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So, I recently got myself a can of white Armory brand primer. I was finishing up a game at my LGS, needed some green GW wash and since they can't process any card charges less than $5, I thought, hey, I have some grey CSM at home and I need a can of white primer. I picked it up since Army painter primer is insanely expensive and I was too knackered to go to Hobby Lobby for my usual. The guy warned me to shake the hell out of it, only prime when it's warm, and get close with it. Fair enough, been priming for months and painting as well, figured I should be good.

BIG MISTAKE.

This stuff catches every dirt and dust particle within a mile. When it does go on, it's smooth, but so flaky and gritty that paint seems to not WANT to stick to it, almost as if it knows. The primer cost me about $8. I went back to the store to pick up some zombies for my CSM Nurgle army and was chatting with one of the other clerks. Apparently, this is a known problem, and he only carries it for the one or two guys in the store who like the stuff.

At this point, I don't even care about the money, I'm more annoyed I primed a Helbrute and a squad of CSM that I now have to strip, reprime, and wait to paint. In short, KRYLON, I LOVE YOU. I'll never leave you again baby!

I assume that you mean it's AP spray primer? I've never used white, but I have used several of the colored ones: Angel Green, Goblin Green, Bone, Ultramarine Blue, Wolf Grey (which is really a space wolves blue), Uniform Grey, Pure Red, Dragon Red, and Chaos Red.

All of them, every single one, has yielded a smooth coat of primer that is super smooth (TOO smooth, causing adhesion issues for first basecoat using some brands of paints), and bulletproof strong after a few days of curing. When I say strong, I mean, if I paint 10 layers of paint on it, and am unhappy, I can pick off all the paint with my nail, a brush, or a plastic tool, and the entire basecoat will still look like new.

My main criticism is that even after ONE coat -- and I usually need to do two, because I've missed a few spots or gotten a few spots a bit light, AP colored primer goes on too heavy (thick). It doesn't quite obscure detail, but it rounds off sharp edges, and that is unacceptable to me in most of my models, and only barely acceptable to cheap plastic miniatures that are painted to a "tabletop standard".

If you haven't watched it, check out the video on Army Painter's website on the primers. The technique that is used for AP primers is different than well, any other primer I've used.

Also, spray primers work horribly if it's too hot (anything > 23C, and I won't use one; over 26C, and it's a disaster), and humidity will wreck your priming job in an epic way. In short, for many parts of the northern hemisphere at this time of year, spray primers suck.

The Krylon you are using is probably Krylon Gesso Spray? That is much more forgiving for temperature and humidity. However, if I may suggest, the brush on Gesso -- for example, Liquitex Black, White, or Clear Gesso -- as very good alternatives. They are much, much cheaper (a big bottle will do like, 1000+ miniatures), and you get lots of control, plus you can do it indoors.

On the other hand... and I hate to sound elitist... absolutely nothing comes close in preserving detail and going on perfect than an airbrushed polyurethane acrylic primer.

Essentially, my primers of choice, in order, are:

1. Airbrush for "nice" models - coverage, consistency are just unmatched

2. P3 Black Spray Primer or Mr. Hobby White Spray Primer - if I don't feel like cleaning an airbrush, or if it's just 1 piece (I'm insanely OCD about keeping every part sparkling new after every use)

3. Army Painter Colored Primer - if it's an "army", AP colored primer is just so much faster than anything else.

4. Gesso - if I'm correcting an area (and scrape off the original coat of primer/paint), or if I want to quickly prime something for testing. Or, if I have a small prep task, don't feel like cleaning an airbrush, and outdoor conditions are not good for spray.

I’ve used 2 cans of armory white primer. The first worked fine, no issues. The second gave me a passable coat at best, and a fuzzy, gritty batch that caused my Eldar project to take a detour through a vat of simple green. And take so long to get to the paint bench that it never got going (the new marines came out)

The can of Krylon I picked up is working fine so far.

 jreilly89 wrote:

At this point, I don't even care about the money, I'm more annoyed I primed a Helbrute and a squad of CSM that I now have to strip, reprime, and wait to paint. In short, KRYLON, I LOVE YOU. I'll never leave you again baby!

I'll never buy another can of hobby brand primer again. Krylon is cheaper, proven, and available everywhere. There is nothing special about GW, Armoury, or Army Painter sprays. You pay for the label and logo on the can, not the contents.

Talys wrote:
I assume that you mean it's AP spray primer? I've never used white, but I have used several of the colored ones: Angel Green, Goblin Green, Bone, Ultramarine Blue, Wolf Grey (which is really a space wolves blue), Uniform Grey, Pure Red, Dragon Red, and Chaos Red.

All of them, every single one, has yielded a smooth coat of primer that is super smooth (TOO smooth, causing adhesion issues for first basecoat using some brands of paints), and bulletproof strong after a few days of curing. When I say strong, I mean, if I paint 10 layers of paint on it, and am unhappy, I can pick off all the paint with my nail, a brush, or a plastic tool, and the entire basecoat will still look like new.

