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Drakmord wrote:

Requizen wrote:
From the iTunes preview:



240 for the Deceiver Shard (both are listed separately, wonder what that brings), and it still Elite. Also note that list of Elite options is exactly the same (except for the C'tan split), so no Immortals in there or Flayed Ones troops.

Thank you for sharing. 240 points is a nice chunk more expensive than a naked Shard, I'm wondering what they've baked in to their profiles to account for that. Hopefully it's not just the random shooting.

Not that much more expensive - a base Shard (Entropic Touch + Lord of Fire) is 205. Knowing that they have a "shooting attack" now and probably have a baked in abilities based on the Shard, 240 would be about right for the current C'tan. If they gain a boost and the baked in powers are good (and the shooting attack isn't as bad as we think), then 240 will be very reasonable imo.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 keltikhoa wrote:

 Anpu-adom wrote:


The Reclamation Legion contains 44 Citadel miniatures, including: 1 Necron Overlord, 5 Lychguard, 10 Immortals, 24 Necron Warriors, 3 Tomb Blades and 1 Monolith. For $306.75... no savings over separate.

HAHA called that one about 10 pages ago

Why get so excited or act like it's some big deal that you were right?
None of the "web bundles" have given savings.

It's only the items which get an actual box and shelf space at the stores which have given savings.

I think he meant he called what was in it.

240 points base?

Hopefully the new shards will be good - and actually playtested.

Just for reference:
Dreadknight - 130 base
Wriathknight - 240 base.
Riptide - 220 normal build.

As a person who played a lot with and AGAINST Ctan shards, their biggest weakness is not their anemic attacks (they were a joke, s4 ap4? really?) but their poor save.

The have only a 4++. That sounds great when coupled with a 2+ or 3+ normal, but its just 4, thats 50%.
I see shards go down easily just because of the poor save.

I hope the new Ctan are good, but not OP.





Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anyone notice this VERY INTERESTING snippet from the Reclamation legion bundle...

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Reclamation-Legion-Web-Bundle

It is also supplied with four 40mm round bases, three small flying bases, and thirty-nine 25mm round bases and forty 32mm round bases to give you the choice of how you want to base your miniatures.

Fascinating.

I think that answers a lot of questions people had...

That's pretty awesome of them, actually.

Is anyone else really excited about getting the Deciever and Nightbringer back, I know I am.

davethepak wrote:
240 points base?

Hopefully the new shards will be good - and actually playtested.

Just for reference:
Dreadknight - 130 base
Wriathknight - 240 base.
Riptide - 220 normal build.

As a person who played a lot with and AGAINST Ctan shards, their biggest weakness is not their anemic attacks (they were a joke, s4 ap4? really?) but their poor save.

The have only a 4++. That sounds great when coupled with a 2+ or 3+ normal, but its just 4, thats 50%.
I see shards go down easily just because of the poor save.

I hope the new Ctan are good, but not OP.

But they are T7, which is a big advantage compared to the majority of most MCs. If they have some of the close combat powers baked in, they are worth it. A better comparison is against Greater Daemons, as they too only have an invulnerable save and no stock ranged firepower (except for Khorne).

The biggest problem has been their mobility. If they get moved up to Jump MC, then they become much more useful and actually a bargain if the random powers are decent.

Hollismason wrote:
Is anyone else really excited about getting the Deciever and Nightbringer back, I know I am.

Not getting them back though. The Deceiver e.g. was a pretty unique model with a strong connection between fluff and rules. Chances that this is coming back: 0.

His powers are random. He's not the deceiver I know.
I am disappoint.

 Tokhuah wrote:

If you like the weird way is legs are spread, the glowing chubby stump crotch thrust (wiggle, wiggle wiggle, wiggle, yeah) and the general design that looks like re-purposed bits then it is totally awesome! The Overlord response shows how starved people are for more Necron models...

Yeah, the more I look at it the more I dislike it.

- That headgear just looks... weird. it almost looks like someone decided to add steampunk elements to them (is he wearing half a gear...? ).

- Why has his scythe got two holes in it? Did Tom and Jerry jump up and bang their heads on it?

- Why is he holding his scythe the wrong way round? Is he going to try hitting his enemies with the blunt end?

- He looks like he's straining far too hard to make that pose. Is his left leg glued to the ground?

- Is that a laser-codpiece? O_o

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
His powers are random.

And like that you've lost me.

Hey, I know I always wanted to have something to do in the psychic phase and maybe now i do. I'm pretty stoked.

 vipoid wrote:

 Tokhuah wrote:

If you like the weird way is legs are spread, the glowing chubby stump crotch thrust (wiggle, wiggle wiggle, wiggle, yeah) and the general design that looks like re-purposed bits then it is totally awesome! The Overlord response shows how starved people are for more Necron models...

