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 djones520 wrote:


http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.28-PM.png
http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.25-PM.png

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

that's 2 times, not 9. as lastly 92% of murderers are male, as males are 92% more likely to commit murder than a women, males are more likely to encounter the police, because they are more likely to commit a crime. What crimes did you commit today?

sirlynchmob wrote:
[quote=djones520 627780 7448518 96cea106a6d01a4adda65c5117d1354d.png

http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.28-PM.png
http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.25-PM.png

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

that's 2 times, not 9. as lastly 92% of murderers are male, as males are 92% more likely to commit murder than a women, males are more likely to encounter the police, because they are more likely to commit a crime. What crimes did you commit today?

sirlynchmob wrote:

 djones520 wrote:


http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.28-PM.png
http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.25-PM.png

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

that's 2 times, not 9. as lastly 92% of murderers are male, as males are 92% more likely to commit murder than a women, males are more likely to encounter the police, because they are more likely to commit a crime. What crimes did you commit today?

You do understand that you have to look at population percentages and then extrapolate those out, right?

FFS.

 cincydooley wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

 djones520 wrote:


http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.28-PM.png
http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.25-PM.png

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

that's 2 times, not 9. as lastly 92% of murderers are male, as males are 92% more likely to commit murder than a women, males are more likely to encounter the police, because they are more likely to commit a crime. What crimes did you commit today?

You do understand that you have to look at population percentages and then extrapolate those out, right?

FFS.

To much thinking outside the box

 cincydooley wrote:

You do understand that you have to look at population percentages and then extrapolate those out, right?

The presented data already controls for that, sort of.

 cincydooley wrote:

FFS.

Indeed.

 dogma wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

You do understand that you have to look at population percentages and then extrapolate those out, right?

The presented data already controls for that, sort of.

You're right, it does.

The numbers lynchmob is trying to compare don't.

 cincydooley wrote:

The numbers lynchmob is trying to compare don't.

Sirlynchmob is citing djones520.

 dogma wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

The numbers lynchmob is trying to compare don't.

Sirlynchmob is citing djones520.

Right, but he's only pulling THESE numbers:

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

to get his 2:1

Exactly. Pure murder numbers alone, it is 2 to 1. But when you take the population disparity into account, that number actually sky rockets.

 cincydooley wrote:


Right, but he's only pulling THESE numbers:

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

to get his 2:1

True, but he is still right that the data does not support djones520's 9:1 claim.

 dogma wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:


Right, but he's only pulling THESE numbers:

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

to get his 2:1

True, but he is still right that the data does not support djones520's 9:1 claim.

Umm... why don't you go show me how the numbers that they have on those spread sheets don't support it.

Per the census data, white teen males 15-19 were 8.4 million. black teen males 15-19 were 1.8 million.

So, if you have the populations ona 1:1 ratio, the murder rate for black teens would actually be around 3900. Which is just about 9 times the total of murders committed by white teens.

 cincydooley wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

 djones520 wrote:


http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.28-PM.png
http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Screen-Shot-2014-10-12-at-Sunday-October-12-2.25-PM.png

OK I see now, you don't understand how those charts work.

murderers by race 13-19 total
whites blacks
457 816

that's 2 times, not 9. as lastly 92% of murderers are male, as males are 92% more likely to commit murder than a women, males are more likely to encounter the police, because they are more likely to commit a crime. What crimes did you commit today?

You do understand that you have to look at population percentages and then extrapolate those out, right?

FFS.

Sure I do, and that is a rather narrow data point, actual murders. what happens when you add in all the other homicides? I bet that would become a much more balanced number. It might even make the white population look like a bunch of thugs & criminals. Cops alone add another 400 bodies a year that's not represented on that chart. Let's look at all homicides, anywhere someone dies at the hands of another and see what fun extrapolations we can make with those numbers.

Lets look at the real numbers first, you have a population 1/4 the size that only committed 2 times the murders. Then you extrapolate it to "9 times more likely" to help spread the fear towards blacks. look what criminals and murderers they are. That's why when a white guy shoots a black guy he can claim "he scared me so I stood my ground" and be 354times more likely to be found justified and thus it wouldn't be ruled a murder.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/criminal-justice/is-there-racial-bias-in-stand-your-ground-laws/

816 is not that much more than 457, and based on the size of america it's actually quite low overall. Not to bad considering america is #1 amongst the developed nations in number of guns & gun deaths.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/health/2013/09/19/u-s-has-more-guns-and-gun-deaths-than-any-other-country-study-finds/

Newsflash: just because it's called a homicide doesn't make it a murder!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

sirlynchmob wrote:


816 is not that much more than 457, and based on the size of america it's actually quite low overall.

You're right. Double isn't that much more.

This has nothing to do with spreading fear, and I'd appreciate it if you'd keep BS claims like that from the discussion.

