Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Doing the math in my head, Tomb Blades (go with Tesla on this for range reasons) will outshoot Eldar bikes of any sort.

Alcibiades wrote:
Doing the math in my head, Tomb Blades (go with Tesla on this for range reasons) will outshoot Eldar bikes of any sort.

The only issue is range. Eldar bikes move 12", have 36" guns, and can assault move 2d6. Tomb Blades would have to Turbo boost turn one and get up into their face and hope they survive until turn 2 to shoot.

Well lucky for necrons. They are meant to take a hit and survive. I feel that the eldar and necrons will be the teams to clash it out the most...Kinda feels like GW is wanting to recreate the War of heavens(get it? necrons vs Eldar).

 DaKKaLAnce wrote:
Well lucky for necrons. They are meant to take a hit and survive. I feel that the eldar and necrons will be the teams to clash it out the most...Kinda feels like GW is wanting to recreate the War of heavens(get it? necrons vs Eldar).

Yeah, battle of the Gods, it seems.

 krodarklorr wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:
Doing the math in my head, Tomb Blades (go with Tesla on this for range reasons) will outshoot Eldar bikes of any sort.

h only issue is range. Eldar bikes move 12", have 36" guns, and can assault move 2d6. Tomb Blades would have to Turbo boost turn one and get up into their face and hope they survive until turn 2 to shoot.

They should survive - most of them, anyway. It takes 4 Scatterlaser Jetbikes to kill a Tomb Blade (assuming Decurion, 3 to kill a 5+ RP Blade). So an equally costed number of Tomb Blades have a good shot.

Unless they use Flamer Wraithguard against them, at which point they're kinda hosed. Ignores Armor, Jink, and RP.

Requizen wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:
Doing the math in my head, Tomb Blades (go with Tesla on this for range reasons) will outshoot Eldar bikes of any sort.

h only issue is range. Eldar bikes move 12", have 36" guns, and can assault move 2d6. Tomb Blades would have to Turbo boost turn one and get up into their face and hope they survive until turn 2 to shoot.

They should survive - most of them, anyway. It takes 4 Scatterlaser Jetbikes to kill a Tomb Blade (assuming Decurion, 3 to kill a 5+ RP Blade). So an equally costed number of Tomb Blades have a good shot.

Unless they use Flamer Wraithguard against them, at which point they're kinda hosed. Ignores Armor, Jink, and RP.

Well yeah, and in the meantime, run everything you have up the board to close the gap. Eldar won't have anywhere to run, and even if they finish off the Tomb Blades, the rest of your army will be right there.

 krodarklorr wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:
Doing the math in my head, Tomb Blades (go with Tesla on this for range reasons) will outshoot Eldar bikes of any sort.

The only issue is range. Eldar bikes move 12", have 36" guns, and can assault move 2d6. Tomb Blades would have to Turbo boost turn one and get up into their face and hope they survive until turn 2 to shoot.

Hence why I specified Tesla. There's no way you're getting in RF range.

Call me dumb but how do 10 tomb blades fire more then 40 shots with an assault 1 weapon that adds 2 for every 6?

 BrotherGecko wrote:
Call me dumb but how do 10 tomb blades fire more then 40 shots with an assault 1 weapon that adds 2 for every 6?

Who said they did? They don't need as many shots since the Eldar bikes are lower Toughness and don't have RP, not to mention that the Tomb Blades are Twin Linked.

A Tomb Blade with Tesla kills .272 Eldar bikes.

An Eldar bike with a Scatter Laser kills .296 Decurion Tomb Blades with Shield Vanes.

Eldar cost 27 points, Necrons cost 20. Necrons win!

It was just said that they will out shoot scatbikers. Which they won't as scatbikers are heavy 4 bs4 and wound tomb blades on 3s just like tomb blades do back.

If you stick the two units on a flat surface and ask that neither move beyond 24in then I agree. Eventually tomb blades should win if they have all their bonuses. But they likely will not be out shooting the eldar bikers.

