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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/15 19:46:39
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Highlord with a Blackstone Fortress
Adrift within the vortex of my imagination.
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Tamwulf wrote:In my meta, we started the first OP Dominion War last August. We had a Gentleman's Agreement that no one would play Borg. Well, a couple new players showed up around OP 3, and demanded to be allowed to play Borg (they threatened to call Wizkids, get the LGS owner involved, etc. etc. ) rather then deal with all that drama and crap, we let them play Borg. Since then, we have ran the entire Dom War, Rif, Episodes, and Collective OP's. In every single one except one OP, it was a Borg player that won. The only one that a Borg player didn't win was to a Klingon Fleet with multiple Dispersion Fields and a horde of ships with Martok and Galron (it was insane how many attack dice each ship was throwing). That player tried it again at the next OP and was shut down by Borg Mines and a Tactical Cube just running over it again and again and again until all his ships were destroyed.
Really, the Borg have ruined the game. I still play, but I refuse to play against the Borg unless it's a FLGS scenario game we make up or an OP. Casual, fun play? No way.
Stupid Borg. Why Wizkids? Why?
Sounds like your FGS is full of 'that guys'. Perhaps the answer is to bring two fleets to every fight. express a preference for no Borg. If the opponent agrees bring out your normal fleet and profit with a mutual enjoyable pleasant game. If the opponent wants borg then table a borg fleet, non-faction pure with every minimaxed trick you can think of. Play to win, play extreme and use the wording of the rules to your advantage.
Both opponents get the sort of game they deserve.
How does that help? Its the psychology of 'that guy'. That guy likes to field a broken list, because he only want to win, that guy never wants a fair or balanced game, and doesnt want to face someone who can also tailor a list. 'That guy' isd the first to complain a list is broken or cheesy if it minimaxes and is used against them. most 'that guys' only know how to make the best lists from lurking on forums for third party experience. Tounament winners and other quality players are rarely 'that guys' those who can dream up the tactics more often than not know how to play competeitive and casual, and choose between the two.
There are exceptions, but the stereotype holds up in most cases. 'That guy' doesn't want to play the player who can table their broken cookie cutter lists. After a few drubbings they will likely go away. Problem solved.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/15 19:56:20
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/15 20:32:04
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Well, as the others have said, you'll not win any chums, alas. A double Soong list, or scout cube/Soong, is both fun and fluffy. If you are playing them for love of faction - which is perfectly valid - some retro TNG action could be just the ticket. It's also perfectly reasonable to come across killer combos yourself, and I'd say that if not that familiar with the relative power levels in the game that may not be immediately obvious - but again, noone will thankyou. Play faction against type. Show folk, hey, I can build borg, but it in a way that you've not seen before.
Just my tuppence worth, mind
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Theophony"... and there's strippers in terminator armor and lovecraftian shenanigans afoot."
Solar_Lion: "Man this sums up your blog nicely."
Anpu-adom: "being Geek is about Love. Some love broadly. Some love deeply. And then there are people like Graven. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/15 22:11:29
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Wow, some of you guys are just getting off on being snarky and nasty to demonize a player that is new to the game.
Like I said, try playing around with adding extra restrictions to how you build your fleet to tone down their power relative to the rest of the game. Lower fleet points than your opponents should be a good move towards how Borg should have been designed, as they are too cheap for what they do. Consider yourself to be doing the playtesting that Wizkids should have done if they were EVER any good at that sort of thing.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/15 22:13:14
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/15 23:56:32
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Stubborn Prosecutor
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Tamwulf wrote:Ok... I failed at getting a good three ship build, but I found an ok combo:
Queen Vessel Prime [Queen Vessel Prime Expansion]
Tactical Drone [Sphere]
Subspace Beacon [Scout Cube Expansion]
Total (50)
Borg Sphere 4270 [Sphere]
Drone [Cube]
Total (40)
Oh hey! Look at that! Bringing two ships with a combined 14 shields and 15 hull! And you'll be throwing at least 14 attack dice every turn in any direction. Some shooting phases, you'll be throwing 16 attack dice at range one with a scan token. And you can't see how over powered that is? Really? /disgust
Have fun winning your tournament!