Yeah, the more I look at it the more I dislike it.

- That headgear just looks... weird. it almost looks like someone decided to add steampunk elements to them (is he wearing half a gear...? ).

- Why has his scythe got two holes in it? Did Tom and Jerry jump up and bang their heads on it?

- Why is he holding his scythe the wrong way round? Is he going to try hitting his enemies with the blunt end?

- He looks like he's straining far too hard to make that pose. Is his left leg glued to the ground?

- Is that a laser-codpiece? O_o

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
His powers are random.

And like that you've lost me.

All C'tan powers are rolled randomly from turn to turn, after you choose your target. According to the WD leak.

 vipoid wrote:

 Tokhuah wrote:

If you like the weird way is legs are spread, the glowing chubby stump crotch thrust (wiggle, wiggle wiggle, wiggle, yeah) and the general design that looks like re-purposed bits then it is totally awesome! The Overlord response shows how starved people are for more Necron models...

Yeah, the more I look at it the more I dislike it.

- That headgear just looks... weird. it almost looks like someone decided to add steampunk elements to them (is he wearing half a gear...? ).

- Why has his scythe got two holes in it? Did Tom and Jerry jump up and bang their heads on it?

- Why is he holding his scythe the wrong way round? Is he going to try hitting his enemies with the blunt end?

- He looks like he's straining far too hard to make that pose. Is his left leg glued to the ground?

- Is that a laser-codpiece? O_o

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
His powers are random.

And like that you've lost me.

The C'tan did not have random powers in the 3rd ed book.
In fact, when I think C'tan, I certainly do not think random. I don't care how capricious they are, its just not right.
Doesn't help the pace of the game either; there are already too many random tables in the game, they didn't need to add more.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NakedSeamus wrote:
Hey, I know I always wanted to have something to do in the psychic phase and maybe now i do. I'm pretty stoked.

They only thing a necron should do in the psychic phase is shut it down.

 docdoom77 wrote:

All C'tan powers are rolled randomly from turn to turn, after you choose your target. According to the WD leak.

Oh joy. If there's one thing the game is really missing right now, it's rolling on random tables for things.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

The C'tan did not have random powers in the 3rd ed book.
In fact, when I think C'tan, I certainly do not think random. I don't care how capricious they are, its just not right.
Doesn't help the pace of the game either; there are already too many random tables in the game, they didn't need to add more.

Oh, I entirely agree.

When I said you'd lost me, I meant that particular titbit has lost any interest I had in the new C'tan.

I don't currently own the models, and it seems GW has no interest in selling me any - otherwise they wouldn't pull this kind of crap.

We don't know what the random effects are.

Smart people could come up with random powers that are all good in a variety of situations, just maybe a bit ....different.

Of course, these are the same game designers that think I should get excited about relentless for my necron warriors that have no heavy weapons.

Regarding the ctan - T7 is worthless with a 4++ save.
It just is. In a world of wave serpents, tau missile launchers, grav amps, autocannon dreds, or heck, just plasma - a 4++ save is incredibly bad at 240 points.

A t7 model with a 2/4++ or 3/4++ - not bad.

However, we have no idea what they will actually have - I was merely giving input on past actual experience comparing to the new point cost. I hope they are good.

davethepak wrote:


Of course, these are the same game designers that think I should get excited about relentless for my necron warriors that have no heavy weapons.

Actually, they addressed the fact that necrons tend not to have heavy weapons. They said that relentless units may charge after rapid firing.
Which is fair. A bit atypical, but necrons didn't really have those sort of tools before.

Who says it has random powers, seriously. You may just randomly pick a certain number of powers at the beginning of the game.

Who knows!! We don't!

Hollismason wrote:
Who says it has random powers, seriously. You may just randomly pick a certain number of powers at the beginning of the game.

Who knows!! We don't!

Here



In the shooting phase, pick a target and roll a die.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
Who says it has random powers, seriously. You may just randomly pick a certain number of powers at the beginning of the game.

Who knows!! We don't!

Here


In the shooting phase, pick a target and roll a die.

Ninja'd!

Talys wrote:
Codex: Necrons Cryptek Edition is online for preorder. 1000 individually numbered copies with codex, 22 datasheets, 6 objective markers (metal), and double-sided poster.

It will be gone in a few minutes, so get it now if you want it.

$200 Canadian.

Have been up for awhile now.

Well, grabbed my Cryptek Edition.

I'm really surprised we haven't seen more from the rules yet, with the release only a week out. They've kept a tight lid on that portion.

Looks like Lords of Wargaming has been on the money so far. Plastic Lord, codex release date were on the money. The Decurion looks to be the Dynasty tactics that was spoken of.

Ah okay well that sucks and I can understand the bitching, but hey NIGHT BRINGER AND THE DECIEVER!

