Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hollismason wrote:
Yeah dunno what to do when someone takes 2 Wraith Knights, a Crimson Hunter Formation and then the Windrider Detachment.

Not many people do know what to do against that. Best things for Necrons I can recommend, Destroyer Cult, Canoptek Harvest with Beamer Wraiths, and troops. Also, to deal with the Jetbikes, Overlord on a Command barge with a Warscythe.

Decurion with mass Reclamation Legion Troop spamming, with Night Scythes and maybe Canoptek. That's my gut reaction. Destroyers feel too expensive against something that can shoot them down before they can fo anything, unless you're going mass DS with them.

And I love the Destroyer Cult =/

I think you might just have to shake hands and congratulate them on their skilled Eldarhammer 40k abilities and move on.

Other possibility is to convert up a wraithknight of your own and run the single wraithknight detachment (s).

Also Warp Spiders absolutely murderize the army. Like more than jetbikes as they wound almost everything on a 2+ and have Pseudorending and super manueverability.

GDYGW

Necrons have that relatively easy. No worry about a backfield Fire Dragon surprise? Sentry Pylon or Obelisk for AA. Vault for an opening volley and pray for good rolls. Mass Troops, Ghost Ark, Rez Orbs and go for 6's, and Destroyer Cult.

Hell, Imotekh might even be good in such a case because you'd get one round of hitting nearly everything on the table with S6, which might take out a handful of bikes and hit a plane or two for free.

But we're gifted with a very resilient codex. Most other armies? ...

Sounds like you would be throwing a lot of money out to just run the chance of doing okay. $165 for the sub par obelisk and $100+ for some pylons of general meh.

Nothing is good about tossing hundreds of dollars just to get by sorta maybe.

Just ideas, obviously depends on your budget, play style, army comp.

Pylon is pretty great. Both have strong AA, which was my biggest reason for mentioning them.

Thing is the large plyon or the little ones would be in a bad way against 1 or 2 wraithknights. You could deepstrike the little ones but given newdars (coining it!) Unparalleled mobility you could be left with next to nothing in good targets. Worse would be you could be left with next to no army by the time they come in lol.

Me I've got no chance. I spent a bunch on upgrading to some new vehicles to play the mechron list I thought would be neat an fun. I will NOT be making any more additions to my already bloated collection.

Mechrons don't stand a chance against newdar. With 1 to 2 wraithknights I'm looking at 1 to 4 crippled vehicles a turn, likely around 3 vehicles. Just hitting our vehicles and rolling higher then 1 we lose our quantum shielding. The bikes will dust whatever is left of the vehicle. The warriors will be left flailing on their own after wards.

Might drop some bikes with my doomsday arks before they get gimped by d weapons. I might be able to get one WK with the 10 praetorians in my judicator battalion IF the eldar player doesn't merc my stalkers right out of the gate lol

I think that Flayed Ones and Deathmarks are going to be our friends, but unfortunately STD ignores RP. So dunno what to do about that..

Just tough, just really really tough.

Destroyer cults will be great against both bikes and Wrathknights with their re-rollable AP3 guns so I'm entirely unworried about crons.

Vehicles are deader than dead though so footcrons are the future.

Kinda as I'm seeing it pretty likely that Eldar players are either going to pack dscythe WG in serpents, warpspiders or hemlocks. All 3 will murdalate everything they touch and are equal solid against destroyers. Plus with GWs sagacious oversight most eldar stuff is so under costed that you can and will see all that stuff in one list.

I believe we are either going to see the biker formation plus a CAD and the Wraith construct formation. Or just a CAD plus wraith construct formation. Which will be 2 WK at the minimum I'm thinking for the competitive bent lists.

Bikes will be there for clean up work if the eldar player is smart. So I don't think they will be the actual central threat ( yah I know I've seen how good they are).

We also can't forget that eldar are also redankulous in the psychic phase....so we gotta plan to be totally dominated in that area too unfortunately.

Hollismason wrote:
I think that Flayed Ones and Deathmarks are going to be our friends, but unfortunately STD ignores RP. So dunno what to do about that..

Just tough, just really really tough.

There's not much we can do about it. I think my current plan is to do bodies. Lots and lots of Warriors, Flayed Ones, Deathmarks, etc. Wraiths are going to find a place just because foot mobility and 3++. Scarabs are now one of my new best friends - expendible, fast, can tie up things, and can even put some wounds on a Wraithknight if they can survive. Sure it gets saves against the Entropic Strikes and insta-drops the bases, but with Spyder support they should have enough bases to tie up for a while and do so for far less points cost.

