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I'm sure the fact that Hillary Clinton didn't actually win Iowa via 6 consecutive successful coin flips means it won't be repeated ad nauseum, right?

The poster boy for fething your neighbor is back in the news:

‘Pharma bro’ Shkreli stays silent before Congress, calls lawmakers ‘imbeciles’ in tweet
by Carolyn Y. Johnson
(https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/02/04/pharma-bro-martin-shkreli-faces-congress-today-but-pledges-silence/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory)

 ScootyPuffJunior wrote:

 whembly wrote:

Does anyone find it interesting that Clinton won all 6 coin toss?

What are the odds?

Have fun.

And Sanders did win some coin tosses to point that there were about equal.

Cool... I knew I saw something that Sanders had some coin toss his way.

Surely the odds of winning six coin flips in a row would be .5 to the power of six, not taking into account that the coin could balance and turn out neither heads nor tails?

 Ahtman wrote:
I liked Rand but he is a non-factor sadly, and I really don't like Hillary so my choices aren't all that great. If my choices end up being Cruz and Clinton I will really be in a bad place, voting wise.

helpful hint, there are more than 2 parties.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2016

vote for Zoltan, just because it's a fun name to say

Zoltan Istvan, futurist, writer, transhumanist philosopher from California. He's running as a independent

Vermin Supreme 2016!

Welp, he lost my vote.... Ponies are almost as evil as cats.

 jasper76 wrote:

I tend to agree with whembley on McCain. I think McCain and Romney both did as well as any GOP candidate could have hoped to do at the time after 8 years of Bush, and demographics have only become more unkind for the next GOP candidate, especially since Trump has alienated the crucial Latino vote, and the party has done nothing to improve its standing on women's issues.

After the Bush years, it would have taken a miracle for the GOP to get the White House, no matter how good a man McCain is. However, they could have made a much better showing without Palin, and by giving her that platform and fame, the years since have only encourage the kind of crazy she represents.

The problem now, however, is that while Rubio may be the best choice if the GOP actually wants to win the election, they absolutely MUST avoid the same mistake they made in 2008: if Cruz were to be on the ticket as VP, the GOP is guaranteed to lose again. Just like I was willing to vote McCain but changed because of Palin, I could see the possibility of voting Rubio, but never with Cruz attached.

I don't see a possibility that Cruz would take a VP position...

I think if Rubio's the nominee.. then, someone like Nikki Haley would be a possibility (or some other Governor).

Rubio/Haley for the win!

Are there similar rules to being VP as to being POTUS??


By this I naturally mean, could Rubio choose the Governator as his VP??

sirlynchmob wrote:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 A Town Called Malus wrote:


You did not just mention Bieber in the same line as The Beatles, Led Zep and Maiden

Lol.... if black people get to blame ALL white people for slavery, then all of us Americans get to blame you Brits for whatever gak Canadian pops out of the woods

by that horrid logic you can blame all the gak america does on the brits as well. If they had never drove out the puritans we wouldn't be in this mess

Well I'm sorry that we didn't believe in religious persecution as strongly as the puritans wanted

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
Are there similar rules to being VP as to being POTUS??


By this I naturally mean, could Rubio choose the Governator as his VP??

I don't think there's anything forbidding the Governator to be his VP... but, if Rubio dies while in office... Arnie couldn't become President, which will fall to... The Speaker of House.

Which is:

 whembly wrote:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
Are there similar rules to being VP as to being POTUS??


By this I naturally mean, could Rubio choose the Governator as his VP??

I don't think there's anything forbidding the Governator to be his VP... but, if Rubio dies while in office... Arnie couldn't become President, which will fall to... The Speaker of House.

Which is:

Spoiler:

President Paul Ryan!

Well, I'd like to see people try to stop the Vice-Prezinator from ascending to his rightful place.

sirlynchmob wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
I liked Rand but he is a non-factor sadly, and I really don't like Hillary so my choices aren't all that great. If my choices end up being Cruz and Clinton I will really be in a bad place, voting wise.

helpful hint, there are more than 2 parties.