Decurion tomb blades are in fact tougher then vanilla scatbikers.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
It was just said that they will out shoot scatbikers. Which they won't as scatbikers are heavy 4 bs4 and wound tomb blades on 3s just like tomb blades do back.

They will, if they can get in range. That second part of the sentence being important.

That's why I specified Tesla because there is no way that is happening with Gauss.

...you know if there was some way to get at least 1 more nightbringer WK wouldn't really be too much of a problem lol.

Actually neither would eldar bikers..

 BrotherGecko wrote:
...you know if there was some way to get at least 1 more nightbringer WK wouldn't really be too much of a problem lol.

Actually neither would eldar bikers..

Nightbringer is terrible against both of those options.

^There are very few situations where I'd want to use a NB solo without the Enclave, they simply add too much between Solar Staff, FNP, +1 S/T, and six more shots upon landing.

In that case, they could stand a rough chance against a WK (Who will outrun them immediately so pray for strong rolls) or could (potentially) waste a Jetbike unit, but then be wide open so not a particularly strong use of them.

But yeah, if your meta allows the NB to use Gaze + C'tan Powers in shooting phase, they're pretty remarkable.

Uh they better since it's literally written in the rules that he can.

I 100% agree but I recall a few isolated cases where they considered the Gaze a shooting attack and said it was either/or.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Random question:
Anyone had a good experience with a named HQ besides Orikan this edition? The Stormlord definitely needs a close-combat weapon FAQ'd in, but his ability still seems pretty potent (moreso, in some cases). Otherwise, Trazyn is a disappointment this round, the Nemesor lost a bit of his prowess as did his friend Zandy, and buffing a single unit of Immortals isn't exactly game changing.

I've been using Nemasor Z to great effect.

In maelstrom games especially, his ability to choose new Warlord traits is amazeballs.

Putting Oberyn with an Orikanstar is also pretty great. (2+ rerolling 1s armor save, LOS anything AP2 is awesome)

I don't know if its been noted yet but eldar I guess get AA missiles with all eldar missile launchers without extra cost. So yah that kinda dents going flyer heavy.

I'm tempted to fiddle with using a vindicare to help combat psyker dominance. Just convert up a fancy pants deathmark.

 Ferros wrote:
I 100% agree but I recall a few isolated cases where they considered the Gaze a shooting attack and said it was either/or.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Random question:
Anyone had a good experience with a named HQ besides Orikan this edition? The Stormlord definitely needs a close-combat weapon FAQ'd in, but his ability still seems pretty potent (moreso, in some cases). Otherwise, Trazyn is a disappointment this round, the Nemesor lost a bit of his prowess as did his friend Zandy, and buffing a single unit of Immortals isn't exactly game changing.

Nemesor is awesome. Imagine footslog Necrons, backed up by a Triarch Stalker unit. Then, imagine a 12" bubble of rerolling 1's when shooting. Boom, there you go. And I've used Anrakyr twice now, and he's awesome in my opinion. 12" bubble of Crusader has twice now been the reason I've swept a unit.

 krodarklorr wrote:

Nemesor is awesome.

Seconded. He's definitely a thinking man's HQ, though. Even moreso than he was in the previous codex. Having to remember all the relevant warlord traits is no easy task, but being able to pick what you need when you need it can be incredibly useful. Or you can choose not to switch the trait, since he's default one finally gives us a reliable way of making an unit fearless, something I often wished the previous codex had available.

