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 BlackArmour wrote:
There is also a core group who let their hate blind them to anything the company even does that's remotely good,heck it only seems to make them angrier that they did in fact do something that people like, and recently there have been some good trends. (in my opinion and also in a lot of others). I.E. Non-Codex model releases + Free rules online or rules in WD to go along with, Cheap starter boxes (SW vs Orks or Blood Angels vs Tyranids) , re-releasing books in softcover again.

It's not so much being 'blinded by hate' as that so much of what GW gets 'right', they do so in a way that either could be better, or seems geared to annoy people.

Re-releasing books in softcover is great - but not if they're still more expensive than they should be.

Cheap box sets are great - but not if they're a limited release that sells out within 3 minutes of release, with no real advance warning that they're coming or that they will be available only in such small quantities.


There are a lot of us who are more than happy to say so when we see GW do something right. It's just frustrating how often to do something that's almost right, but that in some way manages to miss a mark that could have very easily been hit with a little more thought, or just, you know, communicating with their player base.

 RatBot wrote:
Elementary school was such a long time ago.

Says the guy who has in the past resulted in the most direct namecalling I´ve seen on the forums...

Anyway, let´s just leave the "Post-GW" people in their own club and peace. It´s not like discussion about why someone quit ages ago and still goes on about after a year is doing anything for us who are playing and enjoying the game just fine.

This is a forum for the discussion of 40k and related games, no? One doesn't have to play something to discuss it, otherwise millions of sports fans would suddenly have nothing to talk about. Likewise, one doesn't have to like something as it stands to talk about it, otherwise everyone would all have the same opinion.


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 BlackArmour wrote:

I'm in no way a GW fan boy ( I also play WMH) and wish they would change some of their just ridiculous policies , hell starting with making pricing even remotely make sense would be a good start I.E. $30+ dollars for 1 model but that same price for 10 or more models in one box that are the same size as the individual model thats going for $30+.

My point is things could certainly be better but they aren't always as bad as some want to make it out to be. I've learned that very few people like change, its just human nature.

That's how it starts. Then you play long enough to realize that the changes aren't being made for any positive reason. Then you get called a 'hater'.

Quit in 3rd because the rules were an atrocity. Also got into girls, cars, recreationals etc.

Didn't post about it on messageboards though. Quite enjoy it since returning.

The game rules itself - I feel that they must either be very balanced and tactically deep, fluffy, or (ideally) both.

Currently the rules are neither which is plainly sad. It also can't decide if it wants to be a tabletop RPG or a large-scale wargame.

Steadily rising prices and GW generally doing their best to match the 'evil corporation' stereotype doesn't help.

I´ll never understand why continously advertise that you have quit doing anything. And byt this I do mean only the individuals who do it continously. You have this same personality type in pretty much any game forum, be it war- or videogames.

So bitter that one needs to go on about it even after months, venting frustration?

Attention seeking?

Trying to achieve some unfathomable goal?

Needing peer support from other quitters?

Feeling a remotely narcissist need to make ones negative issues be known throughout the internet?

Somehow find it fun to talk about quitting with others ( similiar to peer support ) ?

Know most aren´t interested in hearing about it, and do it exactly because of that?

I wonder if I should make a poll.

TL;DR: For me personally, it was a combination of burnout, disillusionment with the company attitude and direction, and finding other games that i prefered.

I played 40k extensively, and quite competitively back in third and fourth ed. And like it was for many folks, that abomination of an iron warriors/Chaos codex ultimately killed 4th ed through its mind boggling brokeness. For me, 40k never recovered. For me, ultimately though it was burnout - in the end all the games i played blurred into each other with the same lists and the same moves against the same lists with the same moves. I got bored, and disillusioned and pretty much walked away from active gaming for a year or two. A while later i felt that familiar "itch" to get back into it. looked into fifth ed., and almost in the same heartbeat knew it wasnt right for me. i had a lot of ideas for armies that simply would not perform on the table top because they werent one of the handful of dominant builds, and the prices had jumped to the extent that i did not fancy spending a few hundred quid on display pieces for my shelves. to be honest, it reinforced my belief that GW isnt interested in "improving" the game, merely "changing" it, and frankly, that wasnt good enough. at the same time i glanced up at my khador and cygnar battleboxes and remembered how much fun my few starter games were. Looked into Warmachine, and the Mk2 fieldtest was htting. OK, so here is a company doing a free, open access world wide beta test to iron out their rules set? Had me sold. I decided i'd get a bit serious about warmachine. checked out the RPG material and delved into the lore. found myself hooked, found myself loving the game, and not missing playing 40k.

