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2015/10/07 14:52:09
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Tannhauser42 wrote: Yes, it's already been long established that the mishandling of classified material was rather widespread and not limited solely to Hillary. This is not new news that lots of people will be in trouble.
True. But it will be interesting in newsworthy to see who the other people mishandling classified material were, the circumstances under which it was done and what censure they face. It's never bad to shine a light on govt malfeasance and hold bureaucrats and officials accountable for their actions.
Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
2015/10/07 14:55:41
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Tannhauser42 wrote: Yes, it's already been long established that the mishandling of classified material was rather widespread and not limited solely to Hillary. This is not new news that lots of people will be in trouble.
At this point... it's surprising that it has been deep-six'ed yet. KnowWhatIMean?
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
2015/10/07 16:27:15
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Tannhauser42 wrote: Yes, it's already been long established that the mishandling of classified material was rather widespread and not limited solely to Hillary. This is not new news that lots of people will be in trouble.
True. But it will be interesting in newsworthy to see who the other people mishandling classified material were, the circumstances under which it was done and what censure they face. It's never bad to shine a light on govt malfeasance and hold bureaucrats and officials accountable for their actions.
Who the other people are will pretty much be "everybody", I'm guessing. As to what will happen, half of them probably aren't there anymore (so nothing more than an oopsie in the media for them) and the other half will just get a letter of reprimand and some refresher training on classified material handling. Assuming none of them passed on classified stuff to someone unauthorized for it.
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2015/10/07 16:58:46
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Tannhauser42 wrote: Yes, it's already been long established that the mishandling of classified material was rather widespread and not limited solely to Hillary. This is not new news that lots of people will be in trouble.
True. But it will be interesting in newsworthy to see who the other people mishandling classified material were, the circumstances under which it was done and what censure they face. It's never bad to shine a light on govt malfeasance and hold bureaucrats and officials accountable for their actions.
Who the other people are will pretty much be "everybody", I'm guessing. As to what will happen, half of them probably aren't there anymore (so nothing more than an oopsie in the media for them) and the other half will just get a letter of reprimand and some refresher training on classified material handling. Assuming none of them passed on classified stuff to someone unauthorized for it.
Mmm so what you're saying is...
1. The State Department sucks at maintaining security, something which should be pretty basic.
2. But HRC was in charge of the State Department for years so...
3. She's incompetent or intentionally letting the department be illegally sloppy?
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2015/10/07 17:32:16
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
I think the upper bureaucracy has become too complacent which results in a bit of incompetence and sloppiness and an attitude of "everybody else does it so I can do it too." And it's probably between that way for decades, too.
Besides, it's D.C., you make a mistake, you can just move into a different office in a different building down the street. It's just like the politicians, they don't really care about the consequences of what they do in office, because they're already on the gravy train for life.
It's like I said many pages ago, I bet lots of people all over D.C. are squeezing cheeks right now over this, hoping someone doesn't go poking into their correspondence.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/10/07 17:36:20
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2015/10/07 17:44:28
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Tannhauser42 wrote: I think the upper bureaucracy has become too complacent which results in a bit of incompetence and sloppiness and an attitude of "everybody else does it so I can do it too." And it's probably between that way for decades, too.
Besides, it's D.C., you make a mistake, you can just move into a different office in a different building down the street. It's just like the politicians, they don't really care about the consequences of what they do in office, because they're already on the gravy train for life.
It's like I said many pages ago, I bet lots of people all over D.C. are squeezing cheeks right now over this, hoping someone doesn't go poking into their correspondence.
At a minimum... folks could lose their security clearance.
That'll how jobs will be lost.
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
2015/10/07 23:11:39
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Well, last time I did the isidewith survey, I got a popup asking to add my name to some online petition thingy for Bernie Sanders. I don't remember what it was about, but clearly it seemed like a good idea at the time, because I have now received my first email from BernieSanders.com:
Spoiler:
Dear Bernie Supporters,
In two weeks, Bernie will be giving a big speech at the Iowa Democratic Party's Jefferson-Jackson Dinner. It is the largest gathering of Iowa Democrats of the year, and it comes exactly 100 days before the Iowa caucuses.
This event is a BIG deal. Usually, campaigns make sure big-time contributors get the premium tickets. That's what we expect the other candidates to do. Same old, same old.