Of course there are but since the discussion was about the two parties in the Iowa caucus it just makes sense to refer to those.

 Dreadwinter wrote:
The fact that he was able to pull this close to her and only lose in delegates because of a coin toss is way better than expected. Even more so when the party he is running for has been against him the entire time. Buuuuut, nah he lost. Even though he got delegates from it. You are acting like his whole campaign is going to fall apart and that is hilarious to me.

Alright, whatever. You’re not reading, you don’t care, and it doesn’t really matter anyway. So I’ll just sum up my point as briefly as I can, so it’s here as a nice clean record, instead of buried amidst point and counter point with a guy who is uninterested in any political reality discussion beyond ‘feel the bern’.

Sanders has done brilliantly to stay this close to Clinton for this long.
Arguably this is less a case of Sanders doing very well, as it is Clinton not doing very well.
Either way, Clinton dodged a bullet in Iowa. While the difference in delegates was zero, the difference in narrative between a narrow loss and a narrow defeat is huge. And given the tiny number of delegates in Iowa, the narrative is actually the only thing that really matters.
However, even if Sanders had won and benefitted from a strong momentum narrative in to future primaries, it’s pretty hard to figure out how he’d turn that in to winning the nomination. Unless he suddenly built a healthy share of the vote in minorities, or managed to turn his strength in white voters into a total dominance, it’s impossible to see how he’d win the vote in most states.
Sanders stood in the primary in order to direct the political debate towards equality and other issues close to his heart. Sanders has achieved this, and shown there is still a base of democratic voters who want real left wing policy advanced by the democrats.
If Sanders keeps to his initial goal, it’s possible his campaign run here might be something to build on in future years. Probably not for himself, but as the basis for developing organisations that will energise and mobilise that base of voters.
However, if he shoots for the moon, and considers only winning the nomination, then the final narrative might be that you can’t win the nomination from left, only from the centre.

 whembly wrote:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
Are there similar rules to being VP as to being POTUS??


By this I naturally mean, could Rubio choose the Governator as his VP??

I don't think there's anything forbidding the Governator to be his VP... but, if Rubio dies while in office... Arnie couldn't become President, which will fall to... The Speaker of House.

Which is:

Spoiler:

President Paul Ryan!

I did look to see of the natural born citizen requirement was just for being elected (potentially allowing the Governator to move up to the top spot), and then I learned that the 12th amendment requires the VP to meet the same qualifications as the president. No Governator in the White House. :(

Well then... no Governator, no possibility of me voting Republican this election

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 whembly wrote:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
Are there similar rules to being VP as to being POTUS??


By this I naturally mean, could Rubio choose the Governator as his VP??

I don't think there's anything forbidding the Governator to be his VP... but, if Rubio dies while in office... Arnie couldn't become President, which will fall to... The Speaker of House.

Which is:

Spoiler:

President Paul Ryan!

I did look to see of the natural born citizen requirement was just for being elected (potentially allowing the Governator to move up to the top spot), and then I learned that the 12th amendment requires the VP to meet the same qualifications as the president. No Governator in the White House. :(

Well... .

I stand corrected.

 sebster wrote:

 Dreadwinter wrote:
The fact that he was able to pull this close to her and only lose in delegates because of a coin toss is way better than expected. Even more so when the party he is running for has been against him the entire time. Buuuuut, nah he lost. Even though he got delegates from it. You are acting like his whole campaign is going to fall apart and that is hilarious to me.

Alright, whatever. You’re not reading, you don’t care, and it doesn’t really matter anyway. So I’ll just sum up my point as briefly as I can, so it’s here as a nice clean record, instead of buried amidst point and counter point with a guy who is uninterested in any political reality discussion beyond ‘feel the bern’.