Night Scythes are going to see the tabletop because the one thing the Eldar book lacks is heavy anti-air, it seems to just be Dark Reapers (which will probably still not be seen that much as they compete with other options) and Swooping Hawks, but with Supersonic and dropping Troops I'm not too overly worried about them.

Strength D is a pain, but we've got lots of cheap options where losing models isn't going to be a big deal. Orikanstar might still work - it'll still get 3++ rerolling 1s against D weaponry, and the Flamer Wraithguard can't roll that necessary 6 to ignore. If they get to a Wraithknight they might be able to do something to it (ignore its armor, Warscythes might eventually drop it), though it'd be quite difficult to do so. Still, a durable unit that works against all but 6 on D is going to be good, no matter what.

I'm really considering throwing Chronometrons around more now. There's going to be a lot of AP2 and D, and with all the Div rolls possibly granting Misfortune for Rending we're going to need those Invuln saves. A big unit of Warriors with Chronometron can even stand up to Wraithguard and win out point for point, imo.

The crimson hunter is only like 10pts more the our flyers and is built for killing them with its vector dancer. The crimson hunter formation if it gets popular due to necron flyer spam will run rough shod over our flyers. Those dark reapers are cheap and kill flyers good. Scatbikes can nickle an dime av11 flyers due to high shot output and psyker support.

Its really hard to figure out what to due because the eldar can literally hard counter every trick we have if they want to.

The best I can think of is to run something solid that runs counter to conventional necron net lists. An just hope what you did is unexpected for the eldar opponent.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
The crimson hunter is only like 10pts more the our flyers and is built for killing them with its vector dancer. The crimson hunter formation if it gets popular due to necron flyer spam will run rough shod over our flyers. Those dark reapers are cheap and kill flyers good. Scatbikes can nickle an dime av11 flyers due to high shot output and psyker support.

Its really hard to figure out what to due because the eldar can literally hard counter every trick we have if they want to.

The best I can think of is to run something solid that runs counter to conventional necron net lists. An just hope what you did is unexpected for the eldar opponent.

Well any army can counter nearly anything with enough preparation. I don't think it's about creating a Necron list that can't be countered by anything in the Eldar book, it's about building a list that works well against most things and very good against the super popular things. Which, at this point, are going to be Wraiths and Bikes. I don't think worrying about Aspects or pricey flyers should come up since people are going to throw most of their points into the aforementioned power units.

As for Jetbikes plinking off Flyers, I'm not so much worried about that. In fact, I'm not so much worried about our Flyers dying at all. Once they drop their dudes off, I usually write them off as a lost cause since they rarely get to shoot more than once or twice (Zooming, hull mounted guns, and min distances) and they can't score. Which is why I don't generally take them anyway, but having a way to counter the insane Jetbike mobility is tantamount in my eyes.

Currently, our options for this include:
-Night Scythes
-Jetbikes of our own
-Infiltrate/Outflanking Flayed Ones
-Veil and/or Obyron
-Deep Striking Destroyers

Also considering Praetorians. They'd die like fools to D weaponry, but maybe they're fast enough with AP2 guns to deal with Wraithguard at the very least? They can fight Bikes pretty well if they can get in range, and can even somewhat threaten a Wraithknight (ignore armor, can at least wound, 2 attacks each), though they still go second and either get doubled out or D'd.

Yeah the Crimson Hunter Formation is really almost a auto take with it's special abilities.

1 of them is actually BS5 reroll 1s. It's pretty nasty formation. It's inexpensive as well at 140 a piece an then 1 Exarch for 160. 440 for 3 Fliers that have Preferred enemy.

Hollismason wrote:
Yeah the Crimson Hunter Formation is really almost a auto take with it's special abilities.

1 of them is actually BS5 reroll 1s. It's pretty nasty formation. It's inexpensive as well at 140 a piece an then 1 Exarch for 160. 440 for 3 Fliers that have Preferred enemy.

440 seems cheap, but that's 440 for flyers in an army that's already spending a lot on Jetbikes and Wraiths. I don't know what the current lists are, but there's a reason I don't throw in the Deathbringer Flight in my Necron lists even though I think it's fantastic, and it's only 320 base.

But it depends. If they show up more, Night Scythes lose value. If they don't, then Night Scythes can rule the skies (after, you know, Flyrants).

