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So I'm new to the game and I would like to start a very basic army at 500 points just for learning the game and of course having a "blast". I have a list I'm thinking of building that looks fun. If I could get your input on how to make it better or what I can do with the spare points it would be much appreciated.

1 kharn the betrayer - 160

5 khorne berzerkers w/ VotLW -110

5 khorne berzerkers w/ VotLW - 110

5 CSM w/ 2 meltas, MOK, and VotLW - 102

Total - 482

I'm wondering if I should add melee weapons to my CSM or if I should use the rest of the points for maybe champion upgrades or just a 6th CSM. Any advice is great thanks

Pop in a walker or vehicle to give support. They can be mobile bunkers to protect your troops and give you some decent ranged weapons. Also gives you chance to see how they work.

Hey thanks for your input but How could I get another vehicle in there without going over 500 points or my budget. What do you have in mind?

I would consider dropping a unit of berserkers (for the moment and put it back in when you grow past 500pts).

If you are keeping a small force I would consider a helbrute. They can give you a decent ranged attach, and pack a punch in close combat. You can pick them up quite cheap as they were in the main box set.

If you are going to expand further than this into 1500pts+ I would consider a maulerfiend (if you are going full on aggressive) or a predator with sponson lascannons if you see you think you play style would favour having a having a fire base. You may need to drop the VOTLW buff to get the points to stack up to 500.

When you do go to a larger force you will probably need a rhino of landraider to deliver Kharn but you can number crunch that in the future.

You could just run this list, you'd only need two Rhino's and four more marines:

Kharn

9 Marines with Rhino

10 Marines with Rhino

Give them close combat weapon and bolt pistol.

It comes to 497 points.

You could also do

Kharn

CSM 6 x CCW, Melta, champ w/ CCW, Rhino

Bezerkers 6 x CCW, Camp w/ CCW, Rhino

497 pnts

This is a couple less models than Opera's list but you have the melta for anti armour and you still have bezerkers

Hey all thanks for all the advice it's always appreciated. I probably should of mentioned before but I'm on a strict 130-150$ budget. I have some questions due to some of the posts that were made. Instead of running 3 smaller units is it better to run 2 larger units? I'm wondering if it would be better to maybe run kharn with 1 unit of berzerkers, 1 unit of CSM /w ccw and a rhino. I really like my units to have aotlw it seems like if it goes off in close range its gonna be insane not to mention the Tasmanian devil kharn. Like for 150 I think I can get a box of berzerkers a box of CSM a rhino and a kharn. If you guys could maybe help me put together a army with the units I I just listed that would be awesome. Thanks.

I think it depends a little on the opponent and whether you are chasing objectives. Three units may suit you better if it is an objective game, or if you are trying to pop armour (more special weapons / melta bombs). It also lets you leave a unit off the board in reserve.

If you are up against a horde and you just need bolters then bigger units are probably the way to go so you are not paying the champion tax on each of them.

Sagentus has suggested an decent starter list.

Another question how do I get blood and rage, slaughter without respite. Like don't I just need kharn CSM and berzerkers in my army? I'm confused?

Redflex - I forgot to mention i would run Kharn with the bezerker squad. I know what it is like on a tight budget, but planning your lists in advance seriously keeps the cost down

I have bought many models in the past due to there looks and realised they wouldn't be any good on the table top ^^

Sagentus wrote:
Redflex - I forgot to mention i would run Kharn with the bezerker squad. I know what it is like on a tight budget, but planning your lists in advance seriously keeps the cost down

I have bought many models in the past due to there looks and realised they wouldn't be any good on the table top ^^

Hey segentus,

thanks a bunch for your help and advice I'm going to go with your list and run only 1 rhino until I can afford to get get a second. Until then what unit should be embarked in the rhino and what should I do with my extra points?

So until you can get the extra Rhino i would go:

Kharn

CSM - 7 x CCW, 2 x Melta champ w/ CCW

Bezerkers - 6 x CCW champ w/ CCW , Rhino

498 - pnts

This gives you a squad of 10 marines (hopefully giving them a bit more survive ability)

You also need to check ebay , you can get super cheap rhino and berzerkers to I thonk , also there couldbe dark vengance stuff like cheap cyltists chosen and hellbrute if you want to ad something

Or, go for numbers.

