Switch Theme:

What are some good ork units that are "hidden" strong  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





After looking through the codex and playing a few games, I noticed that the orks are not really great at anything other than mobility. What are some great combos that I might have missed? The melee units are alright, but the lack of the AP 2 weapons mean vs marines there really hard to kill, and the ranged units are not every accurate so not really reliable, that being said the d3 shots from lootas might be nice to widdle people down perhaps?
Mainly will fight Space Wolves, Nids, Blood angles, AM and possible crons.
   
Made in by
Flashy Flashgitz






The hidden strength is being able to chop the shooty and shoot the chopy. All orks have WS 4, so even shooting units can hold against an assault for a while. I wouldn't say orks lack AP2, powerklaws and killsaws can be placed in almost any unit.
Lootas, MANz, Tankbustaz and KMKs for da win! Oh, and never underestimate the many attacks from 30 sluga boys, even 2+ will fail time and again.
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





 hordrak wrote:
The hidden strength is being able to chop the shooty and shoot the chopy. All orks have WS 4, so even shooting units can hold against an assault for a while. I wouldn't say orks lack AP2, powerklaws and killsaws can be placed in almost any unit.
Lootas, MANz, Tankbustaz and KMKs for da win! Oh, and never underestimate the many attacks from 30 sluga boys, even 2+ will fail time and again.

Yeah I would love that but vs space wolves 20 str10 ap2 ws 5 boyz dont even get to hit!
   
Made in ru
!!Goffik Rocker!!






Lobbas are one of the best infantry killers in game for their points. Even TWC will loose a few wounds when you hit.

As for the hidden strong units, i'd point out stormboyz. They're underrated and rarely seen on tables at all. But i run a unit of 10+pk bp nob with my footsloggas and am quite happy with what they do. The thing is that if you're playing speed freaks, there's nothing bikes can't do better than stormboyz other than moving over impasable terrain. Bikes are tougher, shootier, can go 24' per turn, cost just 2 times more and are 4 times more durable. However, when you're playing footslogas, you don't have to rush foorward to be there turn 2. So, you can position your stormboyz where they're needed the most and hide if needed. Ad than they perform a charge on the WAAAGH for 12' + 2d6' + 2d6' with 'ere we go. That's 24-27' reliable charge range which is ~7' longer than biker's and doesn't need to go around impassable terrain on the first 12' which is quite handy for a hidden squad.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/08 09:06:48


 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





 koooaei wrote:
Lobbas are one of the best infantry killers in game for their points. Even TWC will loose a few wounds when you hit.

As for the hidden strong units, i'd point out stormboyz. They're underrated and rarely seen on tables at all. But i run a unit of 10+pk bp nob with my footsloggas and am quite happy with what they do. The thing is that if you're playing speed freaks, there's nothing bikes can't do better than stormboyz other than moving over impasable terrain. Bikes are tougher, shootier, can go 24' per turn, cost just 2 times more and are 4 times more durable. However, when you're playing footslogas, you don't have to rush foorward to be there turn 2. So, you can position your stormboyz where they're needed the most and hide if needed. Ad than they perform a charge on the WAAAGH for 12' + 2d6' + 2d6' with 'ere we go. That's 24-27' reliable charge range which is ~7' longer than biker's and doesn't need to go around impassable terrain on the first 12' which is quite handy for a hidden squad.

Yeah I wanted to get a battery of 5 of them, but GW wants like 55$ or something per gun! Its insane! Also what would an ammo runt do with blast weapons?
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend



Maine

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
After looking through the codex and playing a few games, I noticed that the orks are not really great at anything other than mobility. What are some great combos that I might have missed? The melee units are alright, but the lack of the AP 2 weapons mean vs marines there really hard to kill, and the ranged units are not every accurate so not really reliable, that being said the d3 shots from lootas might be nice to widdle people down perhaps?
Mainly will fight Space Wolves, Nids, Blood angles, AM and possible crons.


In general, WS4 and T4 models for 6 points is their big 'hidden' strong. Not to mention our Boyz get 4 attacks on the charge. For 6 points. In groups of 30. That alone is just insane.

Orks are not really 'good' at any one thing really. Yes, they lack the AP to hack through Marine armor, but when you're rolling 70 dice per combat, that 3+ or 2+ IS going to fail.

We have some speedy, if fragile, transports. Battle Wagons get the melee where they need to go with decent effect. Our Warbikes are ridiculously good for 18 points a piece with 18" Assault 3 Twin Linked S5 Ap 5 weapons are dang decent. Again, throw enough dice, armor WILL fail. Lootas are OK at best (IMO). Their range is insane, but their lack of accuracy can be a bit of a let down, though again...throw enough dice, things will work out.

