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I had a bully boyz formation in trukks take out a lance formation in a single turn - granted I was a little lucky and lost most of my orks but still it was pretty funny...
Tankbustas and Meganobz are powerful in close combat against Imperial Knights. But how powerful?
A lot of people say that shooting is the way to kill IKs with Orks. However, based on the below, you would need 8 tankbustas surviving at initiative 1 to kill an Imperial Knight in one round of close combat. An Imperial Knight can kill on average less than 2 Tankbustas in a turn in close combat, which means that on average, you should be able to expect to kill an Imperial Knight if assaulting it with 10 tankbustas in one turn of combat.
.7937 Hull Points stripped per turn of combat on average at Init 1 by 1 Tankbusta
S8 + 2d6 AP1 vs AV13 = 26/36 = 72.22~% to Penetrate
S8 Meltabomb w/ Tank Hunters (reroll to Glance) = 1-(5/6) = 1/6
(1/6) * (5/6) = 13.8~%
13.8~% + 83.33~% = 97.22~% to Glance
S8 Meltabomb w/ Tank Hunters (reroll to Pen) = 1-(26/36) = .27~
(.27~) * (.722~) = 20%
20% + 72.22~% = 92.28% to Pen
Average Hull Points dealt in combat by 1 Tankbusta Meltabomb:
( 50% to hit ) * ( 97.22~% to Glance ) = .4861~
( 50% to hit ) * ( 92.28% to Pen ) * ( 1/3 chance to Explode ) * [(1+2+3)/3] = .3076
.7937 Hull Points stripped on average at Init 1 by Tankbusta
2.148~ Average Hull Points stripped per turn of combat at Initiative 1 by 1 MAN w/ Chainfist
2.98594~ Hull Points stripped per turn of combat at Initiative 1 by 1 MAN w/ Chainfist on the Assault
S8 + 2d6 AP2 vs AV13 = 30/36 = 83.33~% to Glance per hit
S8 + 2d6 AP2 vs AV13 = 26/36 = 72.22~% to Penetrate per hit
Average Hull Points dealt in combat by 1 MAN w/ Chainfist:
( 50% to hit ) * ( 83.33~% to Glance ) = .416~
( 50% to hit ) * ( 72.22% to Pen ) * ( 1/6 chance to Explode ) * [(1+2+3)/3] = .12
.416~ + .12 = .537 Hull Points per attack
.537 * 4 = 2.148~ Hull Points stripped per turn of combat at Initiative 1 by 1 MAN w/ Chainfist
S9 Chainfist (Furious Charge)
S9 + 2d6 AP2 vs AV13 = 33/36 = 91.6~% to Glance per hit
S9 + 2d6 AP2 vs AV13 = 30/36 = 83.33~% to Penetrate per hit
Average Hull Points dealt in combat by 1 MAN w/ Chainfist on the Charge:
( 50% to hit ) * ( 91.6~% to Glance ) = .4583~
( 50% to hit ) * ( 83.33~% to Pen ) * (1/6 chance to Explode) * [(1+2+3)/3] = .138~
.4583~ + .138~ = .59718~ Hull Points per attack
.59718~ * 5 = 2.98594~ Hull Points stripped per turn of combat at Initiative 1 by 1 MAN w/ Chainfist on the Assault
.583 Hull points damaged on average per turn of combat by MAN w/ Powerfist
1.22~ Hull points damaged on average per turn of combat by MAN w/ Powerfist in the Assault
Spoiler:
MANz vs AV13 superheavy walker
S8 Power Fist = .5*.33 chance to Glan = 16.6~% chance to Glance per hit
S8 Power Fist = .5*.16 chance to Pen = 8.3~% chance to Penetrate per hit
Average HP stripped per turn of combat per MAN w/ Powerfist=
.16~ * 3 = .5 Hull Points
( .083~ * 3 ) * .16 * [(1+2+3)/3] = .083 Hull Points
.5 + .083 = .583 Hull points damaged on average per turn of combat by MAN w/ Powerfist
S9 Power Fist = .5*.5 chance to Glan = 25% chance to Glance per hit
S9 Power Fist = .5*.33 chance to Pen = 16.6~% chance to Penetrate per hit
Average HP per turn of combat per MAN w/ Powerfist on charge =
.25 * 4 = 1 Hull Point
(.16~ * 4 ) * .16 * [(1+2+3)/3] = .22~ Hull Pointz
1 + .22~ = 1.22~ Hull points damaged on average per turn of combat by MAN w/ Powerfist in the Assault
Tankbustas are the most efficient in terms of hull points stripped per round of combat avg per point.
