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34>26 so yes, BA are the majority...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
the greater number.
"in the majority of cases all will go smoothly"
synonyms: larger part/number, greater part/number, major part, best/better part, main part, most, more than half;

That is the definition of majority... So yes, I was right.

.... You don't compare 1 army compared to the collective rest.... You're saying, like on all the other threads that ba are an awful codex yet here we are with them being the best drop pod army so yes they DO disagree with you because they ARE the best.

Please don't derail rail this thread with this woe is me blood angels because you're the only one who thinks it

Let me explain why your 'BA vs everyone else' view is incorrect:

As of 2011, London's White British population was 44.9%, so by your logic White British people are the minority because there are more non-White British people than White British people, but you cannot just combine all of the other responses/ethnicities just to suit your view.

SGTPozy wrote:
34>26 so yes, BA are the majority...

SGTPozy, words have specific meanings. Use them correctly. A majority is a subset of a set consisting of more than half of the set's elements. Majority means >50%. Period.

Plurality means the largest number of votes received by one candidate (or any proposal in a referendum) out of the entire group of candidates. Who got the most votes, but not necessarily the majority of votes.

Clearly, Blood Angels have the Plurality in this highly scientific poll, but not the majority.

 kronk wrote:

SGTPozy wrote:
34>26 so yes, BA are the majority...

SGTPozy, words have specific meanings. Use them correctly. A majority is a subset of a set consisting of more than half of the set's elements. Majority means >50%. Period.

Plurality means the largest number of votes received by one candidate (or any proposal in a referendum) out of the entire group of candidates. Who got the most votes, but not necessarily the majority of votes.

Clearly, Blood Angels have the Plurality in this highly scientific poll, but not the majority.

You're just using a different definition of the word 'majority'. I've already quoted the definition that I used, so I am correct. How about you quote where you are getting your definition from?

If your argument is 'BA are not the best podding army', saying 'BA podded armies are bad' is only relevant if you're showing them to be bad in a way another podding army is not.

If BAs might get shot off the table after delivering more dakka than another podding army, how does that army either (a) not get shot off the table, or (b) somehow still be better while doing less damage and dying just as fast?

Saying BA podding armies are not the best podding armies because Davu/WK armies beat all podding armies doesn't address the question.

Asked again, in the face of BAs benefits (heavy flamer, hand flamers, triple meltas, etc) how is any other chapter *better* at podding than they are? Which chapter(s)?

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/majority

SGTPozy wrote:

 kronk wrote:

SGTPozy wrote:
34>26 so yes, BA are the majority...

SGTPozy, words have specific meanings. Use them correctly. A majority is a subset of a set consisting of more than half of the set's elements. Majority means >50%. Period.

Plurality means the largest number of votes received by one candidate (or any proposal in a referendum) out of the entire group of candidates. Who got the most votes, but not necessarily the majority of votes.

Clearly, Blood Angels have the Plurality in this highly scientific poll, but not the majority.

You're just using a different definition of the word 'majority'. I've already quoted the definition that I used, so I am correct. How about you quote where you are getting your definition from?

5 years of being a Lean Six Sigma Black Belt and using advanced statistics and analytical tools.

(In academia, both stats and political science, Plurality is what we are seeing, not Majority. As such, Abraham Lincoln won the plurality, but not the majority of votes. Outside acadamia, Majority is often used to mean Plurality. See the concept, 'Majority-minority' populations.)

 kronk wrote:

SGTPozy wrote:

 kronk wrote:

SGTPozy wrote:
34>26 so yes, BA are the majority...

SGTPozy, words have specific meanings. Use them correctly. A majority is a subset of a set consisting of more than half of the set's elements. Majority means >50%. Period.

Plurality means the largest number of votes received by one candidate (or any proposal in a referendum) out of the entire group of candidates. Who got the most votes, but not necessarily the majority of votes.

Clearly, Blood Angels have the Plurality in this highly scientific poll, but not the majority.

You're just using a different definition of the word 'majority'. I've already quoted the definition that I used, so I am correct. How about you quote where you are getting your definition from?

5 years of being a Lean Six Sigma Black Belt and using advanced statistics and analytical tools.

Me too!

Then you should know the difference between Plurality and Majority. You're welcome for the reminder.

Edit: You're 19. Liar.

I think BA has the best drop squads ATM. You can get the pistolier and 2 meltaguns for a grand 4 meltashots for about 150 points. That as well as heavy flamer tacs, and the FnP they can get make them a solid choice.