Tank Bustas are great if you want an abundance of S8 AP 3 weaponry, and can't help get rid of vehicles. (They have Meltabombs now...about damn time)

Killa Kanz make great distraction units, run those clunkers right up and they will have no choice but to respond or suffer losses in some manner or another.

If you're fighting Marines, I drown them in Boyz whenever I face them.

Chop the shooty, and shoot the choppy.

In summery: Orks, while not specialists in the normal sense, swarm the field. You bring enough of it so if you lose some, you still have answers. They can only kill so many Orks a turn, and GENERALLY, you should be able to overwhelm them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 cosmicsoybean wrote:
 hordrak wrote:
The hidden strength is being able to chop the shooty and shoot the chopy. All orks have WS 4, so even shooting units can hold against an assault for a while. I wouldn't say orks lack AP2, powerklaws and killsaws can be placed in almost any unit.
Lootas, MANz, Tankbustaz and KMKs for da win! Oh, and never underestimate the many attacks from 30 sluga boys, even 2+ will fail time and again.

Yeah I would love that but vs space wolves 20 str10 ap2 ws 5 boyz dont even get to hit!


What the heck are you rushing your Boyz into that get that many S10 attacks? I can't see how they could possibly put that many attacks into a squad with Marines unless it's strictly their CC specialized units. In that case, you SHOOT THEM. You shoot them with everything you have. Shoota Boyz or Lootas, or even Mek Gunz.

While expensive normally, I've begun to repurpose plastic army men cannons to make into my Lobbas. All I've really had to do is put some plasticard blast shields and Orky designs. Cost me 10 bucks on Amazon.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/08 10:28:02


 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Ill try that. Problem is I can't afford to shoot the CC marines because good ol' space wolves deep strike turn one and can shrug all my shooters attacks off except one or two wounds, then the will assault and wipe me out.
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend



Maine

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Ill try that. Problem is I can't afford to shoot the CC marines because good ol' space wolves deep strike turn one and can shrug all my shooters attacks off except one or two wounds, then the will assault and wipe me out.


well, if they DS, you back up, shoot them as much as you can. Or, you bite the bullet and you assault them so you get extra attacks. Using your Shootas should soften them up a little bit. They should only be one wound apiece anyway, so you can shrink their numbers a bit. Or use other nearby units to support fire and take them down.

Marines will always be a bit of a pesky foe for Orks. Try stuff out and see what works. Like I said, if they are DS a lot, then keep Tankbustas or Deffkoptas close by to throw around marine piercing Rokkits (unless they are termies with 2+ armor...then...well...poop. :p)

Though I have to ask as well...what S10 cc weapons are they using that lets them attack at initiative? Because most weapons of that magnitude should be reducing them to initiative 1, meaning your 30 boyz get to swing first.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/08 10:55:09


 
   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran




 cosmicsoybean wrote:

Yeah I wanted to get a battery of 5 of them, but GW wants like 55$ or something per gun! Its insane! Also what would an ammo runt do with blast weapons?

it lets you reroll the scatterdie + distance, pretty handy for barrage weapons...
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






first, to address the "lack of AP2 weapons"...

Powerklaw.
kan klaw
DCCW (don't care if they're powerfists now, they're DCCW's to me!)
Kustom Mega Blasta/slugga
Kustom Mega kannon
Boom Bomm
Buzzsaw
Deff Kannon
Killsaw
Klaw of Gork
Mega Choppa
Shokk-Attack Gun
Smasha Gun
Snazzguns
Tellyporta Blasta
Zzapp Guns
power vomit
Killbolt
'eadwhoppas Killchoppa


not really lacking, seeing as most armies have:

powerfist
thunderhammer
meltagun
lascannon
plasmagun
MC's
psychic powers

so no real lack there. And don't get me started on AP3 weapons...

so there's a lot to choose from for AP2. so the next question is how do we address deep-striking CC units. I don't play against Space wolves so I'll go for the two options it could be.

1: Standard Deepstrike: They arrive clumped up, Presumably have a 2+ save due to your lament about AP2, and remain that way unless they run. in your shooting phase, any of the following:

Shokk Attack Gun
Kustom Mega Kannon
Boom Bomm
Massed Grotzookas
Massed Lobbas
Massed Burnas

will make them have a real bad day. massed shootas will help too, and lootas can force a lot of saves.

next we go onto the combat phase. presumably these units are weilding thunderhammer or something as very little attacks at S10 and isn't Unweildly. This means anyone of your guys without powerklaws will go first - remember boys have stikkbomms!