This is looking at pure numbers.

You have 17% of the population committing 52.5% of the murders. (this is all age groups)

17% of the population makes up 50.6% of those in the prison system. (all age groups)

The question was why are black people more likely to encounter the police. That is why I introduced those statistics.

 Kilkrazy wrote:

Which brings us back to the root of the problem. Ethnic minorities especially black people have a view, well founded in reality, that they are much more likely to be stopped and/or arrested by the police, who are majority white.

Per 100,000 people black individuals are statistically much higher to break the law, and encounter law enforcement then white individuals. This has nothing to do with racism or anything, it's just pure statistics.

I have stated in here a ton of times, that we need to find the root cause of that. Stop pointing fingers at the results, start pointing fingers at the causes. You cut out the cause of it, then the number of tragedies will just plummet.

 djones520 wrote:
This has nothing to do with spreading fear, and I'd appreciate it if you'd keep BS claims like that from the discussion.

This is looking at pure numbers.

You have 17% of the population committing 52.5% of the murders. (this is all age groups)

17% of the population makes up 50.6% of those in the prison system. (all age groups)

The question was why are black people more likely to encounter the police. That is why I introduced those statistics.

 Kilkrazy wrote:

Which brings us back to the root of the problem. Ethnic minorities especially black people have a view, well founded in reality, that they are much more likely to be stopped and/or arrested by the police, who are majority white.

Per 100,000 people black individuals are statistically much higher to break the law, and encounter law enforcement then white individuals. This has nothing to do with racism or anything, it's just pure statistics.

I have stated in here a ton of times, that we need to find the root cause of that. Stop pointing fingers at the results, start pointing fingers at the causes. You cut out the cause of it, then the number of tragedies will just plummet.

The root cause is easy, the inherent racism in America. I'm surprised you forgot the "black on black" crime statistic. Why do we never hear in the news about the "white on white" crime problem? the "christian on christian" crime problem? christians do make up 75% of the prison population. obviously the all bigger criminals and encounter cops far more often than blacks right? It's just a statistic after all. so the obvious conclusion must be

So yes, young christen men are going to be more likely to encounter the police, because they are more likely, by significant numbers, to commit a crime.

Fixed your quote for you.

per 100,000 black people are more likely to be framed and have evidence planted on them as well.

Prison sentences of black men were nearly 20% longer than those of white men for similar crimes in recent years, an analysis by the U.S. Sentencing Commission found.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887324432004578304463789858002

From police officers to prosecutors to prison guards, the entire system is rigged against minorities, the poor and Blacks. This is why 80 percent of criminal defendants are indigent and cannot hire a lawyer. It is why 70 percent of exonerations by DNA testing are of people of color. It is also why there are such widespread racial disparities in sentencing.
The number of African-Americans in the prison-industrial complex quadrupled in the three years after the War on Drugs began. Despite the fact that 5 times as many whites use drugs than African-Americans, the latter are imprisoned for drug crimes at a rate of 10 times that of Whites.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/omer-aziz/the-system-didnt-fail-eri_b_6305172.html

recognize these quotes from the video earlier?
"lets have a black day"
"lets get some more color around the place"

So yes, let's admit there is a racism problem still in the US, and fix it.

 djones520 wrote:


17% of the population makes up 50.6% of those in the prison system. (all age groups)

(snip)

Per 100,000 people black individuals are statistically much higher to break the law, and encounter law enforcement then white individuals. This has nothing to do with racism or anything, it's just pure statistics.

See, this is where I think you made a reasonable but possibly erroneous leap of logic. You're presuming that because blacks are overrepresented in prison, they are then therefore statistically more likely to break the law. I think there are a lot of really obvious variables that would explain why that chicken might not have laid that egg, as it were. Do you think our legal system treats black defendants as fairly as white defendants, on average?

Consider stop & frisk. Whites in NY make up only a fraction of those stopped (84% are black and latino), but are statistically much likely to actually have contraband when they are stopped (1 in 49 stops for whites yielded a gun vs 71 for latinos and 93 for blacks, or nearly half as likely)). Drugs go the same way - one of every 43 stops of whites found drugs, vs 57 for latinos and 61 for blacks.

I suspect if the NYPD did more aggressive stop & frisks on Wall Street of executives at lunch vs Bed-Stuy, those ratios of drugs found would indicate a problem with your logic. But they're not going to, so we'll never know.

 Ouze wrote:

 djones520 wrote:


17% of the population makes up 50.6% of those in the prison system. (all age groups)

(snip)

Per 100,000 people black individuals are statistically much higher to break the law, and encounter law enforcement then white individuals. This has nothing to do with racism or anything, it's just pure statistics.