I mostly say BA though because they can buy a drop pod in FA and through that make the drop assault better by gifting it to some IG vets ETC

Bharring wrote:
(In academia, both stats and political science, Plurality is what we are seeing, not Majority. As such, Abraham Lincoln won the plurality, but not the majority of votes. Outside acadamia, Majority is often used to mean Plurality. See the concept, 'Majority-minority' populations.)

Is a forum for a wargame something that requires academic language? I think not otherwise how would the younger players join in with our jargon-filled conversations?


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 kronk wrote:
Then you should know the difference between Plurality and Majority. You're welcome for the reminder.

Edit: You're 19. Liar.

You got me I'm a black belt in karate, does that count?

SGTPozy wrote:

Bharring wrote:
(In academia, both stats and political science, Plurality is what we are seeing, not Majority. As such, Abraham Lincoln won the plurality, but not the majority of votes. Outside acadamia, Majority is often used to mean Plurality. See the concept, 'Majority-minority' populations.)

Is a forum for a wargame something that requires academic language? I think not otherwise how would the younger players join in with our jargon-filled conversations?

Use hammers until they get it, obviously.

I've got my hammer right here!

Well in this case, they'd get a lesson in Greater vs Greatest.

Then they'd realise the difference between Majority and Plurality.

Then we'd get back to deciding whether the beleif that BAs will always be fail as a drop pod army, right or wrong, necessarily means they aren't the best at it.

Hopefully, then, we'll start discussing who's the best drop pod army.

I think that the poll is pretty conclusive of who's the best (I don't think that Martel likes the answer though).

Bharring wrote:
If your argument is 'BA are not the best podding army', saying 'BA podded armies are bad' is only relevant if you're showing them to be bad in a way another podding army is not.

If BAs might get shot off the table after delivering more dakka than another podding army, how does that army either (a) not get shot off the table, or (b) somehow still be better while doing less damage and dying just as fast?

Saying BA podding armies are not the best podding armies because Davu/WK armies beat all podding armies doesn't address the question.

Asked again, in the face of BAs benefits (heavy flamer, hand flamers, triple meltas, etc) how is any other chapter *better* at podding than they are? Which chapter(s)?

The SWs are far superior against the spoiling assaults. They fare no better against the return fire. Their dakka is very, very comparable. That's why I give them the nod. The spoiling assaults are catastrophic for BA.


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SGTPozy wrote:
I think that the poll is pretty conclusive of who's the best (I don't think that Martel likes the answer though).

I just don't want people to be misinformed. I know how the BA play in 7th. I don't need a poll for that.

"I just don't want people to be misinformed. I know how the BA play in 7th. I don't need a poll for that."

Yet the majority (yes, I will keep using my definition) disagree with you. I highly doubt that the majority (yep, still using it) are misinformed but rather that you are.

SGTPozy wrote:
"I just don't want people to be misinformed. I know how the BA play in 7th. I don't need a poll for that."

Yet the majority (yes, I will keep using my definition) disagree with you. I highly doubt that the majority (yep, still using it) are misinformed but rather that you are.

I'll let people make their own decisions on whether to listen to you or me. The vote is still 2:1 against BA.

The vote is still 11% in Blood Angel's favour so yes, they are winning.

SW are more capable receiving the charge. BAs are more capable when charging. True.

But the opponent gets to pick what to assault. He has some, but much less, say in what gets assaulted.

I think we disagree on how likely it is for a massed podded at to still have some models on the table, and for units that should be just an inch or three away to get out of charge range in one round.

And on the difference in firepower. Might be I love heavy flamers a bit too much.

So, do you see BAs as the #2 podding army? If not, then who?

SGTPozy wrote:
The vote is still 11% in Blood Angel's favour so yes, they are winning.

I'm going to have to defer to Martel in this one, he's definitely one of the more knowledgeable Blood Angels players on this forum, and simply having a "majority" percentage of the forum vote in favour of Blood Angels rather than Space Wolves does not discredit Martel's experience nor insight into the Blood Angels flaws. This is not to say that Blood Angels are bad at drop-podding, its just that Space Wolves have that extra edge that pushes them ahead of the BA in terms of this specific build.

Then why aren't Space Wolves winning the poll? If what you both say is true then wouldn't the poll reflect that?

Bharring wrote:
SW are more capable receiving the charge. BAs are more capable when charging. True.

But the opponent gets to pick what to assault. He has some, but much less, say in what gets assaulted.

I think we disagree on how likely it is for a massed podded at to still have some models on the table, and for units that should be just an inch or three away to get out of charge range in one round.