The 4 most effective things you can charge in at this point are, In order of most to least:
Deff Dreads
Killa Kans
Gorkamorkanaughts
Stompa.

Obviously any unit attacking at S10 isn't one you want to be charging with an expensive unit like a morkanaught or a stompa. kans will hit on 5's, due to low WS, but a 4CC dread will have 7 attacks on the charge. 2 dreads will mince most other units.

2: Drop Pods:
Drop pods are nastier due to no mishaps. if you're expecting drop-pods, I'd play cruelly. leave periodic gaps in your army large enough to fit a drop pod with about 2" around it - that's about a 7-8" circle. if the drop pod lands there, no-one will be able to get out, and the unit will be destroyed. make sure to leave space near the edges of the table for him to try and arrive, but make sure he has to be within 7" of the table edge - drop pods don't reduce scatter for table edges, they mishap.

if a unit gets out of a drop-pod, it'll be more spread out. mass firepower is preferable to blasts, in this case, though grotzookas are still very effective. lootas will wreck the drop pod, and might explode it too, clearing your shooting lanes. shootas, lootas, flashgitz, tankbustas etc are all going to work well here. again, charge with initiative-attackingAP2 weapons, like killa kans and deff dreads.


The Other Technique; Blocking.

If this is a unit which can assault but can't shoot (like thunderhammer stormshield termies, for example), then try to get some disposable units, like grots, dispersed throughout your army, preferably near any places he can deepstrike in (open ground). do your usmost to surround him with grots in your turn. he'll have to waste a turn killing grots whilst you keep pumping shots into him. grots in trukks will work well here. and grot blasters do tend to get kills, for irony purposes.


So now to (finally) talk about the title: What ork units are "Hidden Strong".

Grots in trukks are surprisingly versatile as a spanner-in-the-works unit. treat it first as a piece of movable impassible terrain and you'll never be disappointed. and as a bonus, you get 10 S3 guns, a S4 gun, a rokkit on the trukk, the unit as a whole requires 2 enemy units to kill it, the guys inside are objective secured, it can move up to 24" and the whole thing costs just 65 points!

Flashgits. rarely seen, people often disregard them as being too expensive. if you get the first turn (barring seizing) putting them in a trukk and getting them to a fairly central piece of cover turn one will give you a lovely threat range. if the rest of your army is moving at the enemy, he'l not have time to worry about the flashgitz, but one turn they'll roll AP1-2 and destroy a unit, and the attention will turn to them. I've had a unit of 7 kill 2 carnifexen in overwatch, that was brutal. the much underestimated unit of the codex. and 3 S5 shots each isn't to be sniffed at, regardles of the AP.

Stormboys are also good, and devilishly fast on a WAAAGH!, with an average charge range of 26" and a maximum charge range of 36" (12" move, 12" run, 12" charge), but that's unrealistic to expect but still a 26" move-run-charge is beastly quick! pick a tank and blow it up. never charge stormboys into infantry unless there's no other option, they need to be hunting tanks.

other than that, boyz boyz boyz.

"It's not that i have more boyz than you have marines, it's that I have more boyz than your marines have bullets."

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/08 12:06:21


12,300 points of Orks
9th W/D/L with Orks, 4/0/2
I am Thoruk, the Barbarian, Slayer of Ducks, and This is my blog!

I'm Selling Infinity, 40k, dystopian wars, UK based!

I also make designs for t-shirts and mugs and such on Redbubble! 
   
Made in us
Trigger-Happy Baal Predator Pilot






 cosmicsoybean wrote:
After looking through the codex and playing a few games, I noticed that the orks are not really great at anything other than mobility.


Congratz. Mobility is the unsung key to this game. Make sure to take advantage of it and you'll be competitive in most games.

   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





California

I love the new codex. One thing I noticed more with orks than with other armies is how great some the ork formations are.

bully boys are crazy good
Mogrok's Bossboys granting d3 units out flank can be sneaky
green tide is just great and hard to deal with

Combining these formation with a CAD , orks have lots of build options.

I think the Morkanaught and Gorkanaught are better than people think. I have great success with mine. Can't wait to try and out flank with them and a unit of kanz.

- Neva trust a Deff Skull , gitz just wanna take yur lootz
- Only good Deff Skull iz a Ded one !  
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





 some bloke wrote:
first, to address the "lack of AP2 weapons"...

