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ok. im thinking of buying an air brush but I have no idea where to start. I have seen them priced online from $20 to over a $100. any suggestions? Thanks!
There are three things that you need to look for in an airbrush
- It needs to be a gravity feed (it paint loads from the top instead of the bottom)
- It needs to be dual action ( press down to start air, pull back to start paint)
- It needs to be made by badger, Iwata or paasche.
If you can't find one in your price range that meets these three requirements you should probably hold off on getting one. Airbrushes can be great tools, but cheap ones are waaay too much hassle and can lead to wasted time and ruined models.
Eddtheman wrote: There are three things that you need to look for in an airbrush
- It needs to be a gravity feed (it paint loads from the top instead of the bottom) - It needs to be dual action ( press down to start air, pull back to start paint) - It needs to be made by badger, Iwata or paasche.
If you can't find one in your price range that meets these three requirements you should probably hold off on getting one. Airbrushes can be great tools, but cheap ones are waaay too much hassle and can lead to wasted time and ruined models.
It's not quite as simple as that.
It really depends on what you think you'll use it for. There are a lot of people who buy airbrushes and just use them for basecoating armies, and for a lot of armies that's the main use they have.
Gravity feed vs siphon feed, the advantage of gravity feed is if you put a drop of paint in the cup, you can then proceed to spray that drop of paint. If you put a drop of paint in a siphon feed, it probably won't do anything because it has to be picked up by the siphon tube, fill the siphon tube and then reach the nozzle, so you have to use several drops of paint even if you only intend to paint a small area. That's why wargamers tend to favour gravity feed, as we often only want to paint a small amount of something without wasting paint. I've noticed finescale modellers tend not to care as much. If you're mostly spraying large amounts of paint at a time I can see the benefit of a siphon feed as the cups are typically larger, though I've never really had a problem with my 7cc cup, it's only if I'm spraying a large number of models I need to refill it part way through.
Single action vs dual action... I will admit I went straight for a dual action but on consideration I think a (good) single action would probably be fine for 90% of wargamers. So the way it works, double action you push down for air, pull back for paint, so while spraying you can adjust both at the same time. A single action, you set paint volume with a screw and then push down on the button for air and the paint comes through at whatever volume you set, so you can't be adjusting the paint volume easily while you spray. That's not to say you can't adjust the paint volume, it just means you have to set it before you press the button for air. After using my double action for about a year, I'm beginning to see the merit in a single action as when I want to change my spray distance I typically practice on a test surface anyway instead of trying to dynamically change it while spraying the actual model.
After spraying for a year I feel like the techniques that would genuinely benefit from using a double action over a single action are probably more advanced than 90% of wargamers will achieve, it's so incredibly rare for me to attempt to adjust flow volume while spraying and it usually results in making a mistake, lol. Of course if your target is to become a god of airbrushing, go for the double action... but I'm starting to think we wargamers are giving people bad advice by telling to ignore single action brushes completely.
As for brands, badger, Iwata, paasche, there's also harder and steenbeck, grex, runway 13, sparmax. I'm going to go against Eddtheman and say if it's your first airbrush a cheap one is probably fine, how cheap? I dunno, I haven't used any of the REALLY cheap ones. I started with an artlogic (cheap chinese) which was around a half to a third the price of similar Paasche brushes. If it's your first brush, you're going to have to learn how to pull it apart, how to clean it, I feel like the vast majority of problems you're going to have in your first year of airbrushing are going to be user error rather than a fault of the airbrush, so personally I'd be tempted to go for a cheap brush. But if you have the money you can go for something better, I'd just make sure you can get replacement parts cheap.
When I bought my first brush I asked the guy in the hobby store (who is a great painter himself, the stuff in his cabinet is incredible) and he basically said anything he can do with a paasche he can do with the cheap chinese brush, the paasche just feels higher quality and seems to last longer, but he still uses both of them.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/07 07:27:38
@Eddtheman - while Skink is right that this is a bit simplified, I must say, I pretty much agree with your TLDR buying guide I would add, a reasonable piston-style compressor with a tank.
@AllSeeingSkink - although I don't really disagree with you (everything is technically quite accurate), I'd add a few things.
- My first airbrush was single action, siphon fed. I hardly even used it, because of a few things. Siphon feed jars take TONS of paint just to get started. So if you're doing 28mm scale infantry, just a few at a time (as opposed to an army at a time, or at least a large squad) you'll waste more paint than anything else. Plus, the paint jar is in the way, on most siphon fed airbrushes (Grex being a notable exception).
- Single Action sounds good on paper, perhaps as a basecoating/priming device, but really, double action only takes about 1 hour more to get used to, and then it opens up a whole world of possibilities. You get a lot less control with single action, because you can't adjust the amount of paint flow without stopping and adjusting a screw. Plus, if you really price shop (ie don't buy it at your FLGS...) a reasonable double-action airbrush of the bards that Eddtheman suggested isn't really much more money.
