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2015/08/10 07:20:38
Subject: Someone at WHFB tries fixing AoS. Could Apply to AoS40k.
Well. Normally I don't bother with WHFB, but this caught my eye:
utrage wrote: I've developed an algorithm to derive point values for all units in the Age of Sigmar universe. It is a combination of Attack Rating against movement ability combined with Special Ability Rating. It is a fairly complex model, so I wont go into the details but I've played a few games and have had good results with balancing. Please feel free to use the point values below and comment on your results of balancing or just let me know your thoughts in general. Thanks. I don't have all the armies completed, just six (Bretonnia, Empire, Dwarfs, Warriors of Chaos, Vampire Counts, and High Elves).
Spoiler:
Bretonnian Army
Bretonnia Men-At-Arms 12
Bretonnia Peasant Bowmen 12
Bretonnia Battle Pilgrims 21
Bretonnia Knights Errant 41
Bretonnia Knights of the Realm 43
Bretonnia Questing Knights 43
Bretonnia Grail Knights 44
Bretonnia Mounted Yeomen 48
Bretonnia Pegasus Knights 97
Bretonnia Damsel of the Lady 186
Bretonnia Paladin 195
Bretonnia Paladin Standard Bearer 204
Bretonnia Field Trebuchet 221
Bretonnia Bretonnian Lord 250
Bretonnia Green Knight 301
Bretonnia Fay Enchantress 362
Bretonnia Louen Leoncouer 537
Empire Army
Empire Empire Free Company 8
Empire Empire Archers 11
Empire Empire Crossbowmen 12
Empire Empire State Troops 13
Empire Empire Handgunners 15
Empire Empire Flagellants Warband 26
Empire Empire Greatswords 27
Empire Empire Pistoliers 35
Empire Empire Knights 38
Empire Empire Outriders 39
Empire Reiksguard Knights 40
Empire Demigryph Knights 87
Empire Empire Mortar 119
Empire Hellblaster Volley Gun 147
Empire Helstorm Rocket Battery 160
Empire Battle Wizard 160
Empire Witch Hunter 166
Empire Empire Master Engineer 174
Empire Master Engineer on Steed 181
Empire Markus Wulfhart 181
Empire Empire Cannon 182
Empire Warrior Priest 187
Empire Volkmar the Grim 191
Empire Grand Master Heirloom 193
Empire Luthor Huss 196
Empire Kurt Helborg 218
Empire Empire General 218
Empire Ludwig Schwarzheim 226
Empire Balthasar Gelt 264
Empire Valten 265
Empire Marius Leitdorf 278
Empire Luminark of Hysh Beam of Light 477
Empire War Altar of Sigmar with Volkmar Light 494
Empire Amber Wizard on Griffon 502
Empire General on Griffon 526
Empire Empire Steam Tank 527
Empire Celestial Hurricanum 558
Empire Karl Franz Runefang 735
High Elf Army
High Elves High Elf Archers 11
High Elves Lothern Sea Guard 14
High Elves High Elfmen 15
High Elves Shadow Warriors 29
High Elves Masters of Hoeth 30
High Elves White Lions of Chrace 30
High Elves Sisters of Averlon 31
High Elves Phoenix Guard 37
High Elves Silver Helms 38
High Elves Dragon Princes of Caledor 41
High Elves Ellyrian Reavers 42
High Elves Great Eagles 162
High Elves Tiranoc Chariotss 178
High Elves Korhil 182
High Elves High Elf Mage 189
High Elves Anointed of Asuryan 193
High Elves Handmaiden of the Everqueen 198
High Elves Loremaster of Hoeth 210
High Elves White Lion Chariotss 213
High Elves Lothern Sea Helm 222
High Elves Caradryan 232
High Elves Repeater Bolt Thrower Ithilmar 238
High Elves High Elf Prince Reaver 245
High Elves Alarielle The Radiant 275
High Elves Prince Althran 278
High Elves Lothern Skycutter 290
High Elves Teclis Moon 307
High Elves Lothern Sea Helm on Skycutter 342
High Elves Alith Anar, The Shadow King 344
High Elves High Elf Prince on Griffon 379
High Elves Tyrion Sunfang 390
High Elves Flamespyre Phoenix 535
High Elves Eltharion on Stormwing 542
High Elves Frostheart Phoenix 570
High Elves Archmage on Dragon 603
High Elves Dragon Mage Sunstaff 608
High Elves Prince Imrik, Dragonlord 627
High Elves High Elf Prince on Dragon 640