Sanders has done brilliantly to stay this close to Clinton for this long.
Arguably this is less a case of Sanders doing very well, as it is Clinton not doing very well.
Either way, Clinton dodged a bullet in Iowa. While the difference in delegates was zero, the difference in narrative between a narrow loss and a narrow defeat is huge. And given the tiny number of delegates in Iowa, the narrative is actually the only thing that really matters.
However, even if Sanders had won and benefitted from a strong momentum narrative in to future primaries, it’s pretty hard to figure out how he’d turn that in to winning the nomination. Unless he suddenly built a healthy share of the vote in minorities, or managed to turn his strength in white voters into a total dominance, it’s impossible to see how he’d win the vote in most states.
Sanders stood in the primary in order to direct the political debate towards equality and other issues close to his heart. Sanders has achieved this, and shown there is still a base of democratic voters who want real left wing policy advanced by the democrats.
If Sanders keeps to his initial goal, it’s possible his campaign run here might be something to build on in future years. Probably not for himself, but as the basis for developing organisations that will energise and mobilise that base of voters.
However, if he shoots for the moon, and considers only winning the nomination, then the final narrative might be that you can’t win the nomination from left, only from the centre.

Okay, you are accusing me of not reading but I posted you a link where he just stole a major endorsement in the Carolinas from Hillary and it is an endorsement from a minority leader. Please, read what I linked.

 Dreadwinter wrote:
Okay, you are accusing me of not reading but I posted you a link where he just stole a major endorsement in the Carolinas from Hillary and it is an endorsement from a minority leader. Please, read what I linked.

I read it, I giggled and moved on. Here's the 538 list of endorsements, those with a 1 are house of reps, those with a 5 are senators, and those with a 10 are governors.

Bernie Sanders
10/12/15 Keith Ellison REP. (D-MINN.) 1
10/7 Raúl Grijalva REP. (D-ARIZ.) 1


