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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/06/14 17:22:28
Subject: Sculpting Proxies for LotR minis OOP (What to do after the Mahûd proxies?)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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As has been pointed out, GW has allowed a large number of minis to lapse OOP, and I am working on producing a line of minis that can proxy for Middle-earth.
Obviously, I have my own ideas (technically Tolkien's ideas) about what much of Middle-earth should look like.
But there is plenty that GW did for LotR/The Hobbit that I happen to think close enough to Tolkien's vision that doing new Proxies for them (since GW is not making them any longer) would not fit with the older GW minis.
• The Mahûd – As has been pointed out, these need some proxies, and are first on my list; including a new Mahûd king (since I wanted a really fat one on a palanquin with naked women laying around him, and some huge bodyguards, similar to the Half-Trolls). But I could do another Mahûd king similar to the camel mounted one (since I like having more than one command figure for any particular force as it is). I would also like to do some Far-Haradrim (which is what the Mahûd are supposed to be) that represent OTHER Far-Harad tribes. So, having some Far-Haradrim that would allow more diversity, as if the Mahûd represented a confederation of a bunch of different tribes (these would also be good to use for gaming Conan/Hyboria, as that world had plenty of tribal savages).
• Haradrim – I think there are a few of the specialty troops OOP, but there are no troops specific to Umbar save for the Corsairs, who were only the Umbarrim Navy, and not their land forces.
• Khandirim (not "Khandish" - although that would be acceptable for describing a thing made by the Khandirim, for instance, a Khandish Food, or hat, but the people are the Khandirim)
• Arnorians (since technically the Arnorians produced by GW look more like Gondorians, specifically they look like Soldiers from one of the Southern fiefs, such as Belfalas, Lebennin, Dor-en-Ernil, Ethir Anduin), but getting Armorial troops is on my list as it is, and I think people will be happy with what I can produce.
• Gondorian Fiefs:
• There are no dedicated Archers of Morthond Vale (using Rangers of Ithilien is just wrong. Morthond Vale used massed Archers behind spearmen - The Archers would be more like the
Warriors of Minas Tirith Archers, but without all the armor).
• The Light Troops of Pinnath Gelin, and the Anfalas (these were basically hunters conscripted for war)
• The Soldiers from Pelargir, Linhir, Calembel, and other southern cities (basically massed spearmen, but without a lot of armor as in the wealthier cities - Pelargir was wealthy enough to
have armored troops though)
• Easterlings (As an example: How would people like to see Easterling Mûmakil - smaller than the Haradrim Mûmakil, and with Easterling styled equipment and soldiers?). But the Easterlings also need regular cavalry, in addition to their Cataphracts - I do not recall if the game has stats for regular Easterling cavalry even. But aside from that, there do seem to be Easterling Soldiers in the books for which no minis were ever really made.
So... if people would do me a favor and give me a priority of miniatures you would like proxies for, or miniatures GW never made that you would like to see produced.
I will be beginning with the Mahûd (and other Far-Haradrim), since naked savages with just a little clothing and primitive armor are easy to do digitally.
And then finishing up the replacements of the Khandirim Chariots I began (which I have the 3D models pretty much done, I just need to get the 3D models parted into components for 3D printing so that they can then be cast in metal).
But after those two:
What would people be most interested in seeing next?
MB
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/06/14 18:07:37
Subject: Sculpting Proxies for LotR minis OOP (What to do after the Mahûd proxies?)
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Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?
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One gap you might be interested in is fleshing out is the more unusual aspects of the Sauron the Necromancer's army, the actual 'necromantic' stuff that GW largely hasn't touched at all. Not only are Shades and Spectres rather popular with the competitive scene, but you could also do some Undead that don't appear in the films at all, so you'd have a bit more aesthetic freedom. There would also be a lot of crossover potential, few settings can't use decent undead.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/06/18 17:02:05
Subject: Sculpting Proxies for LotR minis OOP (What to do after the Mahûd proxies?)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Paradigm wrote:One gap you might be interested in is fleshing out is the more unusual aspects of the Sauron the Necromancer's army, the actual 'necromantic' stuff that GW largely hasn't touched at all. Not only are Shades and Spectres rather popular with the competitive scene, but you could also do some Undead that don't appear in the films at all, so you'd have a bit more aesthetic freedom. There would also be a lot of crossover potential, few settings can't use decent undead.
I am DEFINITELY looking into this.
I am trying to figure out how to make skeletons, and undead warriors that can be culled from the various peoples surrounding Dol Goldûr;
• Lothlórien
• Rohan
• Rhovanion (which technically has a sizable population of people similar to Bulgarians)
• People who inhabit the Anduin River Valley and Vales.
• Mirkwood Silvan Elves.
And, there will likely be Middle-earth "werewolves" (similar to Wargs, but with a slight anthropomorphization - hands instead of front paws, slightly more human faces), as well as "Ghosts," or "Wight" and other spectral creatures.