-snip-
Drop pods are nastier due to no mishaps. if you're expecting drop-pods, I'd play cruelly. leave periodic gaps in your army large enough to fit a drop pod with about 2" around it - that's about a 7-8" circle. if the drop pod lands there, no-one will be able to get out, and the unit will be destroyed. make sure to leave space near the edges of the table for him to try and arrive, but make sure he has to be within 7" of the table edge - drop pods don't reduce scatter for table edges, they mishap.


Im new to fighting marines but he told me that drop pods cannot mishap even scattering off the table edge, since it places a drop pod the closest placeable place? also that spacing idea is just evil, i love it! I reacquired my orks after selling them long ago so im really trying to learn them again, and the rules for CC. With my eldar and dark eldar it was REALLY rare they would get into CC so I don't know some rules, like if you have a unit that gets 4 attacks after charging, but has 2 killsaws, that is 5 attacks, or 6? Daka, burna or boom jet?
   
Made in us
Auspicious Daemonic Herald





Scattering off the table is the only thing Drop Pods can mishap from. Internal Guidance System lists what it reduces the scatter on and the table edge is not one of them
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





 CrownAxe wrote:
Scattering off the table is the only thing Drop Pods can mishap from. Internal Guidance System lists what it reduces the scatter on and the table edge is not one of them

Wow.... Yeah he would (when he gets turn one) deepstrike pretty much on my boyz, then when it scatters off the table, just fit it closest he can.... This is great to hear then and will make me not lose my main guys turn one anymore! thanks!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, is that in the BRB or their codex?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/08 21:15:59


 
   
Made in us
Nasty Nob





United States

I also use grots in a trukk.

-Grots are great for taking a charge from assaulty things and promptly running.. permitting you to shoot said assaulty things.

-The 'ard boyz upgrade. You almost always strike last even against shooty gitz.. something really nice about saving nearly half suddenly.

-Stormboyz.. but this isn't soo hidden anymore.

-Furious Charge. Boyz on a charge can wreck vehicles with AV10 rears.

Blitza Bomma. Does everybody forget that large AP2 pie plate also has a rule that assigns it's wounds like a barrage weapon -.-


I am the kinda ork that takes his own washing machine apart, puts new bearings in it, then puts it back together, and it still works. 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





 Rismonite wrote:
I also use grots in a trukk.

-Grots are great for taking a charge from assaulty things and promptly running.. permitting you to shoot said assaulty things.

-The 'ard boyz upgrade. You almost always strike last even against shooty gitz.. something really nice about saving nearly half suddenly.

-Stormboyz.. but this isn't soo hidden anymore.

-Furious Charge. Boyz on a charge can wreck vehicles with AV10 rears.

Blitza Bomma. Does everybody forget that large AP2 pie plate also has a rule that assigns it's wounds like a barrage weapon -.-


Barrage takes the wounds from center to outer, correct?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, what page is the 'ard boyz upgrade on, I cant seem to find it

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/09 01:23:16


 
   
Made in us
Auspicious Daemonic Herald





 cosmicsoybean wrote:
 CrownAxe wrote:
Scattering off the table is the only thing Drop Pods can mishap from. Internal Guidance System lists what it reduces the scatter on and the table edge is not one of them

Wow.... Yeah he would (when he gets turn one) deepstrike pretty much on my boyz, then when it scatters off the table, just fit it closest he can.... This is great to hear then and will make me not lose my main guys turn one anymore! thanks!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, is that in the BRB or their codex?

Its in the codex
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Alright, ill see if I can get my hands on one to read the other rules too if hes conveniently skipping over parts lol.
   
Made in im
Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw





Liverpool

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Barrage takes the wounds from center to outer, correct?
Yes, that's correct.

Also, what page is the 'ard boyz upgrade on, I cant seem to find it
Boyz mobs, give the 'Eavy Armour (can't remember if they actually call them 'Ard Boyz in the book).

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Alright, ill see if I can get my hands on one to read the other rules too if hes conveniently skipping over parts lol.
Basically the initial placement must be legal (otherwise the pod will mishap if it doesn't scatter) so he can't place it ontop of your squads.

If it scatters onto a unit or impassible terrain he can reduce the scatter (note: reduce only, not increase).

If it scatters off the table, it mishaps.
   
Made in no
Fresh-Faced New User




 Rismonite wrote:

Blitza Bomma. Does everybody forget that large AP2 pie plate also has a rule that assigns it's wounds like a barrage weapon -.-



I can't find this rule in the BRB, is this a errata?
   
