Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I used to have a much better time against Borg, however all the new cards from Tactical cube 001 and the mega cube, Im finding it difficult to do anything now.

I used to have a fair game with triple Vor'cha's but not lately. I just got crushed 6 out of 6 games using 3 different fleets against duel spheres or 1 Cube 1 sphere. As I keep trying to figure out something solid against Borg for Adepticon, I'm swiftly about to join many of you in the Borg are utterly broken catagory.

I was wondering what would you all use for Anti-Borg lists, under these rules.

100 points 60 point ship max, ship pure. You can have a mix of factions but each ship must be faction pure. Also, If you can ignore the cross faction penelty (such as Khan) you can mix faction cards. So Khan on a Independant ship can have any upgrade he wants. can have up to 1 resource any point value or 2 resources with a point limit of 10. Matter and honor and Wave 12 not playable


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So after my Klingon failures, I was think of this would this work?

2nd Division Cruiser
Indy Fed Flag Ship (Evade)
Gul Dukat Free BS
Boheeka
Anti-Proton Scan

Battle Cruiser
Gul Macet
Invaluable Advise
Seskal
Anti-Proton Scan

Why 60 point limit? That HUGELY favours the borg, allowing tac cubes with 2 hull armours, feedback pulse etc

The 50 point limit really cuts down on Borg shenanigans

With Klingons you'd need a Projected stasis field (or 2) to win

I did beat a Borg fleet a couple of weeks ago using pure Cardassians. Hidekis and a strategic use of "Truce" worked wonders

I like an indy flagship battle cruiser w/Khan 8 and a 2nd cruiser w/Dukat.

I remember taking apart a double sphere list with double scimitar, but I had a few Interphase Generators to help things along

Dominion and Feds regularly kick my Borg Butt.

I only play them now as an opponent for play testers and the Feds and Dominion are beating me frequently.

I think I'm already in the Borg are broken category, probably why I sold all my pure borg ships away, and kept only the assimilated vessels.

What kind of builds are you expecting to see at Adepticon?

With Klingons, Projected Stasis Field is your best weapon, even though the ship that uses it rolls 2 less attack dice that turn, if you run a swarm build you can do it.

Puscifer wrote:
Dominion and Feds regularly kick my Borg Butt.

I only play them now as an opponent for play testers and the Feds and Dominion are beating me frequently.

Show me the builds that are taking down borg and then show me the borg they're taking down...

Why the anti proton scan? I think it would be better to switch them out with tetryon emissions to keep the battle cruisers alive longer. You could try switching out the gul dukat cruiser with a battle ship. The battle ship can take some damage will dealing it out and give the cruiser a free action.

Edit I also like to move Bohekka onto the ship that doesn't have dukat, because dukat is more likely to get a target lock along with a battle station so he will have a high chance of hitting while ships that don't get two actions can still get one blanked converted with bohekka.

 ds9lord wrote:
Why the anti proton scan? I think it would be better to switch them out with tetryon emissions to keep the battle cruisers alive longer. You could try switching out the gul dukat cruiser with a battle ship. The battle ship can take some damage will dealing it out and give the cruiser a free action.

Edit I also like to move Bohekka onto the ship that doesn't have dukat, because dukat is more likely to get a target lock along with a battle station so he will have a high chance of hitting while ships that don't get two actions can still get one blanked converted with bohekka.

I agree with you on the antiprotons, which are great against cloaks but hardly seem worth taking against borg... but the battleship? It turns like a brick. Any borg player worth their salt should go after the cruiser and then just maneuver around the battleship's fire arc and carve it up.

 emperorpenguin wrote:
Why 60 point limit? That HUGELY favours the borg, allowing tac cubes with 2 hull armours, feedback pulse etc

That's just the TO's rules not mine


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 ds9lord wrote:
Why the anti proton scan? I think it would be better to switch them out with tetryon emissions to keep the battle cruisers alive longer. You could try switching out the gul dukat cruiser with a battle ship. The battle ship can take some damage will dealing it out and give the cruiser a free action.

I agree with you on the antiprotons, which are great against cloaks but hardly seem worth taking against borg... but the battleship? It turns like a brick. Any borg player worth their salt should go after the cruiser and then just maneuver around the battleship's fire arc and carve it up.

They are both cruisers because I like the come about move, not every player there will be Borg although I suspect half will be, after all Adepticon seems to bring out a lot of power gamers

lastly it was an quick off the top of my head fleet, just an idea .... anyone like to share a list?