Kharn
6x Berzerkers, Champion with Chainaxe and Meltabomb+ 2 Chainaxes in a Rhino
10x Cultists, Champion with CCW, 9x Autoguns
Helbrute w/ Combi Bolter on the fist OR Reaper Autocannon. Player's choice there.

Comes out to 498 and gives you the mainstays of a Chaos list. Distraction, annoyance and the one actually good unit. Should be able to stay well within your money budget if you buy ALL of it on ebay. Should be $40 for the Dark Vengeance models. And also look at getting the ENTIRE Chaos side of it for a similar price. Sometimes they charge so much for Cultists that it's smarter to buy the full Chaos side than JUST the Helbrute and Cultists. Berzerkers shouldn't be more than $20-30 for plenty and then you actually should have money to get a painted Kharn. Don't know about you but I suck at painting and always want my centerpiece model to be done professionally or atleast by someone with better detail work than I can ever do.

And I realize now you're in Canada now and that my prices are USD. Not sure if that makes a difference.

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
Or, go for numbers.

Kharn
6x Berzerkers, Champion with Chainaxe and Meltabomb+ 2 Chainaxes in a Rhino
10x Cultists, Champion with CCW, 9x Autoguns
Helbrute w/ Combi Bolter on the fist OR Reaper Autocannon. Player's choice there.

Comes out to 498 and gives you the mainstays of a Chaos list. Distraction, annoyance and the one actually good unit. Should be able to stay well within your money budget if you buy ALL of it on ebay. Should be $40 for the Dark Vengeance models. And also look at getting the ENTIRE Chaos side of it for a similar price. Sometimes they charge so much for Cultists that it's smarter to buy the full Chaos side than JUST the Helbrute and Cultists. Berzerkers shouldn't be more than $20-30 for plenty and then you actually should have money to get a painted Kharn. Don't know about you but I suck at painting and always want my centerpiece model to be done professionally or atleast by someone with better detail work than I can ever do.

And I realize now you're in Canada now and that my prices are USD. Not sure if that makes a difference.

Yes living in Canada makes ebay almost useless for me, first off the canadian doller is gak right now and I'm usually hit with 20-40 bucks for shipping not to mention tax fees at the door. Right now I found a guy who can get me kharn, berzerkers, CSM, an aspiring champion, and a rhino all brand new in the box for 130. Not sure if I can get a better deal than that(unless it's maybe second hand). I've been scanning thought kijiji looking for cheap rhinos. I think I'm going to stick with the army I have so far and see how it plays out. Once I start playing a few games I can decide what my next move will be. Im looking into possibly getting my hands on a chaos lord on a juggernaut. He seems fun to play and he's got so many upgrades and versatility once I Decide to go with a bigger point army. I like the helbrute idea with cultists and I think I might give it a try if I can get my hands on them real cheap.As for painting that for me is the best part I can't wait to get an army painted up and on the table. Just such a sense of pride seeing your own army that you personally painted go in for battle.
Thanks for the advice its much appreciated.

P.s. Does anyone know where I can get reaper or Vallejo paints for a good price in Canada, ontario (Toronto) or maybe on a canadian website?

Thanks

My starter list for 500 points normally runs

Chaos lord on juggernaut woth power weapon

2 squads of CSM in a rhino woth Havoc launcher

And a Maulerfiend for heavy hitting

 The Stormlord wrote:
My starter list for 500 points normally runs

Chaos lord on juggernaut woth power weapon

2 squads of CSM in a rhino woth Havoc launcher

And a Maulerfiend for heavy hitting

Yea I seen that exact starter list on YouTube it seems pretty bad ass but not ideal for a new player starting out. It's just way to much of a cost for me. The lord on a juggernaut alone is like 60-70 bucks and the mauler fiend is another 70 bucks I think. I'm sitting at a budget of 150 to get started on a 500 point army and Another 50-60 bucks for paint. So that list is way to far over my budget. I managed to get a pretty good starter Army that I feel pretty good about and it's just under my budget leaving me an extra 20 bucks for paint.