Ok, let's not be nasty. It is a strong list, but it isn't the cheesiest thing in the game. It will only have 12 dice total and 14 at range 1. There are some Klingon builds that can throw more. He isn't using Hull Armour, that is where the borg get a big boost, adding 4 more hull and ignoring crits. He will have 0 defense, so feds and Dominion have a goof chance against him, especially if they have fighters. TL and the Tac Drone are the only dice fixing he has, Romulan permacloak will cause him some problems. I have have taken apart a double sphere build with double Scimitar. It isn't easy, but doable.
There are ways to take on this list. That being said, the others are right. You may have to put up with some crap or looks just for taking Borg. Unfortunately Borg have left a bad taste in people's mouth. Even in faction pure they have very few draw backs. The the suggested format has been the best thing to bring them in line with everything else, but they are still good. No where near the level they were before, but good. Your millage may very, but in a lot places people are tired of playing Borg or playing agains them. That is why more and more venues are banning them to try and bring back players they lost.
I am in no way knocking your fleet choice, just letting you know what you could expect.
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It's time to go full Skeletor |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 00:06:51
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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Tamwulf wrote:Ok... I failed at getting a good three ship build, but I found an ok combo:
Queen Vessel Prime [Queen Vessel Prime Expansion]
Tactical Drone [Sphere]
Subspace Beacon [Scout Cube Expansion]
Total (50)
Borg Sphere 4270 [Sphere]
Drone [Cube]
Total (40)
Oh hey! Look at that! Bringing two ships with a combined 14 shields and 15 hull! And you'll be throwing at least 14 attack dice every turn in any direction. Some shooting phases, you'll be throwing 16 attack dice at range one with a scan token. And you can't see how over powered that is? Really? /disgust
Have fun winning your tournament!
/Only been playing a week, two at the most.
I see this like the two falcon or two B Wing Boat builds in XWing.
Tough to beat, but very possible to beat.
As it's my first tournament, I have no clue what to take or what meta I've got aside from two of my buds taking Dominion.
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Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 00:45:41
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Puscifer wrote:
I see this like the two falcon or two B Wing Boat builds in XWing.
It isn't. They obey the same rules as the rest of the ships, borg don't, borg play a game where everyone else has Knights on the board and borg bring Queens... with miniguns.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 00:47:47
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Stubborn Prosecutor
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More like rooks, Borg don't move diagonally
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It's time to go full Skeletor |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 01:05:09
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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I thought this looked fairly Queen-like to me.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/16 01:05:26
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 01:09:34
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Stubborn Prosecutor
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That isn't the real card that is fan made from before borg came out. Automatically Appended Next Post: Here are the real Borg movement cards. No banks, no turns. Just back & forth, left and right.
(  )
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/16 01:18:26
It's time to go full Skeletor |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 08:16:10
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Abel
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Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Tamwulf wrote:Ok... I failed at getting a good three ship build, but I found an ok combo:
Queen Vessel Prime [Queen Vessel Prime Expansion]
Tactical Drone [Sphere]
Subspace Beacon [Scout Cube Expansion]
Total (50)
Borg Sphere 4270 [Sphere]
Drone [Cube]
Total (40)
Oh hey! Look at that! Bringing two ships with a combined 14 shields and 15 hull! And you'll be throwing at least 14 attack dice every turn in any direction. Some shooting phases, you'll be throwing 16 attack dice at range one with a scan token. And you can't see how over powered that is? Really? /disgust
Have fun winning your tournament!
Ok, let's not be nasty. It is a strong list, but it isn't the cheesiest thing in the game. It will only have 12 dice total and 14 at range 1. There are some Klingon builds that can throw more. He isn't using Hull Armour, that is where the borg get a big boost, adding 4 more hull and ignoring crits. He will have 0 defense, so feds and Dominion have a goof chance against him, especially if they have fighters. TL and the Tac Drone are the only dice fixing he has, Romulan permacloak will cause him some problems. I have have taken apart a double sphere build with double Scimitar. It isn't easy, but doable.
There are ways to take on this list. That being said, the others are right. You may have to put up with some crap or looks just for taking Borg. Unfortunately Borg have left a bad taste in people's mouth. Even in faction pure they have very few draw backs. The the suggested format has been the best thing to bring them in line with everything else, but they are still good. No where near the level they were before, but good. Your millage may very, but in a lot places people are tired of playing Borg or playing agains them. That is why more and more venues are banning them to try and bring back players they lost.
I am in no way knocking your fleet choice, just letting you know what you could expect.
The Queen Ship has an ability, not even an action, that if you have a scan token or another friendly ship within range 1-2, that ship gets +1 attack die. He has the sub space beacon, which- tap for a free scan token and all friendly ships within 1-2 also get a scan token. So, yeah, he'll have 14 attack dice, and 16 at range 1. If he's lucky enough to get the Scout Cube as his blind draw, that'll be 20-21 attack dice. Automatically Appended Next Post: Orlanth wrote: Tamwulf wrote:In my meta, we started the first OP Dominion War last August. We had a Gentleman's Agreement that no one would play Borg. Well, a couple new players showed up around OP 3, and demanded to be allowed to play Borg (they threatened to call Wizkids, get the LGS owner involved, etc. etc. ) rather then deal with all that drama and crap, we let them play Borg. Since then, we have ran the entire Dom War, Rif, Episodes, and Collective OP's. In every single one except one OP, it was a Borg player that won. The only one that a Borg player didn't win was to a Klingon Fleet with multiple Dispersion Fields and a horde of ships with Martok and Galron (it was insane how many attack dice each ship was throwing). That player tried it again at the next OP and was shut down by Borg Mines and a Tactical Cube just running over it again and again and again until all his ships were destroyed.
Really, the Borg have ruined the game. I still play, but I refuse to play against the Borg unless it's a FLGS scenario game we make up or an OP. Casual, fun play? No way.
Stupid Borg. Why Wizkids? Why?
Sounds like your FGS is full of 'that guys'. Perhaps the answer is to bring two fleets to every fight. express a preference for no Borg. If the opponent agrees bring out your normal fleet and profit with a mutual enjoyable pleasant game. If the opponent wants borg then table a borg fleet, non-faction pure with every minimaxed trick you can think of. Play to win, play extreme and use the wording of the rules to your advantage.
Both opponents get the sort of game they deserve.
How does that help? Its the psychology of 'that guy'. That guy likes to field a broken list, because he only want to win, that guy never wants a fair or balanced game, and doesnt want to face someone who can also tailor a list. 'That guy' isd the first to complain a list is broken or cheesy if it minimaxes and is used against them. most 'that guys' only know how to make the best lists from lurking on forums for third party experience. Tounament winners and other quality players are rarely 'that guys' those who can dream up the tactics more often than not know how to play competeitive and casual, and choose between the two.
There are exceptions, but the stereotype holds up in most cases. 'That guy' doesn't want to play the player who can table their broken cookie cutter lists. After a few drubbings they will likely go away. Problem solved.
This would really only work in friendly, casual games, and it's not a problem in those games. I simply don't play those players. During an OP this is an unworkable solution as you would have to allow everyone to bring two fleets- Borg and non-Borg players alike, or the Borg players would just cry foul that everyone else gets two lists and they don't.
I'm not going to stoop down to a WAAC players level just to give him/her a taste of their own medicine. It won't stop them from playing Borg- especially if they know how much I hate the Borg and I'm only doing it to prove a point that they already know- the Borg are Over Powered and broke STAW. If I win, they will just shrug their shoulders and say ".... it didn't really count, and your going back to playing Mirror Universe next week anyway, so it doesn't matter. I'm still going to play them at the next OP and collect my prize ship to sell on eBay."