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Thing is the large plyon or the little ones would be in a bad way against 1 or 2 wraithknights. You could deepstrike the little ones but given newdars (coining it!) Unparalleled mobility you could be left with next to nothing in good targets. Worse would be you could be left with next to no army by the time they come in lol.

Me I've got no chance. I spent a bunch on upgrading to some new vehicles to play the mechron list I thought would be neat an fun. I will NOT be making any more additions to my already bloated collection.

Mechrons don't stand a chance against newdar. With 1 to 2 wraithknights I'm looking at 1 to 4 crippled vehicles a turn, likely around 3 vehicles. Just hitting our vehicles and rolling higher then 1 we lose our quantum shielding. The bikes will dust whatever is left of the vehicle. The warriors will be left flailing on their own after wards.

Might drop some bikes with my doomsday arks before they get gimped by d weapons. I might be able to get one WK with the 10 praetorians in my judicator battalion IF the eldar player doesn't merc my stalkers right out of the gate lol

On the contrary, Quantum Shield > Bikes.

So unless you're at 2k+ points facing two WK, having 2+ vehicles ensures that either they're not blowing up the bulk of your army, but you'll have a turn or two to use them to blow up the bikes.

You could start with an Anni. Nexus at the front of your deployment line to hit as many bikes as possible with Tesla and large/blast before their inevitable death, for instance. He can't kill all three and if the Anni Barge survives any pens, he can get his shield back

 buddha wrote:
Destroyer cults will be great against both bikes and Wrathknights with their re-rollable AP3 guns so I'm entirely unworried about crons.

Vehicles are deader than dead though so footcrons are the future.

Destroyer cults also cost much more per unit than bikes, and will die relatively quick to a similarly priced number of bikes (I believe, not doing the math).

I really think mass Warriors and Vehicles are going to be our best bet.

a. Vehicles > Bikes
b. Ergo, WK hits them first, won't be able to kill all first round.
c. Warriors, given their sheer numbers, will be able to destroy about anything.

Back them up with Arks for repair - and that's even more targets for the WK to shoot at since it's Gauss can hurt it and those 10 shots will take out bikes.

Flayed Ones I'm iffy on. Can't catch bikes unless you can swamp them in mobs and Stomp will do bad things. Given, they're good against just about anything else. And if they have Wraithguard with Scythe... well... yikes.

And deathmarks, obviously, for any sudden backfield surprises.

I'm thinking Ghost Arks are probably the only good Vehicle option. Not just here against Eldar, but in general. CCB coming in second, situational as discussed..

Stalker is a good boost but is too slow and fragile, either it's sitting in the back to be safe but is only minimally contributing for the points, or it's walking with the midline troops and is a nice juicy target.

Annibarges are more expensive and worse since they can't Jink on a whim anymore. Still decent gun platforms, but with the loss of reliable defense (Jinking isn't an automatic response anymore), they're not as good.

Doomsday Arks are actually quite good now, but they still suffer from certain issues. Firstly, if they ever have to Jink or get Stunned (if not taken in a Decurion), they're useless. All firepower gone. Same goes for Weapon Destroyed. And while 4 HP AV13 is nice, anything anti tank drop podding or DSing in (Haywire guns, Melta, Wraithguard, etc) is just going to laugh because Open Topped and no saves for that many points is funny.

They work if taken on top of a Skyshield Landing Pad. Other than that, meh. Killer against certain things, but a single long range anti-tank or dropped in anti-tank and they're done for, just like the rest of our vehicles.

Monolith is just bad. I talked about the Superheavies previously, I like the Obelisk.

Ghost Arks are, however, good. They're cheap - the cheapest vehicle in the book. And since they're not there for guns, who cares if they Jink? Jink doesn't affect the riders, so you're only affecting 1/3 to 1/2 of the shooting power. If you Cruising speed it and force everything to snap shot, then that's fine too, there's a lot of shots. If it gets blown up, who cares? Warriors are wounded on 4s and then ignore 3/4 of those wounds anyway. The only downside is against Flamer weaponry, but that's nearly inevitable and is workable around, either by bubble wrapping or just positioning. Torrent is a bitch and a half, though.

So yeah. I'm probably going to swing more of them soonish.

Praetorians will be good as well T5 3+ , 5+ Jump Infantry and ST6 shooting or St5 AP2.

Annihilation Barges will be good as well.

Lot of shots , cheap, etc...

The Walkers will be good as well.