Now, to be fair, i stayed "interested" (and to an extent, still do) in 40k because of the fluff. unfortunately, the recent fluff - grey knights, codex:comedy robots, chaos etc hasnt been stuff i've enjoyed. I still like the FW books to be fair, but when it comes to the codices etc i just felt it has really been dumbed down. that it was "better in my day". Which amusingly isnt true. the fluff is as it always has been. i've just gotten older. i want different things now. 40k lore was great for me as a teenager. As an adult, i've moved on. And I'm OK with that.

Last issues would be GW as a company. I am sympathetic to a lot of what they intend to do, but i think their implementation is shocking. I think they've burned a lot of bridges with their customer base with embargoes, legal actions, price rices, killing support for the game, and specialist games etc.

 jasper76 wrote:
This question inspires me to ask another, although I don't think it would be a very helpful thing to ask in a dedicated thread.

If you have stopped playing 40k, why do you spend time on a message board devoted to 40k?

to be fair, "playing" the game isnt the entirety of 40k.

For some, the lore, or painting/modelling is the big thing, and playing the game is an after thought or not done at all, or not that big of a deal. are they allowed to post?

In the same way, as an Irishman living abroad, i like to keep in touch with things that are happening at home on both a national level, and a local level. Im sure its the same for you Jasper. if you move away from your hometown/state, and any time you're back, or chatting to your mates/family who stayed home, you are going to want to stay in touch with whats going on. posting/reading a 40k board is the same for me. Just because i dont play doesnt mean i'm not interested. And if i'm interested, i have a right to get involved. I'm sure its the same for others.

Well, I'm still playing 40k: Necrons in apo games and GK in RTTs.
But I shelved my Eldar, too powerful for my liking.
The new game is WMH. I played Skorne in mk1 and started Cyriss in mk2.

 RunicFIN wrote:
I´ll never understand why continously advertise that you have quit doing anything. And byt this I do mean only the individuals who do it continously. You have this same personality type in pretty much any game forum, be it war- or videogames.

So bitter that one needs to go on about it even after months, venting frustration?

Attention seeking?

Trying to achieve some unfathomable goal?

Needing peer support from other quitters?

Feeling a remotely narcissist need to make ones negative issues be known throughout the internet?

Somehow find it fun to talk about quitting with others ( similiar to peer support ) ?

Know most aren´t interested in hearing about it, and do it exactly because of that?

I wonder if I should make a poll.

Seriously. For games I have quit I don't even bother with nowadays. My time is spent on the games I still DO play, not posting about why I quit those other games. Why would you even venture into the forums or discussion for games you no longer play or have interest in?

And I don't understand why price would make someone quit. Unless 75% of your army was removed from the codex after the update, your army is still there, and it's still playable. What "the price got too high" really means is "I couldn't afford to cheese anymore" or "they nerfed my army and I didn't want to buy new stuff". Because otherwise, the option should be "the price was too high for me to start playing" and not "the price was too high for me to KEEP playing".

RayND wrote:
What "the price got too high" really means is "I couldn't afford to cheese anymore" or "they nerfed my army and I didn't want to buy new stuff".

Not always.

In my case, it just means that I refuse to pay $85 for a codex.

RayND wrote:
My time is spent on the games I still DO play, not posting about why I quit those other games. Why would you even venture into the forums or discussion for games you no longer play or have interest in?

Exactly. I´ve quit probably hundreds of videogames before and a few wargames because there weren´t enough players ( like Confrontation ) but which I liked. Even the thought of actively complaining about the games, advertising that I´ve quit, especially for longer than a few days is just laughable.

I just can´t understand what is being achieved with that, or what purpose does it serve.

There are better games that provide a better bang to buck ratio. For £30 I can get 1 dreadought (maybe) that makes 8% of an army.
For £30 I can get a decent malifaux starter or an even more decent infinity starter + blister for a 200 pt game.

The rules are terrible for 40k and WFB. Their decent games (ie specailists) they shelved because NOT ENOUGH MODELS!

I quit towards the tail end of 5th mostly for balance reasons and because I had started playing Fantasy. It simply got to the point where I would show up at the club and look for games of either but it slowly became that every time I played 40k I was using whatever models I thought where cool and my opponent was bringing the same razorback spam led by Mephiston and there was no point actually playing the match out once I knew I was playing that guy.