Thanks for the post it's always appreciated.

Yeah my.mate said there was a video regarding that, yeah it's not the cheapest started and apologies I didn't read you had a budget, if you can pick up dark vengance CSM that's a good start as cultists are awesome obj grabbers, and you have a lord, adding marines and a rhino is where I'd go next as you need mobility, good luck though man

Oy... I tried to make a 500 point CSM Khorne list it just doesn't work very well... to make berzerkers AWESOME (which they defiantly can be!) you need an assault vehicle... My input is... try to get rhinos in that list probs you might need to take out a whole berzerker squad or the CSM squad, but without a vehicle berzerkers are amazingly worthless. P.S. just proxy your juggerlord if you want to do that list I did it and no one cared because they knew I was just starting out.

 dragoonmaster101 wrote:
Oy... I tried to make a 500 point CSM Khorne list it just doesn't work very well... to make berzerkers AWESOME (which they defiantly can be!) you need an assault vehicle... My input is... try to get rhinos in that list probs you might need to take out a whole berzerker squad or the CSM squad, but without a vehicle berzerkers are amazingly worthless. P.S. just proxy your juggerlord if you want to do that list I did it and no one cared because they knew I was just starting out.

We'll for now I don't need a lord on a jug I just want one for future use plus a lord just looks so much more badass on a jug. I think my 500 point army is going to be ok I'm running 10x CSM w/ 2 meltas, 7 x berzerkers in a rhino and a kharn for my hq. Doesn't seem like much but I think my zerkers will do ok in the rhino with kharn, plus kharrn is a absolute beast straight up Tasmanian devil lmao.

You cannot run 2 special weapons on Chaos Space Marines at 5 models in a squad.

thechosen1 wrote:
You cannot run 2 special weapons on Chaos Space Marines at 5 models in a squad.

I'm confused what do you mean? I'm running in 1 squad 10 CSM including a aspiring champion. I can't give 2 of my marines in that squad meltas?

Redflex wrote:

thechosen1 wrote:
You cannot run 2 special weapons on Chaos Space Marines at 5 models in a squad.

I'm confused what do you mean? I'm running in 1 squad 10 CSM including a aspiring champion. I can't give 2 of my marines in that squad meltas?

Ah, did not see that it was a full squad! I assumed it was still at 5 men. Never mind, carry on!

I would go with:

30 cultists + Kharn the betrayer = 130+160 = 290
10 CSM + 2 meltaguns + lightning claw champ + rhino = 140 + 35 + 15 + 20 = 210

The cultists can be gotten from cheap DV re-sellers for pretty cheap
The box of CSM + Kharn + Rhino should be reasonably cheap

Any marine who isn't in a Rhino is a dead marine. Having Kharn run around with marines is a bit of a liability as he has a wicked back swing.

wtnind wrote:
I would go with:

30 cultists + Kharn the betrayer = 130+160 = 290
10 CSM + 2 meltaguns + lightning claw champ + rhino = 140 + 35 + 15 + 20 = 210

The cultists can be gotten from cheap DV re-sellers for pretty cheap
The box of CSM + Kharn + Rhino should be reasonably cheap

Any marine who isn't in a Rhino is a dead marine. Having Kharn run around with marines is a bit of a liability as he has a wicked back swing.

To be honest I'm not a big fan of cultists they die so damn easy, like I get it they are cheap and you can run a gakload of them for more numbers on the board but I don't really know how I feel about them. I think if I did run them they would be used as obj units or a line of defence for a maulerfeind or some other heavy hitter. ( I'm over my budget as of right now to buy more models)
I haven't played much so I probaby don't know what I'm talking about but Correct me if I'm wrong. I think kharn with 7 berzerkers in a rhino will be pretty devastating at 500 points. Plus they are backed with 10 CSM with 2 meltas ( still on the fence about switching their bolters with ccw) Once I get a second rhino I'm going to run the marines in a rhino as well. I will definitely be getting some cultist if I can get em for cheap as I would still like to give them a test.

