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I heard this question asked and was shocked to hear that some people think Chaos is more evil.
What do you all think?
Personally, I see Chaos as being elemental. It's evil like a natural disaster is evil. Though followers of Chaos may be the types who kill for the sake of killing and then maybe demons consume your soul afterward.
Whereas DE also kill for the sake of killing, but they deliberately torture the crap out of you for as long as possible first AS they consume your soul, very much enjoying your suffering all the while.

imo, DE are more evil.

It depends. Some people turn to Chaos purely for their own gain, or because they're sadistic anyway and it corrupts them, whereas some fall to chaos from good intentions. The road to hell and all that. The Dark Eldar torture and kill out of necessity to stay alive.

Chaos is evil itself.

Its not like "we are evil" They are evil given form, physical or otherwise.

DE have a reason for being what they are but I can't remember why. Either way.... They must be purged.

Chaos is the 'evil' gods, the 'good' gods not being mentioned any more. While life varies for the minions, the big 4 who are leading the show are without a doubt selfish and evil.

The dark eldar need to torture as a kind of 'food'. They're not good guys by any stretch of the imagination, but their need comes from chaos. Ima go with chaos being the bigger evil on this one.

Dark eldar are BFF-s with craftsworld eldar. That's allready enough for many people to rate them as emo-wanabe-evil instead of true evil.

Chaos are naturally evil. Dark Eldar are evil by choice.

To me, that makes DEldar the 'eviller'.

Chaos have a variety of reasons, some of which more sinister than others. Some Chaos forces turn because they were left with no choice, though a better way to go out is death.
But the Dark Eldar, they torture slaves to preserve their depraved lifestyle. Unlike their Craftworld cousins who lived in harder lives to prevent their soul being consumed, the Dark Eldar continue to indulge in hedonism and debauchery because they like it. They are the more evil bunch.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Chaos are naturally evil. Dark Eldar are evil by choice.

To me, that makes DEldar the 'eviller'.

Dark Eldar are evil by necessity, really. They're like predators feeding off prey. And they see themselves as higher than other species so it's okay to kill them, much like humans do with other species.

 Torga_DW wrote:
Chaos is the 'evil' gods, the 'good' gods not being mentioned any more. While life varies for the minions, the big 4 who are leading the show are without a doubt selfish and evil.

The dark eldar need to torture as a kind of 'food'. They're not good guys by any stretch of the imagination, but their need comes from chaos. Ima go with chaos being the bigger evil on this one.

I don't think so. Remember, it was the Dark Eldar who created Slaanesh in the first place. The Craftworld had nothing to do with that apart from their negligence.

Dark Eldar are evil to the core.
There existence relies on pain.

bibotot wrote:

 Torga_DW wrote:
Chaos is the 'evil' gods, the 'good' gods not being mentioned any more. While life varies for the minions, the big 4 who are leading the show are without a doubt selfish and evil.

The dark eldar need to torture as a kind of 'food'. They're not good guys by any stretch of the imagination, but their need comes from chaos. Ima go with chaos being the bigger evil on this one.

I don't think so. Remember, it was the Dark Eldar who created Slaanesh in the first place. The Craftworld had nothing to do with that apart from their negligence.

No, Eldar as a whole created Slaanesh. Craftworld Eldar are the ones that got outta there quickly, Dark Eldar are the ones who sheltered in Comorragh where they were safe.


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 jhe90 wrote:
Dark Eldar are evil to the core.
There existence relies on pain.

And Chaos' doesn't?

Well, you could think about Chaos people doing 'nice' things to others while they plan on enslaving/conquering/subduing/WOLOLO them later. Some are more subtle and could look like 'good' for a while (tzeentch cultits, specially)

Dark Eldar never were nice to anyone, except Craftworld in some stances.

Isn't this question somewhat redundant? Aren't Dark Eldar essentially the same as Slaaneshi worshippers in terms of their behaviour? Sans tentacles, perhaps...

The Dark Eldar (before they got the name) brought their empire to such low and widespread depravity that they created a new Chaos god. As the Exodites illustrated, it was possible for the Dark Eldar to cease such evil practices if they chose to.
Entities of Chaos never had such a choice. Their natures are locked in on whatever negative emotion/action spawned them. Though the Chaos gods are a bigger threat and are likely committing more evil acts throughout the galaxy then the Dark Eldar ever could, it is this lack of choice in the matter that would have me rate them as less evil.

Is there such a thing as 'Evil' in 40k?

To my mind there is very little 'evil'; only point of view.

I mean slaughtering people is evil (Technically this is because we defined it this way, but I'm not condoning the notion).

For example:
Space Marines in general are pretty evil. They kill anything not human, they force perfectly normal reasonable people to adhere to a specific doctrine and kill them if they deviate.

A Chaos Space Marine is not really as evil (depending on the marine). They kill often as a result of being unable to stop themselves (Khorne), they strive for perfection and/or get corrupted by desires (Slannesh/Tzench) or fear their own mortality (Nurgle).

They don't necessarily intend to be evil, they might not agree with the Emperor's doctrine.

Dark Eldar however do appear to be more evil.

 Fafnir13 wrote:
The Dark Eldar (before they got the name) brought their empire to such low and widespread depravity that they created a new Chaos god. As the Exodites illustrated, it was possible for the Dark Eldar to cease such evil practices if they chose to.
Entities of Chaos never had such a choice. Their natures are locked in on whatever negative emotion/action spawned them. Though the Chaos gods are a bigger threat and are likely committing more evil acts throughout the galaxy then the Dark Eldar ever could, it is this lack of choice in the matter that would have me rate them as less evil.