Our campaign has a different idea, and we need your help to carry it out.
We want to pack the Iowa Events Center with regular folks — supporters carrying crushing student debt, parents who would benefit from a $15 minimum wage, and workers who have lost their jobs due to our disastrous trade policies.
General admission tickets cost $50 apiece, and our campaign is asking for supporters across the country to sponsor a student, a parent, a worker, or a campaign supporter by covering their cost of admission.
Contribute $25 to our campaign today and we’ll pair you with another supporter to cover the cost of admission for one person.
Every member of the national political media will be there, and this is a moment we can ensure the voices of students, parents, and those looking for work are heard loud and clear. Let’s send a powerful message about what a united national movement standing in solidarity with each other looks like.
All my best,
Robert Becker
Iowa State Director
Bernie 2016
That...is actually an interesting idea to get the "not rich and powerful" into some of the events. I'm not actually contributing myself, but I am tempted to at least get a "Feel the Bern" bumper sticker to troll my fellow Texans.
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2015/10/08 00:23:55
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Tannhauser42 wrote: Well, last time I did the isidewith survey, I got a popup asking to add my name to some online petition thingy for Bernie Sanders. I don't remember what it was about, but clearly it seemed like a good idea at the time, because I have now received my first email from BernieSanders.com:
Spoiler:
Dear Bernie Supporters,
In two weeks, Bernie will be giving a big speech at the Iowa Democratic Party's Jefferson-Jackson Dinner. It is the largest gathering of Iowa Democrats of the year, and it comes exactly 100 days before the Iowa caucuses.
This event is a BIG deal. Usually, campaigns make sure big-time contributors get the premium tickets. That's what we expect the other candidates to do. Same old, same old.
Our campaign has a different idea, and we need your help to carry it out.
We want to pack the Iowa Events Center with regular folks — supporters carrying crushing student debt, parents who would benefit from a $15 minimum wage, and workers who have lost their jobs due to our disastrous trade policies.
General admission tickets cost $50 apiece, and our campaign is asking for supporters across the country to sponsor a student, a parent, a worker, or a campaign supporter by covering their cost of admission.
Contribute $25 to our campaign today and we’ll pair you with another supporter to cover the cost of admission for one person.
Every member of the national political media will be there, and this is a moment we can ensure the voices of students, parents, and those looking for work are heard loud and clear. Let’s send a powerful message about what a united national movement standing in solidarity with each other looks like.
All my best,
Robert Becker
Iowa State Director
Bernie 2016
That...is actually an interesting idea to get the "not rich and powerful" into some of the events. I'm not actually contributing myself, but I am tempted to at least get a "Feel the Bern" bumper sticker to troll my fellow Texans.
I hope he comes to MO with the same idea. I'd go. The bill that smashes right to work might actually flip this state. There's a LOT of people here more than a little pissed off about that, at least, that's what I gather from the frequency of related bumper stickers I see.
Tannhauser42 wrote: It's only immature of they don't actually follow though on it. Otherwise, yes, if you're the kind of person whose personal life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness is dependant on who is the head of state, then you should move to a country that meets your needs better.
It’s immature then as well. People get caught up in this idea that because people talk about politics all the time then it must have this massive, life altering impact on society and on each person. But there’s been a flow of good, bad and indifferent politicians for hundreds of years and life just bubbles on anyway.
For a real eye opener, try going to a country that doesn’t even get to vote. It was a real eye opener when I first went to China. I don’t want say it’s okay to not have democracy, but for almost all daily living it doesn’t actually matter. So having a crap president for four years isn’t good, but it’s no reason to give up on the life you’ve built in that country.
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
2015/10/08 04:45:42
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
sebster wrote: For a real eye opener, try going to a country that doesn’t even get to vote. It was a real eye opener when I first went to China. I don’t want say it’s okay to not have democracy, but for almost all daily living it doesn’t actually matter. So having a crap president for four years isn’t good, but it’s no reason to give up on the life you’ve built in that country.
"The common people pray for rain, health, and a summer that never ends. They don't care what games the high lords play." ~ Some TV Show based on some book somewhere
Washington (CNN)House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy has dropped out of the race to succeed House Speaker John Boehner, in a shocking move that reflected his inability to gather the support of the Republican caucus.
