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My area had monthly WHFB day in a libarary run by a bunch of guy. always had 8+ people there. My FLGS just recruited 3 new guys that got moderate sized armies, few months later ET Khaine came out and killed it for most people. we had about 12 players up until AOS. WHFB 8th is still being played buy all but not as much with AOS going on.

Currently the few who are trying AOS gave me thier reviews from them it has positives and negatives. thay all said that you need to trust who your playing because things can get ugly if someone builds a WAAC list.

Before AoS no one was really playing Fantasy. Mostly 40k and WM/H with a bit of Flames of War and Infinity.

After AoS, well, everyone has dusted off their old Fantasy armies and is playing it and loving it, but no one is buying the AoS starter set.

A few guys were playing, not sure whether they're staying with 8th or switching to KoW.

I hadn't been playing a lot but had been buying like crazy, then stopped when AoS rumors showed up everywhere suggesting it might be something more than a ridiculous joke.

 Commissar Molotov wrote:

Lastly, I gotta say - enjoying AoS's stumbling road to failure isn't "misguided." It's absolutely DELICIOUS.

This. It's like watching that arogant and sleazy douche drink one too much, piss himself and hit every road sign on the way home. Pure fun.

I see a lot of word "rage" thrown around in relation to AoS critique but I dont think I had my pressure raised once when watching the sigmar's trainwreck, I just despise it.

WHFB was (and is) the main game at our club. We've had a few let's-see-what-the-fuzz-is-about AoS games, but so far not much traction.

We're holding an 8th edition tournament end of the month, so at least in this neck of the woods it's like AoS never happened.

Bede19025 wrote:
In reading the thread "AoS; How well is it doing in your Area" I noted the misguided glee of those who don't like AoS.

I don't get it? wasn't the thread just asking how well its doing. Is it everyone's fault if they answered its doing poorly? I mean I went to two different stores in busy city centers and saw the AoS area void of people, boxes still on shelves and some of the stuff even put to one side to make way for more 40k. I guess that means I too took glee in answering honestly because it wasn't praise? im confused.

As for the topic I only went to one gaming club but fantasy was pretty big there, about half and half the tables were 40k and fantasy and sometimes there would be three large fantasy battles going on at one time. so it was pretty active, haven't been recently though so I couldn't comment on if they accepted AoS

It was dead. Never once seen a game played in any shop round my way. AoS on the other hand has reinvigorated fantasy to the point that is all that's being played

It was deader than dead. I've not seen a WHFB game played locally in god knows how long. Most stores that sell any volume of it basically sell a bunch of stuff to a tiny number of regulars.

We actually had a campaign and an escalation league going on with about 12 players. Prior to that, it had been maybe 2-3 games every 6 months.

It wasn't dead, just most people played WMH. Fantasy does take a long time to set up.

Last time I went to Warhammer World only place I can get WHFB games, there was about 15 WHFB players. The rest (majority of) the gaming hall were 40k. Some of the WHFB group were trying out AoS after their fantasy game but nobody took it as WHFB replacement. More like a quick side game that wasnt taken seriously. A silly experiment. Didn't see any sigmarines. Although that was 3 weeks ago so that may have changed somewhat. Doubt it though. Isn't dead where I play, cos these guys, typically have at least 5k fantasy armies, some have multiple armies of massive size.

My personal observations:

WHFB had been dead or largely so for a couple of years. The core 8E rules themselves weren't actually that bad, there were a couple issues with Steadfast, but the bigger issues were with Magic being ridiculous, though there had always been something like that in every edition of Warhammer ever.

However, the way they interacted with the subsequently released 8E army books and the types of units GW was pushing (big monsters) coupled with the high cost of books and models, the "more and bigger" syndrome, simply drove the game out of the price range of new players, and beyond the interest of old players and their ability to "keep up". The game strangled itself. 8E seemed to be going fairly strong through about the first half of 2011, and then seemed to drop off until by the end of 2012 and into 2013 it had largely died out.

Age of Sigmar hasn't taken off either. There's been a few people trotting out their old stuff just to try out the new rules, but nobody seems interested in using any of the AoS-specific models for anything but 40K proxies, and nobody seems to be coming back for more games of AoS after trying it out once or twice. Feels very "dead on arrival".

On one level, I have to respect at least part of the attempt. The method of using the existing conflicts with the End Times series and allowing them to culminate in a suitably Grimdark ending where the bad guys win, in order to create a new paradigm for the reboot, I thought was pretty neat. However, none of the new fluff is particularly interesting, the new "order" faction just feels like Space Marines hamfistedly transplanted into a very "paint by numbers" high fantasy setting where a lot of the old defining Warhammer universe traits no longer apply. There's no connection to a living world anymore. On top of a somewhat uninspiring setting, the rules are very messy and open to abuse, with zero attempt at any sort of balance, but no real good attempt at coherent narrative structure either.

