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Made in us
Grey Knight Purgator firing around corners



Ohio

The rumor is that next week Draigo will be a Lord of War rather than an HQ. So what will likely change about him?

I think he needs at least the Titansword to be AP2 and to have the It Will Not Die and Feel No Pain special rules.

It's not fair for a generic Iron Hands Captain with the Shield Eternal to be more survivable than the Supreme Grand Master of the Grey Knights.

Your thoughts?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/14 14:45:20


 
   
Made in de
Been Around the Block





well if we take the orc codex and Ghaz's "ascendency" as precedent then Draigo will in fact get weaker by moving to the LoW slot
   
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Dakka Veteran




Same thing with Logan's move to LOW slot, it seems they may get different boons, such as the new chariot, but it won't be anything that will make them a must have.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/14 15:07:43


 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





that said it's quite possiable he'll get AP2 on his sword. that's about the only improvement I'd expect.

Personally I don't see why it's unfair for a Iron Hands chapter master to be more survivable. it's kinda their schtick.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
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Trustworthy Shas'vre






Well, Grand Strategy is going to move to Warlord Traits, so he'll get weaker in that respect. Probably going to gain access to another Phychic discipline, or maybe not. Could go both ways.

I"d expect the Titan sword to become AP2, and losing Grand Strategy to be about it, for the same cost. Hell, Logan is a terrible buy for his price tag, so is Ghaz now, why would we expect Driago to be any different.

Having to take another HQ is going to be annoying to say the least, but is manageable.

Hopefully he'll still make Paladins troops, otherwise I'll be pissed off to no end and my GK will be sold. I've hear he still will, but that will be a direct contradiction to the Ork and SW codices.

40k is 100% Skill +/- 50% Luck

Zagman's 40k Balance Errata 
   
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I feel like with Draigo you will get a formation that will encourage you to take paladins, but will not get the ability to make them troops, like you said if you look as ghaz or grimnar, both lost their ability to move elites to troops.
   
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Trustworthy Shas'vre






I don't know, looks like GKs are losing GK terminators completely. The boxes are getting redone into Paladin Boxes, no more GK Terminators at all. That may make it possible for Paladins to be troops when taken in large squads, otherwise having only Strike Squads as troops is too limiting. No other army would be so limited in troop choices, as in only having one.

40k is 100% Skill +/- 50% Luck

Zagman's 40k Balance Errata 
   
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The darkness between the stars

ForeverARookie wrote:
The rumor is that next week Draigo will be a Lord of War rather than an HQ. So what will likely change about him?

I think he needs at least the Titansword to be AP2 and to have the It Will Not Die and Feel No Pain special rules.

It's not fair for a generic Iron Hands Captain with the Shield Eternal to be more survivable than the Supreme Grand Master of the Grey Knights.

Your thoughts?


Probably nothing significant. Ghazzy overall got hurt more than buffed by the move so it'll likely just be pushed over with minimal changes. Probably no fnp, probably no iwnd, maybe Titansword but that would be odd considering Abby got AP2 on his sword in the FAQ (before the codex came out) while Draigo didn't. On a humorous note, from a technical point, there's no reason for it to have ap2 as daemons can, at max, discounting Invulns, only get 3+ I believe.

And hey, don't worry Abby, Ahriman, all them old folks, Chapter masters of important SM armies, and so on all look with envy at the Iron Hands Captain


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Zagman wrote:
I don't know, looks like GKs are losing GK terminators completely. The boxes are getting redone into Paladin Boxes, no more GK Terminators at all. That may make it possible for Paladins to be troops when taken in large squads, otherwise having only Strike Squads as troops is too limiting. No other army would be so limited in troop choices, as in only having one.


Wait do SoB have troops besides Sisters?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/14 16:13:54


2375
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Made in us
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus





Well according to that leaked army builder, he did get 30 points cheaper

3000
4000 
   
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Trustworthy Shas'vre







Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Zagman wrote:
I don't know, looks like GKs are losing GK terminators completely. The boxes are getting redone into Paladin Boxes, no more GK Terminators at all. That may make it possible for Paladins to be troops when taken in large squads, otherwise having only Strike Squads as troops is too limiting. No other army would be so limited in troop choices, as in only having one.


Wait do SoB have troops besides Sisters?


Sisters have a codex?? Sisters aren't treated as a fully army anymore, despite what GW likes to tell people. If they got a plastic sisters kit, a hardcover dex, another troop option, and some new units they would be. But, there have been rumers of that happening since I started playing 40k over a decade ago.