The move comes as House Republicans were in a closed-door meeting to select their nominee for speaker and came without any warning. Boehner has postponed the vote.
Members had no indication the move was coming. "Totally stunned," said Rep. Peter King on CNN.
*
And now McCarthy is out of the Speaker race. Really concerned about the state of the GOP at this point. I don't want to trot out the word 'implosion' but it's hard not to think about it.
curran12 wrote: Really concerned about the state of the GOP at this point. I don't want to trot out the word 'implosion' but it's hard not to think about it.
I wouldn't be. We might be witnessing the actual creation of an ACTUAL third (albeit insanely conservative) party if the Rs split into "far right / tea party" and "corporate sellout / center right". Despite my names for the two groups, I think it would actually be a good move, as we might actually get a group of people who are capable of actual cooperation. If they don't have to constantly pander to the far-right, maybe we can get some ACTUAL Republicans.
2015/10/08 17:17:11
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
d-usa wrote: Well, he made the mistake of telling everyone the truth about the Benghazi investigations and now he is paying for it.
Banghazi!
I wouldn't want the job, not with that cast of ...interesting individuals.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2015/10/08 19:28:24
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
I'm sure everyone has heard that Dr. Ben Carson, if confronted with a person with a gun, said he wouldn't just stand around waiting to be shot., right? It turns out when that actually did happen, it went a little differently than he boasted it would today.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/10/08 19:28:56
d-usa wrote: "When the Internet sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending posters that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing strawmen. They're bringing spam. They're trolls. And some, I assume, are good people."
2015/10/08 20:26:56
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2015/10/08 22:27:54
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
curran12 wrote: Really concerned about the state of the GOP at this point. I don't want to trot out the word 'implosion' but it's hard not to think about it.
I wouldn't be. We might be witnessing the actual creation of an ACTUAL third (albeit insanely conservative) party if the Rs split into "far right / tea party" and "corporate sellout / center right". Despite my names for the two groups, I think it would actually be a good move, as we might actually get a group of people who are capable of actual cooperation. If they don't have to constantly pander to the far-right, maybe we can get some ACTUAL Republicans.
Won't happen.
The Cons are flexing their muscle now.
Maybe Paul Ryan will save the day:
Robert Costa ✔ @costareports
BREAKING: BOEHNER IS PERSONALLY ASKING RYAN TO STEP UP AND BE SPEAKER, have spoken twice today by phone...
2:57 PM - 8 Oct 2015
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
2015/10/09 01:25:50
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
I think as we get closer to crunchtime and when the Republicans have to start getting serious about picking their candidate rather than running the circus they have now, we may start seeing some of that implosion factor, particularly if the "wrong" candidate is in the lead by that point. A lot may also depend on whether Cornyn's move to extend the debt ceiling into 2017 goes smoothly or turns into another pointless pissing match, because playing chicken with the USA's credit is always such a good idea...
But I don't think we'll see any real implosion until after the elections. If more of the supercrazy far right Rs get voted in, but the Ds still get the White House, we might as well replace the congressional seal with the 8 pointed star of Chaos.
Anyway, as a followup on my earlier post about that Bernie Sanders email I got to sponsor normal people into the Democrat dinner event, I got an email today saying over 1350 tickets have already been purchased so far. I don't know how many seats there are in total for the event, but that sounds like a lot?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/10/09 01:26:54
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2015/10/09 01:44:54
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
streamdragon wrote: I wouldn't be. We might be witnessing the actual creation of an ACTUAL third (albeit insanely conservative) party if the Rs split into "far right / tea party" and "corporate sellout / center right". Despite my names for the two groups, I think it would actually be a good move, as we might actually get a group of people who are capable of actual cooperation. If they don't have to constantly pander to the far-right, maybe we can get some ACTUAL Republicans.
Yeah, the story floating around is that McCarthy couldn't win any votes from the Freedom caucus, and without them he wouldn't have enough votes.
Honestly, as much as I like the Ameican culture of crossing the aisle and voting for conscience and district over party lines, there's times where you just have to except party voting or you're not really a party anymore. Once the party has decided its nomination for speaker, then anyone who doesn't follow the party line and vote for that person needs to be booted.