Hollismason wrote:
Ah okay well that sucks and I can understand the bitching, but hey NIGHT BRINGER AND THE DECIEVER!

All this means is that they took away the option of making your own Shard. There's just the three official models, end of story. Screw you guys with your scratch built Dragon shards.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

 Tokhuah wrote:

If you like the weird way is legs are spread, the glowing chubby stump crotch thrust (wiggle, wiggle wiggle, wiggle, yeah) and the general design that looks like re-purposed bits then it is totally awesome! The Overlord response shows how starved people are for more Necron models...

Yeah, the more I look at it the more I dislike it.

- That headgear just looks... weird. it almost looks like someone decided to add steampunk elements to them (is he wearing half a gear...? ).

- Why has his scythe got two holes in it? Did Tom and Jerry jump up and bang their heads on it?

- Why is he holding his scythe the wrong way round? Is he going to try hitting his enemies with the blunt end?

- He looks like he's straining far too hard to make that pose. Is his left leg glued to the ground?

- Is that a laser-codpiece? O_o

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
His powers are random.

And like that you've lost me.

The C'tan did not have random powers in the 3rd ed book.
In fact, when I think C'tan, I certainly do not think random. I don't care how capricious they are, its just not right.
Doesn't help the pace of the game either; there are already too many random tables in the game, they didn't need to add more.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NakedSeamus wrote:
Hey, I know I always wanted to have something to do in the psychic phase and maybe now i do. I'm pretty stoked.

They only thing a necron should do in the psychic phase is shut it down.

That's your opinion :-P

 lord_blackfang wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
Ah okay well that sucks and I can understand the bitching, but hey NIGHT BRINGER AND THE DECIEVER!

All this means is that they took away the option of making your own Shard. There's just the three official models, end of story. Screw you guys with your scratch built Dragon shards.

I guess they got tired of players using the old metal C'tans instead of buying a vault and using the tiny plastic C'tan.

Nightbringer model as T. C'tan > plastic T. C'tan

davethepak wrote:
We don't know what the random effects are.

Regarding the ctan - T7 is worthless with a 4++ save.
It just is. In a world of wave serpents, tau missile launchers, grav amps, autocannon dreds, or heck, just plasma - a 4++ save is incredibly bad at 240 points.

A t7 model with a 2/4++ or 3/4++ - not bad.

However, we have no idea what they will actually have - I was merely giving input on past actual experience comparing to the new point cost. I hope they are good.

Funny you should mention grav amps since they do almost nothing (wound on 6+) to you if you don't have an armor save...but in your example of what they 'should' have they become wounded on a 2+ or 3+ and still won't get that armor save...

 ClassicCarraway wrote:
Actually, for a game such as 40k, fluff is the primary reason for a mechanic or rule to exist. Reanimation Protocols exists because of the fluff. They Shall Know No Fear exists because of the fluff. Warp Storm exists because of the fluff....I could go on for several paragraphs, but you should be able to see my point. Every 40k game mechanic that is unique to an army is based on that army's fluff.

Your example of the heroic dreadnaught is flawed, because that is a one-off " story time" fluff piece and not a general description of the unit in question, where as the C'Tan shards are described in general as unwilling slaves.

Not quite, there's a difference between a concept and a game mechanic. Using your example, animation protocols is a concept, whereas the game mechanic (which is the TT abstraction of that concept) is fallen models getting back up on a d6 result. The fluff justifies the existence of the concept, but it doesn't justify the existence of the mechanic that brings that concept to life. The game mechanic that actually represents RP has changed multiple times, for example, and may even change to simple FnP this edition.

Similarly, the C'Tan being crazy and disobeying its masters' orders may be a fluff concept, but there are a number of different mechanics one can use to go about representing that concept, random powers being just one of them.

I don't get what your point is regarding the dreadnought example. A) No fluff is "more valid" then others, regardless of how frequent its been thrown around. B) You're missing the forest for the trees- you can replace the dreadnought with space marines, which have frequently been shown defeating armies that outnumber them dozens to one, and my point remains the same. Just because a mechanic may be "fluffy" doesn't mean that it belongs in a game.

The really sad thing is, if it had been the other way around (roll for C'tan power THEN pick target) it would have been a hell of a lot more versatile.
With the way it's going now, you could choose a Landraider, roll, and end up getting a power with S8 AP3... oh boy, that's some delicious forged narrative right there.
>:[

Better forge a letter showing your distaste for the situation

maybe on a roll of a 6 they will give a damn

Geez people the codex is out (in a warehouse somewhere) now get on the leaked pages all ready!!

^ Heh

Regarding the C'tan, I'm still holding out hope for the duel-profiles before I declare total doom n' gloom. It's possible that GW integrated the alternate-attack after accounting for the fact that there's a wide variety targets out there that require specific kinds of attacks to deal with.

But, we'll see.