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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 05:20:33
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Fixture of Dakka
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 05:44:06
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Avatar of the Bloody-Handed God
Inside your mind, corrupting the pathways
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Or maybe they adjust your votes to what you would vote if presented with a list of policies rather than a button with red or blue on it?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 06:04:55
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Somewhat related... I got my ballot in the mail, and sat down to fill it out, but to brush up on/remind myself of a couple of the issues being voted on (Washington's Tax Advisory 8, I-591 and I-594), I pulled up google to see what I could pull up and came across this gem of a website (as the first result no less)
http://progressivevotersguide.com/washington/2014/general/vote-maintain-tax-advisory-vote-no-8
It truly is facepalm worthy stuff on there:
The gun lobby filed Initiative 591 to confuse and distract voters from supporting universal background checks. Vote no on Initiative 591.
So folks, in short, if you're looking for info on a bill, make sure it's actually info and not specifically designed to simply tell you which way to vote
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 06:50:28
Subject: Re:Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Kid_Kyoto
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I still like the idea of people holding up their pepsi or coke to show who they supported.
Does it actually mean democrat or republican? Who knows? Who cares? It's the same thing.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 06:56:38
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Stealthy Space Wolves Scout
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Clearly Illinois is trying to fix our nation.
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DR:80-S++G+M-B---I+Pw40k#10++D+A++++/cWD-R+++T(T)DM+
(Grey Knights 4500+) (Eldar 4000+ Pts) (Tyranids 3000 Pts) (Tau 3000 Pts) (Imperial Guard 3500 Pts) (Doom Eagles 3000 Pts) (Orks 3000+ Pts) (Necrons 2500 Pts) (Daemons 2000) (Sisters of Battle 2000) (2 Imperial Knights) |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 08:18:18
Subject: Re:Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan
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Sadly, voting machine irregularities are the new normal... I knew in 2004 they were here to stay.
I'm sure there will be many more reports of similar shenanigans over the next 2 weeks.
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lord_blackfang wrote:Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote:The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 12:19:51
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Democratic voter fraud in Illinois? I'm shocked, just shocked.
Did you see the ballot stuffing video in Colorado? Choice.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 12:26:25
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Fixture of Dakka
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Frazzled wrote:
Democratic voter fraud in Illinois? I'm shocked, just shocked.
Did you see the ballot stuffing video in Colorado? Choice.
Not saying fraud, just that the machines calibrations were off.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 12:57:50
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Blood Angel Captain Wracked with Visions
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Shady conduct in Chicago?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 13:24:03
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Relapse wrote: Frazzled wrote:
Democratic voter fraud in Illinois? I'm shocked, just shocked.
Did you see the ballot stuffing video in Colorado? Choice.
Not saying fraud, just that the machines calibrations were off.
You're right. Switching the vote from Republican to Democrat is just a calibration error.
In Chicago.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 13:30:32
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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The good news is that voting fraud is a made up issue
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 13:54:18
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Ultramarine Librarian with Freaky Familiar
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I'm sure there's a Mass Effect joke in there somewhere...
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 14:12:02
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan
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In person voter fraud of the type photo ID is intended to deter is statistically nonexistent, yes.
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lord_blackfang wrote:Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote:The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 14:13:08
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Sniping Reverend Moira
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Ouze wrote:
In person voter fraud of the type photo ID is intended to deter is statistically nonexistent, yes.
The same statistical nonexistence as registered gun owners committing gun crime with their registered firearms, right?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 14:15:28
Subject: Re:Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan
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I'm not really sure where we are veering towards, here. However, sticking with one point at a time, when people say "voting fraud is virtually nonexistent in the US" on these forums, I have yet to see a single example that didn't reference in-person voter fraud - which is accurate.
So when you say :
It's actually true, when referencing the type of which is always discussed in the OT.
It's also possible this wasn't fraud, per se. It's possible that the bad calibration was merely incompetence. This being Illinois, that seems sort of unlikely though.