Made in im
Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw





Liverpool

WhiskeySquig wrote:
 Rismonite wrote:

Blitza Bomma. Does everybody forget that large AP2 pie plate also has a rule that assigns it's wounds like a barrage weapon -.-



I can't find this rule in the BRB, is this a errata?
It's in the "Bomb" rules in the BRB. Last sentence.
   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut





Montreal, Quebec

Hey!

Nice post title! It always helps to see what people are using as a secret weapon!

I really think boyz will always be the key of success. but i dont think its a hidden force... Anyways, here how i play them.

In the last few game i've played (between 1250 and 1500 pts) i field unit of 30 slugga boyz, with one painboy ( seriously the best shitzzz in the codex for 50pts, give you fill no pain 5+) and a big me with a KFF so 5+ cover save and that lucky stikk (+1 WS). Put a Nob with a boss pole and a PK. The turn of the charge your boyz will do a lot of damage and after they will make the combat last longer so your you PK will kill few space marine each turn.

The last unit i discovered recently is the tank bustas, 5 in a trukk with 3 attack squigg is dirt cheap and do the job again a lot of vehicule!

In this edition, meganobz is super good as well. 3 in a battle wagon with a killkanon and a warboss with mega armour and the lucky stikk. With a painboy. Super destructive.

Deff dread is good but you really need to bring it fast in CC. If your opponent use DP to be in CC super fast, put 3 Deff dread with 3 DCCW and 1 skorcha and that will be fun!

Good luck!


May the WAAAGH!!! be with you! 
   
Made in im
Nasty Nob on Warbike with Klaw





Liverpool

 calarok wrote:
with a KFF so 5+ cover Invulnerable save
There you go

Burna Boyz sadly took a hit between the new eddition and a slight point increase.
But stick them behind a Promethium Relay and they become hillarious
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Currently I have no cash to spend, but my army (while a bit ramshackle because when i bought them back, units were missing or added) consists of:
24 boys w/ boss nob with TL shoota/powerclaw
80 points of gretchen
108 points of nobz one with a banner
200 points of Meganobz, outfitted with the dual killsaws
65 point trukk
130 point dakajet 3 TL supa shooters
A stompa (doesnt get used much)
70 point Weird boy, phy.2,
250 in kans
80 deff dread

Most things that can have 'evey armour has it. Also proxied weirdboy from a Mek and my friends don't play WYSIWYG so it's fine to proxie a dakajet as a burnabomber and such.
   
Made in ru
!!Goffik Rocker!!






 cosmicsoybean wrote:

65 point trukk


You're doing it wrong.
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





Im assuming you're saying that because plain trukks are better, and you are correct, i needed points to be filled since my opponent refuses to lower their point values from whatever they want, I however will be removing the upgrades and adding in some proxied Mek guns
   
Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin






 Voidwraith wrote:
 cosmicsoybean wrote:
After looking through the codex and playing a few games, I noticed that the orks are not really great at anything other than mobility.


Congratz. Mobility is the unsung key to this game. Make sure to take advantage of it and you'll be competitive in most games.



Mobility is king, look at the top tier lists. Bikers, skimmers, beasts, jetbikes and cavalry.

   
Made in us
Noise Marine Terminator with Sonic Blaster





Moon Township, PA

 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Ill try that. Problem is I can't afford to shoot the CC marines because good ol' space wolves deep strike turn one and can shrug all my shooters attacks off except one or two wounds, then the will assault and wipe me out.


Use gretchin to bubble wrap your units and deny space. If you are taking a big mob of orks, you can deny a large portion of the battlefield. This can allow you to dictate to a lesser degree where your opponent can drop his pods in.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/12 18:22:13


 
   
Made in ca
Furious Fire Dragon





 Green is Best! wrote:
 cosmicsoybean wrote:
Ill try that. Problem is I can't afford to shoot the CC marines because good ol' space wolves deep strike turn one and can shrug all my shooters attacks off except one or two wounds, then the will assault and wipe me out.


Use gretchin to bubble wrap your units and deny space. If you are taking a big mob of orks, you can deny a large portion of the battlefield. This can allow you to dictate to a lesser degree where your opponent can drop his pods in.

Now that I know his drop pods dont prevent scattering off the table, im going to do that for sure and force his turn one to be killed unless its in front of my guys or he gets a direct hit. When I first started this army I was going kan-wall but vs the types of armies im facing green tide might be better idea. Do you think the gazkull supplement would be worth the buy for the formations and rules?
   
 
Forum Index » 40K General Discussion
Go to: