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Hi what's the general consensus of running fw chapter tactics these days. I quite like the looks of the raptor chapter tactics and wonderd weather people would mind some one using their rules in a pick up game? Also what do people feel about the special marine characters outlined in the badab war book. Would any of these rules be deemed cheesy or op by the general 40k player?

Thanks in advance.

It doesn't matter how 'op' or 'cheesy' they actually are. When asked, people will fall into one of two groups:

"Yeah, cool."

or

"No way! Forge World is cheesy!"

No matter what the actual rules in question are.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
It doesn't matter how 'op' or 'cheesy' they actually are. When asked, people will fall into one of two groups:

"Yeah, cool."

or

"No way! Forge World is cheesy!"

No matter what the actual rules in question are.

I guess this is what I expected tbf. I guess this is the problem (although it feels unfair to call it that) with fw in general. FW seems to generate much of a knee jerk reaction even in a world of triptides, chapter master smashfether serpent spam etc.

Raptor tactics are what raven guard should be. The problem with raven guard tactics is that a unit benefits from one half of the CT or it benefits from the other, it cannot benefit from both.

Whilst raptors have realised that assault marines (with jp) are pants for vanilla marines so have instead gained the option of heavy1 rending bolters, and lets face it - single shot st4 rending bolters on models which are too expensive to take in numbers where it begins to really make a difference isn't that OP. And the fact that RG already have the other half of the CT just goes to show raptors CT are ok. (I personally think the ability to scout a gazillion razorbacks is jaw droppingly amazing but they aren't considered the best CT by the wider community)

Issodon on the other hand has to be the most amazing marine character ever made... ok I over exaggerate... but he is amazeballs!

Issodon is the man, yes. one of, if not THE, best warlord you can have around.
And not because he is immortal or deals massive damage, but because of a slew of tactical effects that really spins the game around. and make everything more intresting in return.
(as long you don't abuse the fact "master of ambush" from the BAB is overpowered, at that point he becomes annoying.)


As for other chapters, there are several others who are pretty good like the star phantoms and mantis warriors, but the rest of mostly underpowered.
And the characters are also mostly not very good. but they do interesting things (say hello to my salamandar dreadnaut HQ!) yet mostly only fitting for casual games or to make funny stuff (devestators as elites in the "drop pod" chapter....brilliant!)

Issodon's rules do seem pretty solid and really fluffy for the raptors, but I can see an opponent getting really frustrated with the master of ambush rule. "Hey I just wrecked your land raider before we even start playing lol" guess doesn't sound all that friendly.

I always wanted to run Red Scorpions myself. I like their fluff. I do like the Minotaurs fluff better but their chapter tactics are not too good.

 Vash108 wrote:
I always wanted to run Red Scorpions myself. I like their fluff. I do like the Minotaurs fluff better but their chapter tactics are not too good.

And plus the sevrin loth model looks great.

I know what you mean about the minotaurs. I kinda like the idea of running a loyal pre heresy era world eaters style army. Full of close combat butchers.

Also Asterion Moloc looks bad ass

Im in the process of making a Carcharadon looking chapter. theyre going to be similar in asthetic but I pretty much will run them as a generic chapter of my choosing. that way I can play them as depending on my mood.

but I will be modeling my tacticals with knives just to test out that extra attack

not sure how useful the space shark tactics will be. rage after the unit kills a unit seems blah. I dont normally have a unit that kills another unit after its killed another unit in close combat. maybe if i have a game that goes in to turn 9 or something

 Vash108 wrote:
Also Asterion Moloc looks bad ass

Yes, yes he does.

Johnnytorrance wrote:
Im in the process of making a Carcharadon looking chapter. theyre going to be similar in asthetic but I pretty much will run them as a generic chapter of my choosing. that way I can play them as depending on my mood.

but I will be modeling my tacticals with knives just to test out that extra attack

not sure how useful the space shark tactics will be. rage after the unit kills a unit seems blah. I dont normally have a unit that kills another unit after its killed another unit in close combat. maybe if i have a game that goes in to turn 9 or something

Charcadons really favour a Drop Pod army. Drop and Rapid T1, charge a weak unit with 3 attacks a model T2, and then you should have a good few turns leftover to make use of Rage. And that's just Tacticals, throw in some Honour Guard or Vanguard and it can get very nasty. You do need to go all-in aggressive, but it should be pretty fun.

Fantome wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:
Also Asterion Moloc looks bad ass

Yes, yes he does.

I agree with the good man.

Now, keeping the previous picture in mind (I'm biased as all hell) the Forgeworld Chapter Tactics aren't designed to be used in a vacuum; by and large they're worse than the codex ones, but they all have pretty good character coverage which synergizes very well. Take the Minotaurs: no 25% tests, Crusader USR, +1 charge range in enemy deployment. On its own, kind of meh. On a unit of Honour Guard with Chaplain Enkomi granting rage to the whole unit, they'll never break, move about as quickly as footslogging marines possibly can, and proceed to murder anything in close combat. Anything. It's fun killing so many orks on the charge they can't consolidate into combat....

Some of the tactics stand on their own, such as Red Scorpions (FNP on all my tac squads, and if you follow the RAW arguement, anything with a Veteran Sergeant, why yes please!), others like the Minotaurs have more to do with getting access to some very interesting and unconventional characters. In my case, Asterion Moloc will only lose 1v1 against an AV13 walker, Abaddon the Despoiler or a Primarch, and generates a VP everytime he murders someone in a challenge, and can give LC Terminators the ability to strike at Init when charging into terrain, as well as being Fearless (which isn't actually all that common in Marines, relying usually on ATSKNF).

Other chapters also offer some interesting opportunities; I've experimented with Mantis Warriors tactics with my Blood Ravens, and killed a Bloodthirster with St5 HoW attacks from charging out of cover, which was hilarious. Their ability to not be slowed down nearly as much by terrain and gain bonuses on the charge really does work well with melee marines (my preferred direction with them since 6th) allowing you to stay in life-saving cover and then charge out and out-fight most opponents of otherwise similar capacity.

Ultimately, I think it's fair to say FW CT favour more specific builds to capitalize on their rules, while the core ones are more generalist in their utility.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
It doesn't matter how 'op' or 'cheesy' they actually are. When asked, people will fall into one of two groups:

"Yeah, cool."

or

"No way! Forge World is cheesy!"

No matter what the actual rules in question are.

Absolutely this. There's a guy on this forum that actually thinks Carcharodons CT is too good...