Robert Costa ✔ @costareports BREAKING: BOEHNER IS PERSONALLY ASKING RYAN TO STEP UP AND BE SPEAKER, have spoken twice today by phone... 2:57 PM - 8 Oct 2015
It's an interesting pick, and maybe he is the guy who'll bridge the gap between the far right and the more sensible end of the Republican party.
Ryan has this kind of amazing ability to seem like a moderate, considered politician, while actually pushing a platform that's really hardline. So if he can sell his really conservative policies to the far right of his party, while keeping a more moderate face to appeal to the rest, maybe it'll work. It would be an amazing job if he can hold it together as long as Boehner did.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/10/09 01:47:58
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
2015/10/09 02:45:16
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
Some of his errors have been unforced. Last week, days before Hurricane Joaquin was projected to hit the East Coast, a reporter tossed Carson a softball in asking how he would prepare for the storm if he were in the White House.
"I don't know," he replied, touching off mockery on social media.
You know what? I think that was a great answer. I think that was a totally appropriate answer. He's running as a political outsider, which is what he base wants, and that goes hand in hand with not really knowing a lot of public policy. I don't really endorse the idea that a total outsider is a great idea; but it doesn't matter, because this is what his base actually wants, and I think it was a totally fair, honest answer.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/10/09 02:50:34
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
2015/10/09 03:06:43
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
I've often found that "I don't know" is an entirely honest answer that isn't accepted as much as it should be. I have a hard time trusting people that seem to have explanations for everything, including things they couldn't possibly have explanations for.
Some of his errors have been unforced. Last week, days before Hurricane Joaquin was projected to hit the East Coast, a reporter tossed Carson a softball in asking how he would prepare for the storm if he were in the White House.
"I don't know," he replied, touching off mockery on social media.
You know what? I think that was a great answer. I think that was a totally appropriate answer. He's running as a political outsider, which is what he base wants, and that goes hand in hand with not really knowing a lot of public policy. I don't really endorse the idea that a total outsider is a great idea; but it doesn't matter, because this is what his base actually wants, and I think it was a totally fair, honest answer.
I do think it's a fair and honest response.
:shrugs:
I think he'll crash & burn soon though...
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
2015/10/09 03:17:28
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
The "I don't know" is certainly better than this: Ben Carson said today that Adolf Hitler’s mass murder of Jews “would have been greatly diminished” if German citizens had not been disarmed by the Nazi regime.
Gordon Shumway wrote: The "I don't know" is certainly better than this: Ben Carson said today that Adolf Hitler’s mass murder of Jews “would have been greatly diminished” if German citizens had not been disarmed by the Nazi regime.
Gordon Shumway wrote: The "I don't know" is certainly better than this: Ben Carson said today that Adolf Hitler’s mass murder of Jews “would have been greatly diminished” if German citizens had not been disarmed by the Nazi regime.
Someone needs to get this neurosurgeon a head doctor.
I can't comment on the situation in Nazi Germany so many years ago. You all likely know much more history than I do, but they quipped about the gunpoint situation, and I can't fault him for that. We all want to think noble and empowering things about how we would react when faced with imminent danger, but I'd likely toss any number of people in my way to get out myself. Survival is human. So is ego.
And having guns probably wouldn't have made a difference. By and large the German population supported the Nazi regime up until the final 2-3 years of the war, and even if they had opposed it anti-Semitism was rampant among Germans anyway.
Suggesting that gun rights would have made a difference in anything that happened there is the height of "just not getting it."
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/10/09 03:26:32
The thing about the "I don't know" also shows a bit of forgetfulness regarding relatively recent history. At the very least, Katrina made sure everybody knew that FEMA existed (probably only Deus Ex players knew about FEMA before that). So, at the least, he should have said he would ahve mobilized FEMA and other federal emergency response services, even if he didn't have any detailed action plan.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/10/09 03:29:43
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
2015/10/09 03:28:51
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
LordofHats wrote: And having guns probably wouldn't have made a difference. By and large the German population supported the Nazi regime up until the final 2-3 years of the war, and even if they had opposed it anti-Semitism was rampant among Germans anyway.
Suggesting that gun rights would have made a difference in anything that happened there is the height of "just not getting it."
I dunno...
I'd rather go down fighting with a Heckler & Koch in my hands than marched into a gas chamber.
But, that's me...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/10/09 03:35:30