See, this is where I think you made a reasonable but possibly erroneous leap of logic. You're presuming that because blacks are overrepresented in prison, they are then therefore statistically more likely to break the law. I think there are a lot of really obvious variables that would explain why that chicken might not have laid that egg, as it were. Do you think our legal system treats black defendants as fairly as white defendants, on average?

Consider stop & frisk. Whites in NY make up only a fraction of those stopped (84% are black and latino), but are statistically much likely to actually have contraband when they are stopped (1 in 49 stops for whites yielded a gun vs 71 for latinos and 93 for blacks, or nearly half as likely)). Drugs go the same way - one of every 43 stops of whites found drugs, vs 57 for latinos and 61 for blacks.

I suspect if the NYPD did more aggressive stop & frisks on Wall Street of executives at lunch vs Bed-Stuy, those ratios of drugs found would indicate a problem with your logic. But they're not going to, so we'll never know.

This is a circular argument because someone going to throw up a map of high crimes area where stop and frisk was implemented. Since I've done similar I call BS on Stop and Frisk idea and counter a "high presence" to counter what Stop and Frisk tries to do. Curtail crime.

 cincydooley wrote:

 Dreadwinter wrote:


I like how you are implying that by questioning LEO's carrying around 2-3 extra clips I am suddenly arguing the whole aspect of their use of firearms. I am also suddenly calling for all LEOs to drop their 2nd and 3rd magazine. I have not once talked about the caliber of a bullet or anything else you have implied. You are implying that I am saying a lot and all I am doing is asking you to provide evidence for your arguments. I said none of these things. I really expected much better from you.

You understand I used all those other qualifiers because it greatly impacts the magazine size, correct?

I'm implying that you don't actually know what you're talking about.

You realize I am talking about a 9mm, which is the only sidearm that has been mentioned in this thread, correct?

 Jihadin wrote:
This is a circular argument because someone going to throw up a map of high crimes area where stop and frisk was implemented. Since I've done similar I call BS on Stop and Frisk idea and counter a "high presence" to counter what Stop and Frisk tries to do. Curtail crime.

Probably to the former, and to the other, yes I agree: community policing isn't done nearly as well as it could be in many areas.

 Dreadwinter wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

 Dreadwinter wrote:


I like how you are implying that by questioning LEO's carrying around 2-3 extra clips I am suddenly arguing the whole aspect of their use of firearms. I am also suddenly calling for all LEOs to drop their 2nd and 3rd magazine. I have not once talked about the caliber of a bullet or anything else you have implied. You are implying that I am saying a lot and all I am doing is asking you to provide evidence for your arguments. I said none of these things. I really expected much better from you.

You understand I used all those other qualifiers because it greatly impacts the magazine size, correct?

I'm implying that you don't actually know what you're talking about.

You realize I am talking about a 9mm, which is the only sidearm that has been mentioned in this thread, correct?

Full size? Compact? Sub Compact? Are you assuming all LEOs carry 9mms? Because they don't.

One final post for some additional clarity as to what is happening: Now why would fox "news" be altering footage? I'd call it fear mongering and racism.





What they said, "We won’t stop, we can’t stop, untill the killer cop is in a cell block"
Fox changes it to this: ‘We won’t stop, we can’t stop, so kill a cop,’”

"Kill-a cop"
sounds like "Kill a cop"

Pronunciation is off

Edit

Wait
Ebonic in play?
Kill a cop
Killa cop

 cincydooley wrote:

video

Is that another fox edit job? what site has the original footage?

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

video

Is that another fox edit job? what site has the original footage?

Youtube

Edit

or
http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Eric-Garner-Manhattan-Dead-Cops-Video-Millions-March-Protest-285805731.html

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

video

Is that another fox edit job? what site has the original footage?

Clearly not. Nice try. That is the original.

 djones520 wrote:

Umm... why don't you go show me how the numbers that they have on those spread sheets don't support it.

Per the census data, white teen males 15-19 were 8.4 million. black teen males 15-19 were 1.8 million.

So, if you have the populations ona 1:1 ratio, the murder rate for black teens would actually be around 3900. Which is just about 9 times the total of murders committed by white teens.

If you re-read the tables the data indicates something in the area of an 8-1 ratio, and that is an estimate derived from 3 different data sets. Specifically the rate of murder commission among US citizens aged 13-19, the same of US citizens aged 17-19, and the number of US citizens aged 15-19; all broken down by racial identity.

So are we, within the US of A, dealing with a "War of Cops" situation now?

sirlynchmob wrote:

The root cause is easy, the inherent racism in America.

Don't forget systemic poverty.

 Jihadin wrote:
So are we, within the US of A, dealing with a "War of Cops" situation now?

As much as we are dealing with a "War on Black Men". We love war, after all, and there is no problem we can't turn into a war: war on drugs, war on poverty, war on terrorism, war on crime, ect ect. It is all war all the time!