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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/17 17:54:12
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
I probably wouldn't want to be posing in a large static group with some flags in a battlefield.
Prestor Jon wrote: Because children don't have any legal rights until they're adults. A minor is the responsiblity of the parent and has no legal rights except through his/her legal guardian or parent.
Soladrin wrote: American SS. Classy. Can I assume that entire squad was court martialed?
Negative Counseling form was giving
Remember
Battlefield humor
Edit
Scout Sniper
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/17 18:18:38
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
Scout Snipers had been using that SS logo for a long time. Nobody in the chain of command had any issue with it until that pic got loose on the internet and people decided to complain about on social media. Nobody in the unit did anything that violates UMCJ or was deserving of a court martial. There's a very lengthy history of non pc unit patches and flashes all through the armed forces. It's not a big deal.
And yet it still ended up everywhere with a bunch of soldiers standing in front of an SS flag. Battlefield humor or not it was an incredibly stupid thing to do.
Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
And yet it still ended up everywhere with a bunch of soldiers standing in front of an SS flag. Battlefield humor or not it was an incredibly stupid thing to do.
These guys got reamed out and slammed for this. Weapon safety
This Marine got slammed. "Conduct Unbecoming"
Paperwork was started for UCMJ action. Yet the argument was coming from Stateside so CoC said basically "Feth you".
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
Many of them were erected for the wrong reasons, and glorifying people who were Traitors, and allied to/fighting for a cause that was based upon an evil foundation is not something we should be honoring or glorifying.
Correcting mistakes of the past is what nations need to do in order to move past those mistakes.
As long as we continue to honor the Confederacy as any type of "Heroic figures" we will remain fighting the Civil War.
The South Lost. It is time we reinforced that fact.
MB
The same could be said of Washington and the other founding fathers had they lost the Revolutionary War.
And?
MB
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, people just have no fething clue what Intentionalism, or the differentiation between ideals expressed and behavior are, do they?
We are doomed.
MB
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/17 22:26:47
My, how things have changed, but stayed the same...
Charlie Chaplain spanks the gak out of any modern actor and most modern political demagogues. Speech is from the end of the Great Dictator (a film I recommend).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/18 00:19:54
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
Many of them were erected for the wrong reasons, and glorifying people who were Traitors, and allied to/fighting for a cause that was based upon an evil foundation is not something we should be honoring or glorifying.
Correcting mistakes of the past is what nations need to do in order to move past those mistakes.
As long as we continue to honor the Confederacy as any type of "Heroic figures" we will remain fighting the Civil War.
The South Lost. It is time we reinforced that fact.
MB
The same could be said of Washington and the other founding fathers had they lost the Revolutionary War.
And?
MB
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, people just have no fething clue what Intentionalism, or the differentiation between ideals expressed and behavior are, do they?
We are doomed.
MB
Coming from someone with many entertaining stories of shooting people down in the street, then saying we need more gun control, that's fairly ironic.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/18 00:15:36
Many of them were erected for the wrong reasons, and glorifying people who were Traitors, and allied to/fighting for a cause that was based upon an evil foundation is not something we should be honoring or glorifying.
Correcting mistakes of the past is what nations need to do in order to move past those mistakes.
As long as we continue to honor the Confederacy as any type of "Heroic figures" we will remain fighting the Civil War.
The South Lost. It is time we reinforced that fact.
MB
The same could be said of Washington and the other founding fathers had they lost the Revolutionary War.
And?
MB
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, people just have no fething clue what Intentionalism, or the differentiation between ideals expressed and behavior are, do they?
We are doomed.
MB
Coming from someone with many entertaining stories of shooting people down in the street, then saying we need more gun control, that's fairly ironic.
And this just provides evidence for my point.
Understanding Intentionalism, and where and when it is applicable has absolutely nothing to do with having shot people (considering people don't seem to understand WHY I shot who I did, when I did, and the situation).
This is a clumsy attempt at trying to divert the attention from the issue raised; Trying to shout "Squirrel!" but ultimately failing.
Many of them were erected for the wrong reasons, and glorifying people who were Traitors, and allied to/fighting for a cause that was based upon an evil foundation is not something we should be honoring or glorifying.
Correcting mistakes of the past is what nations need to do in order to move past those mistakes.
As long as we continue to honor the Confederacy as any type of "Heroic figures" we will remain fighting the Civil War.
The South Lost. It is time we reinforced that fact.
MB
The same could be said of Washington and the other founding fathers had they lost the Revolutionary War.
And?