Hillary Clinton
2/3/16 Alma Adams REP. (D-N.C.) 1
2/1 Chaka Fattah REP. (D-PA.) 1
1/30 Ron Wyden SEN. (D-ORE.) 5
1/29 Al Green REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
1/26 David Price REP. (D-N.C.) 1
1/19 Mike Quigley REP. (D-ILL.) 1
1/8 Frank Pallone Jr. REP. (D-N.J.) 1
1/7 G.K. Butterfield REP. (D-N.C.) 1
12/18/15 Earl Blumenauer REP. (D-ORE.) 1
12/16 Linda Sánchez REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
12/15 Brad Ashford REP. (D-NEB.) 1
12/7 Michael E. Capuano REP. (D-MASS.) 1
11/30 Maxine Waters REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
11/30 Pete Aguilar REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
11/30 Anna G. Eshoo REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
11/30 Jerry McNerney REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
11/30 Jackie Speier REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
11/19 John A. Yarmuth REP. (D-KY.) 1
11/17 Donna F. Edwards REP. (D-MD.) 1
11/17 C. A. Dutch Ruppersberger REP. (D-MD.) 1
11/17 Alan Grayson REP. (D-FLA.) 1
11/17 John P. Sarbanes REP. (D-MD.) 1
11/17 Jack Reed SEN. (D-R.I.) 5
11/16 Ruben Gallego REP. (D-ARIZ.) 1
11/14 Jay Inslee GOV. (D-WASH.) 10
11/14 Denny Heck REP. (D-WASH.) 1
11/14 Suzan DelBene REP. (D-WASH.) 1
11/13 Joe Donnelly SEN. (D-IND.) 5
11/13 Ann Kirkpatrick REP. (D-ARIZ.) 1
11/11 Gwen Moore REP. (D-WIS.) 1
11/11 Tony Cárdenas REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
11/11 Corrine Brown REP. (D-FLA.) 1
11/10 Christopher A. [see forum posting rules] SEN. (D-DEL.) 5
11/9 Bennie G. Thompson REP. (D-MISS.) 1
11/8 Seth Moulton REP. (D-MASS.) 1
11/5 Maria Cantwell SEN. (D-WASH.) 5
11/4 Jay Nixon GOV. (D-MO.) 10
10/28 Heidi Heitkamp SEN. (D-N.D.) 5
10/28 Jared Huffman REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
10/27 Sherrod Brown SEN. (D-OHIO) 5
10/26 Thomas R. Carper SEN. (D-DEL.) 5
10/26 John Carney REP. (D-DEL.) 1
10/23 Paul D. Tonko REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
10/21 Jack Markell GOV. (D-DEL.) 10
10/20 Eliot Engel REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
10/19 Joe Courtney REP. (D-CONN.) 1
10/16 William Keating REP. (D-MASS.) 1
10/14 Edward J. Markey SEN. (D-MASS.) 5
10/13 Yvette D. Clarke REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
10/13 Hakeem Jeffries REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
10/5 John Hickenlooper GOV. (D-COLO.) 10
10/5 Robert C. Scott REP. (D-VA.) 1
9/17 Maggie Hassan GOV. (D-N.H.) 10
9/13 Ann Kuster REP. (D-N.H.) 1
9/7 Cheri Bustos REP. (D-ILL.) 1
9/7 David Loebsack REP. (D-IOWA) 1
9/1 Zoe Lofgren REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
8/31 Tammy Baldwin SEN. (D-WIS.) 5
8/28 Timothy J. Walz REP. (D-MINN.) 1
8/24 Donald Payne Jr. REP. (D-N.J.) 1
8/24 John Garamendi REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
8/24 Bonnie Watson Coleman REP. (D-N.J.) 1
8/24 Bill Pascrell Jr. REP. (D-N.J.) 1
8/18 Jim Himes REP. (D-CONN.) 1
8/6 Xavier Becerra REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
8/5 Scott Peters REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
7/15 Lois Capps REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
7/15 Marcia L. Fudge REP. (D-OHIO) 1
7/14 André Carson REP. (D-IND.) 1
7/13 Suzanne Bonamici REP. (D-ORE.) 1
6/27 Niki Tsongas REP. (D-MASS.) 1
6/26 Don Beyer REP. (D-VA.) 1
6/26 Brenda Lawrence REP. (D-MICH.) 1
6/23 William "Lacy" Clay Jr. REP. (D-MO.) 1
6/23 Matthew Cartwright REP. (D-PA.) 1
6/13 Elizabeth Esty REP. (D-CONN.) 1
6/13 John B. Larson REP. (D-CONN.) 1
6/13 Tom Wolf GOV. (D-PA.) 10
6/7 Dannel P. Malloy GOV. (D-CONN.) 10
6/5 Steve Cohen REP. (D-TENN.) 1
6/4 Christopher Murphy SEN. (D-CONN.) 5
5/27 Katherine Clark REP. (D-MASS.) 1
5/20 Peter Shumlin GOV. (D-VT.) 10
5/14 Joseph P. Kennedy III REP. (D-MASS.) 1
5/12 James McGovern REP. (D-MASS.) 1
5/5 Michael F. Bennet SEN. (D-COLO.) 5
5/5 Gary Peters SEN. (D-MICH.) 5
5/4 Kathy Castor REP. (D-FLA.) 1
5/4 Mike Thompson REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
5/4 Gerald E. "Gerry" Connolly REP. (D-VA.) 1
5/4 Patrick Murphy REP. (D-FLA.) 1
5/4 Marc Veasey REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
5/4 Adam Schiff REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
5/4 José E. Serrano REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
5/4 Kurt Schrader REP. (D-ORE.) 1
5/4 Julia Brownley REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
5/4 Kathleen Rice REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
5/4 Brad Sherman REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
5/4 Jim Cooper REP. (D-TENN.) 1
5/4 Sean Patrick Maloney REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