- It is almost impossible to find a single action, gravity fed airbrush. Yes, they exist, but... they are really rare.
- If you buy an Iwata, the double action trigger mechanism is amazingly smooth, and there is less of an inclination to reef it back and let out way too much paint.
- I would stay away from Grex as a first airbrush. They cost a lot, if nothing else. And, the pistol-style thing sounds better than it actually is. I ended up returning mine. Never tried a harder & steenback, but I've heard great things.
- I own two Paasche Talon, and 1 junk brush. It's a WORLD of difference. The Paasche is just better engineering -- better trigger, better gravity well, better cup, smoother pull. A Paasche is actually a great buy, because they can come in a kit that includes 3 needle sizes -- 0.25mm, 0.38mm, and 0.66mm , plus heads and nozzles. All three are actually useful for painting 40k type stuff. The kit (TG-3F) is actually less than $100 (or $75-ish with just the 0.38mm)
- I kind of expect all my airbrushes to last forever. They don't perform any differently than the first day I bought them -- I think it's just a matter of keeping them clean.
@Nicky86 -- Most importantly... GO SEAHAWKS!!! Superbowl 50, here we come ^^
Talys wrote: - Single Action sounds good on paper, perhaps as a basecoating/priming device, but really, double action only takes about 1 hour more to get used to, and then it opens up a whole world of possibilities. You get a lot less control with single action, because you can't adjust the amount of paint flow without stopping and adjusting a screw. Plus, if you really price shop (ie don't buy it at your FLGS...) a reasonable double-action airbrush of the bards that Eddtheman suggested isn't really much more money.
I haven't really had enough time with good single action brushes to make an experienced comment... but I do feel I could do damned near everything I do with my double action with a decent single action (maybe not those super cheap $20 siphon fed ones, but there are better ones on the market).
I'm seriously considering getting an Iwata or Runway 13 single action gravity feed brush for my next AB because the dual action I have gives me hand cramps after about an hour of using it.
It's not like using a single action you lose the ability to modulate the opacity and thickness of your lines, instead of trying to varying the trigger position like you do with a dual action, you just vary the range and speed instead (which, frankly, is what I mostly do with my dual action anyway ).
- It is almost impossible to find a single action, gravity fed airbrush. Yes, they exist, but... they are really rare.
There are a few around. Badger make the 200G, I'm considering getting an Iwata Revolution M or a Runway 13 MA-101A Komachi.
- I kind of expect all my airbrushes to last forever. They don't perform any differently than the first day I bought them -- I think it's just a matter of keeping them clean.
Yeah I'm just going off what this guy said, I doubt he's lying, but he does also use enamels mostly so maybe it's an issue of harsher thinners and cleaners damaging seals and whatnot.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/07 12:45:08
ooh hot debate how fun! ... mightaswell thro in my 2pence.
'Airbrush' is a wide range of tools all made to play upto certain jobs better.
The siphon fed airbrushes have their use, mostly outside of the miniature painting arena, tee shirt guys love them, canvas painters too. Because they typically need a higher pressure to both siphon and atomize the paint than a gravity feed, they offer less control over detail unless the target object is able to absorb high volumes of fluid quickly ; like a canvas, a tee shirt, a plastered wall etc etc. On a hard non absorbent surface this will usually result in having to stay well back or push wet paint around the job. making spider marks or various other issues.
Automotive airbrushers spraying at a metal panel would go for a gravity feed more often than not because of the lower pressure letting them get closer and have more control. The same is true for mini's because theyre so small overall and typically not absorbent we cannot afford to waste that control on offer. And its preferable to build up light layers of fine detail, which is more achievable with a gravity feed running thinner paints at lower air pressures.
This also reduces strain on the air source, and lets us shop weaker motors without much problem.
The trade off is having to clean up between colours more.
Siphon can come into play if volume work is being looked at for sure. But for almost every situation on mini painting, a gravity feed should do you better.
Needle size; this is hot debate are also, I use 0.2mm most of the time. And have no problems with it shooting any citadel or vallejo colours. Vallejo airbrush thinner, and Liquitex airbrush medium are brilliant!
It is trickier to learn on a tiny needle, they clog more, and have more issues overall than something in the region of 0.5mm, I'd suggest starting with a 0.3 to 0.5mm sort of nozzle setup. If you feel that you need to do finer lines than is possible with those maybe go smaller. Really an airbrush can pull a line as thin as its nozzle under optimal circumstances.