I simply stopped bringing 40k to the club eventually. I had never considered myself 'out' of 40k but Fantasy was well and truly my main game at that point.

Then 6th edition hit and I thought it would revitalize my love of 40k. I got a demo game in at the then brand new GW store in my area and it just felt so much more clunky and unintuative when you are now trying to play a mass battle but need to remove casualties from the front and issue challenges and crap like that. As well the random terrain I had gotten used to ignoring in fantasy suddenly made a reappearance.

I never did pick up the 6th ed rulebook that day and that was when i considered myself 'out'. From then on it was only Fantasy. Until I tried Dystopian Wars and picked that up as my side game. More and more I enjoyed that and my fleet grew but I played it and Fantasy side by side for a long time.

Probably a year ago now I realized I had lost all enthusiasm for fantasy when the local club leader asked me for the entry fee to a tourney I thought I had paid for months before. As soon as i realized I hadn't I dropped that and paid for the Dyst one that was on the same day and went to that instead.


As for now, I play a lot of games that aren't GW. I come to Dakka in general because it is not a 40k site, or a GW games site, it is a wargaming site and I am still very big into wargaming.
As for visiting this sub forum specifically, I still enjoy the setting and the models but the game is complete rubbish. Some times i just poke my head in here though because I want to get back into 40k. I want it to be good. I'm still holding out hope it can be a game that can stand on the merits of it's mechanics one day instead of those mechanics killing any enthusiasm for the game.

Your missing "By the time I converted and painted the army a new list came out and invalidated it"

 insaniak wrote:
Cheap box sets are great -

Read that as "Cheap sex bots". What is wrong with me!?!

RunicFIN wrote:I just can´t understand what is being achieved with that, or what purpose does it serve.

How old are you, Runic? How long have you played 40k? I played 40k for about 15 years. I had over 10,000 points worth of models for half a dozen different armies, all of which I painted. Now it's basically all in storage, because after getting more and more disappointed with the rules, the prices, and the overall direction of the company, and spending less and less money on the game, I moved to a new city and I realized I didn't care enough to bring any 40k stuff with me.

But that doesn't mean I completely forgot about a setting I really enjoy, that's been a fairly integral part of my gaming hobby since childhood. I didn't lose my curiosity at what new models will come out (even if I don't like the aesthetic of a lot of them now and I'll never buy them). I'm still a wargamer in general too, and I like tinkering with rules. I get a lot of enjoyment out of seeing what's changed in the game, or trying to make my own 40k rulesets just for fun. I do feel a bit of schadenfreude when I see GW do something idiotic, but I also genuinely enjoy when they put out a good product.

For all those reasons, I still come to dakka to catch the latest in 40k news, offer my opinions on developments, and answer questions about fluff when I can. I do this even if I personally don't think the game is worth playing anymore, and the models aren't worth buying. And when someone makes a thread titled "Why do you still play 40k?" I don't crap all over it. So what's your excuse?

RayND wrote:

.

RayND wrote:

Seriously. For games I have quit I don't even bother with nowadays. My time is spent on the games I still DO play, not posting about why I quit those other games. Why would you even venture into the forums or discussion for games you no longer play or have interest in?

Because, as you say yourself, they might maintain an active interest in the game, regardless of other factors. Just because you don’t play doesn’t mean you can’t stay involved.

RayND wrote:

And I don't understand why price would make someone quit. Unless 75% of your army was removed from the codex after the update, your army is still there, and it's still playable.

Is it though? It may be playable in the sense that you can put in on the board, make some “pew pew” noises, roll some dice and move models around, but another question to ask is will it be “viable”? Will it be effective? Or will playing it be an exercise in frustration in trying to fit a square peg into a round hole?

My mate had three of his customised armies invalidated by GWs codex, and edition shifts. And I’ve heard horror stories from other people.

During the various edition shifts whole playstyles have been invalidated and made unviable. Third edition boiled down to either “rhino rush”, or “shoot the rhino rush” builds, fourth was 6man las/plas and assault cannon spam if you were marines, skimmer spam for anything else. Oh, and Iron Warriors. The third edition rhino rush builds? Dead, to all intents and purposes, because aside from skimmers, and especially in the case of transports, vehicles were death traps. Fifth, sixth and seventh did the same thing. My tau went from OK in fourth to paperweight by fifth. Still playable? Only in theory.

Then you have the various armies that have been discontinued, models that were removed etc.

RayND wrote:

What "the price got too high" really means is "I couldn't afford to cheese anymore" or "they nerfed my army and I didn't want to buy new stuff".

