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So, I have been thinking of a chaosy army for some time now, And lately I'v been thinking about Night Lords or Word Bearers, And upon seeing the Horus Heresy Word Bearers models I just wanna say, Awesome.. So now I want to ask, Is the horus heresy army list that you can get from Forge World any good? I saw you can buy a package with 2 books that contains the entire legion army list and the legion specific units. Do the Horus Heresy lists work well against regular 40k armies without being too over powerd or under powerd? (I know they are designed for 30k play, But I belive me friends will allow me to play them anyway. We are pretty open and accepting)

30K =/= 40K.

There are two Legion books- one is the Legones Astartes Crusade Army List which has the basic Legion army list in it. The other is the Isstavan Campaign Legions that has all the rules for each specific legion. You will need BOTH books to run a Night Lords list. Or, you can play a "Crusade Legion" and just use the base Legion book, but you lose out on all the specific stuff for your Legion.

In a 30K Legion List, there is no And They Shall Know No Fear (it didn't exist yet). It's replaced with the "Legion Astartes" rule (the unit may always attempt to regroup). Fearless is very, very rare and only a few units/models have stubborn. Close combat is especially deadly if you lose- you can lose the entire squad to a sweeping advance. Legion Tactical Squads do not get special weapons- that's another squad usually called a Legion Tactical Support Squad. Basically, you want missile launchers? You take a Legion Tactical Support Squad or Legion Heavy Support Squad.

Your squads will be big- the Legion Tac Squad base size is 10 models, and they can take 10 more for 20 total. You might want 20 in a squad considering you have LD 9 and will have to take leadership checks all the time. You're gonna want to take a Legion vexilla for every squad- allows rerolls for failed morale checks.

Some wargear options are very, very limited. P-fists, Claws, Thunderhammers, power weapons, are all rare and very pricy for each unit, unless you get into the Isstavan Legion lists. The specific Legion lists (like the Sons of Horus, Alpha Legion, Salamanders, Iron Fists, etc.) all have unique wargear, Legion rules, and a couple unique units. You get access to stuff that isn't seen in 40K (Cataphract Terminator Armor, Volkite weaponry, Sicarian Battle Tanks, Contemptor Dreads, Lightning and Avenger fighters, the Spartan and Phobius Land Raiders), so that is pretty cool. The Lords of War choices are simply... well, they would break a normal game of 40K. Lords of War are things like the Fellblade/FellGlaive super heavy tanks, Warhound Titans, and the Primarchs. If there is a Primarch on the table and you don't have yours, you might as well reach across the table and shake your opponents hand "Good game! Want to play again?".

A game of 30K Legion vs. Legion is a fantastic, fun game and is everything I always wanted out of 40K. Now, 30K vs. 40K? You will either win by such a large margin that your opponents will never play you again, or you will lose so badly you will want to quit playing. There really doesn't seem to be any middle ground. If you planned out a 30K vs. 40K game before hand, limited some rules (like no Rad grenades or Vortex grenades, no Lords of War) and picked a scenario to play, you can make it work. Showing up to the FLGS for a pick up game? That could be a mistake. What I mean by that is something like Volkite weapons. They are S5-6/Ap4 weapons with 2-4 shots depending on the type. They have a special rule called Deflagrate- for each unsaved wound, they cause another hit on the squad. Those hits don't inflict more hits, but you could easily see how one Volkite weapon could potentially wipe out an entire squad on non-MEQ models. And you never see just one Volikte weapon. How about a 10 man squad of Legion Tactical Support Squad with 10 Volkite Chargers?

So consider very carefully a 30K vs. 40K match, and make sure your opponent is OK with it.

Well, I only play against friends I know IRL. And we dont realy use Lords of War in regular games. But, Reading your information on it, I'm not sure 30k vs 40k would be a very fun game, So I might just go for a normal chaos marine army instead. I'm not one that needs to win every game, But I want to have fun, And I want my friends to have fun aswell as it isent fun if one of the players arent enjoying the game.

Hmm... *tries to think of ideas for a regular 40k Word Bearers or Night Lords army instead* I'm thinking Word Bearers cus my friend I play against the most plays Ultramarines and I read somewhere that Ultramarines and Word Bearers have some sort of rivalry/hatred towards eachother.

