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Sewers are in.

Are you ready for the Monster Sewer?

It’s 107 pieces of slime-crusted walls, floors, sluiceways (+ 1 mystery mini) – a thousand different setups to host the nastiest of underground encounters. Use it to create a ratman warren, an otyugh lair, or even to build curtain walls or an urban canal.

$185 US (including shipping), or around $225 Canadian... spicy.

I mean, it's practically a tier on its own. I probably shouldn't, but... very tempting.

Would probably combine nicely with the dungeon tiles I have if nothing else, and the 1x1 and 1x2 parts could make for some interesting build options.

Yeah, as soon as they put themselves into the same price point as tabletop world models then they're a deffo no, if I were to spend this kind of dosh on fantasy terrain i'd want the best. And tabletop world dunks all over this.

I love the sewer stuff!

But again, way too expensive for me, especially rght now.

MaxT wrote:
Yeah, as soon as they put themselves into the same price point as tabletop world models then they're a deffo no, if I were to spend this kind of dosh on fantasy terrain i'd want the best. And tabletop world dunks all over this.

To each their own.

However, I'm not seeing sewers even offered on their site. Nice cottages, if I had any skill with painting whatsoever. And didn't mind the loss of the modular nature. And enhanced concerns about transport (DF stuff you literally just throw in a bag).

I'm impressed with how little they charge for shipping though.

Honestly I think we're talking two different target audiences here (with some overlap, obviously): the hyper detailed 2-4 piece structures, versus "lego style" build in any of a thousand combinations group.

I can see why the former would hold appeal for some, but just because DF and TW offer different things to different people I have a hard time calling one "the best".

But as a giant fanboy of one I admit there may be some measure of bias present here. >.>

Why aren't there example builds of each pledge level? Do they expect people to draw their own building plans to figure out what you can do with any Specific pledge?

They've said they're working on getting those done. I believe it's a mix of having some things to catch up on still, and partly letting some stretch goals go by so they can show off a more accurate view of what can be built without missing out on a ton of things.

I mean, the Sewers pics show off some pretty impressive things, perhaps they already have some taken but we haven't 'caught up' to what they were built with, and showing them off too early could be a problem.

Maybe once we breach the balconies sometime today (at the current rate)? Either way, they're coming.

 Forar wrote:
Building a 2x2 upper floor without a 'tray' approach (which might as well just be the floor at that point) wouldn't be easy. Hell, the lower floor(s) would be obnoxiously covered in pillars.

Not that building and removing a multiple 4x4 upper floor will be terribly easy with the system as we see it, but 2x2 would only exasperate that.

They could still have bigger floor tiles. Have a floor pack with 4x4, 4x6 and 6x6 floors. But let's be honest. Only one floor is really usable at any given time anyways. Moving the floor to get at the bottom level will bump the minis all to hell. The medieval building expansion has a 4x6 and a 6x6 floor, which lets you make cute dioramas, but is largely useless for gaming the moment you have figures on both level and are trying to move things underneath. You're better off building the upper floor off to the side, just like different levels of a dungeon.

Not sure how the 4x4 'detracts' from the modularity really. Like, I get that literally it reduces the manner in which the designs can be built, but utility/pragmatism has to come into play as well.

Because everything has to be done in units of 4 inches. In D&D terms, every wall has to be 20, 40, 80 etc feet long. There's no real benefit to this setup, and you sure as hell get less for more money due to how fiddly they made the walls/corners/floors.

Personally, if the tavern has to be 40 feel long instead of 35 or 45 feet long, I'll make due. :-P

But I also have the benefit of owning 3 sets of tiles from the Dungeon campaign and 2 from the Caverns, so I recognize I may have options available that someone starting fresh wouldn't.

Of possible interest: this is from one of their Q&A sessions. It explains why the sets don't have tons of roofs.

Why is the number of Roofs compared to other pieces so low in the Base Pledges?
ANSWER:
The number of roofs in the sets has been a huge debate internally. The big issue is that roofs are generally cosmetic rather than functional for actual game sessions. We made the Assassin's Perch to add functionality to the roofs (since you could place and move minis on the roofs now). And theoretically the Chimneys could add minor game functionality (send the halfling down that chimney!). The roofs are big, hard to pack, and heavy. Which means they bump a ton of more functional pieces out of the sets. Ultimately, a majority of game encounters will happen in the buildings and on the streets (and of course down in the sewers). So the choice was made to skew the sets towards being the most useful for actual game play, and thus include less roofs in the base sets. But of course there are a lot of people who, like Stefan, really want their buildings to look aesthetically pleasing and all have roofs. Thus we decided to make some of the various Roof Add-On Packs available relatively early so people could start covering their bare buildings. We will also have some other roofing options down the line, so that you guys will have a lot of options on how to cover your buildings.

Also: cobblestone street add-on coming at some point. Castles will be next year but this one will have castle elements.

I have quite a few Tabletop world buildings.I also have the first and second KS sets of DF I also have several sets of the original resin box sets. There isn't a comparison between DF and TW. The quality of TW blows DF and all other companies out of the water. The versatility of the DF sets and the quality of the TW buildings makes combining the two into a great game table. So far the cost of this DF KS is making me rethink my pledge. So far I'm still in it, just re-thinking it.