5/4 Henry Cuellar REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
5/4 Ed Perlmutter REP. (D-COLO.) 1
5/4 Joyce Beatty REP. (D-OHIO) 1
5/4 Derek Kilmer REP. (D-WASH.) 1
5/4 Eddie Bernice Johnson REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
5/4 Jared Polis REP. (D-COLO.) 1
5/4 Adam Smith REP. (D-WASH.) 1
5/4 Daniel Kildee REP. (D-MICH.) 1
5/4 Rubén Hinojosa REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
5/4 Filemon Vela REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
4/29 Emanuel Cleaver REP. (D-MO.) 1
4/24 Robert P. Casey, Jr. SEN. (D-PA.) 5
4/23 Cory A. Booker SEN. (D-N.J.) 5
4/23 Steve Israel REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
4/22 John Conyers Jr. REP. (D-MICH.) 1
4/16 Gina M. Raimondo GOV. (D-R.I.) 10
4/15 Jim McDermott REP. (D-WASH.) 1
4/14 Rosa L. DeLauro REP. (D-CONN.) 1
4/13 Tom Udall SEN. (D-N.M.) 5
4/12 Andrew M. Cuomo GOV. (D-N.Y.) 10
4/12 Jeanne Shaheen SEN. (D-N.H.) 5
4/12 Karen Bass REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
4/12 Debbie Dingell REP. (D-MICH.) 1
4/12 Diana DeGette REP. (D-COLO.) 1
4/12 Rick Larsen REP. (D-WASH.) 1
4/11 Nydia M. Velázquez REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
4/11 Jerrold Nadler REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
2/2 Brian Schatz SEN. (D-HAWAII) 5
1/29 Alcee L. Hastings REP. (D-FLA.) 1
1/27 Tammy Duckworth REP. (D-ILL.) 1
1/27 Judy Chu REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/27 Ami Bera REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/27 Ted Lieu REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/27 Mazie K. Hirono SEN. (D-HAWAII) 5
1/27 Mark Takano REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/22 Lucille Roybal-Allard REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/22 Grace Napolitano REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/22 Loretta Sanchez REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
12/18/14 Bill Nelson SEN. (D-FLA.) 5
12/16 Al Franken SEN. (D-MINN.) 5
12/1 Barbara A. Mikulski SEN. (D-MD.) 5
12/1 Benjamin L. Cardin SEN. (D-MD.) 5
11/14 Terry McAuliffe GOV. (D-VA.) 10
11/10 Charles B. Rangel REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
10/14 Nita Lowey REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
8/5 Mark R. Warner SEN. (D-VA.) 5
7/12 Michelle Lujan Grisham REP. (D-N.M.) 1
7/12 Martin Heinrich SEN. (D-N.M.) 5
6/21 Patrick J. Leahy SEN. (D-VT.) 5
6/18 Betty McCollum REP. (D-MINN.) 1
6/18 Rick Nolan REP. (D-MINN.) 1
6/7 Richard Blumenthal SEN. (D-CONN.) 5
6/6 Robin Kelly REP. (D-ILL.) 1
6/6 Bill Foster REP. (D-ILL.) 1
6/5 Richard J. Durbin SEN. (D-ILL.) 5
6/4 Amy Klobuchar SEN. (D-MINN.) 5
5/22 Debbie Stabenow SEN. (D-MICH.) 5
5/4 Mark Takai REP. (D-HAWAII) 1
5/3 Tim Kaine SEN. (D-VA.) 5
2/7 Ted Deutch REP. (D-FLA.) 1
1/31 Joseph Crowley REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
1/29 Joe Manchin III SEN. (D-W.VA.) 5
1/28 Danny K. Davis REP. (D-ILL.) 1
1/28 Janice Hahn REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/28 Terri A. Sewell REP. (D-ALA.) 1
1/28 John Lewis REP. (D-GA.) 1
1/28 Doris O. Matsui REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/28 Frederica Wilson REP. (D-FLA.) 1
1/28 Sander Levin REP. (D-MICH.) 1
1/28 Sheldon Whitehouse SEN. (D-R.I.) 5
1/28 Henry C. "Hank" Jr. Johnson REP. (D-GA.) 1
1/28 David Scott REP. (D-GA.) 1
1/28 Brian Higgins REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
1/28 David Cicilline REP. (D-R.I.) 1
1/28 Louise Slaughter REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
1/28 Jim Langevin REP. (D-R.I.) 1
1/28 Gregory W. Meeks REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
1/28 Jan Schakowsky REP. (D-ILL.) 1
1/28 Gene Green REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
1/28 Grace Meng REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
1/28 Joaquin Castro REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
1/28 Luis Gutierrez REP. (D-ILL.) 1
1/28 Cedric Richmond REP. (D-LA.) 1
1/28 Richard E. Neal REP. (D-MASS.) 1
1/28 Steny H. Hoyer REP. (D-MD.) 1
1/28 Sheila Jackson Lee REP. (D-TEXAS) 1
1/28 Lois Frankel REP. (D-FLA.) 1
1/28 John Delaney REP. (D-MD.) 1
1/28 Mike Honda REP. (D-CALIF.) 1
1/28 Chellie Pingree REP. (D-MAINE) 1
1/28 Stephen F. Lynch REP. (D-MASS.) 1
1/13 Chris Van Hollen REP. (D-MD.) 1
12/12/13 Dianne Feinstein SEN. (D-CALIF.) 5
11/17 Kirsten E. Gillibrand SEN. (D-N.Y.) 5
11/11 Carolyn Maloney REP. (D-N.Y.) 1
11/8 Patty Murray SEN. (D-WASH.) 5
11/7 Mark Dayton GOV. (D-MINN.) 10
11/5 Tim Ryan REP. (D-OHIO) 1
11/2 Charles E. Schumer SEN. (D-N.Y.) 5
10/30 Barbara Boxer SEN. (D-CALIF.) 5
8/18 Dina Titus REP. (D-NEV.) 1
6/18 Claire McCaskill SEN. (D-MO.) 5