Basically anything T5 or AV13.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
The crimson hunter is only like 10pts more the our flyers and is built for killing them with its vector dancer. The crimson hunter formation if it gets popular due to necron flyer spam will run rough shod over our flyers. Those dark reapers are cheap and kill flyers good. Scatbikes can nickle an dime av11 flyers due to high shot output and psyker support.

Its really hard to figure out what to due because the eldar can literally hard counter every trick we have if they want to.

The best I can think of is to run something solid that runs counter to conventional necron net lists. An just hope what you did is unexpected for the eldar opponent.

I honestly think you're over reacting a bit. If they bring the Crimson Hunter formation, thats a TON of points. Points that they don't have towards countering other things. And Scatriders probably won't be as big of a deal. Yeah, they can hurt stuff, but die rather easily.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Requizen wrote:

 BrotherGecko wrote:
The crimson hunter is only like 10pts more the our flyers and is built for killing them with its vector dancer. The crimson hunter formation if it gets popular due to necron flyer spam will run rough shod over our flyers. Those dark reapers are cheap and kill flyers good. Scatbikes can nickle an dime av11 flyers due to high shot output and psyker support.

Its really hard to figure out what to due because the eldar can literally hard counter every trick we have if they want to.

The best I can think of is to run something solid that runs counter to conventional necron net lists. An just hope what you did is unexpected for the eldar opponent.

Well any army can counter nearly anything with enough preparation. I don't think it's about creating a Necron list that can't be countered by anything in the Eldar book, it's about building a list that works well against most things and very good against the super popular things. Which, at this point, are going to be Wraiths and Bikes. I don't think worrying about Aspects or pricey flyers should come up since people are going to throw most of their points into the aforementioned power units.

As for Jetbikes plinking off Flyers, I'm not so much worried about that. In fact, I'm not so much worried about our Flyers dying at all. Once they drop their dudes off, I usually write them off as a lost cause since they rarely get to shoot more than once or twice (Zooming, hull mounted guns, and min distances) and they can't score. Which is why I don't generally take them anyway, but having a way to counter the insane Jetbike mobility is tantamount in my eyes.

Currently, our options for this include:
-Night Scythes
-Jetbikes of our own
-Infiltrate/Outflanking Flayed Ones
-Veil and/or Obyron
-Deep Striking Destroyers

Also considering Praetorians. They'd die like fools to D weaponry, but maybe they're fast enough with AP2 guns to deal with Wraithguard at the very least? They can fight Bikes pretty well if they can get in range, and can even somewhat threaten a Wraithknight (ignore armor, can at least wound, 2 attacks each), though they still go second and either get doubled out or D'd.

You guys are giving the Strength D too much credit. Sure, it effing sucks for our army, but it's decently priced. If they have a reliable delivery system for Wraithguard, thats one unit they'll eat, possibly not even making their points back, and then dying horribly. And the Wraithknight has 2, count'em, 2 Strength D shots. So, at best, could kill two infantry models a turn. Wooo, nice for 300 points. Also remember, we're one of the few armies where literally anything we have can hurt it. Warriors can kill it. And we have a ton of Deep Striking things, and good, cheap flyers that are transports. We have ways for dealing with Eldar. Plentiful ways. Hell, we're probably the only codex that can easily deal with whatever they throw at us.

 Ferros wrote:

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Thing is the large plyon or the little ones would be in a bad way against 1 or 2 wraithknights. You could deepstrike the little ones but given newdars (coining it!) Unparalleled mobility you could be left with next to nothing in good targets. Worse would be you could be left with next to no army by the time they come in lol.

Me I've got no chance. I spent a bunch on upgrading to some new vehicles to play the mechron list I thought would be neat an fun. I will NOT be making any more additions to my already bloated collection.

Mechrons don't stand a chance against newdar. With 1 to 2 wraithknights I'm looking at 1 to 4 crippled vehicles a turn, likely around 3 vehicles. Just hitting our vehicles and rolling higher then 1 we lose our quantum shielding. The bikes will dust whatever is left of the vehicle. The warriors will be left flailing on their own after wards.

Might drop some bikes with my doomsday arks before they get gimped by d weapons. I might be able to get one WK with the 10 praetorians in my judicator battalion IF the eldar player doesn't merc my stalkers right out of the gate lol

On the contrary, Quantum Shield > Bikes.

So unless you're at 2k+ points facing two WK, having 2+ vehicles ensures that either they're not blowing up the bulk of your army, but you'll have a turn or two to use them to blow up the bikes.