No. And you're being short sighted.

In the case of the former, that’s a bit melodramatic of you. Lets be clear: Its OK for people to want new stuff. New edition/expansion etc. new models. Go for it. As players, we all look forward to the new shinies, in any game we play. Equating that with being able to “afford to cheese” is both insensitive and inaccurate. No one buys “an army” and stops. There should always be new projects and expansions to keep you interested. But when those expansions come at the cost of invalidating what you have, it embitters people. Similarly, when expanding what you have comes up against the cynical ploys of halfing the contents of boxes for the same price (eg dire avengers) it gets peoples’ backs up. Frankly, the price is too high when im buying 10 models for £20 one day, and 5 of the same models for £20 the next day. That’s just downright cheeky.

In the case of the latter, yes, it’s a valid complaint. See above edition shifts. Third was rhino rush/shoot the rhino rush. Fourth was skimmer spam. Fifth was tankhammer. Sixth was fortifications, MCs and flyers. Etcetera. Having your army invalidated or nerfed into ineffectiveness is a pathetic and cynical ploy to force the purchase of shiny new models. Why is it a good thing to invalidate whole playstyles and collections? That’s not a clever strategy.

“I didn’t want to buy new stuff”? Yeah, how about we put in the full sentence? “I didn’t want to buy new stuff. I’ve seen GWs track record. They’ve broken,and invalidated armies and playstyles on a whim. I’m not buying into stuff that’s simply going to be made irrelevant in a couple of years, and will have to replace all over again”.

RayND wrote:

Because otherwise, the option should be "the price was too high for me to start playing" and not "the price was too high for me to KEEP playing".

Incorrect. See above. Also add in the continual cost of new rules, new codices etc. That is an added factor in what’s needed to stay current.

 RunicFIN wrote:

RayND wrote:
My time is spent on the games I still DO play, not posting about why I quit those other games. Why would you even venture into the forums or discussion for games you no longer play or have interest in?

Exactly. I´ve quit probably hundreds of videogames before and a few wargames because there weren´t enough players ( like Confrontation ) but which I liked. Even the thought of actively complaining about the games, advertising that I´ve quit, especially for longer than a few days is just laughable.

I just can´t understand what is being achieved with that, or what purpose does it serve.

But why come on to moan about complainers? What purpose does that serve? What gives them any less right to have their say than you?

Or are we just ignoring the fact that people have valid points about the current direction of the game/ pricing and would love to get back into it, if only some issues were cleaned up.

There's more than just the tabletop aspect that keeps people interested as well as the large investment some may have in it.

As I've mentioned before, many people who have stopped playing may be willing to return to regular play, or have just stopped giving GW but continue to play occasionally.

Its not a black and white issue some posters may lead you to believe.

Besides, if these people didn't care, they wouldn't be posting. I'll I'm seeing are a bunch of people who still care about 40k and its universe, but are being put off by the actions of its parent company.

Not to mention the head scratchingly bizarre habit of complaining about people complaining. Its not like the intention of the thread wasn't totally clear from the title.

 Blacksails wrote:
As I've mentioned before, many people who have stopped playing may be willing to return to regular play, or have just stopped giving GW but continue to play occasionally.

Its not a black and white issue some posters may lead you to believe.

Besides, if these people didn't care, they wouldn't be posting. I'll I'm seeing are a bunch of people who still care about 40k and its universe, but are being put off by the actions of its parent company.

Not to mention the head scratchingly bizarre habit of complaining about people complaining. Its not like the intention of the thread wasn't totally clear from the title.

Yup. The Dakka branch of the GW PDF launches into action as soon as someone dare besmirch fair lady GW in her own board!

I would gladly play 40k again, but GW seems to want to stymie any attempt by doing stupid things and releasing crap rules.

I mean, how many stories have we all read of players who leave the game for a decade and then return to test the waters?

These same people may still enjoy the novels, fluff, video games, and RPGs. And, oddly enough, the 40k boards have the highest concentration of 40k related anything.

Its not weird, or abnormal, or even a bad thing we have discussions about why people have left, may leave, or have returned. It shows there's something more to 40k, and that GW is throwing it away with poor policies that drive consumers away.

The weirdest part is that some of the complaints people have that drove to them other companies are things even the most die hard GW/40k fan would agree would be great things to have or fix.

I just don't understand the divide some posters seem to want to create. An exclusive community of only those who profess an undying love of 40k and would never complain about GW. Its odd.