MB
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, people just have no fething clue what Intentionalism, or the differentiation between ideals expressed and behavior are, do they?
We are doomed.
MB
Coming from someone with many entertaining stories of shooting people down in the street, then saying we need more gun control, that's fairly ironic.
And this just provides evidence for my point.
Understanding Intentionalism, and where and when it is applicable has absolutely nothing to do with having shot people (considering people don't seem to understand WHY I shot who I did, when I did, and the situation).
This is a clumsy attempt at trying to divert the attention from the issue raised; Trying to shout "Squirrel!" but ultimately failing.
MB
Not clumsy at all. Just showing you have a double standard that clouds your opinion. First you make up a story about shooting someone, then turn around a couple threads later saying guns are evil. You express the ideals of gun control, yet walk about with the stated intention of shooting people.
Now if you'd like to continue the discussion without passive aggressive attacks that brought about my response about your heroic stories of yourself, and ask me why I said that about the Founding Fathers, I would be happy to elaborate.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/20 00:01:28
Many of them were erected for the wrong reasons, and glorifying people who were Traitors, and allied to/fighting for a cause that was based upon an evil foundation is not something we should be honoring or glorifying.
Correcting mistakes of the past is what nations need to do in order to move past those mistakes.
As long as we continue to honor the Confederacy as any type of "Heroic figures" we will remain fighting the Civil War.
The South Lost. It is time we reinforced that fact.
MB
The same could be said of Washington and the other founding fathers had they lost the Revolutionary War.
And?
MB
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, people just have no fething clue what Intentionalism, or the differentiation between ideals expressed and behavior are, do they?
We are doomed.
MB
Coming from someone with many entertaining stories of shooting people down in the street, then saying we need more gun control, that's fairly ironic.
And this just provides evidence for my point.
Understanding Intentionalism, and where and when it is applicable has absolutely nothing to do with having shot people (considering people don't seem to understand WHY I shot who I did, when I did, and the situation).
This is a clumsy attempt at trying to divert the attention from the issue raised; Trying to shout "Squirrel!" but ultimately failing.
MB
Not clumsy at all. Just showing you have a double standard that clouds your opinion. First you make up a story about shooting someone, then turn around a couple threads later saying guns are evil. You express the ideals of gun control, yet walk about with the stated intention of shooting people.
Now if you'd like to continue the discussion without passive aggressive attacks that brought about my response about your heroic stories of yourself, and ask me why I said that about the Founding Fathers, I would be happy to elaborate.
Understanding Intentionalism is not contradictory to having shot people, nor is it a double standard.
All intentionalism is about is WHY you might shoot people (or do anything else), and when it would be ethical to do so.
I NEVER said "Guns are evil."
That would be someone reading something into it that wasn't said (I DID say that Guns are a tool that was invented to kill people (or animals - but, it was invented to kill people, specifically) more easily. But this does not automatically make them evil (and a belief that this statement IS saying they are evil would again be a failure to understand Intentionalism).
Not to mention that is completely irrelevant to the issues of the Intentions of the Founding Fathers vs. their actions (it is possible for intentions and behavior to not line up - the important thing is that they eventually line up, along with the intended consequences of that behavior).
And yet it still ended up everywhere with a bunch of soldiers standing in front of an SS flag. Battlefield humor or not it was an incredibly stupid thing to do.
These guys got reamed out and slammed for this.
Because it was stupid and they should have known better. Battlefield humor isn't an excuse for that level of idiocy.
Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
BaronIveagh wrote: So was George Washington, but he's hailed all over as a great hero. The difference being simply that he won.
Unless George Washington had his men fire on troops who were attempting to surrender, I have no idea what your point has to do with anything.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
snurl wrote: South Carolina had been seceded for several months, and the surrender of the fort had been requested several times.
They declared their secession, and the Feds said no. No part of that means the Feds should pack up stakes and abandon their forts, that's complete fething nonsense, basically just a complete rejection of the idea of government.
Now, obviously, when the Feds say no then that means war is likely if terms can't be reached. And there's really nothing wrong with the decision to go to war. It's just that once you make that decision and attack the fort, its really silly for people years later to claim that wasn't the original act of aggression.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/20 03:18:07
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
Prestor Jon wrote: Scout Snipers had been using that SS logo for a long time. Nobody in the chain of command had any issue with it until that pic got loose on the internet and people decided to complain about on social media.
Yeah, the problem wasn't with our armed forces deployed overseas displaying Nazi iconography, it was with the SJWs who complained about it.