Here are my romulan Ideas:

Scimitar
Salatrel
Tactical Officer
Interphase Generator
Interphase Generator

Reman Warbird
Valdore
Tactical officer
Advance Cloaking Device
Interphase Generator

Or

Scimitar
Salatrel
Tactical Officer
Interphase Generator
Interphase Generator

Valdore
Toreth
Indy (Dom) fleet Captian
Tactical officer
Advance Cloaking Device
Interphase Generator

5 point left over Torps maybe


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Federation Klingon


Ent-E
Johnathan Archer
Indy (Klingon) fleet Captian
Kyle (to add to archer)
Shelby (to add to archer)
Riker (add Crew)
Phlox
M. Scott (+2 attack dice)
Dorsal Phaser Array

Maht-H'a
Kargen
Bu'Kah
Drex
Projected Statis Field

Dominion Independant Mix
Changes based on feedback

2nd Div Cruiser
Indy Fed Flagship
Khan skill 8
Kenneth Dalby
Joachim
Seskal
Shroud

Battle Cruiser
Dukat Free BS
Boheeka
Shroud

Things that give dice outside the combat phase are also helpful against the borg, such as Admiral Worf, Preemptive Strike, Gelnon, cloaked mines.

I'm still struggling as well to come up with my Adepticon list.

One thing Borg don't like is getting Aux tokens put on their ships. But I am struggling to find good ways to do that outside of Borg themselves

 Mr. S Baldrick wrote:
Things that give dice outside the combat phase are also helpful against the borg, such as Admiral Worf, Preemptive Strike, Gelnon, cloaked mines.

I see where your going.... extra damage out of phase

MU Worf is out I don't have him.

Preemptive strike and Gelnon I have ..Ill tinker around with some lists

I was thinking about cloaked mines but really its one hit, thier superior movement allows them to never have to risk it again they can just move around it. I don't think they are worth replacing my Interphase Generators. I could use my leftover 5 points above for the Triphasic Emitter and use Antimatter mines in the lower Romulan fleet again its one hit and I need to fly past him.

My plan it to concenterate fire on the weakest sphere to quickly eliminate 6 attack dice ASAP. With the Interphase Generators I think it is possible to do it in 2 rounds of firing and survive.



Playing around with Gelnon, but was wondering if the range 1-2 attack 3 Phased Polaron Beam would be worth it if I found bonus attack dice?

I've never seen cloaked mines work versus Borg. They can white reverse away from them or simply spin and go around

 emperorpenguin wrote:
I've never seen cloaked mines work versus Borg. They can white reverse away from them or simply spin and go around

If you use several overlapping fields mines can be effective against the borg. The borg are the only fleet I have no problem using 4+ mines against

So this weekend saw 6 more games against Borg and I much did better. 4 out of 6 were wins.

Archer fleet is butts....not action effecient, just takes too much time to keep moving disable tokens around. I found a desent Federation ship with Picard 8 on ENT-E with DPA and Miles O'brien (disable one upgrade version) Ilia was very useful against Borg cubes. Worf with a PSF.

Dominion fleet worked OK. Came down to the last minute both Khan and the last Borg ship both limping around, but Seskal making Khans ship STR 8 is awesome. I'm sure working a few cards around, it mightt do better. Kenneth Dalby, Joachim, Shroud were ok but I think better subsitutions can be found.

Dual Scimitars put some smack down on spheres but Cubes and Assimulation Tubes cause it the most problems.


ds9lord, we tried your Cube138 with double hull armor...and a sphere leaving 2 points to add a 2 point Tactical Drone. The fleet is tough with 25 total hits to kill the cube and the first 16 hits (Shields and Hull) no criticals. Suprisingly with low captian skills it was still difficult to beat. as its opponent I needed to fly a perfect game. If the borg player stops your actions it'll win.

Double Sphere with one Assimulation Tube each was the toughest fleet out of a total 12 games so far, it just gets in close and tears your lists apart by stealing your key upgrades. No defense against it.

FYI, I saw the TO has posted the scenarios.

http://staw-adepticon.blogspot.com/

Not sure about the movement changes near planets...

If anyone is around at Adepticon and wants to play test in the open gaming areas before the Sunday tournament let me know.

 crazyK wrote:

Not sure about the movement changes near planets...

It represents the Gravity Well of the planet, many space combat systems have this in the form of free movement. BFG for example allowed you to make a free 90 degree turn toward the planet.