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I've seen people say tau aren't in a good spot, and that competitively they're lackluster. I also see people say they're op and unfair to play against whilst also tabling people all the time. Can someone explain to me where they stand and why tau seem to be both lacking and op at the same time?

Because there WERE op during early sixth, but seventh shut down tau's op combo.


Fact is that beyond a single fire Base formation, tau don't even make an appearance in higher tables of big competitions, let alone won anything.

Heck, even orks and nids who are considered generally poor, are doing better for n scores.

Tau in 6th ed were the big dogs, and the Riptide+Missileside combo was quite potent for tabling enemies. Their best opponent is also Power Armored Folks, which make up like 90% of the armies people play casually since SMs are so popular.

So between those thoughts tau are considered really strong because they are easy to build a strong list for casual play.

That's why in casual play Eldar and Tau are quite often hated on.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BoomWolf wrote:
Because there WERE op during early sixth, but seventh shut down tau's op combo.


Fact is that beyond a single fire Base formation, tau don't even make an appearance in higher tables of big competitions, let alone won anything.

Heck, even orks and nids who are considered generally poor, are doing better for n scores.

Except, you know, the most recent top level ITC tournament, where Tau and FSE made it to top 8.

Tau has the Firebase Support Cadre (which is really good).
Apart from that, they have a couple good choice, but nothing crazy.

They were boring to play against in 6th, but in 7th, they feel more balance, and fun to play against, especially in Maelstorm (because it will force the Tau to build more mobile squad, and they are decent at it and fun to play with and against in those scenario)

If you face a firebase on a parking lot then sure, they are OP. If there's actual terrain to block some LOS and you can get close enough to shoot/charge (depending on your army) they're easy pickings. The Tau army works on units supporting each other - people cry about markerlights increasing BS or taking away cover saves but fail to notice that those ML units are usually very soft. And ofc, if the "too cheap" Riptide does stuff while supported by ML Pathfinder teams you really should count those Pathfinders into the cost of the Riptide shouldn't you? Take them out and the Tau are crippled. People also cry about special wargear that allow interceptor - but it's rare and the Tau might not even want to use it since they can't boost the shots with markerlights.

Most people that scream OP are still butthurt from 6th. But they are not bad at all. Upper mid still. BAO was last week (?) and tau took 4th. That's pretty strong showing still.

Most Tau and Necrons lists are like magic combo decks. They aren't interactive at all for the other player. It doesn't matter what the other army has, the strategy doesn't change. That's the main reason people tend to dislike playing them.

If you haven't played against magic combo decks, it's something like:
-you get 4-7 turns to kill the opponent past a small token defense.
-on one of his turns in the 4-7 range, if he's still alive, he will suddenly tell you that you lost.

As for being OP, the typical tau list tears people up in flgs games, where people try to run khorne berserkers in rhinos and the Sanguinor and junk like that. Middle-table and higher tourney lists is where they start getting wrecked though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hawkeye888 wrote:
Most people that scream OP are still butthurt from 6th. But they are not bad at all. Upper mid still. BAO was last week (?) and tau took 4th. That's pretty strong showing still.

A strong showing, but one high placing in one 5 round event is not significant data. Izzy's list is also farsight enclave with a bunch of crisis suits + firebase formation, not standard tau codex junk.

In tournaments... no tau are not op, but that is because most tournaments nerf and limt what units you can bring.

In non competitive games... Yes and no. I say yes because they could use the FW units(decent to good) and can wreck elder and Ravenwing bike list and anything else if the list uses certain units. No, because it depends on how a player uses them, and everyone has a different experience. Look through this thread and you can tell who here has a negative experience and who has a positive(some are obvious).

Fun list to use is Fist of fury in non competitive matches. Once used to be the most OP thing tau had , but now it can catch you off guard but wont work as well the 2nd+ time.

niv-mizzet wrote:
Most Tau and Necrons lists are like magic combo decks. They aren't interactive at all for the other player. It doesn't matter what the other army has, the strategy doesn't change. That's the main reason people tend to dislike playing them.

If you haven't played against magic combo decks, it's something like:
-you get 4-7 turns to kill the opponent past a small token defense.
-on one of his turns in the 4-7 range, if he's still alive, he will suddenly tell you that you lost.

As for being OP, the typical tau list tears people up in flgs games, where people try to run khorne berserkers in rhinos and the Sanguinor and junk like that. Middle-table and higher tourney lists is where they start getting wrecked though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hawkeye888 wrote:
Most people that scream OP are still butthurt from 6th. But they are not bad at all. Upper mid still. BAO was last week (?) and tau took 4th. That's pretty strong showing still.

A strong showing, but one high placing in one 5 round event is not significant data. Izzy's list is also farsight enclave with a bunch of crisis suits + firebase formation, not standard tau codex junk.

Yeah, F those people, running what they enjoy instead of at the very least a mid-tier competitive list from the internet. When will they learn?