You could start with an Anni. Nexus at the front of your deployment line to hit as many bikes as possible with Tesla and large/blast before their inevitable death, for instance. He can't kill all three and if the Anni Barge survives any pens, he can get his shield back

 buddha wrote:
Destroyer cults will be great against both bikes and Wrathknights with their re-rollable AP3 guns so I'm entirely unworried about crons.

Vehicles are deader than dead though so footcrons are the future.

Destroyer cults also cost much more per unit than bikes, and will die relatively quick to a similarly priced number of bikes (I believe, not doing the math).

I really think mass Warriors and Vehicles are going to be our best bet.

a. Vehicles > Bikes
b. Ergo, WK hits them first, won't be able to kill all first round.
c. Warriors, given their sheer numbers, will be able to destroy about anything.

Back them up with Arks for repair - and that's even more targets for the WK to shoot at since it's Gauss can hurt it and those 10 shots will take out bikes.

Flayed Ones I'm iffy on. Can't catch bikes unless you can swamp them in mobs and Stomp will do bad things. Given, they're good against just about anything else. And if they have Wraithguard with Scythe... well... yikes.

And deathmarks, obviously, for any sudden backfield surprises.

WK are 295pts with any of the main weapons being free. If they took bright lances or missile launchers a single WK can potentially but not likely pen 4 vehicles. A GMC can fire all of its weapons at seperate targets. Couple that with 12" jump movement and a WK could shoot 4 vehicles an choose to charge the one it failed to do damage to. There it would kick any of our vehicles to splinters most ricky tick.

Mass warriors would have to pray for killing one in a single shooting phase. Otherwise the WK will gank the ghost ark support and then stomp the warriors to paste. Which is why a savy eldar player will assault in with the bikes, soak the overwatch and let the WK romper stomp yer boyz.

I feel like all I'm offering is doom and gloom but I've been playing this game for a long time and have never seen anything like this new eldar codex.

They don't have any real exploitable weakness. Not even high points cost low model count. They are good at everything.

 BrotherGecko wrote:


WK are 295pts with any of the main weapons being free. If they took bright lances or missile launchers a single WK can potentially but not likely pen 4 vehicles. A GMC can fire all of its weapons at seperate targets. Couple that with 12" jump movement and a WK could shoot 4 vehicles an choose to charge the one it failed to do damage to. There it would kick any of our vehicles to splinters most ricky tick.

Mass warriors would have to pray for killing one in a single shooting phase. Otherwise the WK will gank the ghost ark support and then stomp the warriors to paste. Which is why a savy eldar player will assault in with the bikes, soak the overwatch and let the WK romper stomp yer boyz.

I feel like all I'm offering is doom and gloom but I've been playing this game for a long time and have never seen anything like this new eldar codex.

They don't have any real exploitable weakness. Not even high points cost low model count. They are good at everything.

Low model count? I mean, are they literally spamming Scatriders and Wraithknights? Thats low model count. Are they using aspects with the detachment and formations? Restrictive list building with tax units, and their infantry are T3 with 4+ or 3+ saves. They go squish.

We both know that their decurion is as restrictive as ours. Which is to say it isn't at all really. Probably even less so as eldar do not have any weak units to be honest.

Scatriders are 27pts a piece and WK are 295pts, that will get you a lot of stuff with a lot of firepower.

The eldar may be t3 on average but what we are looking at is whole armies consisting of t4/t6/t8 units mixed with fast durable av12 vehicles.

I will agree horde crons will probably be our best bet. Eldar will be very strong against our vehicles and any "star" units will be too many points and far to easy to hurt with StrD firepower and eldars' uncanny speed. Our ability to veil is too easily countered by their ability to rapidily dance away. Preventing any reliable veil then next turn assault.

Necrons will be the biggest threat to total eldarhammer supremacy for now. I think ironically that will make us the biggest drivers in the eldar list meta.


Still the WK is a nice model. Would be a shame if it got a scarab infestation an showed up on our side of the board ; ).

 BrotherGecko wrote:
We both know that their decurion is as restrictive as ours. Which is to say it isn't at all really. Probably even less so as eldar do not have any weak units to be honest.

Scatriders are 27pts a piece and WK are 295pts, that will get you a lot of stuff with a lot of firepower.

The eldar may be t3 on average but what we are looking at is whole armies consisting of t4/t6/t8 units mixed with fast durable av12 vehicles.