But he got two representatives! Feel the burn!

With that 14% approval rating congress has right now, I bet those endorsements really help. hahaha

Also, wait. We are only counting Congress and Governor endorsements? What about all the other endorsements? Unions? Things like that?

 Dreadwinter wrote:
With that 14% approval rating congress has right now, I bet those endorsements really help. hahaha

You were talking about how important it was that a single endorsement flipped. So I gave you the list of congressmen and governors who've given endorsements. And then when you saw how overwhelmingly one sided that list is, you start coming up with reasons why endorsements don't count.

There's a pattern developing here.

 Dreadwinter wrote:
With that 14% approval rating congress has right now, I bet those endorsements really help. hahaha

Also, wait. We are only counting Congress and Governor endorsements? What about all the other endorsements? Unions? Things like that?

In that case, the 1s and 5s don't matter, and Bernie has no endorsements that matter while Hillary still has all the 10s.

 sebster wrote:

 Dreadwinter wrote:
With that 14% approval rating congress has right now, I bet those endorsements really help. hahaha

You were talking about how important it was that a single endorsement flipped.

I gave an example of an endorsement flipping and then you gave me a list of endorsements of a specific type that shows heavily in your arguments favor, but you did not provide a complete list of endorsements.

There is a pattern forming with your arguments, I believe it is called "dishonesty".

I mean, the endorsement that I gave you wasn't even a congressman or a governor. But somehow you think that only Congressman and Governors apply here. Either you are intentionally trying to win the argument with dishonesty or you have no clue what you are talking about. Which one?

 Dreadwinter wrote:

Also, wait. We are only counting Congress and Governor endorsements? What about all the other endorsements? Unions? Things like that?

In the primary process, Governors and members of Congress are not just endorsements, they are actually delegates. So while Unions can endorse people, and have their endorsement be an influence when people consider who they vote for, the super-delegates actually vote for the people they endorse.