But yeah, the combo-deck comparison is pretty dang accurate. Scatbike/Dspam Eldar is the same way.

Jaxler wrote:
I've seen people say tau aren't in a good spot, and that competitively they're lackluster. I also see people say they're op and unfair to play against whilst also tabling people all the time. Can someone explain to me where they stand and why tau seem to be both lacking and op at the same time?

Take away their marker lights, and they are IG without the Leman Russ' or orders system.

Tau are a shooty army in a shooty edition. Furthermore, they tend toward a gunline style of play, which can be very boring to play against.

However, Tau suffer in terms of rapid mobility. Maelstrom hurts them significantly. As others have said, their shooting is powerful, but reliant on markerlights to be effective. Kill the markerlights and their long-range firepower and they crumple like wet paper.

I think one of the problems is also that most people don't KNOW the tau codex. It can come as a surprise when your careful maneuver suddenly offers less cover, and the enemy has higher ballistic skill than you thought.

For Imperial and chaos, most players know what the units are capable of.

If you don't play or fight tau often, it's easy to be taken off guard by their unique special rules.

 zgort wrote:
I think one of the problems is also that most people don't KNOW the tau codex. It can come as a surprise when your careful maneuver suddenly offers less cover, and the enemy has higher ballistic skill than you thought.

For Imperial and chaos, most players know what the units are capable of.

If you don't play or fight tau often, it's easy to be taken off guard by their unique special rules.

People can know the Tau codex all they want, it's simply a case of Tau ignore the main game rules.

People aren't necessarily used to charging a lone unit and then getting Overwatched at BS3+(depending on how many Markerlights hit from a unit providing Supporting Fire with Markerlights at BS1) by multiple units with some serious fire power that are within a certain distance of the unit being charged.

Tau Empire? No

Farsight Enclaves? Can be pretty damn good with a TE detachment.

In a recent tournament a FSE/TE army took fourth. Which is pretty darn good given how old both our dexes are. TE alone is pretty okay.

Tau just have many shenanigans as other armies, including Imperium of Man armies which in my experience are the ones that are the most vocal when it comes to the silly "Tau are OP" complaint. Especially with the release of the latest Imperium Codex's, Mechanicum, Space Marines & Dark Angels. All have the tools necessary to absolutely mess up Tau, Eldar and other Xenos forces quite nicely.

Tau are not op, yes they have some great Models, but in all reality they are only good if the player knows how to use each model and tactic properly and to a T other than that any half-competent player can eradicate a Tau firing line as tau are horrendous in Melee. Most people complain because in competitive you will see things like riptides and missilesides which are the Tau's best attribute once those are dead even a swarm of cultists can finish the rest of the tau army on their own.

Also I would like to add that I see a lot of people complaining about our markerlights. For gods sake people for one we are BS3 standard Most armies are 4 and 5 so there is that for you, and second you can't fire markerlights into overwatch unless you have a marker unit within 6" of other unit being overwatched and this can only overwatch once and each markerlight must hit on a 6 THEN ANOTHER unit can use those markerlights the only other exception to this rule is the counterfire defense system which is 5pts PER model and you must sacrifice another upgrade slot to even take it and it only raises your BS by 1. So please for all of you haters learn to play and stop complaining about markerlights.

 Kanluwen wrote:

People can know the Tau codex all they want, it's simply a case of Tau ignore the main game rules.

People aren't necessarily used to charging a lone unit and then getting Overwatched at BS3+(depending on how many Markerlights hit from a unit providing Supporting Fire with Markerlights at BS1) by multiple units with some serious fire power that are within a certain distance of the unit being charged.

I'm not convinced that higher overwatch is a game breaker (said the DA player haha). You still can only overwatch once per turn, so maybe a little strategy will be required. If they are not used to tau overwatch, they don't know the codex, that was my point.

Also consider tau have NO psychic phase and most are absolutely awful in CC. Play to their weaknesses.

Is the sky blue?
Yes Tau are OP. Their whole codex is OP. (With the exception of maybe Shadowsun).

I'm not saying that Tau is the only thing that's OP in 40k, I'm just saying that they're in general, the most OP codex as a whole.

 zgort wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

People can know the Tau codex all they want, it's simply a case of Tau ignore the main game rules.

People aren't necessarily used to charging a lone unit and then getting Overwatched at BS3+(depending on how many Markerlights hit from a unit providing Supporting Fire with Markerlights at BS1) by multiple units with some serious fire power that are within a certain distance of the unit being charged.

I'm not convinced that higher overwatch is a game breaker. You still can only overwatch once per turn, so maybe a little strategy will be required. If they are not used to tau overwatch, they don't know the codex, that was my point.

I can know all the statlines that I want to, it doesn't mean I remember that they can Overwatch to support an Overwatch or that they can get Markerlights to Overwatch and then boost up their other Overwatches.