Warriors of Chaos Army
Warriors of Chaos Marauders of Chaos 12
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Warhounds 16
Warriors of Chaos Warriors of Chaos 20
Warriors of Chaos Forsaken 32
Warriors of Chaos Marauder Horsemen 33
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Familiars 43
Warriors of Chaos Hellstriders of Slaanesh 49
Warriors of Chaos Wrathmongers 53
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Knights 55
Warriors of Chaos Putrid Blightkings 56
Warriors of Chaos Skullreapers Gore-slick 59
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Trolls Vomit 86
Warriors of Chaos Skullcrushers of Khorne 99
Warriors of Chaos Dragon Ogres 118
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Spawn 157
Warriors of Chaos Exalted Hero with Battle Standard 176
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Lord of Slaanesh 207
Warriors of Chaos Crom the Conquerer 223
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Chariots 224
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Lord 225
Warriors of Chaos Skarr Bloodwrath 227
Warriors of Chaos Wulfrik the Wanderer 240
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Sorcerer Lord 247
Warriors of Chaos Tzeentch Sorcerer Lord 249
Warriors of Chaos Lammasu 249
Warriors of Chaos Nurgle Chaos Sorcerer 258
Warriors of Chaos Khorne Exalted Hero 259
Warriors of Chaos Sigvald The Magnificent 268
Warriors of Chaos Nurgle Chaos Lord 276
Warriors of Chaos Gutrot Spume 278
Warriors of Chaos Vilitch the Curseling 282
Warriors of Chaos Great Taurus Fire 284
Warriors of Chaos Festus The Leechlord 285
Warriors of Chaos Gorebest Chariots 286
Warriors of Chaos Scyla Anfingrimm Fists 286
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Lord on Daemonic Mount 286
Warriors of Chaos Nurgle Lord on Daemonic Mount 287
Warriors of Chaos Throgg Vomit 288
Warriors of Chaos Valkia The Bloody 295
Warriors of Chaos Lord of Slaanesh on Daemonic mount 295
Warriors of Chaos Daemon Prince Nurgle 296
Warriors of Chaos Daemon Prince Cursed 311
Warriors of Chaos Daemon Prince Khorne 311
Warriors of Chaos Daemon Prince Slaanesh 311
Warriors of Chaos Tzeentch Chaos Lord on Disc of Tzeentch 318
Warriors of Chaos Daemon Prince Tzeentch 361
Warriors of Chaos Khorne Lord on Juggernaut 362
Warriors of Chaos Cockatrice 394
Warriors of Chaos Giant 412
Warriors of Chaos Hellcannon 436
Warriors of Chaos Slaughterbrute 436
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore 444
Warriors of Chaos Mutalith Vortex 447
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Warshrine 452
Warriors of Chaos Be'lakor, Choas Daemon Prince 452
Warriors of Chaos Dragon Ogre Shaggoth 464
Warriors of Chaos Chaos Lord on Manticore 482
Warriors of Chaos Bloab Rotspawned 483
Warriors of Chaos Orghotts Daemonspew 553
Warriors of Chaos Galrauch 561
Warriors of Chaos Chimera 583
Warriors of Chaos Archaon, The Everchosen Slayer 585
Warriors of Chaos Morbidex Twiceborn 590
Warriors of Chaos The Glottkin 783
Vampire Counts Army
Vampire Counts Zombies 17
Vampire Counts Skeleton Warriors 20
Vampire Counts Crypt Ghouls 22
Vampire Counts Grave Guard 39
Vampire Counts Dire Wolves 42
Vampire Counts Black Knights 47
Vampire Counts Blood Knights 59
Vampire Counts Hexwraiths 65
Vampire Counts Fell Bats 92
Vampire Counts Spirit Hosts 103
Vampire Counts Vargheists 108
Vampire Counts Crypt Horrors 114
Vampire Counts Corpse Cart 172
Vampire Counts Necromancer 194
Vampire Counts Wight King 228
Vampire Counts Cairn Wraith 235
Vampire Counts Tomb Banshee 240
Vampire Counts Black Coach 260
Vampire Counts Vampire Lord 265
Vampire Counts Konrad Von Carstein 282
Vampire Counts Krell, Lord of the Undeath 296
Vampire Counts Morghast Harbingers 300
Vampire Counts Morghast Archai 303