OT: So where can I get some inexpensive village terrain? I'm thinking cardboard villages. Terraclips, unfortunately, is out of business. Too lazy for papercraft. Any companies like Battlesystems making cardboard villages? TIA!

ced1106 wrote:
OT: So where can I get some inexpensive village terrain? I'm thinking cardboard villages. Terraclips, unfortunately, is out of business. Too lazy for papercraft. Any companies like Battlesystems making cardboard villages? TIA!

http://www.4ground.co.uk/Default.aspx?page=283

4Ground do some absolutely fantastic prepainted terrain that does not hit the wallet to bad in my opinion.

A bunch of new add-on sets have been released in the last few days, including the aforementioned Sewers, Battlements, and Streets. Those two mega packs are essentially (fairly pricey) tiers unto themselves, but for fans of the product/material (and are quite well funded), there's definitely some new stuff to mull over.

http://www.dwarvenforge.com/kickstarter-2015-add-on-sets/

The campaign has also ticked over a few stretch goals, but the middle of campaign crawl (which is expected in comparison to that opening) means we'll probably take a day or two for the next to pop open. At 1.16m, next stretch goal is at 1.2m.

Not that a balcony and a few other odds and ends are going to be game changers for those on the fence, but I'm not really expecting things to really heat up again for another week anyway.

There is also a lot of talk about getting pictures of completed builds. That should help tick the counter up as well.

rox wrote:
There is also a lot of talk about getting pictures of completed builds. That should help tick the counter up as well.

Update - new unlocks, add-on packs. Some really nice for wargaming. You asked for completed builds, check out the site for vids, but here's a look directly from the studio that films their ads as well as a close up of the prototypes in hand: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xM6wd8Pw-nI

ced1106 wrote:
OT: So where can I get some inexpensive village terrain? I'm thinking cardboard villages. Terraclips, unfortunately, is out of business. Too lazy for papercraft. Any companies like Battlesystems making cardboard villages? TIA!

For cheap fantasy buildings you can hunt down dickensian porcelain christmas houses on craigslist or at resale shops. A bit of touchup flock over the snow and a good dark brushdip or wash and you;re set.
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2012/03/28mm-on-cheap-fast-and-cheap-fantasy.html
http://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2012/05/medieval-village-grows.htmlhttp://chicagoskirmish.blogspot.com/2012/05/medieval-village-grows.html

Not "historically" accurate and the sculpts aren't as crisp as MBA or DF, but they look pretty good to me

Terraclips went out of business? :-(

I bought one of each of their original releases, and had wanted to get some of the second wave. I think a buddy of mine got one or two of those.

The clips were good, though even with careful use it wasn't shocking to lose one or two in a full table (setup and/or takedown).

Not always the easiest things to work with, but overall I liked that product line. Shame to think what I have left is going to be part of a dwindling supply as tiles and clips get ruined/destroyed.

As for DF, they're past 1.4m on the KS, approaching the next SG of 1.425m (1.4m was a wall with a metal plate inside, 1.425m is a magnetic accessory wall sign that'll attach).

While this is by now means doing poorly, with a mere 5 days (118 hours to be reasonably precise) I do hope both they drop the coy charade and let us see as much as they can justify, and things do pick up a little so we can get the momentum rolling again.

Shame I don't have any friends that are interested in this stuff. Going in with 1-3+ people on a 5 or 10 'set' pledge would help bring the cost per set down by up to $20 US. Still a considerable cost for what you get, of course.

Yeah, iirc, the guys behind Terraclips / WorldWorks went into the video games business. Food on the table, I suppose. (: Wyrd has some sort of rights to publish Terraclips but hasn't been doing so. Fuzzy on the details and I wouldn't mind knowing more.

However, the Battlesystems guys put out good cardboard terrain. There's hope for the wallet yet!

Oh, and check out the Dungeon Decor 2 for tavern bric-a-brac for your villages. Wheelbarrow, rope, anvil, butter churn, and other hard-to-find pieces unlocked.

8K to the tavern sign!

They added a "Wargamer Dtreets" pack add-on. Posting on my phone, lack tech-fu to post image. Could be interesting if you want to do urban fantasy battlefield.

$370 for (I believe) 72 pieces that are each 4x4 inches. Covers a fair bit of area...

I finally dropped the DF KS3. To get everything I wanted would have cost me a small fortune and a marriage. In my opinion this KS should have been broken up into 3 KSers. The project is just to over whelming and expensive. What's sad is I really like DF and own a bunch of their sets.
I'm going to see what kind of deal Manorhouse has in their KS. I've always wanted to try their product, just didn't care for the crowd funding they use.

It's definitely something I continue to struggle with.

I get that it's a niche of a niche product, but at least with Dungeons I could get 3 sets and say "wow, that's a ton of tiles!" and there was some variety. And with Caverns I got 2 sets and said "wow, that's a ton of tiles" (along with 2 add ons this time) and there was some variety.