I will agree horde crons will probably be our best bet. Eldar will be very strong against our vehicles and any "star" units will be too many points and far to easy to hurt with StrD firepower and eldars' uncanny speed. Our ability to veil is too easily countered by their ability to rapidily dance away. Preventing any reliable veil then next turn assault.

Necrons will be the biggest threat to total eldarhammer supremacy for now. I think ironically that will make us the biggest drivers in the eldar list meta.


Still the WK is a nice model. Would be a shame if it got a scarab infestation an showed up on our side of the board ; ).

Eldar have a board edge. I walked across the board at an entire Tau Suit army, and caught them, as they had nowhere else to run. Same thing would happen with them. And lets say they brought the Windrider host to get their Scatriders. Lets say they bring a decent number, lets say, 3 units of 5. Thats 405 points for 15 models. 15 Space marine models. Won't be that hard to kill. Then lets look at Wraithguard. Are they footslogging? They'll die in droves. If not? Well, if they're bringing them in the Wraithhost, thats a metric ton of points sunk right there into that, not including the fact that they'd have to buy Serpents for each unit of them. So thats pretty much their whole army right there. It's not the end of the world, especially for Necrons. And lets compare Orikanstar to Wraithguard with D-scythes. They wound on a 3+ with template weapons, and it's impossible for them to ignore our Invulns, so we still have a 3++ rerolling 1s. We just don't get our Reanimate. Then, next turn, the Lychguard charge (still being durable enough to survive the overwatch) and then mulch that squad that cost them about 210 points, not including the transport.

Why wouldn't we be looking at CADs plus formation support like necrons?

You know all this theoryhammering is just showing the necron v eldar has become little more then a expensive version of rock paper scissors.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Why wouldn't we be looking at CADs plus formation support like necrons?

You know all this theoryhammering is just showing the necron v eldar has become little more then a expensive version of rock paper scissors.

It's always possible, yes. But if so, they're not getting any bonuses to their troops, so there you go. There's always an upside, you just gotta look for it.

And not necessarily. If you're playing a game at your local store, and some dude wants to use an uber cheese list, build a list to counter it. If not, and they're just playing a casual, fluffy Eldar list, most casual Necron lists are going to have a field day.

 Ferros wrote:
Destroyer cults also cost much more per unit than bikes, and will die relatively quick to a similarly priced number of bikes (I believe, not doing the math).

3 scatterbikes cost nearly the same than 2 destroyers, so lets mathammer a plausible 6 Vs 4 engagement.

In the eldar side:
24 F6 shots that hits and wound at 3+ with a 3+/4+++ save.
24 * 2/3 * 2/3 * 1/3 * 1/2 = 16/9 wounds on average, 36 points of killed adversaries.

In the destroyer side:
12 F5 shots that hits and wound at 3+, but repeating all misses wounding and the 1's hitting; with a 4++ save if jinking.
12 * 7/9 * 8/9 * 1/2 = 112/27, all the scatterbikes are killed if they dont jink, and even then, at least 4 of them (112 enemy points).

So in a face to face engagement the destroyer cult are 3 times more killy and approximately 3 times more resistent.

Advantage for the necrons?
Actually I doubt it, the larger range and superior mobility of the scatterbikes should suffice to over maneuvering the destroyers and cause enough casualties to minimize response.

The only real advantage of destroyers is their capacity of deep strike and kill lots of scatterbikes before their retaliation, and before they move out of range.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
I feel like all I'm offering is doom and gloom but I've been playing this game for a long time and have never seen anything like this new eldar codex.

They don't have any real exploitable weakness. Not even high points cost low model count. They are good at everything.

I'm still considering the scatterbike a far better unit than the necron destroyer, but certaintly not one without debilities.

What about Night shroud bombers? 4hp av12 with ID vs t5 or lower large blast bombs, ap1 so no armor, possible that no cover save either since barrage, as well as blind and pinning meaning even if the unit survives they have a chance to not do much on their next turn.

The Tesseract Ark could also be useful av12 all around naturally so all the S6 spam can suck it av 13 because of the new QS rule, has a 5++ so has some defense against D most of the time (can't jink though). Small mountain of firepower from 4 gauss cannon shots and it's fire modes, the Solar Fire with 48" range of s7 ap 2 could put some wounds on the wraithknight

Eh... both were expensive last edition, and with the way everything got cheaper in the codex, most of the IA12 stuff lags behind just due to price, other than maybe Sentry Pylons. Night Shrouds are cool, and can do some serious damage, but can be finnicky. Still, I would put the Night Shroud and the Sentry Pylons as the only "competitive" choices from FW.