The only way to defeat the Borg is by playing Borg. There are one or two Fed builds (Voyagernought) that can do it, but you make one wrong move, or your dice decide to not cooperate, and you're done. Game over. Borg vs. Borg- might as well just roll five attack dice and who ever gets the most Battle Stations wins.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/16 08:30:04
Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 12:40:37
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Stubborn Prosecutor
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Tamwulf wrote:
The Queen Ship has an ability, not even an action, that if you have a scan token or another friendly ship within range 1-2, that ship gets +1 attack die. He has the sub space beacon, which- tap for a free scan token and all friendly ships within 1-2 also get a scan token. So, yeah, he'll have 14 attack dice, and 16 at range 1. If he's lucky enough to the Scout Cube as his blind draw, that'll be 20-21 attack dice.
That is not how the Queens Vessel works. It says you "may spend the scan token from beside this ship gain +1 attack die". So the Queens vessel must be the one taking the scan action and that ship or another friendly can spend the scan for +1 attack. You can't have multiple ships using it a turn. Even if you had a way to take multiple scan tokens (Janeway, Officer resource, Romulan Pilot) it is a nonaction "may" ability, so it can only be used once a turn.
At the best, using that ability, he would have 15 dice at range 1. (6 + 1 range + 6 +1 range +1 spend Queens scan = 15). Target locks all around are much better. Having the Queen's vessel reroll its dice is way better than giving 1 ship an extra attack. Unless the opponent is cloaked then it's alright.
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It's time to go full Skeletor |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 16:48:34
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Abel
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Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Tamwulf wrote:
The Queen Ship has an ability, not even an action, that if you have a scan token or another friendly ship within range 1-2, that ship gets +1 attack die. He has the sub space beacon, which- tap for a free scan token and all friendly ships within 1-2 also get a scan token. So, yeah, he'll have 14 attack dice, and 16 at range 1. If he's lucky enough to the Scout Cube as his blind draw, that'll be 20-21 attack dice.
That is not how the Queens Vessel works. It says you "may spend the scan token from beside this ship gain +1 attack die". So the Queens vessel must be the one taking the scan action and that ship or another friendly can spend the scan for +1 attack. You can't have multiple ships using it a turn. Even if you had a way to take multiple scan tokens (Janeway, Officer resource, Romulan Pilot) it is a nonaction "may" ability, so it can only be used once a turn.
At the best, using that ability, he would have 15 dice at range 1. (6 + 1 range + 6 +1 range +1 spend Queens scan = 15). Target locks all around are much better. Having the Queen's vessel reroll its dice is way better than giving 1 ship an extra attack. Unless the opponent is cloaked then it's alright.
Opps, yup. I missed the "...your ship, or 1 friendly ship..." on the Queen Vessel Prime. When I faced this list, it was before the WORF "nonaction "may" ability ruling. I was doing all that from memory. And I'm old, and the island is full of Penguins, so sometimes I get information wrong. However, the use of Subspace Beacon, the Queen Vessel Prime, and Target Locks would all be a rotating dynamic, and the player could get 15 dice of attacks, with all rerolls. I've seen it done, and it's stupid. If the player pulls the Kazon "Banana Boat" as his blind draw, that could be a potential 7 attack dice with a reroll (4 base, +1 for green maneuver, +1 for range 1, +1 for Scan token/Queen Ship ability- action: Target Lock). In this best case scenario, the player at range one could potentially throw 21 attack dice with re-rolls that round. On the other hand, he could potentially pull the Vulcan ship, which means his offensive firepower would be greatly diminished, but he'd have a large ship that could be hard to kill. /shrug
Anywho- yeah, it's a classic Borg list that's just stupid good, and easy button.
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Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 16:59:43
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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Ok... Tested the build with friends and their OP and competitive builds.
Yeah, I'm not taking the Borg unless it's in a competitive tourney.