You can only read gak like this and laugh
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Jihadin wrote: This Marine got slammed. "Conduct Unbecoming"
Paperwork was started for UCMJ action. Yet the argument was coming from Stateside so CoC said basically "Feth you".
LordofHats wrote: Which I might add, just brings me to my second point; No sane state just lets territories secede, and even in an age where the 'right to secession' was at least debatable in America, the North was never going to let the South leave and only a fool would actually expect to be able to secede without having to fight. Hell, the secession bit of it, wasn't even much of a case. That decision is pretty much the height of rationality. "Of course you can't unilaterally secede that defeats the whole purpose of having a Union. Are we seriously having to explain this to you?" (quote from the Supreme Court to Texas that I just made up )
There are instances. Pakistan seceded from India, it was hardly peaceable but the deaths were more spontaneous racial violence - there was no government effort to resist secession. There's been some Balkan events as well - Finland was granted independance by Lenin after the revolution, and Norway and Sweden seperated in two at the turn of the last century.
But yeah, its extraordinarily uncommon for regions to secede from a stable government with no resistance - most examples involves cases where the central government is or has collapsed. Reality is if you want independence you better want it bad enough to start a war, because that's almost certainly what it's going to take.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2015/07/20 03:48:32
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
Prestor Jon wrote: Scout Snipers had been using that SS logo for a long time. Nobody in the chain of command had any issue with it until that pic got loose on the internet and people decided to complain about on social media.
Yeah, the problem wasn't with our armed forces deployed overseas displaying Nazi iconography, it was with the SJWs who complained about it.
You can only read gak like this and laugh
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Jihadin wrote: This Marine got slammed. "Conduct Unbecoming"
Paperwork was started for UCMJ action. Yet the argument was coming from Stateside so CoC said basically "Feth you".
I mention this before
There's what You know and there's what is known.
MARINE CORPS BASE QUANTICO, Va. — Smoking kills. When necessary, so do Marines.
Ideally, the two shouldn't mix. Marines must maintain peak physical fitness for the rigors of combat — not to mention the Corps' new Combat Fitness Test. Yet the most recent Marine Corps Quality of Life survey, conducted in 2007 and released this past summer, found that nearly 32 percent of leathernecks smoke.
That's down slightly from the 2002 survey, but the figure is noticeably higher than the national average, estimated by the American Cancer Society to be about 21 percent, and a bit higher than the percentage of 18- to 24-year-old civilians who ignore the surgeon general's ubiquitous warnings.
Another 21 percent of Marines — the highest number in the military, according to 2005 Defense Department statistics — use smokeless tobacco.
And while cigarette sales at base exchanges are down this year, smokeless tobacco tins are flying off the shelves with double-digit increases over a year ago, according to Marine Corps Community Services.
It's not the news Marine officials like to hear, but it comes as no real shock either. Throughout the military, smoking is making an unwelcome comeback, reversing a nearly 20-year decline and running counter to civilian trends. Today, the Defense Department spends about $875 million on tobacco-related health care costs.
GO's were pissed that he was glamorized for smoking and he was down to two packs of Marlboro. Actually
2004-11-18 04:00:00 PDT Fallujah, Iraq -- The Marlboro man was angry: He has a war to fight, and he's running out of smokes.
"If you want to write something," he tells an intruding reporter, "tell Marlboro I'm down to four packs, and I'm here in Fallujah till who knows when. Maybe they can send some. And they can bring down the price a bit."
Those are the unfettered sentiments of Marine Lance Cpl. James Blake Miller, 20, a country boy from Kentucky who has been thrust unwittingly and somewhat unwillingly into the role of poster boy for a war on the other side of the world from his home on the farm.
Edit
I was at BIAP when that exploded
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/20 05:36:16
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
Whatever the case, the photo seems to have struck a chord, and top Marine brass are thrilled.
Lt. Gen. John F. Sattler, commander of the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force, dropped in on Charlie Company Friday to laud the Marlboro Men.
"That's a great picture," echoed Col. Craig Tucker, who heads the regimental combat team that includes Miller's battalion. "We're having one blown up and sent over to the unit."
yeah, sounds like they were pretty pissed and he was looking at "conduct unbecoming", alright. Definitely sounds like they wanted to push a UCMJ charge
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/07/20 06:13:48
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
Whatever the case, the photo seems to have struck a chord, and top Marine brass are thrilled.
Lt. Gen. John F. Sattler, commander of the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force, dropped in on Charlie Company Friday to laud the Marlboro Men.