For me the reasons are many.
I like the idea of 40k but not the delivery. The rules are poor representations of the background, the models are becoming increasingly convolted and just ruin the world for me.
The game is too bloated and not very 'fair' (imbalance).
The price isn't bad for a set but because the game is setup to make models ineffective you have to buy more of them for an army (which is nonsense in its own right).
The fact that instead of improving the product they just keep making more 'crap' to throw on top.
Space Marines - the sheer over abundance of them bugs me

I'll Play. 3 reasons for me.

-First off is the forced exclusivity via-price.
If 40k was the only game I was interested in and the only game in town, there's a slim chance I might keep playing, but playing/buying 40k requires all of my gaming dollar (and then some…). I have deveoped more gaming interests than 40k to the point where I'm not willing to have it dominate my gaming hobby. My choice was made even easier when I saw what it would costto get codices and rules for the new edition.

-Second was finding games (emphasis on the plural) I like more.
I now play alot of indie games and skirmish games. I am probably playing and building armies for a half dozen games for what many folks invest in just one GW game. I've got several post apoc and fantasy warbands, alien invaders, a 10mm scale mech army, a 28mm Mecha company, Sci-Fi Romans, etc, etc, many of which see action with more than one ruleset.

-Third was finding other gamers who like these other games.
Forming a club of like minded "indie" gamers completely kicked 40k off my radar. The best thing 40k has going for it is the ubiquity of the system which means you'll always find an opponent. When I have regular opponents for a wider variety of better-and-cheaper games, there's just no point ot 40k anymore.

I've held on to my 40k armies (still play Warpath and In The Emperor's Name from time to time) and I'm still slowly working on my squat army, but the current 40k rules are no longer part of my hobby.

 RunicFIN wrote:
I´ll never understand why continously advertise that you have quit doing anything. And byt this I do mean only the individuals who do it continously. You have this same personality type in pretty much any game forum, be it war- or videogames.

So bitter that one needs to go on about it even after months, venting frustration?

Attention seeking?

Trying to achieve some unfathomable goal?

Needing peer support from other quitters?

Feeling a remotely narcissist need to make ones negative issues be known throughout the internet?

Somehow find it fun to talk about quitting with others ( similiar to peer support ) ?

Know most aren´t interested in hearing about it, and do it exactly because of that?

I wonder if I should make a poll.

I have you on ignore but I saw this quote and had to ask.
Why must you be so insulting to people just because they have different opinions than you?
If you think we're wrong about GW, tell us why we're wrong about GW.

 Mozzyfuzzy wrote:
But why come on to moan about complainers? What purpose does that serve? What gives them any less right to have their say than you?

Didn´t say anything about rights, and I even excluded people who occasionally mention their reasons and most of the time valid points ( for them ) by underlining the target group. Just wondered what purpose does it serve to make a deal out of you quitting a game a year ago on a continous basis, which is what I wrote.

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:
How long have you played 40k?

I have played 40K for 12 years. Next to that, I take it you´re not one of the people who continously advertises that they´ve quit, which I underlined earlier, so nothing I said really affects you.

I believe I articulated it in a perfectly understandable way which type of folk I was referring to.

 MWHistorian wrote:

I have you on ignore but I saw this quote and had to ask.
Why must you be so insulting to people just because they have different opinions than you?

If we´re going with personal questions again, I´ll ask you a few before answering yours:

Why do you state your own opinions and views as universal truths? Why do you usually open up by being rude and condescending? Why do you deliberately misinterpret information and turn discussions into a mess? Why after continously doing all of these things do you find it surprising I act in a negative manner towards you?

How is advertising you´ve quit a game on a regular basis "an opinion?" I haven´t insulted anyone who´s had a different opinion. Opinions haven´t been exchanged to beginwith. I have merely questioned behaviour that just doesn´t make any sense to me and many others, and I believe there are only a few individuals here who belong in said group of people. Occasionally bringing it up is different, like on a thread like this for example, than making a daily parade about it, which is what some people do.

You have now talked about putting me on ignore around 3 times, and also sent me a PM telling me that. Now you announced it once more for reasons unknown. Maybe it´s time to decide, it´s getting a bit confusing. I´d rather you put me on ignore tbh, on a mental level too, as I find we don´t really have anything meaningful to discuss about. You dislike GW, you dislike 40K, and you think GW is pretty much evil. I think none of these things, case closed, let´s go our different ways.