MANz with Killsaws on the assault are the second most efficient in hull points per point.
MANz with Killsaws are the third most efficient in hull points per point.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
because unlike Knights, Stompas are absolutely terrible and a serious waste of cash.
I've had a rough time as an Ork player mostly because even in CC, those Stomp attacks wipe a lot of dudes quickly. But if your Bustas are lucky, you can peg it from multiple sides to reduce the effectiveness of the force field it can throw up, or Melta Bomb the crap out of it in CC.
because unlike Knights, Stompas are absolutely terrible and a serious waste of cash.
I've had a rough time as an Ork player mostly because even in CC, those Stomp attacks wipe a lot of dudes quickly. But if your Bustas are lucky, you can peg it from multiple sides to reduce the effectiveness of the force field it can throw up, or Melta Bomb the crap out of it in CC.
Dreadmob Stompas are pretty freaking boss, and one of the shootiest units in the entire game (bizarrely enough).
That said, Tankbustas will make Knights cry. Melta bombs are at I2, so before stomp!
because unlike Knights, Stompas are absolutely terrible and a serious waste of cash.
I've had a rough time as an Ork player mostly because even in CC, those Stomp attacks wipe a lot of dudes quickly. But if your Bustas are lucky, you can peg it from multiple sides to reduce the effectiveness of the force field it can throw up, or Melta Bomb the crap out of it in CC.
Dreadmob Stompas are pretty freaking boss, and one of the shootiest units in the entire game (bizarrely enough).
That said, Tankbustas will make Knights cry. Melta bombs are at I2, so before stomp!
MB are unwieldy but anywayz, tankbustas do the job effectively.
because unlike Knights, Stompas are absolutely terrible and a serious waste of cash.
I've had a rough time as an Ork player mostly because even in CC, those Stomp attacks wipe a lot of dudes quickly. But if your Bustas are lucky, you can peg it from multiple sides to reduce the effectiveness of the force field it can throw up, or Melta Bomb the crap out of it in CC.
Dreadmob Stompas are pretty freaking boss, and one of the shootiest units in the entire game (bizarrely enough).
That said, Tankbustas will make Knights cry. Melta bombs are at I2, so before stomp!
So, FW, which is also a waste of money IMO. Having to buy an additional rule book to make a 100+ dollar model worth a damn doesn't make the model worth a damn. It just further alienates it as an unrealistic option. :(
There is a battle report on "blue table painting" orks vs eldar.. I think it is the latest report they have.. he gives his warboss a bike and a lucky stick and I think power claw.. basically the boss kills a wraithknight in one turn 9 times out of 10.. the trouble is the eldar guy didn't take a wraithknight.. but the ork player bemoans this and lists the warboss build..
His bikes had 2+ cover and 5+ fnp which is the highest save in the game turn one and then 4++ force and 5 + fnp therafter.. so he lost 1 out of about 9 when he crossed the board
Automatically Appended Next Post: Go to 50:00 they discuss how to beat eldar with orks in a LOT of detail
https://youtu.be/Al28cu90L00
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/05 08:29:34
ConanMan wrote: There is a battle report on "blue table painting" orks vs eldar.. I think it is the latest report they have.. he gives his warboss a bike and a lucky stick and I think power claw.. basically the boss kills a wraithknight in one turn 9 times out of 10.. the trouble is the eldar guy didn't take a wraithknight.. but the ork player bemoans this and lists the warboss build..