Thanks for the information! ^_^

To correct a few bits of misinformation:
With the exception of the superheavy-mounted Volkite Carronade (which is AP2), NO Volkite weapons have AP4. They're all AP5. That is a big difference for some armies.
Also, most of the vehicles, from Sicarans, Contemptors, and Avenger fighters up to the superheavies like Fellblades and Titans, are also in 40K as well. They might have a few extra options in 30K, but the basic vehicle is still completely available within 40K.
Lords of War are, mostly, equally broken in either 30K or 40K.

You will find with the legion list that it excels against horde and MEQ armies but it struggles against Flying Circus and Serpent Spam armies. But if you want to play Legion competitively you should check with your TO because I've only ever seen 1 tournament that allowed Legion lists that wasn't a 30K-only tournament.

Well if you are only playing with friends, then what does it matter? If something is a bit weak, change it. If something is overpowered, change it.

I say play with 30K, against 40K. It's all about fun after all, and with friends, you should be able to make any concessions that you find is necessary to make it more balanced.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
To correct a few bits of misinformation:
With the exception of the superheavy-mounted Volkite Carronade (which is AP2), NO Volkite weapons have AP4. They're all AP5. That is a big difference for some armies.
Also, most of the vehicles, from Sicarans, Contemptors, and Avenger fighters up to the superheavies like Fellblades and Titans, are also in 40K as well. They might have a few extra options in 30K, but the basic vehicle is still completely available within 40K.
Lords of War are, mostly, equally broken in either 30K or 40K.

Opps. Beg pardon about the AP on Volkite. I'm not sure what I was thinking when I said AP 4.

For the "...are also in 40K as well..." you have to buy Imperial Armor 2 updated edition, and then you can only take those vehicles under certain conditions with certain army formations. To field a Titan requires you to also buy a Forge World book, then very carefully check the FAQ for Stronghold Assault and the rules for Super Heavies in the MWB (Medium White Book). While the basic vehicle might be available in 40K, you'll only ever be able to field one of them. In 30K, you can field squadrons of those vehicles (except for the Sicarian... which I really think was an oversight on FW's part, but...)

Regardless, there are some significant differences between a Legion 30K army list and a 40K army list. If you plan a 30K vs. 40K game out and talk with your opponent before hand, it could be a really fun and interesting game. If you just show up at the FLGS for a pickup game... things could go bad very quickly for you or your opponent.

30K is awesome, and I wish more people could/would play it (price being a significant barrier to playing...).

To correct other parts of misinformation

Power weapons are very cheap and very common, every unit can get a sarge with pw for 10pts, almost every unit can upgrade sarges for 10pts to have articifer armour aswell.

If they have a primarch and you don't, don't worry about it too much, they will kill a unit in cc quite easily but 30k has an abundance of tools for taking out primarchs with a couple of exceptions.

The best way to think of 30k marines is like eldar, each unit specialises in killing something, tacs kill hordes, dev squads all have a heavy weapon and so will specialise in killing whatever you have equipped them to, there are a couple of general purpose units but they are either elite or expensive.

Take a look at my run down of all the legion units to get a better idea of what's what.

 Tamwulf wrote:
For the "...are also in 40K as well..." you have to buy Imperial Armor 2 updated edition, and then you can only take those vehicles under certain conditions with certain army formations. To field a Titan requires you to also buy a Forge World book, then very carefully check the FAQ for Stronghold Assault and the rules for Super Heavies in the MWB (Medium White Book). While the basic vehicle might be available in 40K, you'll only ever be able to field one of them. In 30K, you can field squadrons of those vehicles (except for the Sicarian... which I really think was an oversight on FW's part, but...)

Actually, not exactly. There are no specific conditions or formations required for many of the vehicles (like Spartans, Storm Eagles, and Contemptors). Some do have the Relic rule (Sicarans, Javelins, some Predator variants, the Fire Raptor), meaning only one vehicle with that rule can be in the army...unless you have a Master of the Forge (or equivalent), then you can take as many relics as the force org allows.

Sure, you still have to have the appropriate books, though. And, yeah, it's cool that some vehicles, like the dreadnoughts and predators, can be fielded in squadrons in the Legion list.

30k vs. 40k plays better around 2k points. Anythung below 1500 will be bad for 30k and anything above 2k will end poorly for the 40k player.