Thanks for the feedback. Cheers.

As a loyalist player, I drool over your marine squads with multiple special weapons. Do something with a rhino for the LOS blocking ability, and some marine squads with special weapons to deliver some punch. Your counter assault unit can be any half decent CC unit with your HQ (Kharn seems to be your favourite for some reason), or something stand alone like a Hellbrute.

Basically what everyone above me is saying

Fisheyes wrote:
As a loyalist player, I drool over your marine squads with multiple special weapons.

That's okay, we drool over your drop pods and land raiders that can carry more than 10 marines :-(

Fisheyes wrote:
Your counter assault unit can be any half decent CC unit with your HQ (Kharn seems to be your favourite for some reason)

Kharn is definitely the HQ to go for if you aren't wanting a biker/jugger lord. He has buckets of S7 (furious charge) armour bane AP2 attacks that basically auto hit on the first round of combat (and on 2+ for every round thereafter). What's not to love! Well his capacity to take a punch is not to love but he is a 10,000 year old man who was run over by a landraider so he's not as spry as he used to be.

Fisheyes wrote:
As a loyalist player, I drool over your marine squads with multiple special weapons. Do something with a rhino for the LOS blocking ability, and some marine squads with special weapons to deliver some punch. Your counter assault unit can be any half decent CC unit with your HQ (Kharn seems to be your favourite for some reason), or something stand alone like a Hellbrute.

Basically what everyone above me is saying

Hey,
I'm a little confused on what you mean by you drool over my marine squad. Do you mean that you love playing up against this type of squad because they are so easy to kill or are you saying that you drool over this type of unit because they are amazing?

kharn is just such a boss I just love his character and his thirst for blood, Plus I think he's a pretty nutty hq. like I said before I think 8 zerkers and a kharn in a rhino seems pretty good as I can get up close while my rhino soaks up the damage. I'm new and its a trial and error type thing just like any game. I'm probably not going to be the most overpowered 500 point army but I'm sure I'll have a blast once kharn gets all up in your face.

The loyalists can only take one special and one heavy. Two specials in a squad are what most loyalist armies dream of. My Tyrant's Legion and Blood Angels can do it, and the Blood Angels can use Drop Pods, so I don't have that jealousy. But Heavy Weapons in a mobile squad is like tits on a tin man. Just the most pointless thing in the world. It doesn't make them amazing, but it does make them more practical.

But, going to say that you might want to hold off a moment to look at the Khorne Demonkin army coming out soon. Pics just showed up here on Dakka of their box set with CSM, Berzerkers, a Helbrute, Possessed and the Daemon faction units Herald of Khorne and Bloodcrushers. Doesn't have Kharn, but maybe it will when the codex drops. Might be a good alternative to a CSM list but we just don't know yet.

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
The loyalists can only take one special and one heavy. Two specials in a squad are what most loyalist armies dream of. My Tyrant's Legion and Blood Angels can do it, and the Blood Angels can use Drop Pods, so I don't have that jealousy. But Heavy Weapons in a mobile squad is like tits on a tin man. Just the most pointless thing in the world. It doesn't make them amazing, but it does make them more practical.

But, going to say that you might want to hold off a moment to look at the Khorne Demonkin army coming out soon. Pics just showed up here on Dakka of their box set with CSM, Berzerkers, a Helbrute, Possessed and the Daemon faction units Herald of Khorne and Bloodcrushers. Doesn't have Kharn, but maybe it will when the codex drops. Might be a good alternative to a CSM list but we just don't know yet.

+1

I have recently started playing a Kharn Butcherhorde army at 1k, originally saw it on MWG, but have since fallen in love with it as it is fun and fluffy. It really isn't competitive, but it is a heck of a lot of fun to play, the only problem is the lack of mobility, but that isn't such an issue at higher point levels. I am hoping that the new CSM update makes Khorne a more functional competitive army. I think the inclusion of the little twerks of the Butcherhorde (i.e. exploding 6's and the 8" charge buff) are what will make this game seem more dynamic and fun.