I didn't lose a single hull point in any game. The ships were destroying one a turn easy on something like a KBOP.
I faced what would have been a filth 4 KBOP list against anyone else, but it was over in less than 20 minutes.
The other games were against Dominion. The Jemhadar Battleship was destroyed with a single volley from both the Sphere and Octohedron.
I'm going Romulan instead.
I'm sorry I doubted anyone.
With the 360 degree arc and those manoeuvres, the Borg are totally OP.
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Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 18:23:56
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Puscifer wrote:Ok... Tested the build with friends and their OP and competitive builds.
Yeah, I'm not taking the Borg unless it's in a competitive tourney.
I didn't lose a single hull point in any game. The ships were destroying one a turn easy on something like a KBOP.
I faced what would have been a filth 4 KBOP list against anyone else, but it was over in less than 20 minutes.
The other games were against Dominion. The Jemhadar Battleship was destroyed with a single volley from both the Sphere and Octohedron.
I'm going Romulan instead.
I'm sorry I doubted anyone.
With the 360 degree arc and those manoeuvres, the Borg are totally OP.
Romulans are sneaky, I really enjoy playing them. The Scimitar is a beast but not borg-powerful and they have a lot of great tech. Captains and crew aren't on par with Klingons or Feds and they'll never put out the sort of dakka you get with Dominion, but they do have very nice combos.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 18:49:08
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
The Great State of New Jersey
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Shame, I had only a minor interest in the game, mostly because I thought playing Borg would be fun, guess Wizkids wont be gettin any of my $, no real loss there (for me).
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 20:03:25
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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chaos0xomega wrote:Shame, I had only a minor interest in the game, mostly because I thought playing Borg would be fun, guess Wizkids wont be gettin any of my $, no real loss there (for me).
Oh it was fun for me, but I really felt bad for my opponent.
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Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/16 23:48:42
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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Romulans are my favourite fleet. They're not easy and they don't have some of the crutches of other factions but they are fun and rewarding
I've not won an OP as Romulans, but I've finished 2nd or 3rd almost every time
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/17 03:59:33
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Abel
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chaos0xomega wrote:Shame, I had only a minor interest in the game, mostly because I thought playing Borg would be fun, guess Wizkids wont be gettin any of my $, no real loss there (for me).
Well, it's a fun game as long as you don't take it too seriously and no one plays Borg. /shrug
If you really are concerned about play balance and not too interested in Star Trek, may I suggest Fantasy Flight Game's X-wing? Almost exactly the same play mechanics, better looking ships, and way tighter game play. The draw back? Not as ship customizable as Star Trek, and nowhere near the OP support or prizes the Wiz Kids offers. Oh, and only two factions (Imperial and Rebel) with limited ships for both sides. A third faction, Scum and Villainy, has been due out for months, but for some reason, FFG just can't seem to get it's product onto store shelves. Automatically Appended Next Post: Puscifer wrote:Ok... Tested the build with friends and their OP and competitive builds.
Yeah, I'm not taking the Borg unless it's in a competitive tourney.
I didn't lose a single hull point in any game. The ships were destroying one a turn easy on something like a KBOP.
I faced what would have been a filth 4 KBOP list against anyone else, but it was over in less than 20 minutes.
The other games were against Dominion. The Jemhadar Battleship was destroyed with a single volley from both the Sphere and Octohedron.
I'm going Romulan instead.
I'm sorry I doubted anyone.
With the 360 degree arc and those manoeuvres, the Borg are totally OP.
Yup. That's the Borg for you. Now, as your friend was playing with Klingon Birds of Prey, yeah, they are easy to one shot if they are not cloaked. Even so, 6-7 attack dice against 5 evade dice means a couple hits and maybe crits each round, which are devastating on a ship with only 2-3 hull. Kinda curious about the Dom Battleship and how it performed so poorly. Usually that's one of the ships able to go head to head with the Borg.