Vampire Counts Isabella Von Carstein 303
Vampire Counts Bat Swarms 307
Vampire Counts Strigoi Ghoul King 315
Vampire Counts Heinrich Kemmler, The Lichemaster 344
Vampire Counts Vampire Lord on Abyssal Terror 356
Vampire Counts Count Mannfred 361
Vampire Counts Vlad Von Carstein 382
Vampire Counts Varghulf 384
Vampire Counts Mortis Engine 400
Vampire Counts Coven Throne 475
Vampire Counts Neferata, Mortarch of Blood 591
Vampire Counts Arkhan the Black 642
Vampire Counts Mannfred, Mortarch of Night 674
Vampire Counts Terrorgheist 760
Vampire Counts Zombie Dragon 776
Vampire Counts Nagash, Supreme Lord of the Undead 997
Total Points = Round(Total Attack Rating + Other Rating)/(((Minimum # of Models in the unit)+1)/2),0)
Total Attack Rating = (Attack Rating Weapon 1 + Attack Rating Weapon 2 + ....)*10
Attack Rating Weapon # = ((((Model Movement/12)+(Range of Weapon)/12))*(# of Attacks)*((7-(To Hit))/6)*((7-(To Wound))/6)*(Damage))*(6/(6-(Rend)))
Other Rating = (7-(Save))*10+(bravery)*2+(Wounds)*20+Special Ability Rating
Special Ability Rating = (Enhancements)*5+(Specials)*10+(Super)*25+(Ultra)*50
I have multiplied the ratings by factors to add arbitrary weights as I deemed appropriate for balancing (example: 20 points per Wound)
I have arbitrarily on personal opinion weighted each individual model's Special Abilities and weighted each one for the Special Ability Rating
Future use reference of the above Point System should be referred to as the Texas Point System.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I have also been looking into a progressive Wound Point Rating to put more weight on High Wound Models than just 20 points per wound, for instance:
I think this would better the rate the toughness to kill individual models with more wounds compared to low wound models.
"But Selym, this is for AoS, why post it in 40k General?" Good question. The answer is that Age of Emprah (40k's AoS) may happen in the future. It will likely have similar rules, and there has been previous speculation that Gee Dubs would intend the two games to be crossover-compatible (meaning the rules would be almost exactly the same).. One of the major issues with the AoS style of rules is that there is no balancing mechanic. One suggested method was simply to have the same number of wounds as your opponent, but that would lead to matchups like "100 GK Terminators vs 100 Guardsmen".
I have no idea how effective it would be in AoS or potentially Age of Emprah, but it looks like a good start, should the worst happen. All you'd need to do is reach a consensus on how to make the silly rules less silly, add some points, and Gee Dubs may be on to something.
2015/08/10 07:34:35
Subject: Someone at WHFB tries fixing AoS. Could Apply to AoS40k.
There is no reason they would "AoS-ify" 40k because is there biggest seller as is by a ton. It alone is half of their revenue. WHFB was dead and needed to be rebooted. 40K does not.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/10 07:34:51
2015/08/10 07:35:13
Subject: Someone at WHFB tries fixing AoS. Could Apply to AoS40k.
Selym wrote: I'm not saying its a certainty, but this is a suggestion if the worst happens.
If it happens I don't know if I will play 40k anymore, personally I enjoy AoS but I like the fact that it is different from 40k and that 40k is different from AoS. Two different games that play differently is much better then two games that play the same with just different models involved.
19th Krieg Siege Army 7500pts.
40k/HH Night Lords 5000pts.
Orks Waaaghmacht Spearhead 2500pts.
2015/08/10 11:28:44
Subject: Someone at WHFB tries fixing AoS. Could Apply to AoS40k.
19th Krieg Siege Army 7500pts.
40k/HH Night Lords 5000pts.
Orks Waaaghmacht Spearhead 2500pts.