What about followers of chaos then? They have the same choice as Dark Eldar do.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Chaos are naturally evil. Dark Eldar are evil by choice.

To me, that makes DEldar the 'eviller'.

Would you say a lion is evil for mauling and eating the gazelle?

Dark Eldar commit atrocities because they're desperate and terrified of Slaanesh, but aren't willing to admit it and mask it with arrogance.

Chaos commit atrocities because they're greedy and believe they will be blessed or empowered as a reward for it.

Therefore I'd say Chaos are more evil.

Exactly.

Dark Eldar commit a certain set of actions because they're a tiny splinter group that will be instantly destroyed if they fail to placate their murder god. Sure, some of them may enjoy torture for its own sake, but by and large they act out of self-preservation.

One could argue that what dark eldar do isn't structurally different than a starving person hunting animals for meat.

Chaos, on the other hand, is a much, MUCH broader thing. Yes, there are some parts of chaos that are "elemental", and there are some parts of chaos that I'd argue are fighting for less-evil (the grimdark equivalent of good).

But with a tent that large, they're going to soak up more evil than a tiny group like dark eldar, and so their worst is likely to be worse.

I think Chaos is far more evil. They are the end all and be all of corruption and destruction.

Dark Eldar live to torture and raid other civilizations, but their endgame is pretty short-sighted.

Chaos, on the other hand, plans to worm its way into everything, corrupting and manipulating everyone.

Dark Chaos.

I'd rather be taken hostage by Chaos than Dark Eldar. At least the Chaos guys MIGHT straight up murder me. Dark Eldar will make it last months for sure.

Those voting "Chaos" should read Talon of Horus. It's a pretty radical change on how the warp and chaos (not the same thing) work. While not quite a retcon, pretty big shift on the metaphysics of 40k.

I voted Dark Eldar. It's like asking if Drow society is evil.

ImAGeek wrote:Dark Eldar are evil by necessity, really. They're like predators feeding off prey. And they see themselves as higher than other species so it's okay to kill them, much like humans do with other species.

melkorthetonedeaf wrote:Would you say a lion is evil for mauling and eating the gazelle?

Except that you're both missing one very important thing. Dark Eldar aren't lions. Dark Eldar aren't predators by necessity.

Dark Eldar are sadists by choice. At any point, a Dark Eldar could decide: "Hey. I don't think being a vicious monster is the right thing to do any more!", and go and get a Waystone and convert to the Paths, and thus be protected against Slaanesh without having to do anything evil at all.

The Dark Eldar are the Eldar who looked at their lifestyle, looked at what it had created in Slaanesh, then looked at what the soon-to-be Craftworld Eldar were suggesting, and said: "Well, sure, abstinence could make things better for everyone... but I'm having way too much fun torturing people." and then carried on doing exactly what they were doing before.

 Furyou Miko wrote:

ImAGeek wrote:Dark Eldar are evil by necessity, really. They're like predators feeding off prey. And they see themselves as higher than other species so it's okay to kill them, much like humans do with other species.

melkorthetonedeaf wrote:Would you say a lion is evil for mauling and eating the gazelle?

Except that you're both missing one very important thing. Dark Eldar aren't lions. Dark Eldar aren't predators by necessity.

Dark Eldar are sadists by choice. At any point, a Dark Eldar could decide: "Hey. I don't think being a vicious monster is the right thing to do any more!", and go and get a Waystone and convert to the Paths, and thus be protected against Slaanesh without having to do anything evil at all.

The Dark Eldar are the Eldar who looked at their lifestyle, looked at what it had created in Slaanesh, then looked at what the soon-to-be Craftworld Eldar were suggesting, and said: "Well, sure, abstinence could make things better for everyone... but I'm having way too much fun torturing people." and then carried on doing exactly what they were doing before.

And humans could become vegetarians and stop killing animals, but meat is delicious.

 ImAGeek wrote:

And humans could become vegetarians and stop killing animals, but meat is delicious.

I think you just proved his point

 ImAGeek wrote:


And humans could become vegetarians and stop killing animals, but meat is delicious.

They could, yes. That doesn't change the fact that evil-by-choice is more despicable than evil-by-nature.


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 Deafbeats wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

And humans could become vegetarians and stop killing animals, but meat is delicious.

I think you just proved his point

(also, her )

her! Sorry haha.

 Furyou Miko wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:


And humans could become vegetarians and stop killing animals, but meat is delicious.

They could, yes. That doesn't change the fact that evil-by-choice is more despicable than evil-by-nature.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Deafbeats wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

And humans could become vegetarians and stop killing animals, but meat is delicious.

I think you just proved his point

(also, her )

But like I've said, the followers of Chaos, they're also evil by choice, no? They don't have to follow Chaos, so are they not as bad as the DE?

Well.... Hmm... I dunno, some of them are just kinda forced into Chaos no? When CSM drop kick a planet don't they torture and enslave locals, and turn them to cultists? And I think Chaos is like a bad gang, once in, the only way out is in a 8 pointed star engraved box. If what Furyou Miko said is right, and tbh I have no idea, I don't know much about Dark Eldar, then they could have a change of heart as unlikely as it is, and join a path, whereas when Chaos has its grip on you, you can't escape it.

But yeah don't I have much of an idea about Chaos and Dark Eldar fluff, this is just what I think is some logical spit ballin'

edit.