Now you know why the Borg are so OP, and I hope you can understand my vehemence towards them. Romulans are an excellent choice, especially with all the Romulan Love Wizkids has finally starting throwing at them. The joke used to be that Wizkids hated the Romulans, and gave them crappy ships, poor captains, and even worse upgrades. Now, they have the Valdore (which was one of the best ships in the game when it came out), the Scimitar (you'll want two of them- believe me!), and the fun little Flea- I mean, Drone ship.
Have fun, and good luck! Just say no to the Borg.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/17 04:06:11
Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/17 11:25:06
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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I've bought a sizeable fleet so far...
Scimitar
Valdore
The Assimilated Warbird
Regular Warbird
Regular RBOP
Vorta Vor
Thinking of getting another Scimitar, but not sure how Romulans play yet. I know about the cloaking, but the synergy between cards and ships seems to be ramp up with +1 Attack Dice skills and Donatra.
Is that right?
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Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/17 16:15:11
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
The Great State of New Jersey
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Tamwulf wrote:chaos0xomega wrote:Shame, I had only a minor interest in the game, mostly because I thought playing Borg would be fun, guess Wizkids wont be gettin any of my $, no real loss there (for me).
Well, it's a fun game as long as you don't take it too seriously and no one plays Borg. /shrug
If you really are concerned about play balance and not too interested in Star Trek, may I suggest Fantasy Flight Game's X-wing? Almost exactly the same play mechanics, better looking ships, and way tighter game play. The draw back? Not as ship customizable as Star Trek, and nowhere near the OP support or prizes the Wiz Kids offers. Oh, and only two factions (Imperial and Rebel) with limited ships for both sides. A third faction, Scum and Villainy, has been due out for months, but for some reason, FFG just can't seem to get it's product onto store shelves.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Puscifer wrote:Ok... Tested the build with friends and their OP and competitive builds.
Yeah, I'm not taking the Borg unless it's in a competitive tourney.
I didn't lose a single hull point in any game. The ships were destroying one a turn easy on something like a KBOP.
I faced what would have been a filth 4 KBOP list against anyone else, but it was over in less than 20 minutes.
The other games were against Dominion. The Jemhadar Battleship was destroyed with a single volley from both the Sphere and Octohedron.
I'm going Romulan instead.
I'm sorry I doubted anyone.
With the 360 degree arc and those manoeuvres, the Borg are totally OP.
Yup. That's the Borg for you. Now, as your friend was playing with Klingon Birds of Prey, yeah, they are easy to one shot if they are not cloaked. Even so, 6-7 attack dice against 5 evade dice means a couple hits and maybe crits each round, which are devastating on a ship with only 2-3 hull. Kinda curious about the Dom Battleship and how it performed so poorly. Usually that's one of the ships able to go head to head with the Borg.
Now you know why the Borg are so OP, and I hope you can understand my vehemence towards them. Romulans are an excellent choice, especially with all the Romulan Love Wizkids has finally starting throwing at them. The joke used to be that Wizkids hated the Romulans, and gave them crappy ships, poor captains, and even worse upgrades. Now, they have the Valdore (which was one of the best ships in the game when it came out), the Scimitar (you'll want two of them- believe me!), and the fun little Flea- I mean, Drone ship.
Have fun, and good luck! Just say no to the Borg.
Oh child, dont talk to me about XWing lol, many many mistakes were made with that game, and I regret none of them.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/17 17:32:36
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Puscifer wrote:I've bought a sizeable fleet so far...
Scimitar
Valdore
The Assimilated Warbird
Regular Warbird
Regular RBOP
Vorta Vor
Thinking of getting another Scimitar, but not sure how Romulans play yet. I know about the cloaking, but the synergy between cards and ships seems to be ramp up with +1 Attack Dice skills and Donatra.
Is that right?
Look up the following cards.
Romulan Pilot
Romulan tactical officer
Interphase Generator
Advanced cloaking device
Cloaked mines.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/17 17:37:36
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Abel
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chaos0xomega wrote:
Oh child, dont talk to me about XWing lol, many many mistakes were made with that game, and I regret none of them.