His bikes had 2+ cover and 5+ fnp which is the highest save in the game turn one and then 4++ force and 5 + fnp therafter.. so he lost 1 out of about 9 when he crossed the board
How was he getting a 2+ cover save? Night Fighting I assume combined with Turbo Boosted Jink?
Regardless, the Eldar player should have had very little issue nuking Ork Bikers with D weaponry or with Ignores Cover weaponry (D-Templates)
So, FW, which is also a waste of money IMO. Having to buy an additional rule book to make a 100+ dollar model worth a damn doesn't make the model worth a damn. It just further alienates it as an unrealistic option. :(
The Dreadmob list is, in it's updated PDF format, totally free on the Forgeworld site.
And stompas are one of the easiest, most visually impressive things to scratch build as an ork. Get creative.
Watch the battle report the orks destroy the eldar... in no time... the lists the orks.use is very very strong.. it wasn't night fighting it was some orky moving flat out jink bonus plus some warboss gear buff.. dscythes are the only unit that could have maybe stopped them but to be honest they would have got their 4+ invul , have 2 wounds plus fnp so faaar less than 1/3rd of what is hit dies even with dscythes
Automatically Appended Next Post: I found the actual link in the timeline, listen to this guy explain how to kill a wraithknight with orks easy
Tankbustas, Manz, and Mek Gunz each come to mind. Although I don't think I'd use a Stompa to go chase Knights I wouldn't dismiss it so easily either. It's pretty darn killy and tanky and transporty. It's a bit of a dick move but the thing can be filled up with Burna and Loota units that swap for 3 free meks each. Dropping a unit to put in a Big Mek with a forcefield and then free HQ meks for the 3 squads can give 13 meks and still have room for another IC. A fast moving, regenerating Super Heavy that can shoot and use all those weapons on multiple targets, still assault and vomit out 20 models can be pretty useful. Fething expensive pt cost though XD. But I've seen this particular Super Heavy perform very well many times when lists are built around it.
Considering that my tyranids take out Imperial Knights with mass S6 shooting (flying hive tyrants and / or dakka fexes), I assume Lootas, with their massed S7 shooting, would also be a decent way to hull point out a knight.
Heck, the rarely used Wreckin Ball upgrade D3 S9 shots (albeit at super short range) could be a decent way to help finish off a pesky knight charging up the middle.
Voidwraith wrote: Considering that my tyranids take out Imperial Knights with mass S6 shooting (flying hive tyrants and / or dakka fexes), I assume Lootas, with their massed S7 shooting, would also be a decent way to hull point out a knight.
Heck, the rarely used Wreckin Ball upgrade D3 S9 shots (albeit at super short range) could be a decent way to help finish off a pesky knight charging up the middle.
I was just going to mention lootas. They are great at stripping hull points off knights. It took two rounds of shooting but my lootas dropped one knight all on their own then took all but one hull point off another in the next round of shooting leaving it for the tankbustas to knock it out. The only reason my lootas were even in my list for that fight was the guy wanted to play a 1850 point game and I had prepared for a 1500 point game so I chucked in some stuff to get to 1850. Now lootas are going to be a auto take in my list they are just good at taking out so many things now.
ive done a stompa oriented list before and it rocked (though it wasnt fighting against any superheavies, so my experience with that is limited).
if you want to make the stompa most optimal then go for the IA8 custom stompa and give it the bare essentials you want for you game (making it much cheaper). fill the guy with a bigmek with the ghaz mega force field for the 4up invol, and then finish by filling it to the brim with meks (both hq variants and loota varients).
if you want a ranged build stompa and are afraid of risking it in cc with knights or melta bombs then take a large squad of grots to keep infront of it just to prevent assaults (they will get feerless from the stompa).