Still, I don't recall any major elections in the last 10 years that didn't have these sort of voting machine shenanigans.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/10/23 14:20:24
lord_blackfang wrote:Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote:The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:21:53
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Esteemed Veteran Space Marine
My secret fortress at the base of the volcano!
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Computerized voting machines were a bad idea from the word go. Whoever builds the machines has the capacity to determine which candidate gets your vote, without you knowing anything about it.
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Emperor's Eagles (undergoing Chapter reorganization)
Caledonian 95th (undergoing regimental reorganization)
Thousands Sons (undergoing Warband re--- wait, are any of my 40K armies playable?) |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:24:47
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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We use the best of both worlds in Oklahoma IMO.
Our paper ballot is easy to read and use, just make your mark. The machine scans it right in front of you and deposits it in the secure ballot box. The computer tallies the vote and sends it to the election board. The paper ballots are available for manual recounts.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:31:05
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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I like paper voting or the infamous punchcard voting the best. Nothing more satisfying that a solid "Kathunk" when you punch a choice.
In Texas (at least last election) there was no paper ballot that I remember. I don't trust it one bit. Same for advocates of online voting.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:33:45
Subject: Re:Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard
Catskills in NYS
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We still use the lever-operated ones where I live. I have to say, they are rather satisfying.
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Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote:Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote:Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens BaronIveagh wrote:Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:35:29
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Frazzled wrote:
In Texas (at least last election) there was no paper ballot that I remember. I don't trust it one bit. Same for advocates of online voting.
I personally "like" the online voting for the VERY small percentage of people it was designed for: such as people overseas in the military who quite literally cannot walk into a local polling office to cast their votes.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:37:17
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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squidhills wrote:Computerized voting machines were a bad idea from the word go. Whoever builds the machines has the capacity to determine which candidate gets your vote, without you knowing anything about it.
Paper ballots were a bad idea from the start. Whoever makes the tally has the capacity to determine which candidate gets your vote without you knowing anything about it. Automatically Appended Next Post: Frazzled wrote:I like paper voting or the infamous punchcard voting the best. Nothing more satisfying that a solid "Kathunk" when you punch a choice.
Will agree though that the kathunk sounds way cooler than a mouse click (or that terrible beeping noise the touch screen machines make).
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/10/23 15:38:15
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:45:08
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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LordofHats wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Frazzled wrote:I like paper voting or the infamous punchcard voting the best. Nothing more satisfying that a solid "Kathunk" when you punch a choice.
Will agree though that the kathunk sounds way cooler than a mouse click (or that terrible beeping noise the touch screen machines make).
But how do you count the "hanging chads" ???
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:50:03
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Ensis Ferrae wrote: LordofHats wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Frazzled wrote:I like paper voting or the infamous punchcard voting the best. Nothing more satisfying that a solid "Kathunk" when you punch a choice.
Will agree though that the kathunk sounds way cooler than a mouse click (or that terrible beeping noise the touch screen machines make).
But how do you count the "hanging chads" ???
Easy, make all the Chads line up in 70s basketball shorts. If you can see the tip he counts as "hanging Chad".
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:54:36
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Esteemed Veteran Space Marine
My secret fortress at the base of the volcano!
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LordofHats wrote:squidhills wrote:Computerized voting machines were a bad idea from the word go. Whoever builds the machines has the capacity to determine which candidate gets your vote, without you knowing anything about it.
Paper ballots were a bad idea from the start. Whoever makes the tally has the capacity to determine which candidate gets your vote without you knowing anything about it.
But your original ballot is still available for recounts in the case of paper ballots. And any polling place that "loses" the ballots prior to a recount would be on the top of the list for an investigation into election fraud.
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Emperor's Eagles (undergoing Chapter reorganization)
Caledonian 95th (undergoing regimental reorganization)
Thousands Sons (undergoing Warband re--- wait, are any of my 40K armies playable?) |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 15:58:06
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Ensis Ferrae wrote: Frazzled wrote:
In Texas (at least last election) there was no paper ballot that I remember. I don't trust it one bit. Same for advocates of online voting.