Brands; Eddtheman is talking out of his arse, As pointed out by Talys theres quite a few others. The way to choose one really is to find out who you can get spare parts for close to home. You are going to need a needle, nozzle, and o-rings oneday these parts are considered consumable. ; its a matter of buy a cheap airbrush to throw away instead of fix, or buy a nice airbrush that is worth buying parts for, if the needle/nozzle set is worth more than half of the airbrush total cost, throw it away and buy a new one. (also if you ever change the needle seal, theres a tool to put it back in that youl need too, I've onyl seen harder and steenbeck offer this tool)
For me Harder and Steenbeck Evolution (no need for the infinity's gold plating and red anodising although it is pretty), never looking back at the frankly awful Badger patriot 105 that I have; I've got a china special that outshines it in every way I can think of.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2015/02/07 15:35:41
'Ain't nothing crazy about me but my brain. Right brain? Riight! No not you right brain! Right left brain? Right!... Okay then lets do this!!
Talys wrote: @Eddtheman - while Skink is right that this is a bit simplified, I must say, I pretty much agree with your TLDR buying guide I would add, a reasonable piston-style compressor with a tank.
@AllSeeingSkink - although I don't really disagree with you (everything is technically quite accurate), I'd add a few things.
- My first airbrush was single action, siphon fed. I hardly even used it, because of a few things. Siphon feed jars take TONS of paint just to get started. So if you're doing 28mm scale infantry, just a few at a time (as opposed to an army at a time, or at least a large squad) you'll waste more paint than anything else. Plus, the paint jar is in the way, on most siphon fed airbrushes (Grex being a notable exception).
- Single Action sounds good on paper, perhaps as a basecoating/priming device, but really, double action only takes about 1 hour more to get used to, and then it opens up a whole world of possibilities. You get a lot less control with single action, because you can't adjust the amount of paint flow without stopping and adjusting a screw. Plus, if you really price shop (ie don't buy it at your FLGS...) a reasonable double-action airbrush of the bards that Eddtheman suggested isn't really much more money.
- It is almost impossible to find a single action, gravity fed airbrush. Yes, they exist, but... they are really rare.
- If you buy an Iwata, the double action trigger mechanism is amazingly smooth, and there is less of an inclination to reef it back and let out way too much paint.
- I would stay away from Grex as a first airbrush. They cost a lot, if nothing else. And, the pistol-style thing sounds better than it actually is. I ended up returning mine. Never tried a harder & steenback, but I've heard great things.
- I own two Paasche Talon, and 1 junk brush. It's a WORLD of difference. The Paasche is just better engineering -- better trigger, better gravity well, better cup, smoother pull. A Paasche is actually a great buy, because they can come in a kit that includes 3 needle sizes -- 0.25mm, 0.38mm, and 0.66mm , plus heads and nozzles. All three are actually useful for painting 40k type stuff. The kit (TG-3F) is actually less than $100 (or $75-ish with just the 0.38mm)
- I kind of expect all my airbrushes to last forever. They don't perform any differently than the first day I bought them -- I think it's just a matter of keeping them clean.
@Nicky86 -- Most importantly... GO SEAHAWKS!!! Superbowl 50, here we come ^^
go hawks! and thanks for all of the help guys. Im mostly looking an air brush to do patterns on models. I wanted to stencil a checkering effect on my wraith knights head.
HairySticks wrote: Brands; Eddtheman is talking out of his arse, As pointed out by Talys theres quite a few others. The way to choose one really is to find out who you can get spare parts for close to home. You are going to need a needle, nozzle, and o-rings oneday these parts are considered consumable. ; its a matter of buy a cheap airbrush to throw away instead of fix, or buy a nice airbrush that is worth buying parts for, if the needle/nozzle set is worth more than half of the airbrush total cost, throw it away and buy a new one. (also if you ever change the needle seal, theres a tool to put it back in that youl need too, I've onyl seen harder and steenbeck offer this tool) For me Harder and Steenbeck Evolution (no need for the infinity's gold plating and red anodising although it is pretty), never looking back at the frankly awful Badger patriot 105 that I have; I've got a china special that outshines it in every way I can think of.
I've always struggled with which brand to buy because there's a lot of opinions and none of which actually help me decide, people will often tell you one brand is better than another without actually articulating why. I would like to try a Harder and Steenbeck but they are soooo much more expensive than I can get a range of other brushes, so I can't really justify it. People often recommend Badger but I've heard lots of bad about their cheaper brushes (which frankly aren't that cheap anyway, lol) compared to the likes of Iwata or Grex or Runway 13 (I think Runway 13 might be an Australian brand? Not sure).
I think the only way to really know which brush is right for you is to buy something, anything, learn how to use it, then start using other brushes to see which one you like best... which isn't really practical unless you have a bunch of friends who own brushes they are willing to let you try them or have lots of money to burn buying different brushes.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/08 07:05:37
AllSeeingSkink wrote: I feel like the vast majority of problems you're going to have in your first year of airbrushing are going to be user error rather than a fault of the airbrush, so personally I'd be tempted to go for a cheap brush.