"dont put all yer boyz in one trukk" "umless its dredds, then take as much uf those as possible"
geargutz interpretation of the 'umies "eggs in one basket"
ConanMan wrote: yeah but whenever I see lootas I just it them with serpent shields.. ignores cover :-/
I agree with you there! I've had a single knight kill my Stompa by rolling lucky in CC. Double 6 and no more Stompa. Now, fearless grots in front of the Stompa will tie it up for the game!
ConanMan wrote: yeah but whenever I see lootas I just it them with serpent shields.. ignores cover :-/
I agree with you there! I've had a single knight kill my Stompa by rolling lucky in CC. Double 6 and no more Stompa. Now, fearless grots in front of the Stompa will tie it up for the game!
Large Grot squad in front of Stompa is the way to go!
Warboss with power klaw or big mek with killsaw in a squad of boyz. Boyz take the wounds, character does the damage.
I once took down a Knight Paladin. Nobz with three power klaws duked it out and eventually died after doing a lot of damage. Finished it off by ramming it with a wagon and bombing it with the blitza bommer.
I have noticed a lot of people recommend meganobz. Am I missing something? Surely superior initiative + ap2 = dead meganobz?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/06 22:02:35
Krusha wrote: Warboss with power klaw or big mek with killsaw in a squad of boyz. Boyz take the wounds, character does the damage.
I once took down a Knight Paladin. Nobz with three power klaws duked it out and eventually died after doing a lot of damage. Finished it off by ramming it with a wagon and bombing it with the blitza bommer.
I have noticed a lot of people recommend meganobz. Am I missing something? Surely superior initiative + ap2 = dead meganobz?
+Str D for instadeath. Even though meganobz may have as many wounds as other units, they usually have fewer bodies for the cost. In this case with strD weapons, having multiple wounds doesn't really matter.
So, FW, which is also a waste of money IMO. Having to buy an additional rule book to make a 100+ dollar model worth a damn doesn't make the model worth a damn. It just further alienates it as an unrealistic option. :(
The Dreadmob list is, in it's updated PDF format, totally free on the Forgeworld site.
And stompas are one of the easiest, most visually impressive things to scratch build as an ork. Get creative.
Well, easy doesn't mean good. I don't think I've seen a complete from-scratch kustom stompa build I've liked. And for the amount of plastic and detail you get from the kit, they're a pretty good deal.
I did make a forgeworld kustom stompa, but I used the kit as a base.
Automatically Appended Next Post: But to answer the OPs question, the best way to do it is melee. Power klaws, kill saws, and tankbustas can do it pretty effectively.
The problem is that knights are fast as hell, and our transports are too paper-thin to have any real chance of getting to krumpin' range unless the knight lets us.
And if you do get to melee, chances are the knight will be taking 60% - 80% of the unit with him. Besides the fear tests which are particularly effective against orks, d melee, stomps are absolutely devastating to anything but meganobz (who can and have been stomped right off the table).
Then, when it actually does go down, it ALWAYS explodes in an 15" blast with a large blast D at its core.
So, getting to the knight is your first problem, as a player with a brain in his head will keep it away from your power klaws.
Then you have to be able to kill it between the stomps, fear tests, and D melee.
Then you have to survive the subsequent explosion.
It's possible to kill them as orks, but in my experience it's a rather pyrrhic victory when you do.
As for killing them at range as orks.......yeah, not really going to happen unless you bring nothing but tankbustas.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/07 22:54:18
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment." Words to live by.
I wouldn't go with mega nobz, they are initiative one and will be ID by night while having absolutely no CC invulv. Go with mass boyz that can soak up wounds while PK nobz and warboss take away hull points, with one good assault one or multiple squad consisting of nobz and warbosses with luky stick, you could probably kill a Knight while only losing a couple of cheap ork boyz
Sankhkare (the dynisty of the dead)
Tankbustas and Meganobz are powerful in close combat against Imperial Knights. But how powerful? 
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