My main criticism is that even after ONE coat -- and I usually need to do two, because I've missed a few spots or gotten a few spots a bit light, AP colored primer goes on too heavy (thick). It doesn't quite obscure detail, but it rounds off sharp edges, and that is unacceptable to me in most of my models, and only barely acceptable to cheap plastic miniatures that are painted to a "tabletop standard".

If you haven't watched it, check out the video on Army Painter's website on the primers. The technique that is used for AP primers is different than well, any other primer I've used.

Also, spray primers work horribly if it's too hot (anything > 23C, and I won't use one; over 26C, and it's a disaster), and humidity will wreck your priming job in an epic way. In short, for many parts of the northern hemisphere at this time of year, spray primers suck.

The Krylon you are using is probably Krylon Gesso Spray? That is much more forgiving for temperature and humidity. However, if I may suggest, the brush on Gesso -- for example, Liquitex Black, White, or Clear Gesso -- as very good alternatives. They are much, much cheaper (a big bottle will do like, 1000+ miniatures), and you get lots of control, plus you can do it indoors.

On the other hand... and I hate to sound elitist... absolutely nothing comes close in preserving detail and going on perfect than an airbrushed polyurethane acrylic primer.

Essentially, my primers of choice, in order, are:

1. Airbrush for "nice" models - coverage, consistency are just unmatched

2. P3 Black Spray Primer or Mr. Hobby White Spray Primer - if I don't feel like cleaning an airbrush, or if it's just 1 piece (I'm insanely OCD about keeping every part sparkling new after every use)

3. Army Painter Colored Primer - if it's an "army", AP colored primer is just so much faster than anything else.

4. Gesso - if I'm correcting an area (and scrape off the original coat of primer/paint), or if I want to quickly prime something for testing. Or, if I have a small prep task, don't feel like cleaning an airbrush, and outdoor conditions are not good for spray.

I'll eventually try out an airbrush, but my simple rattle cans are really effective. I've also sprayed at all times of year and never had a problem with it. And it's not Army Painter, it's Armory brand primer, much different.

 jreilly89 wrote:

I'll eventually try out an airbrush, but my simple rattle cans are really effective. I've also sprayed at all times of year and never had a problem with it. And it's not Army Painter, it's Armory brand primer, much different.

Wow, epic reading fail on my part! Sorry!!!

Yes, ARMORY brand primer is horrible. Also, Armory clear matte finishing spray came out awful for me (very chalky). I have an almost full can of it in a box that I'll never use again.

Seriously. Everyone knows its crap, everyone hates it, why does it still exist?!?

I have used the grey and thought it was good stuff.

I've used Armory black and white. The white was thick and chalky, the black was fuzzy as hell. I checked to see if it was a bad can and swapped it for another; same problem. Other folks I know who've used Armory sprays also found they were fuzzy and lousy too. Krylon costs the same and is far superior, in addition to being available at any hardware or craft store.

i had a bad time with both their primer, and their varnish...
used once each, and went straight in the garbage...
super fuzzy primer and foggy varnish are not good:(...

i don't see how these guys are still selling this product...

cheers
jah

Not sure if this is super fishy or what, but apparently they don't even have a website, but their distributor does....

Ugh! I just had an epic fail with the Armory black spray primer.

In Central Kentucky the humidity is high most of the time, so I don't get many opportunities to prime my minis. I just got back into the game in July, and yesterday was the first nice day that I was off work to do some priming. I primed most of a tactical squad before I gave up and dropped them into the Simple Green. The finish was fuzzy, and I couldn't do anything to make it smooth. I tried different distances, shaking the can like a maniac, and I even put the can in a hot water bath to try to get a better result.

Now I've wasted a rare chance to get some priming done and I don't know when I'll get another shot.

What kind of Krylon are you using? I prime black for my Crimson Fist marines, but I don't see Krylon "primer" in black. Are you guys using the flat black Colormaster?

The nearest hobby shop is about an hour away, so if I could get primer at a local hardware store or Walmart it would save me a big trip.

Thanks.

Huh, I thought the last can I got was Krylon, but it was Rust-olium. White, not black, but I’ve had good results with it. YMMV, I think there is an element of luck and black magic in getting a decent prime with a rattle can. I still toss the dice though..

 Lhorgrim wrote:

What kind of Krylon are you using? I prime black for my Crimson Fist marines, but I don't see Krylon "primer" in black. Are you guys using the flat black Colormaster?

The nearest hobby shop is about an hour away, so if I could get primer at a local hardware store or Walmart it would save me a big trip.
Thanks.

I'm just a random stranger on the Internet, but I really don't believe that "primer" in the strictest sense is necessary. I've been using the Color Place brand sprays from Wal-mart in FLAT black for years, and I do not have paint chipping or paint failure on any of my minis. Krylon also makes a FLAT black spray paint, and I've also used that as a primer to good effect.

If you're painting a car or house, a primer product is absolutely necessary. I think any FLAT color--something that our hobby paints can stick to--is perfectly acceptable to use as a mini primer.

 Lhorgrim wrote:
Ugh! I just had an epic fail with the Armory black spray primer.