And on the difference in firepower. Might be I love heavy flamers a bit too much.

So, do you see BAs as the #2 podding army? If not, then who?

There are no Salamanders to my knowledge where I play anymore. Given your analysis of the Salamanders above, I'd have to say the BA are the #2 pod army. There might be a FW chapter I don't know about. If IH could take BA weaponry, I'd give it to them.

And all pod armies have the problem of their own pods getting in the way of each other and disembarking models. I'm really not a fan with BA.


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 Grimskul wrote:

SGTPozy wrote:
The vote is still 11% in Blood Angel's favour so yes, they are winning.

I'm going to have to defer to Martel in this one, he's definitely one of the more knowledgeable Blood Angels players on this forum, and simply having a "majority" percentage of the forum vote in favour of Blood Angels rather than Space Wolves does not discredit Martel's experience nor insight into the Blood Angels flaws. This is not to say that Blood Angels are bad at drop-podding, its just that Space Wolves have that extra edge that pushes them ahead of the BA in terms of this specific build.

I'd feel a lot better about BA drop pod lists with the 6th ed vehicle table. As it stands, a triple melta team has approx a 50/50 shot of popping a Rhino or comparable transport. Compare this to a S6/7 spam unit. The melta drop just isn't scary enough.

SGTPozy wrote:
Then why aren't Space Wolves winning the poll? If what you both say is true then wouldn't the poll reflect that?

Just because the "majority" thinks something is true doesn't mean it is. Just like how most people back then used to believe that the sun orbited the earth rather than the other way around and Galileo was imprisoned for saying otherwise. Also in terms of "winning" with BA only having 11% more than SW or Salamanders I think its only a marginal lead, not as much as you seem to claim it to be.

Sanity is not statistical.

You could probably find some easily documented facts for which the average person would assume otherwise, and see overwhelming majorities be wrong.

That said, are Space Wolves really better at podding than BA? Charging SW is a bit scarier than charging BA, but a lot of things can't really charge either. And will die much faster being charged by BA than SW. And this is after BA unleash better shooting.

I suppose SW just haven't done as much when I've faced them.


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(I don't think we disagree by much on this point, Martel. Not even sure I still disagree with you. Just with parts of the arguments)

"Charging SW is a bit scarier than charging BA"

They have triple the attacks. That's more than a "bit".

All this being said, though, I think the same kinds of lists fold to drop lists and the same kinds weather the storm and crush drop lists regardless of who is dropping.

By personal biggeest fear is a drop list that draws assault Orks, Nids, or Chaos Demons. There is literally zero chance I can do enough damage with a BA alpha strike to not get erased on turn two. SW, on the other hand, are right at home.

BA Pod armies are based on Assault Squads.
The problem is that
a) you can't expect for two Meltaguns to actually do what you want
b) the small squad gets shot down rather easily
c) you can get the charge, but by no means can you assume that you're going to get it. The enemy isn't an idiot, he knows that the BA are superior in charge so why would he let you to do it?
You will most likely recieve no benefit from either BSF or FC.

SW has the strenght to withstand the coming firepower much better and have three attacks per model no matter if he charges or gets charged.

BA aren't bad, I just wouldn't and didn't personally vote them to be the best Drop Pod army.
IMO their biggest advantage over the other armies are Fragiosos.

 soomemafia wrote:
BA Pod armies are based on Assault Squads.
The problem is that
a) you can't expect for two Meltaguns to actually do what you want
b) the small squad gets shot down rather easily
c) you can get the charge, but by no means can you assume that you're going to get it. The enemy isn't an idiot, he knows that the BA are superior in charge so why would he let you to do it?
You will most likely recieve no benefit from either BSF or FC.

SW has the strenght to withstand the coming firepower much better and have three attacks per model no matter if he charges or gets charged.

BA aren't bad, I just wouldn't and didn't personally vote them to be the best Drop Pod army.
IMO their biggest advantage over the other armies are Fragiosos.

while I agree with your point when It comes to C generally. However when your drop pods don't scatter (using the right formations of course) then there's a really good chance you can put yourself in a great position to get a charge off almost 100% of the time.

again I go back to my point of the points value of the game being key to this discussion ( the OP did say he was playing 3000) almost anything above 2000 starts to swing it greatly in favor of BA.

1. Turn 1 Charges
2. ASM 4x melta pods
3. 4x flamer Tac squads

and again this includes 3x Stormravens with 3x tac. squads arriving on turn 1 with those pods.

Sub 2000 point games, say 1850-1500 point games I give it to SW