 BlackArmour wrote:

That being said , I'm also disappointed in those who come to this board to tell you how much they hate GW in thread after thread (not referring to this one, because in this one the poster was asking a question related to it) and try to convince everyone why they need to quit with them or just in general spread their hate.

Do you really think people who complain about GW are trying to convince others to quit? I mean, if you put yourself in the shoes of the person who posts something negative about GW - is that why they are posting? They just want to get other people to quit and kill the hobby because they are disaffected for some reason?

The way I look at it, there is (and has been, as long as there has been a 40k) a group of people who care about the game but chose to stop playing for one reason or another. It's hard for me to see why it would be valid to talk about how much you love the game but somehow invalid to talk about why you don't. Does this mean everyone who has a different opinion than you needs to shut up or go away?

It would be hard to call me a GW hater. I don't play 40k right now, but it's not the first time I stopped playing for long stretches and it probably does not mean I won't play again. My perspective on GW stretches back to the late 80s and I am critical of their policies in a number of areas. At the same time, I have mentored dozens of players on all aspects of the game, helped organize local communities that have grown to be hundreds strong, and spent ridiculous amounts of money on models / paints / books / etc. Through my FLGS, I can observe the impact some decisions have on communities of players, which are sometimes good and sometimes bad.

All that said - do I just need to go away because I like to share my thoughts on the latest happenings in Nottingham? If dakka was just a platform for fanboys to profess their love for the latest piece of plastic crack, would it be a better place?

 Blacksails wrote:

 lobbywatson wrote:
So all the people in this thread that "dumped" 40k I find it rather odd you "stalk your ex" this way. I wish GW could file restraining orders against you.
Honestly you could have put this in the "general discussion" area but you instead decided to troll the "40k general discussion" area. Got it....

So all the people that "enjoy" 40k I find it rather odd you "stalk your GW haters" this way. Dakkadakka could file a restraining order against you.

Honestly yoi could have "not posted in this thread" but instead decided to troll the "thread specifically meant for people to talk about reasons they have left or may leave".

Got it.

Any more insights to share? We'd all be thrilled to hear you whine about a thread you could have, I dunno, maybe ignored. We've to hear you bitch about people bitching, that wouldn't be ironic at all and would be super on topic and productive.

Azrael stalks me... Lol

 BlackArmour wrote:
That being said , I'm also disappointed in those who come to this board to tell you how much they hate GW in thread after thread (not referring to this one, because in this one the poster was asking a question related to it) and try to convince everyone why they need to quit with them or just in general spread their hate.

Why are you complaining about other threads in this thread? Seriously, the OP has a reasonable question and most of the responses have been poignant, and for some reason you felt the need to come in and moan about those bad people who talk bad about GW in other places?

EDIT: again, what is up with all this nastiness from people upset that people are citing their reasons for quitting GW games? Is Tom Kirby your uncle? Were you offered some stock option for defending GW against any and all complaints? I don't get why people can't handle something as simple as a "Why did you [X]?" without feeling the need to start personally insulting other forum members...over a game with plastic models.

I'm curious if the same people who complain about these recurring threads equally complain about the recurring threads about which primarch is the best, or which chapter is the best, or 'hey I'm new, which army should I start'.

Its a forum. Threads happen. No one needs to justify their posting habits or behaviours to anyone else.

 Accolade wrote:

EDIT: again, what is up with all this nastiness from people upset that people are citing their reasons for quitting GW games? Is Tom Kirby your uncle? Were you offered some stock option for defending GW against any and all complaints? I don't get why people can't handle something as simple as a "Why did you [X]?" without feeling the need to start personally insulting other forum members...over a game with plastic models.

I´ll emphasise on my behalf, again, that I am only interested in why some folk do it on a regular basis for years. Just answering a thread like this or occasionally letting your opinion known is different afaic.

 Blacksails wrote:
No one needs to justify their posting habits or behaviours to anyone else.

This is a bit paradoxical coming from you tbh. You´re constantly questioning peoples habits and behaviour yourself. Just saying. I know in the end you´re a good guy.

7th Edition basically did it for me. I didn't like that after only 2 years I had to spend another $85 on rules that hardly changed. I never bothered to pick up the rule book, then slowly became busy doing other things and focused mainly on WFB. Eventually sold my 40k armies and now only have fantasy stuff, and End Times is making me think about stopping that as well. I really didn't like the allies system in 40k and mixing armies in fantasy is just a recipe for disaster. Now I rarely have time to actually go into the shop and get a game in at all.