In Central Kentucky the humidity is high most of the time, so I don't get many opportunities to prime my minis. I just got back into the game in July, and yesterday was the first nice day that I was off work to do some priming. I primed most of a tactical squad before I gave up and dropped them into the Simple Green. The finish was fuzzy, and I couldn't do anything to make it smooth. I tried different distances, shaking the can like a maniac, and I even put the can in a hot water bath to try to get a better result.

Now I've wasted a rare chance to get some priming done and I don't know when I'll get another shot.

What kind of Krylon are you using? I prime black for my Crimson Fist marines, but I don't see Krylon "primer" in black. Are you guys using the flat black Colormaster?

The nearest hobby shop is about an hour away, so if I could get primer at a local hardware store or Walmart it would save me a big trip.

Thanks.

Yeah, I've heard if you prime it and cover everything, then take a toothbrush to remove the fuzzies, it's good. That's just way too much gak for me. Yeah, I use the Krylon Colormaster, but get the matte or flat black/white. The plain black (glossy I think) does not let paint stick AT ALL. You have to put on a ton of layers for it to stick.

 the_Armyman wrote:


I'm just a random stranger on the Internet, but I really don't believe that "primer" in the strictest sense is necessary. I've been using the Color Place brand sprays from Wal-mart in FLAT black for years, and I do not have paint chipping or paint failure on any of my minis. Krylon also makes a FLAT black spray paint, and I've also used that as a primer to good effect.

If you're painting a car or house, a primer product is absolutely necessary. I think any FLAT color--something that our hobby paints can stick to--is perfectly acceptable to use as a mini primer.

I'm sorry, but I must respectfully disagree that any flat black spray paint makes a good scale (miniature) primer, although certainly, some might be better than others.

A great primer for scale should be very thin, cover evenly ("self levelling"), and provide "teeth" for a fluid acrylic layer that follows. Chip resistance and durability are important too, if you're going to handle the models to any degree. Not that I've tried exhaustively, but most commercial spray paints I've come across are quite durable, and much less concerned with thinness, so the result is that some details are reduced. For instance, the ridges on a chest eagle become less pronounced, or tiny holes get filled in.

Even arts spray paints like Liquitex provide an inferior work surface when compared to their surface prep products. For instance -- and I've tried this -- use a black Liquitex spray paint, and try to paint a terminator's head white. Then try the same with black Liquitex Gesso. The difference is night and day. With the spray paint, the first acrylic coat pools all over the place and is pretty much a mess; with Gesso, the first coat (VMC white diluted 50% flo-aid) comes out a nice, uniform grey.

If you are in a very humid locationI would strongly encourage you to try brush on black Gesso. It works like magic. Don't water it down; the material shrinks into a thin coat like magic when it dries. Plus, Gesso is super cheap. A giant tub of it that will last a thousand miniatures costs $20. I use Liquitex -- I have black, clear, and white, but I use black most of the time, as I think it has the best single-coat coverage.

I do have some unpainted models that are "perfectly prepped" by various methods and some old ones that turned out badly by spray that I haven't gotten around to scrubbing -- if I get a chance, I'll snap a pic or two later on.

Talys wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:


I'm just a random stranger on the Internet, but I really don't believe that "primer" in the strictest sense is necessary. I've been using the Color Place brand sprays from Wal-mart in FLAT black for years, and I do not have paint chipping or paint failure on any of my minis. Krylon also makes a FLAT black spray paint, and I've also used that as a primer to good effect.

If you're painting a car or house, a primer product is absolutely necessary. I think any FLAT color--something that our hobby paints can stick to--is perfectly acceptable to use as a mini primer.

I'm sorry, but I must respectfully disagree that any flat black spray paint makes a good scale (miniature) primer, although certainly, some might be better than others.

Again, I'm just one random stranger talking to another random stranger on the Internet, but I've been priming minis for years with a rattle-can of flat black paint that costs 97 cents: metal/plastic/resin, no obscuring of details, no paint chipping or flaking, no black magic. I game with them, they get handled on a regular basis, and I just don't see the difference between a $17 hobby brand primer and the stuff I use. Except the extra $16 in my pocket

Sealing your minis has far more impact on how they look after years of gaming than the type of undrecoat they get prior to paint.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Again, I'm just one random stranger talking to another random stranger on the Internet, but I've been priming minis for years with a rattle-can of flat black paint that costs 97 cents: metal/plastic/resin, no obscuring of details, no paint chipping or flaking, no black magic. I game with them, they get handled on a regular basis, and I just don't see the difference between a $17 hobby brand primer and the stuff I use. Except the extra $16 in my pocket

Sealing your minis has far more impact on how they look after years of gaming than the type of undrecoat they get prior to paint.

No argument on sealing your minis! Glad the black paint works for you.

One last consideration on primer/undercoat choice is how you want it to work if/when you screw up and you have to fix a part of the miniature without stripping the whole model. Different primers/paints come off differently when you do want to do "localized stripping". It is moderately important to me to be able to do this cleanly, because sometimes I'm unhappy with my work, and I don't want to chuck the 15 hours I've already spent on it.