted by a squad whose sergeant is wielding a power fist, and I declare a challenge to make sure my Dreadknight's attacks are allocated to the sergeant first, can the rest of his unit attack my Dreadknight on that first turn of the challenge, or do they have to wait until the second round to attack him? The rules seem ambiguous to me.

They attack like normal, allocating Wounds to the Dreadknight as it is the closest Model in Base to Base contact to their Unit.
In 6th Edition there where a few Rule interactions which ensured that Models in a Challenge never could be allocated Wounds from models outside of the Challenge, but they are no longer present in 7th.

I dunno JinxDragon. The rulebook states:

"Whilst the challenge is ongoing, other models locked in the combat can only allocate Wounds to the models involved in the challenge after all other enemy models that are locked in that combat (if any) have been removed as casualties, even if the models fighting in the challenge are the closest models."

In order to allocate Wounds one must have been able to make wounds at first. Note that this rule clearly does not include anything about To Hit or attack and that the Assault Phase bit has Allocating Wounds after hits are made.

Well First of all your dreadnought cannot issue or be issued a challenge unless it is a characte. But to answer your question no they will not be able to attack your dreadnought.

Yes, allocating is after you have rolled to hit etc. I am in base with a unit, I can attack it - nothing in the challenge rules prevents this, so the general allowance to attack remains

Oh, and where are you seeing that the dreadknight is a character?

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Yes, allocating is after you have rolled to hit etc. I am in base with a unit, I can attack it - nothing in the challenge rules prevents this, so the general allowance to attack remains.

Well I'll be damned. You know I read over that part completely expecting it to be pretty much the same but that is a welcome change.

I am a little confused when you state:
In order to allocate Wounds one must have been able to make wounds at first.

Wounds are generated during the To Wound step in the sequence, which occurs before we get to the instructions telling us how to Allocate said Wounds. There is no permission to go back a step in the sequence in order to undo the Step completely, even if there was an issue with the final resolution, so the Wounds will be generated regardless and they must be Allocated. This is also why there are numerous Rules which exist to do nothing more then 'empty the Wound pool' in situations where there are no longer valid Models to Allocate a Wound to.

In any case, notice how it has that (if any) there.
If there are no other Models in the combat, the does this clause even trigger?


Sorry for the slow response time, work and all that.

JinxDragon wrote:
I am a little confused when you state:
In order to allocate Wounds one must have been able to make wounds at first.

Wounds are generated during the To Wound step in the sequence, which occurs before we get to the instructions telling us how to Allocate said Wounds. There is no permission to go back a step in the sequence in order to undo the Step completely, even if there was an issue with the final resolution, so the Wounds will be generated regardless and they must be Allocated. This is also why there are numerous Rules which exist to do nothing more then 'empty the Wound pool' in situations where there are no longer valid Models to Allocate a Wound to.

In any case, notice how it has that (if any) there.
If there are no other Models in the combat, the does this clause even trigger?


Sorry for the slow response time, work and all that.

No you get me wrong. In the previous edition the rules of challenges specifically said that the two challengers were in combat with just the two of them. This would result in the "there can be no wound allocation, since no wounds can be generated from attacking the challenger". This edition changed those rules by removing the above rule and thus does not prevent outsiders attacking the challenges once all other combatants have been slain. Thus, I agree with nosferatu1001 that you can attack lone challengers with a squad.

Hence the sorry for the slow response, your conversation with nosferatu1001 was unseen when I typed that up.

I'm not sure we're all on the same page. My question was in regards to the following rules:

"Whilst the challenge is ongoing, other models locked in the combat can only allocate Wounds to the models involved in the challenge after all other enemy models that are locked in that combat (if any) have been removed as casualties, even if the models fighting in a challenge are the closest models" (CR103)

The reference to the Dreadknight (not Dreadnought) was an attempt at an illustration for the question. 6th Edition made it a Character, and I assumed it still was one in 7th, though I haven't found the rule yet.

To illustrate it another way. If I had Draigo attached to a squad of Purifiers and assaulted a lone character wielding an AP3 weapon, and I declared a challenge with Draigo to absorb all the opponents attacks, would the Purifiers be allowed to attack that lone character in the first round of combat because there are no opposing forces outside the challenge in that close combat?

I think so, but I was hoping that if there were a rule preventing this, that someone would post the page number so I would know for my next game.

Yes, if there is nobody else for them to attack, they will attack the lone character.

All characters who are 'engaged' with the opponent get to make attacks. 'Engaged' is defined as in base to base, or within 2" of a model that is in base to base. Nothing about challenges changes this fact. Therefor all models will get to attack, and since there are no models outside the challenge to soak up wounds first, all the successful wounds from those attacks will be allocated to the lone challenging character.

Hate to bring back something that is kinda old. But I have a question concerning challenges aswell....

the scenerio is this:

A fight consists of a Hive Tyrant locked in a challenge with a Ork Warboss, while 6 termagaunts are also in the same fight, fighting with 8 Warbikers.

When the Warbikers swing off, they inflict 11 wounds to the Termagaunts, killing all 6 and leaving 5 wounds in the wound pool.

Does the Hive Tyrant then take these wounds? even though they were inflicted swiging away on toughness 3 models and not toughness 6?

Correct,
The Rule cares not which Toughness the Wounds where tested against, any remaining Wounds are Allocated to the only Model left in combat.

that makes me sad, think they need to fix this.

actually, in the above situation the wounds would not go to the tyrant. Tyrants are not IC's and are thus not attatched to the gaunts. They are a seperate unit completely, and thus attacks and wounds allocated to them cannot carry over to the tyrant.

Eihnlazer,
Good catch, thought it was one of those 'joined at the start of the game' things that the Nid's do.