I would find it extremely surprising for any modern Codex to have only a single Troop choice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 WrentheFaceless wrote:
Well according to that leaked army builder, he did get 30 points cheaper


Now, that would be cool and I'd see that happening with no changes barring losing Grand Strategy and a move to LOW. AP3 Titan Sword and all.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/14 17:38:33


40k is 100% Skill +/- 50% Luck

Zagman's 40k Balance Errata 
   
Made in ca
Lord of the Fleet






Halifornia, Nova Scotia

I'm betting on a chariot, pulled by enslaved daemons.

My faith in GW to provide a sensible model with sensible fluff is rapidly degrading. Its not like the current fluff for Draigo is anything to be praised either.

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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I am predicting he gets the option to swing his sword 2handed making it unwieldy but ap2.

no other changes.
   
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Ohio

blaktoof wrote:
I am predicting he gets the option to swing his sword 2handed making it unwieldy but ap2.

no other changes.


Abbadon already has an AP2 weapon at Initiative, so there's no reason to make the Titansword unwieldy.
   
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Zagman wrote:Sisters have a codex?? Sisters aren't treated as a fully army anymore, despite what GW likes to tell people. If they got a plastic sisters kit, a hardcover dex, another troop option, and some new units they would be. But, there have been rumers of that happening since I started playing 40k over a decade ago.

I would find it extremely surprising for any modern Codex to have only a single Troop choice.


Just one. Battle Sisters are our only option in the Troops slot. We can kit them different ways, but the basic model/unit is the same.

It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised. 
   
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The real question is whether he'll have a Warp Dust upgrade available.
   
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Seattle

It will be like "The stars are RIGHT!" from Codex: Necron. A temporary buff based on a d6 roll taken at the beginning of the controlling player's phase turn. This reflects the unpredictable nature of a fat rail of warp-dust you just snorted off a Daemonette's ass.

It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised. 
   
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Trustworthy Shas'vre






 Psienesis wrote:
Zagman wrote:Sisters have a codex?? Sisters aren't treated as a fully army anymore, despite what GW likes to tell people. If they got a plastic sisters kit, a hardcover dex, another troop option, and some new units they would be. But, there have been rumers of that happening since I started playing 40k over a decade ago.

I would find it extremely surprising for any modern Codex to have only a single Troop choice.


Just one. Battle Sisters are our only option in the Troops slot. We can kit them different ways, but the basic model/unit is the same.


My point was that Sisters don't count, because GW doesn't care about them in the slightest and they certainly didn't get a proper codex. So, sure, they have only one Troop choice, but no "real" codex has only one option, it would be highly unlikely that they'll take a codex with multiple troop options and move it to only one option, especially as it looks like Terminators are gone.

40k is 100% Skill +/- 50% Luck

Zagman's 40k Balance Errata 
   
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Seattle

Think what you will, but it *is* a Codex, and fairly viable for a mid-tier army like the SOB. They'll never be a top-tier army, because GW both cannot write for them and, also, doesn't appear to care to, and so doesn't devote the resources to doing so, but as-is, it's perfectly viable.

It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised. 
   
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 Zagman wrote:
Well, Grand Strategy is going to move to Warlord Traits, so he'll get weaker in that respect. Probably going to gain access to another Phychic discipline, or maybe not. Could go both ways.

I"d expect the Titan sword to become AP2, and losing Grand Strategy to be about it, for the same cost. Hell, Logan is a terrible buy for his price tag, so is Ghaz now, why would we expect Driago to be any different.

Having to take another HQ is going to be annoying to say the least, but is manageable.

Hopefully he'll still make Paladins troops, otherwise I'll be pissed off to no end and my GK will be sold. I've hear he still will, but that will be a direct contradiction to the Ork and SW codices.



INC sold army? I don't see them breaking with their new "no changing the FOC" attitude. It makes sense for 7th edition, and we've got two codexes that followed very similar paths. At this point, I'd just accept that they don't care if we FOC swap anymore and quite frankly it has little effect on most armies. (Only break I'll give GK is that as a really low model count army, they need everyone to have obj secured that can, so that'll blow) Oh well.

"If the application of force does not solve a problem; apply more force." 
   
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Losing everything scoring like in 5E/6E will be painful. Yes, everything scores, but OBSEC is what counts. Scoring Dreadknights allowed for so many good times. I fear for the Grand Strategies and their change to warlord traits, it leaves me curious what Draigo will get? Maybe 2 traits like Calgar given his status?

The same Draigo being cheaper is amazing even at AP3. He's not a Lord of War, but still amazing. I can see his stuff on the Titansword being tied to challenging or that he has to challenge a daemon or psyker.