With this one it feels like the price of entry is up but the quantity is down. While the quality (variety of different pieces) seems to be going bonkers if you can afford a pile of add ons, paying $270 US for a 1' x 1' building (or a bunch of 4" x 4" mini buildings/hovels) plus exchange rate is a hard call.

I know it's an expensive product in an entirely 'want' category of disposable income, but I guess it just feels like I'm being priced out of supporting them, and from what is being said of KS4 next year, I may even be less able to back that one.

We'll have to wait and see where they end up, but it seems like their support is staying on par or even growing with an ever shrinking number of supporters. It's not getting out to wider masses, but catering to a select couple thousand that can drop a full grand US or more on terrain.

Trying to stay positive here, but a Hamlet and some sewers add ons for half a grand just isn't flooring me. And unfortunately it has felt that the campaign hasn't been as strongly run as the previous ones, with them being eternally behind on delivering pics and info.

Maybe I'll just snag the sewers and call it a day. A cottage and a pair of add ons is seeming more and more likely, if that.

I backed the first Dungeon KS, wish I had backed the caverns... I think I will wait for this to go retail and just pick up the sewers. I am currently trying to off load all my first dungeon add-ons and bonus items. a few things you cant buy and at roughly $2 a painted tile which I thought was pretty reasonable. Id sell all of it but everyone once in blue moon my 5yr daughter or 2yr son pull it off the shelf and build with it. My heart swells with pride as they build their little dungeon lairs! But ya, other than that it doesnt see nearly enough use to justify the KS3 prices. I want the sewer just because it ties perfectly into the first KS dungeon tiles.

This one started out overpriced and overproduced, and the stretches arent adding more basic pieces, which was what made the dungeon/caverns great. The few free pieces here don't really let you build more here, just add some decoration. I'm quite surprised this one has done as well as it has.

I disagree. The houses are bigger pieces and along with streets, alleys and all the other pieces that go into it, makes it just as much a deal as the previous. More so really, because when you place the sets out you get a little town with even the smaller levels. At Empire, and with some of the add-ons, its a pretty huge town. I think the value, especially if several people go in, at the Empire level is enormous. For me, as a wargamer as much as a roleplayer, I can use these for other systems and 2-4 houses makes up half the board in terrain!

$165 kind of gets you 6 4" by 4" unpainted buildings (less really, because they were stingy with the doors and roofs).

To make one of those 4" x 4" buildings with the dungeon sets, you need a door, 3 corners and a wall. The $175 pledge got you 66 walls, 24 corners and 9 doors plus a crapton of other stretch goals. All you miss out on is the roofs and a few windows, and I guess the Tudor look. The deal on this one simply blows in comparison.

I'm in mostly for the ability to build upwards with some stability. For me, this KS is more about the sewers, streets, minis, and roofs/balconies than the actual building pieces for the city. I have a bunch of the resin medieval sets and the dungeon tiles in Dwarvenite, so I can do quite a bit with cities right now, but it takes some serious balancing to make sure everything lines up and plays nicely with the 2"x2" footprint. The 4"x4" should add some easier management of building upwards, and I'm really excited about the streets and sewers.

That said, I can see this stuff being used for any number of Fantasy games, RPGs, backdrops for photos, etc. Also, it may eventually get me to paint all of my Reaper Bones models at some point.

Finally, I still think the KS is the best time to get in on these deals, what with pricing, guarantee of being in stock, pack components, shipping times, etc.

I do think they could have waited on the sewers and battlements, and just stuck to one theme (city) this time round, but my guess is that it's cheaper to get everything molded and cast from the factory in one go.

~iPaint

DF just posted a video on YouTube that I'm pretty sure will interest the WarGaming community. Here it is!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPf9R2bwdW4&feature=youtu.be

Anyone see this already?

https://www.kickstarter.com/stories/dwarven

biowizard wrote:
DF just posted a video on YouTube that I'm pretty sure will interest the WarGaming community. Here it is!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPf9R2bwdW4&feature=youtu.be

The price to make that setup sounds insane, and it's not even enough to use for more than a small skirmish game!

He listed:

- Wargamer streets pack ($290 unpainted, $370 painted)
- Empire pledge level's worth of buildings ($710 unpainted, $920 painted)
- 2 of each of the ruins sets (there are 2 types, so that's 4 sets total - $180 unpainted, $240 painted)

So that setup, which is... I have no idea, somewhere between 2'x2' to 3'x3' in size, costs $1530 as-shown!! Or $1180 unpainted...

What wargamer is going to spend over $1500 to have a partial table set of terrain is beyond me... this is clearly more appropriate for RPG players since it is configurable. Wargamers don't need that level of configuration. I bought heavily into the Caverns kickstarter, and while it's absolutely fantastic stuff, realized I didn't need that kind of modularity and sold it to basically break even. I like this company's mojo, but to think many wargamers could possibly buy into this to make a setup like what is shown here would be a mistake, imo... they might want a few buildings from it, but again, that kind of modularity isn't usually needed for wargaming buildings. Let alone making every few inches of street configurable . It's almost the definition of overkill for that application... whereas it is a great fit for RPG use.