EDIT: Actually, those warlord traits deserve some more discussion. Here's a list of the ones I think are the most useful for Zahndrekh:

Tactical
1. Tactical Genius: Discard up to 2
6. Lead by Example: +1 VP if Zahndrekh himself (or a unit he's in) scores an 'objective X' card

Command
4. Master of the Vanguard: +1" charge & run within 12"
5. Target Priority: Re-roll shooting 1s within 12"
6. Coordinated Assault: Re-roll assault 1s within 12"

Personal
6. Immovable Object: Fearless + IWND (if you need that fearless back later, since he can't switch back to he's default trait)

Strategic
1. Conqueror of Cities: Move through cover + stealth in ruins
4. Strategic Genius: Re-roll reserves

Codex traits
3. Immortal Hubris: Re-roll morale etc. within 12"
4. Hyperlogical Strategist: +1/-1 to reserves (Strategic Genius is better, though)

The ones that need to be used during deployment are obviously not useful unless they also do something during the game, like Strategic Genius, and the ones that only affect Zahndrekh himself are generally not either (like 1 & 2 from Personal).

Can you think of any others?

Heavy Destroyers, Destroyer Cult and Deathmarks are probably going to be my go to for dealing with Jetbikes and Wraithknights.

All the guns being AP3 and rerolling to wound and hit along with upgrading to a H. Destroyer in each squad is going to be handy.

Hollismason wrote:
Heavy Destroyers, Destroyer Cult and Deathmarks are probably going to be my go to for dealing with Jetbikes and Wraithknights.

All the guns being AP3 and rerolling to wound and hit along with upgrading to a H. Destroyer in each squad is going to be handy.

Agreed. Most Necron TAC lists now should include a Destroyer Cult and a Canoptek Harvest when dealing with Eldar. But, those two formations can easily deal with most other things, too.

I don't see Canoptek Harvest doing well. It would be easy for the Eldars to kill the spyder and without the RP wraiths will be quite screwed.

Honestly, I'm not really worried about Scatterbikes and Wraithknights. Every army has power units and the Knight is superheavy.

What worries me not just as a Necron Player but in general is the idea of my opponent having a few Vaul batteries and just wiping anything interesting off the side of my board on turn one. Ain't really a counter there.

I've not bought into most of the panic, and even a lot of the D Weapons aren't as bad as they look. Flamethrower with no 6 results on a slow platform? Meh. Single shot 12 inch? Nasty, but on a fairly expensive platform and short ranged.

24 inch blast? Yeah, that'll just rip holes through Monstrous Creatures and Vehicles with no counter.

Well the D-Cannon Batteries only have a 24" range so you can stay away from them on the first turn. Gonna have to deal with them eventually but it's a option now.

Outflanking Flayed Ones will come in handy as well as you can pressure the Jetbikes to not hug corners and table edges.

Hollismason wrote:
Well the D-Cannon Batteries only have a 24" range so you can stay away from them on the first turn. Gonna have to deal with them eventually but it's a option now.

"Only" have a generic weapon range, and basically give up a turn of shooting to stave them off a little longer.

Like I said, no counter.

I have the new Eldar codex in hand..one thing that I haven't heard anyone talk about is the warlock upgrade for guardians and jetbike squads.
Warlocks are a upgrade like a sgt now.
Psychic dice going to be more than ever.

Codex is powerful..but IMO can be dealt with.

changemod wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
Well the D-Cannon Batteries only have a 24" range so you can stay away from them on the first turn. Gonna have to deal with them eventually but it's a option now.

"Only" have a generic weapon range, and basically give up a turn of shooting to stave them off a little longer.

Like I said, no counter.

The counter is that they're 2 wound Artillery Pieces. Shoot them. They're also small blasts, so can easily miss, and/or get cover if you're smart.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Denizen of the Dark City wrote:
I have the new Eldar codex in hand..one thing that I haven't heard anyone talk about is the warlock upgrade for guardians and jetbike squads.
Warlocks are a upgrade like a sgt now.
Psychic dice going to be more than ever.

Codex is powerful..but IMO can be dealt with.

The Warlock upgrade is also more points, on an already fragile unit. Not saying it's not good, but the point is, if you invest too heavily in Jetbikes, you'll regret it, as once the opponent starts shooting at them, they crumble.

The major issue we don't have an answer to, is Wrathknights.

Thanks to their upgrade to Gargantuan status, they are even harder to kill than before.

We didn't have a really "Great" answer before, now it's even worse.