Technically, the "Ghost-Candles" from the Dead Marshes near Dagorlad would be useable for these in small numbers (such as a skirmish game), but they include none of the more "modern" (in Middle-earth terms) forces.
MB
P.S. I have the concept art for the Mahûd finished, but I am on the road for the next week, and the drawings are back in Houston - They are similar enough to the GW produced Mahûd to mix with them, but different enough to look like a different tribe. I have two different drawings for each one (three poses), one as just a simple "blank," and another which is what they might look like painted. I also have sculpted them to be produced "Open-handed" with a selection of weapons. I may change that to "open-armed," where you choose a selection of arms, which would allow me to produce a "Blowgun" (which I loath and detest, but which is a part of the game - technically the Far-Haradrim used bows).
But three bodies, and a selection of four different sets of arms would give a total of 12 different poses, and four different weapons a total of 48 different models, combined.
I am still working on the concept for a Mahûd king, and a "Chieftain" (the Chieftain would be the actual replacement for the current "King" - I want the king to look like something out of Heart of Darkness/ Apocalypse Now).
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/06/18 21:32:36
Subject: Sculpting Proxies for LotR minis OOP (What to do after the Mahûd proxies?)
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Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?
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I would certainly take the alternative arms route rather than open hands, the latter can be a real put-off for people these days now that it's easier to produce weapon-holding hands. Even if it was a case of swapping at the wrist rather than the whole arm (scuplt a bangle/vambrace so you don't get a 'seam' in the skin), I think that would be far more enticing option.
Best case scenario, though, would be fully swappable arms. As you note, it opens up so many more poses/conversion options, and it you can do it, would make them even better than the GW ones (just 3 duplicate poses are fine for shieldwall troops, but for skirmishers like the Mahud it makes little sense)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/06/18 21:55:07
Subject: Sculpting Proxies for LotR minis OOP (What to do after the Mahûd proxies?)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Paradigm wrote:I would certainly take the alternative arms route rather than open hands, the latter can be a real put-off for people these days now that it's easier to produce weapon-holding hands. Even if it was a case of swapping at the wrist rather than the whole arm (scuplt a bangle/vambrace so you don't get a 'seam' in the skin), I think that would be far more enticing option.
Best case scenario, though, would be fully swappable arms. As you note, it opens up so many more poses/conversion options, and it you can do it, would make them even better than the GW ones (just 3 duplicate poses are fine for shieldwall troops, but for skirmishers like the Mahud it makes little sense)
I am going the route of four different right and left arms, with the shields and weapons separate (I do not yet know if I will make the weapon-hand cast onto the weapon, with a bangle or bracelet separating the hand, or if I will just make them open-handed).
I am thinking open-handed, because all of the figures I am doing are open-handed, with weapons cast separately.
This means a few of the Mahûd could have looted weapons from the Haradrim, Gondor, or Mordor Orcs, rather than their natively produced copper-weapons (which was Tolkien's intent when he mentioned "Red weapons" for the Haradrim). The term for a copper/bronze-smith is a Redsmith rather than the Blacksmith who works with iron/steel.
This is because the raw metals tend to be reddish for copper and/or Bronze (although oxidized, both turn green), and the raw metal for iron is black.
But I think just the open hands will work out, since the way I sculpt open hands allows a MUCH tighter fit for the weapons than the way other's sculpt open-handed miniatures (which do tend to be a pain).
I sculpt them so that the fingers can be bent closed around the weapons (similar to Old Glory's hands which need to be drilled out). But simply drilling out a hand can leave too loose a fit for many weapons.
But with the fingers capable of being bent closed, you can position the weapon, then bend the fingers closed, and then glue the weapon into place.
I learned the technique from Tom Meier's new Thunderbolt Mountain Fantasy figures. And the 100 or so I have finished have survived falls that trashed smaller (and thus lighter) figures.
The only thing I am trying to figure out is how to make a separate shield that is easier to attach without having to go the route of pinning (but that seems to be inevitable).
But I am going positively apeshit insane not being able to work on them while I am away from my main computer (which will be replaced with a newer one soon, leaving me another month I will have to go without).
I have the absolutely coolest design for the Mahûd King, which is a large, fat, but still muscular "king" sitting atop another Mahûd on his hands & knees, atop a palanquin carried by six eunuchs and three nude women lounging around him... And a leopard on a leash sitting in front of him. And a tall pole as a standard with severed heads hanging from it (I need to see is shrunken heads is a purely Polynesian thing, or if any sub-Saharans did it as well - that is yet another old racist trope about Africa, but it might fit with the theme here) being held behind him to "shade" him from the sun.
I am also doing the Mahûd as actual Black Africans (which is what the Far-Haradrim are supposed to be), so their facial features might be a little different from GW's. Overall the styles match closely enough, though.
I just thought of something else I could do.
Rather than having him sitting on ONE kneeling Mahûd, have him sitting on a small couch supported by three of four kneeling Mahûd.
MB
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