"That's a great picture," echoed Col. Craig Tucker, who heads the regimental combat team that includes Miller's battalion. "We're having one blown up and sent over to the unit."
yeah, sounds like they were pretty pissed and he was looking at "conduct unbecoming", alright. Definitely sounds like they wanted to push a UCMJ charge
Did I not mention something about those in the US and those in the combat theater were of two different opinion. Oh wait....I did
I bow your vast experience and knowledge on this subject.
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
Are you going to support your claim with anything other than an appeal to authority fallacy?
Yes, you have more experience being in the military than I do, but even as a layperson I'm pretty sure you don't get hauled up on UCMJ conduct unbecoming charges for the crime of "smoking on camera".
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/20 13:02:57
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
Ouze wrote: Are you going to support your claim with anything other than an appeal to authority fallacy?
Yes, you have more experience being in the military than I do, but even as a layperson I'm pretty sure you don't get hauled up on UCMJ conduct unbecoming charges for the crime of "smoking on camera".
well it depends on what he was smoking doesn't it.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
You weren't there Ouze, you just don't know. How dare you expect people to back up what amounts to office gossip about pissed off management when they claim it as fact on the Internet.
Prestor Jon wrote: Scout Snipers had been using that SS logo for a long time. Nobody in the chain of command had any issue with it until that pic got loose on the internet and people decided to complain about on social media.
Yeah, the problem wasn't with our armed forces deployed overseas displaying Nazi iconography, it was with the SJWs who complained about it.
You can only read gak like this and laugh
Marine Scout Snipers have used that flag for decades without any previous issues before that picture incited internet outrage. The double S logo is easier to put on a flag than a hog's tooth. A lightning bolt shaped S is nothing new and can be seen in the logo for the band KISS and on Tolkien's original maps for The Hobbit. Only someone who is literally blind or willfully ignores context could conflate the Marines in that photo with the Waffen SS. Symbols don't exist in vacuums, context is everything and that photo is clearly US Marines, in uniform, in Afhanistan, standing next to an American flag. Nobody looks at the KISS logo and thinks that the band with multiple Jewish musicians in it are a bunch of Nazis, even though there' s the double lightning bolt S, because context is everything.
That there's simply nothing wrong with taking a logo from something when the new re-purposed form has no connection to the old usage, especially when the logo is textual and not graphical. What are you going to have an issue with next? Unit shirts? How about airwing patches? Should we get rid of battle guidons while we're at it! I mean, Old Glory and the EGA is all any unit should need, it's not fair that Victor units should have streamers units like CLB 4,569 could never get.
Various LAR groups have been using the repurposed DAK insignia since the Gulf War. Obviously the Marines in that pic are also Nazis, right?
Here's another one:
Not only does that unit patch include a totenkopf, but it also features the logo of a fictiticious terrorist organization. Clearly everyone in that unit must be terrorist Nazis that need to be drummed out of the service for being dangerously evil.
Here's two more unit patches with a variation of the totenkopf:
I guess we need to get rid of everyone in those units too.
And everyone in the 6th Division must be a racist given their preference fo the Indian head logo (maybe they're just all big Blackhawks fans).
Do you understand that when I said they were using Nazi iconography, I wasn't calling them Nazis? I mean, I know it feels good whaling away on a strawman, but come now.
It's kind of ironic you said "context is everything" and glossed over that the band KISS uses them, without mentioning it's in part of a larger word, and that Tolkein used them, without mentioning that he used the rest of the symbols from that alphabet as well.
Obviously, you know all these things already and are just pretending you don't, but I thought I'd mention it for any other readers that don't feel like doing a quick google search.
So far as "other iconography we shouldn't have our tax-payed-funded troops display while overseas", lets start with removing the ones that are most strongly associated with the people responsible for the holocaust, and go from there. Crazy talk!
I don't think we even need to get into the idea you're fumbling for that every skull is a totenkopf
even for the Dakka OT, these ideas are just pure lol
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/07/20 15:59:12
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
To pretend that any random skull is automatically a SS Totenkopf (in style or in meaning) and then act like anyone complaining about Scout Snipers using the exact same SS runes that the Nazis used should is a hypocrite if they are okay with anyone using a random skull of the logo of a cartoon nemesis is about as textbook as you can get when defining "strawman arguments". Lego should charge you for wasting Dakka bandwidth with that post.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Edit: the 45th Infantry division has an interesting example since we are on the topic of divisional insignias in our military:
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/07/20 17:00:59
)
since the Gulf War. Obviously the Marines in that pic are also Nazis, right?