WHFB was largely dead in most of my experience for the last probably two and a half or three years, and AoS is failing to restart dead WHFB communities. Not sure if it's just too far gone to recover or AoS just isn't the right solution or what, but Fantasy has been dead for a while and doesn't appear to be coming back in any big way.

Indeed. I think what killed Fantasy was the high entry cost, and the more cerebral nature of the ruleset not appealing to the lesser attention span of newer(typically younger) players.

Of course, GW misread the que and did the wrong thing to try and revitalize the game.

Yeah, and not only the monetary cost, but the time & effort invested into painting endless ranks of near identical ranked weeny infantry, who were there literally just for Steadfast, made the effort of "completing" an army very difficult. I can't recall the last time I saw a fully painted WHFB army, I think it was 2010 to be honest...

Yeah, but nothing looks as awesome as a fully painted Fantasy army either. Its tedious, but boy is it a grand sight.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Yeah, but nothing looks as awesome as a fully painted Fantasy army either. Its tedious, but boy is it a grand sight.

Indeed!

Aye, they're gorgeous, but so tedious. I never got my Fantasy army fully painted.

Another thing that just popped into my head, all those impressive big new models were also a gigantic pain in the ass to paint. I mean, they looked impressive, but painting something like a Skaven Bell, Mortis Engine/Coven Throne, or Nagash is a nightmare that takes forever.

 Vaktathi wrote:
My personal observations:

WHFB had been dead or largely so for a couple of years. The core 8E rules themselves weren't actually that bad, there were a couple issues with Steadfast, but the bigger issues were with Magic being ridiculous, though there had always been something like that in every edition of Warhammer ever.

However, the way they interacted with the subsequently released 8E army books and the types of units GW was pushing (big monsters) coupled with the high cost of books and models, the "more and bigger" syndrome, simply drove the game out of the price range of new players, and beyond the interest of old players and their ability to "keep up". The game strangled itself. 8E seemed to be going fairly strong through about the first half of 2011, and then seemed to drop off until by the end of 2012 and into 2013 it had largely died out.

Age of Sigmar hasn't taken off either. There's been a few people trotting out their old stuff just to try out the new rules, but nobody seems interested in using any of the AoS-specific models for anything but 40K proxies, and nobody seems to be coming back for more games of AoS after trying it out once or twice. Feels very "dead on arrival".

On one level, I have to respect at least part of the attempt. The method of using the existing conflicts with the End Times series and allowing them to culminate in a suitably Grimdark ending where the bad guys win, in order to create a new paradigm for the reboot, I thought was pretty neat. However, none of the new fluff is particularly interesting, the new "order" faction just feels like Space Marines hamfistedly transplanted into a very "paint by numbers" high fantasy setting where a lot of the old defining Warhammer universe traits no longer apply. There's no connection to a living world anymore. On top of a somewhat uninspiring setting, the rules are very messy and open to abuse, with zero attempt at any sort of balance, but no real good attempt at coherent narrative structure either.

WHFB was largely dead in most of my experience for the last probably two and a half or three years, and AoS is failing to restart dead WHFB communities. Not sure if it's just too far gone to recover or AoS just isn't the right solution or what, but Fantasy has been dead for a while and doesn't appear to be coming back in any big way.

Good post.

We weren't that big here on big units though heh. It was nice to have the option to field a horde with solid bonus but in the end was rarely used tbh.

What is worst about AoS is the wasted opportunity. Starting fresh without a burden of multiple army books, they could have introduced an amazing ruleset. Instead they made AoS.

In my area, which comprised of several stores, I basically hadn't seen a game of WHFB played until around the time of The End Times started releasing. Prior to the End Times, there were maybe 3 or 4 games played in the weeks after 8th released. Before 8th, there was a very rare game of 7th being played, maybe 2-3 times per year. Contrast this to a 6 games of 40k being played simultaneously on those same nights, and it gives you a pretty good idea of how little action fantasy got.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Aye, they're gorgeous, but so tedious. I never got my Fantasy army fully painted.

Another thing that just popped into my head, all those impressive big new models were also a gigantic pain in the ass to paint. I mean, they looked impressive, but painting something like a Skaven Bell, Mortis Engine/Coven Throne, or Nagash is a nightmare that takes forever.

Wasn't sure how many people out there are like me, but I don't even like painting characters, let alone the highly detailed monsters/machines. I enjoy painting blocks of simple guys, maybe mostly because I'm not the greatest painter in general and like to keep it basic.