The Iowa Delegate total was:

23 delegates for Clinton
21 delegates for Sanders

The current endorsements/votes from super-delegates is:

357 super-delegates for Clinton
13 super-delegates for Sanders

Which makes the current total:

380 votes for Clinton
34 votes for Sanders

 Dreadwinter wrote:
I gave an example of an endorsement flipping and then you gave me a list of endorsements of a specific type that shows heavily in your arguments favor, but you did not provide a complete list of endorsements.

I went to a site I go to fairly often, because I knew that among a lot of other things it tracks the formal endorsement count. So I copied that list and gave it to you, to show that talk about single endorsement is quite silly, when the total endorsement count is so one sided.

And now you’re calling me dishonest because the list was only the formal endorsements, and for reasons you’ve recently invented in your head we really need to know about every single person connected to the Democratic party who might endorse anyone at all. In fact, not just people connected to the Democratic party, because you listed a lawyer who worked on a high profile case. So I guess until we get a list with every single person who's ever been in a news story, then any kind of list would be 'dishonest'.

So really, I think its best we call it on this stupid little back and forth. It’s going nowhere, you just get pissier with every point I make about Sanders' position.

But the thing is, what I love about elections, same reason I got drawn in to business and finance, is that for all the talk and bs, at the end of the day there are cold hard numbers to show who was actually talking some sense. So I guess we’ll see when the numbers are in.

 sebster wrote:

 Dreadwinter wrote:
I gave an example of an endorsement flipping and then you gave me a list of endorsements of a specific type that shows heavily in your arguments favor, but you did not provide a complete list of endorsements.

I went to a site I go to fairly often, because I knew that among a lot of other things it tracks the formal endorsement count. So I copied that list and gave it to you, to show that talk about single endorsement is quite silly, when the total endorsement count is so one sided.

And now you’re calling me dishonest because the list was only the formal endorsements, and for reasons you’ve recently invented in your head we really need to know about every single person connected to the Democratic party who might endorse anyone at all. In fact, not just people connected to the Democratic party, because you listed a lawyer who worked on a high profile case. So I guess until we get a list with every single person who's ever been in a news story, then any kind of list would be 'dishonest'.

So really, I think its best we call it on this stupid little back and forth. It’s going nowhere, you just get pissier with every point I make about Sanders' position.

But the thing is, what I love about elections, same reason I got drawn in to business and finance, is that for all the talk and bs, at the end of the day there are cold hard numbers to show who was actually talking some sense. So I guess we’ll see when the numbers are in.

You are dismissing an endorsement that effects how voters are going to view a candidate based on the amount of super-delegates a person has right now. Which is honestly quite silly, considering a person like that can influence quite a few people in states and push them to vote for a candidate. You also linked me a bunch of endorsements by super-delegates that are not locked in. They can change(as they have in the past, with Hillary of all people!) and switch sides. On top of that, there are still 210 additional super delegates that have not chosen a candidate. We are still at the point of the process where endorsements matter as they can sway how people vote in a given area and how many delegates a candidate can earn in the state. Just because that person endorsing them is not a super delegate, does not make the endorsement meaningless as you have been claiming.

We will see when the numbers are in but if you are going with cold hard numbers and facts, you should probably remember history and how Hillary lost a lot of the people who pledged to her towards the end of the primary. But, we will see when the numbers are in.

 Dreadwinter wrote:
Just because that person endorsing them is not a super delegate, does not make the endorsement meaningless as you have been claiming.

So we'll agree to end this debate now that's long past interesting or fun, but I'll still call you on bullshitting. I didn't say endorsements were meaningless, you made that up. fething don't do that.

 sebster wrote:

 Dreadwinter wrote:
Just because that person endorsing them is not a super delegate, does not make the endorsement meaningless as you have been claiming.

So we'll agree to end this debate now that's long past interesting or fun, but I'll still call you on bullshitting. I didn't say endorsements were meaningless, you made that up. fething don't do that.

You laughed off an endorsement I posted for what reason then? You also claimed I did not read what you had previously written. fething don't do that.