FFG made mistakes with X-Wing, or you made mistakes with X-wing? I'm not quite getting the reference.
I like it just because most ships only throw out 3-4 attack dice with a similar amount of defense dice. It really becomes a game of maneuverability like STAW had back in the beginning before ships started throwing 6+ attack dice, and then the Borg happened...
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Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/17 18:33:54
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba
The Great State of New Jersey
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"If you have to ask, you'll never know."
I made the mistakes, I have more stuff for it than I will ever use, and so much more on preorder.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/28 13:39:13
Subject: What am I missing with the Borg?
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Fixture of Dakka
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Tamwulf wrote:
FFG made mistakes with X-Wing, or you made mistakes with X-wing? I'm not quite getting the reference.
The reference. But yeah, I played a 100 point Dominion VS 80 point Borg game a few months ago, that I think included the 50 point per ship cap. So, I figured, "ok, attempt to balance the game, lets see..." So I took what should be a 'classic' style casual game Jem Hadar fleet, Battlecruiser and 2 Attack Ships. Oppnent had Borg with a Diamond (with shield matrix and Queen)and a Scout Cube (with transwarp signal).
Result, Dead attack ship in the first 2 rounds of shooting. A Transwarp Signal basically nullified my battlecruiser's firing on round 2. And Round 3 because of the aux token. Of course, my shooting would have been pants on Round 4 due to needing to flip too. Basically, by that point, my Battle Cruiser would be dead.
Sure, my fault for not going for a proper fleet but still, I was given as much as sensibly possible in my favour to try to make a properly balanced game, I had no major tactical 'fails' or anything like that. The borg fleet wasn't even that powerful and yeah, combat ineffective within a couple of rounds. I'm not even sure I took down the Diamonds shields properly.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/28 13:39:42
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/28 17:20:56
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Abel
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The FLGS finally got in some Scam and Villainy yesterday. Happy happy joy joy dance!
Can't wait to run two Star Vipers and do S-turns all over the place and maybe a little PTL action too for kicks. Tie Phantom? Bah! You will be like a slug! LOL
Anyways, it always feels like I'm playing a different game of STAW when I face off against the Borg. I have to follow all these rules, and they don't. As soon as the Borg have to start following the same rules as everyone else, then they lose. What I mean by that is an inexperienced Borg player but a veteran STAW player might try to play the Borg the way they played their old fleet. They might look at the table with the same "boundaries" as before- "I'm gonna have to maneuver here, take a shot there, nullify that, do this..." In those instances, I do very well against the Borg and can even squeek out a win every once in a while. But against a Veteran Borg player who looks at the game and sees all my disadvantages, and knows that he doesn't follow the same set of rules as I do, and capitalizes on them... it's often a quick, stupid game, table wipe with him losing only a couple shields and my whole fleet gone.
At this point in the game, I feel that the only thing that can be done to balance the Borg would be to have more "FU Borg" cards. "Advanced Multi-Phasic-Quantum-FU-Borg Shields"- 5 point tech upgrade, and against only the Primary Weapons of a Borg you ALWAYS have these shields, even when your regular shields are disabled. Or maybe "Ferroic-Phasic-Multi-Spectrum-Adaptive-FU-Borg Armor"- 5 point tech upgrade, cancel 3 hits from hits caused by Borg Ships. A good weapon card- "Disruptive-Quantum-Plasma-FU-Borg Torpedoes"- 5 point upgrade, 4 attack dice, range 1-3, forward or aft arcs, does not require a target lock, but does disable the card when its fired, ignores Borg shields and can convert one blank result into a hit, and one hit result into a crit. Usable only against a Borg ship.
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Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/28 18:11:10
Subject: Re:What am I missing with the Borg?
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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*
* - This card does double damage when used against a borg ship.
**
**- This card adds + 2 sheilds/hull/ice cream when used to defend against attacks from a borg ship.
***
***- May not be used on a borg vessel.
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