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Ohio

Draigo can still make Paladins Troops, but Crowe doesn't make Purifiers Troops in the traditional sense? Based on the leaks it seems that Draigo will still be Lord of Titan, but that Crowe may just get a formation that makes the Purifiers in it OBSEC.

Grand Strategy becoming a Warlord Trait could be really unreliable, especially if it only effects D3 units. It would be epic if it made the entire army OBSEC.

Draigo really should have at least a 4+ FNP of his own. After all, the curse has turned him into a Warp entity of judgement and wrath against all enemies of the Emperor. He destroys the impossible city in the Warp multiple times, and hunts daemons in the Warp, only stopping to go to realspace to kill daemons there before returning to slaughter the abominations in their own backyards. He shouldn't go down to lasgun fire so easily.
   
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So how are people suppose to play their GK armies? if Draigo is LoW. Will the normal grand master make paladin troops or something ?
   
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The LOW is part of the Detachment, so Draigo can still make Paladins into Troops. Besides, Grand Masters have been demoted to an upgrade for Brother-captains if the leaked army builder is to be believed, and it looks like they lost some of their gear options.
   
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I doubt anything will move around the FOC.

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Maine

ForeverARookie wrote:
The rumor is that next week Draigo will be a Lord of War rather than an HQ. So what will likely change about him?

I think he needs at least the Titansword to be AP2 and to have the It Will Not Die and Feel No Pain special rules.

It's not fair for a generic Iron Hands Captain with the Shield Eternal to be more survivable than the Supreme Grand Master of the Grey Knights.

Your thoughts?


It's also not fair that Ghaz, one of the most terrifying and skilled Warbosses in all the known Galaxy can die just as easily as a Nob.

He will probably see very little change, if any at all once he is moved to the LoW slot. Ghaz got a nerf and no point drop. But, seeing as how MEQs are their poster boys, they might not screw you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
ForeverARookie wrote:
The LOW is part of the Detachment, so Draigo can still make Paladins into Troops. Besides, Grand Masters have been demoted to an upgrade for Brother-captains if the leaked army builder is to be believed, and it looks like they lost some of their gear options.


If the other codecies are setting the trend, all new books will lose Force Org manipulation. Nothing will be allowed to be taken 'as troops' anymore. Things will remain in their proper slots.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/08/16 19:56:37


 
   
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ForeverARookie wrote:


Draigo .... He shouldn't go down to lasgun fire so easily.



he's got 2+ armor and a 3++ invul, and toughness 5. He's not going to go down to lasgun fire easily.

to hit him the player of dragio must roll a 1, and then the Imperial guard player rolling to wound him has to roll a 6, and he has to do that 4 times!

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BrianDavion wrote:
ForeverARookie wrote:


Draigo .... He shouldn't go down to lasgun fire so easily.



he's got 2+ armor and a 3++ invul, and toughness 5. He's not going to go down to lasgun fire easily.

to hit him the player of dragio must roll a 1, and then the Imperial guard player rolling to wound him has to roll a 6, and he has to do that 4 times!


Assuming average rolls (which when determining this kind of thing we must), a single Lasgun shot has a 1.4% chance to cause a Wound on Draigo. It would take approximately 288 shots (at BS3) to kill Draigo.

288 shots, 144 hit, 24 Wound, 4 failed saves

Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
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 Happyjew wrote:
BrianDavion wrote:
ForeverARookie wrote:


Draigo .... He shouldn't go down to lasgun fire so easily.



he's got 2+ armor and a 3++ invul, and toughness 5. He's not going to go down to lasgun fire easily.

to hit him the player of dragio must roll a 1, and then the Imperial guard player rolling to wound him has to roll a 6, and he has to do that 4 times!


Assuming average rolls (which when determining this kind of thing we must), a single Lasgun shot has a 1.4% chance to cause a Wound on Draigo. It would take approximately 288 shots (at BS3) to kill Draigo.

288 shots, 144 hit, 24 Wound, 4 failed saves


any IG player who wants Dragio dead THAT MUCH (rememebr he's proably running in a squad of Paladins) deserves to kill him

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He will probably not even be worth taking for his point cost if the last 2 books released are any indication. Logan and Ghaz are just wasted points unless you're playing like 3k+ point games. "Lords of war for everyone! And they will be so mediocre, nobody will ever cry about them again!" - GW
   
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I dunno even if his stats don't change at all, I'd be willing to take Dragio. I think the problem with the LOW HQs is that in addition to taking them, you get hit with an "HQ tax" as well.
to take Dragio, you'd also have, for example, to take a librarian or brother-captian.

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