I personally "like" the online voting for the VERY small percentage of people it was designed for: such as people overseas in the military who quite literally cannot walk into a local polling office to cast their votes.
In the age of hacking, nothing online is secure. Automatically Appended Next Post: Ensis Ferrae wrote: LordofHats wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Frazzled wrote:I like paper voting or the infamous punchcard voting the best. Nothing more satisfying that a solid "Kathunk" when you punch a choice.
Will agree though that the kathunk sounds way cooler than a mouse click (or that terrible beeping noise the touch screen machines make).
But how do you count the "hanging chads" ???
Real Menz have no hanging chads.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/10/23 15:59:10
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 16:03:21
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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squidhills wrote:But your original ballot is still available for recounts in the case of paper ballots. And any polling place that "loses" the ballots prior to a recount would be on the top of the list for an investigation into election fraud.
But your original mouse click is still stored in the machine you used and available for investigation in the case of electronic ballots. And any polling place that "loses" the machine prior to a recount would be on the top of the list for an investigation into election fraud.
The argument that one form of vote counting is corruptible but another is not is irrational paranoia. It's a political election. Paper. Electrons. it doesn't matter. Ways will be found by those who want to rig the vote. Further, I'd argue its harder to rig electronic votes than paper votes. A computer can be monitored in real time, code checked for alterations, and when you store the votes on 1 hard drive its a lot easier to watch them than hundreds of boxes full of paper ballots (and a lot faster to count them).
Blame the laughable terribleness of many electronic voting machines on a number of things, but it's not that machines are bad, it's that the government seems to have this obsession with making voting irritating (just like the DMV).
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/10/23 16:05:39
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 16:04:20
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Esteemed Veteran Space Marine
My secret fortress at the base of the volcano!
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LordofHats wrote:squidhills wrote:But your original ballot is still available for recounts in the case of paper ballots. And any polling place that "loses" the ballots prior to a recount would be on the top of the list for an investigation into election fraud.
But your original mouse click is still stored in the machine you used and available for investigation in the case of electronic ballots. And any polling place that "loses" the machine prior to a recount would be on the top of the list for an investigation into election fraud.
The argument that one form of vote counting is corruptible but another is not is irrational paranoia. It's a political election. Paper. Electrons. it doesn't matter. Ways will be found by those who want to rig the vote. Further, I'd argue its harder to rig electronic votes than paper votes. A computer can be monitored in real time, code checked for alterations, and when you store the votes on 1 hard drive its a lot easier to watch them than hundreds of boxes full of paper ballots.
But I like killing trees to fuel democracy!
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Emperor's Eagles (undergoing Chapter reorganization)
Caledonian 95th (undergoing regimental reorganization)
Thousands Sons (undergoing Warband re--- wait, are any of my 40K armies playable?) |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 16:05:57
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Electronics and their production will kill nature for democracy now and for hundreds of years after democracy fails!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 16:06:48
Subject: Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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Don't worry. We still have the DMV and Tax season
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2014/10/23 16:16:29
Subject: Re:Make sure of who your vote is going to
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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan
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I also like the punch cards because I like the noise it makes, good call Frazzled.
I'm not against electronic voting in theory. After all, we handle billions of secure ATM transactions a day so we are capable of transmitting data securely.
The problem is the secrecy and lack of transparency around the machines. They are usually done by low bidder using secret contracts - often politically connected and the whole process is a black box where opportunities for shenanigans abound.
I think sunlight would be a useful disinfectant in this situation - the same standard *nix-based machines needs to be in use across the country, the source code for the machines and demos of the software should be publicly available for at least 6 months before an election, the progress of the voting (sans names) should be publicly viewable in realtime, the voting should output a print showing clearly the filled ballot before a second option drops it into secure storage and completes the process, and all paper ballots are saved for any needed recounts.
This might cost money, but things that are worth having usually do.
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lord_blackfang wrote:Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote:The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock |
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