And quite frankly, "only Overwatching once per turn" isn't exactly a weakness for Tau. Not when you're talking about people setting their army up in a legitimate "gunline" where everything is more or less within range to use Supporting Fire.

Also consider tau have NO psychic phase and most are absolutely awful in CC. Play to their weaknesses.

Speaking as someone playing Skitarii, the no Psychic Phase doesn't matter. And CC? My assault units are too expensive to be sending in for charges outside of anything but the Sicarian Kill-Clade formation where I can debuff BS,WS,I, and LD in a 12" bubble around the Infiltrators and can have all of the Ruststalkers Move, Run, then Charge once per game past turn 1.

It's also not helped by the fact that Tau have a rather large abundance of weaponry that doubles out T3...

 Farseer Uruvion wrote:
Is the sky blue?
Yes Tau are OP. Their whole codex is OP. (With the exception of maybe Shadowsun).

I'm not saying that Tau is the only thing that's OP in 40k, I'm just saying that they're in general, the most OP codex as a whole.

Yes, because giving Move Through Cover, Stealth, and Shrouded to any unit isn't good or anything. Everything ELSE is the problem with that codex. Ee gads.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 zgort wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

People can know the Tau codex all they want, it's simply a case of Tau ignore the main game rules.

People aren't necessarily used to charging a lone unit and then getting Overwatched at BS3+(depending on how many Markerlights hit from a unit providing Supporting Fire with Markerlights at BS1) by multiple units with some serious fire power that are within a certain distance of the unit being charged.

I'm not convinced that higher overwatch is a game breaker. You still can only overwatch once per turn, so maybe a little strategy will be required. If they are not used to tau overwatch, they don't know the codex, that was my point.

I can know all the statlines that I want to, it doesn't mean I remember that they can Overwatch to support an Overwatch or that they can get Markerlights to Overwatch and then boost up their other Overwatches.

And quite frankly, "only Overwatching once per turn" isn't exactly a weakness for Tau. Not when you're talking about people setting their army up in a legitimate "gunline" where everything is more or less within range to use Supporting Fire.

Also consider tau have NO psychic phase and most are absolutely awful in CC. Play to their weaknesses.

Speaking as someone playing Skitarii, the no Psychic Phase doesn't matter. And CC? My assault units are too expensive to be sending in for charges outside of anything but the Sicarian Kill-Clade formation where I can debuff BS,WS,I, and LD in a 12" bubble around the Infiltrators and can have all of the Ruststalkers Move, Run, then Charge once per game past turn 1.

It's also not helped by the fact that Tau have a rather large abundance of weaponry that doubles out T3...

I support this.

Not anymore. The more recent codices really outshine them. Not saying they are weak but they are definitely not top dog anymore with the advent of all the "decarons."

Depends. If you have Eldar, Space marines, Dark Angels or Necrons your fighting at their level.

If you have anything else then you are well and truly f*cked.

 Farseer Uruvion wrote:
Is the sky blue?
Yes Tau are OP. Their whole codex is OP. (With the exception of maybe Shadowsun).

I'm not saying that Tau is the only thing that's OP in 40k, I'm just saying that they're in general, the most OP codex as a whole.

This is coming from an Eldar player. I lol'd.

Then again I dunno, I mean you are playing the most broken army in the game, so you'd probably know all about what it means to be OP.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Farseer Uruvion wrote:
Is the sky blue?
Yes Tau are OP. Their whole codex is OP. (With the exception of maybe Shadowsun).

I'm not saying that Tau is the only thing that's OP in 40k, I'm just saying that they're in general, the most OP codex as a whole.

This is coming from an Eldar player. I lol'd.

Then again I dunno, I mean you are playing the most broken army in the game, so you'd probably know all about what it means to be OP.

I'm not saying Eldar aren't OP. I'm saying Tau are the most OP.

 Farseer Uruvion wrote:
Is the sky blue?
Yes Tau are OP. Their whole codex is OP. (With the exception of maybe Shadowsun).

I'm not saying that Tau is the only thing that's OP in 40k, I'm just saying that they're in general, the most OP codex as a whole.

Er, lulwhut?

Not even close mate. Necrons and CWE do a number on Tau.

 Farseer Uruvion wrote:
I'm not saying Eldar aren't OP. I'm saying Tau are the most OP.

Except you're wrong.

 Sidstyler wrote:

 Farseer Uruvion wrote:
I'm not saying Eldar aren't OP. I'm saying Tau are the most OP.

Except you're wrong.

This will keep going on and on and on. You support Space Communist Fish people and nothing I say will change that. It's useless to try and argue with you.

I can sometimes beat them with BA. That should tell right there that they aren't OP.

The top 4 (OVERALL) OP codexs are:
Tau
Eldar
Necrons and;
Space Marines

No argument about it. You pick anything in the Tau codex and it is strong, with most options being OP. Riptides being the worst.