One thing I like about AoS is it seems to discourage using stand-in models. I always hated using stand-ins, but I understood it when you're kind of stuck to building one army until you make it to a points threshold.

WHF was dead and buried. AoS has rekindled the fantasy side of the game and it sells well.

I mean, it wasn't played very much around here.

But it made up a total of 15% of GW's sales. That's a bigger market share than most other major companies HAVE. To throw that away is the pinnacle of idiocy and arrogance.

But then again, people will buy it anyway because the older models really are so good and full of flavour.

Dead as a doorknob since the release of 8th. We had a tourney scene a few dozens strong (and hosting international tourneys with ~100 players) and they all just dropped it like a hot potato during the first few months. The big tourney still happens once a year for international guests, but all the locals just play Flame of War or Infinity there.

Fantasy and 40k had pretty much equal numbers of players here with little overlap, although the 40k players bought a lot more stuff, but then there have been a lot more releases and codexes in recent years. AOS caused most of the WFB veterans to drop out, but it has attracted new players and 40k players who want to try out a fantasy army. Bit early to say how AOS will do over time but fantasy sales are up considerably according to the LFGS owner and local GW staff.

It varied.

When we did Regiments of Renown, we had quite a few people. But then once it got into the normal games and the local Skaven players weren't as heavily restricted as they were in Regiments...we lost players in droves.

It was all but going dead in my area, for the last year it was mostly just the same two Fantasy players playing each other at my club every few weeks, other then someone new turning up for a one off game, then never appearing again every other month.

We did have a period where we had more serious players about 18 months back but they were more competitive mindset and quickly got bored of our hobbyist style club.

Its still not dominant at my club, BloodBowl is king as always, although we now have 5 regular Fantasy players and growing, the local stores, one is a GW store, the other a mostly Magic the Gathering dominated store are selling a lot more Fantasy then they did in the past from what i have been told and seen for myself.

We had a nice active group - 4-8 players on whfb night, more on tournament days. There was always someone to find and play! AoS has been a tough sell as most of the group has been playing whfb for many editions. We are trying to make it work, the SDK point system has made a smoother transition. Though the group is now playing both games

I live in a very small town in Ohio, and primarily shop at a jack of all trades games and comic shop.

Prior to AoS, the fantasy section had stopped updating some time ago. The same dusty boxes have been in place for ages - a lot of it good stuff, some of it really old stuff (Like the Great Unclean one in pewter with a proper face) but nothing from the last year or two. I think so little sold, they stopped carrying the new releases. In contrast, the 40k section remains fresh, with new releases turning up in small amounts.

Nothing seems to have changed with AoS, but then again I think I bought the only copy they bothered stocking. I can't help but feel like, should they stock those $50 Stormcast boxes, they will literally never move, and will be there like that Great Unclean One, endlessly awaiting a war that never comes.

The only other shop in my immediate area is more of a gaming club that grew to become a store, and in their case I feel like they either expected a huge influx of players, or GW forced copies on them, because they have far and away more starter sets of AoS than any other game in the place, stacked in columns around the 40k and Fantasy area.

In the bigger city nearby, I imagine it's doing better, if only because those shops tend to offer discounts, while my smaller vendors put MSRP on their boxes.

Fantasy was dying around here (I was always a 40k player). The 40k tournaments were healthy and full, the fantasy tournaments were sparse and had fewer players with every edition and month.

From a FLGS standpoint:

Around here a few fantasy players have joined the AOS bandwagon. A good amount of 40k players have jumped on board, and I have seen several new players/gamers join the hobby with this game (free rules, play what you want, etc). Overall it has rejuvenated the fantasy hobby around here even if the naysayers say otherwise.

From a home gaming standpoint:

We have a large gaming network of friends who have tables and game at eachother's homes rather than FLGS (more relaxed, can drink beer if one wants, don't have to get babysitters for the kids, etc). It was the same with fantasy being dead and 40k was very healthy along with miniature board games, rpg's, and card games. AOS has exploded in this scene. Most of the friend's play AOS. Their wives have actually joined due to the simplicity and speed of games (they never wanted to try to learn 40k). Some of their older kids are joining for the same reasons (simplicity of learning to play, fast games, cool models, etc).

Overall I think this will be a big success, although I hope they don't change 40k to this format (diversity of game styles is good).

Fantasy was dead in both my areas, (Richmond, VA and northern Utah) and AOS is just as dead.
In VA it's 40k, WMH, Infinity and a bunch of other games mixed in.
In northern Utah it's 40k, WMH, Hero Clix (for some reason I can't fathom) and Infinity.
Fantasy, old or AOS might as well not exist.

I live in a very rural area and have a group of about 11 players.

Fantasy was the second most played game after WM/H, with 3 other players just starting to pick it up.