That stance is likely due to the "[having never] used any of the REALLY cheap ones" bit that preceded it. My effective start in airbrushing was seriously delayed (not to mention all of the accompanying frustration!) by a crap starter brush (I've ranted about that Master G44 in other threads). It took me ages of messing with spray technique, air pressure, paint consistency, etc. to finally diagnose an irreparable mechanical flaw, due to poor machining. A good deal on Amazon netting me a Sotar is what finally allowed me to actually start learning, not just fight my equipment.
If you're the type who does his homework and cares for his tools, your only fear when starting with a mid- to high-end brush should be losing interest and, thereby, wasting money. There are good brushes with reasonably priced replacement parts, should you bend a needle or split a nozzle (whether due to clumsiness or ignorance), that will serve as much better training tools than a bargain bin brush, as well as actually maintaining their usefulness well after you've expanded your collection.
That's not to say that all cheap brushes are garbage, of course. I paid less for a HF siphon-feed (<$20) than I did for the accursed G44 and it's perfectly serviceable (after a cheap replacement color cup from Badger circumvented one idiotic bit of design, that is), especially now that I have at least some sense of what I'm doing. Starting out, though, I'd have been infinitely better served springing for an Iwata Neo, let alone a mid-range Badger or actual Iwata (only ignoring H&S for price point, being on the higher end of the 'Big 3').
The Dreadnote wrote:But the Emperor already has a shrine, in the form of your local Games Workshop. You honour him by sacrificing your money to the plastic effigies of his warriors. In time, your devotion will be rewarded with the gift of having even more effigies to worship.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: I've always struggled with which brand to buy because there's a lot of opinions and none of which actually help me decide, people will often tell you one brand is better than another without actually articulating why. I would like to try a Harder and Steenbeck but they are soooo much more expensive than I can get a range of other brushes, so I can't really justify it. People often recommend Badger but I've heard lots of bad about their cheaper brushes (which frankly aren't that cheap anyway, lol) compared to the likes of Iwata or Grex or Runway 13 (I think Runway 13 might be an Australian brand? Not sure).
I think the only way to really know which brush is right for you is to buy something, anything, learn how to use it, then start using other brushes to see which one you like best... which isn't really practical unless you have a bunch of friends who own brushes they are willing to let you try them or have lots of money to burn buying different brushes.
Just a suggestion, I dont suppose you can get Vallejo airbrushing sets near by?
Vallejo bundle H&S Ultra and Evolution Models with their paint sets. (which in all honesty I expect is nothing more than proximity ; vallejo are Spanish, H&S are German, theyre neighbours and enjoy EU trading terms) ~ side note... was anyone surprised that the Germans made a top notch airbrush with their reputation for precision engineering?!
Needle size; this is hot debate are also, I use 0.2mm most of the time. And have no problems with it shooting any citadel or vallejo colours. Vallejo airbrush thinner, and Liquitex airbrush medium are brilliant!
It is trickier to learn on a tiny needle, they clog more, and have more issues overall than something in the region of 0.5mm, I'd suggest starting with a 0.3 to 0.5mm sort of nozzle setup. If you feel that you need to do finer lines than is possible with those maybe go smaller. Really an airbrush can pull a line as thin as its nozzle under optimal circumstances.
If you paint terrain or large pieces (like the Honored Imperium statue) with an airbrush, the large needles/nozzles really speed things up. I wouldn't go out of my way to buy one, but if it comes as a freebie in a kit, you'll probably find a couple of times to pop it out of the box. It's also nice if you're mixing up non-airbrush paint, in the gravity well and not being very careful about the thinner ratio.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Gunzhard wrote: Look I'm sorry but Talys doesn't know what the heck he is talking about!
The Patriots are going to repeat. ;-)
HA! PFFFT!
I really thought the Hawks had that last one, lol. That intercept was epic.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/09 01:13:18
I have been airbrushing only a short while but I will add my two pennys. I bought a cheap Chinese airbrush to start. A BD 130 I believe. I still use it on occasion for metallics and things of that nature. I found it a nice little airbrush for the money while allowing me some time to ponder if it really was something I wanted to invest in. It was. So i bought a Harder & Steenbeck Evolution Silverline 2 in 1. This is an excellent airbrush. such a difference. You get 2 cup sizes and 2 needle sizes, 0.2 and 0.4, that eliminates one dilemma. Bottom line, I could have skipped the BD 130, but I'm happy with the way it went. It Depends how much disposable cash you have I suppose. BTW the Evolution is not made by badger, Iwata or paasche.
I would add, a reasonable piston-style compressor with a tank.
).
ooh hot debate how fun! ... mightaswell thro in my 2pence.
and thanks for all of the help guys. Im mostly looking an air brush to do patterns on models. I wanted to stencil a checkering effect on my wraith knights head.
