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2015/08/12 13:44:47
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
Nefertiti — she’s an ancient Egyptian queen and the source of a fantastic mystery regarding the iconic remnants of long-lost royalty.
For decades, archaeologists have speculated on the location of the queen’s remains, the last royal mummy missing from the dynasty of the famous King Tutankhamun, better known as King Tut. But now, an archaeologist claims that he has found her secret tomb in the Valley of the Kings, hidden just beyond a wall near the resting place of the boy-pharaoh.
The dramatic theory, published in a paper by Nicholas Reeves of the University of Arizona, is based on an analysis of detailed scans of Tutankhamun’s tomb. The scans reveal the texture of walls beneath their layers of paint, and Reeves believes he found a number of cracks indicating two previously concealed doors.
One of these doors would possibly lead to a storeroom, Reeves said. But the larger door on the north side of the burial chamber, he suggests, could lead to another room holding the remains of Nefertiti, believed by some to be the mother of Tutankhamun.
“I have been testing the evidence ever since, looking for indications that what I thought I was seeing was, in fact, not there,” Reeves told the BBC. “But the more I looked, the more information I found that I seemed to be looking at something pretty real.”
Archaeologists have expressed cautious excitement over Reeves’s conclusion, although they have yet to embrace it fully, as expected. The theory would take many more tests to confirm, although a radar scan could quickly reveal any hollows, an archaeologist told the Economist.
“If I’m wrong, I’m wrong,” Reeves said to the Economist. “But if I’m right this is potentially the biggest archaeological discovery ever made.”
The tomb of Tutankhamun has been a puzzle for archaeologists ever since archaeologist Howard Carter famously discovered it in 1922. It is comprised of four rooms, but it’s much smaller than those of other pharaohs. Scientists have also found that it was constructed and decorated in stages.
Foreign diplomats and Egyptologists attend the opening of an exact replica of the Tomb of Tutkankhamun in Luxor, Egypt, in 2014. The replica aims to help preserve the original, more than 3,300-year-old tomb from deterioration caused by tourist visitors. (Khalil Hamra/AP)
Carter first found it filled with thousands of priceless treasures — safe from the tomb robbers who ravaged items found in other chambers because of how well it was hidden.
To find Nefertiti would be a huge win for archaeologists, and may be able to solve some of the mysteries of King Tut’s tomb. The queen, famed for her beauty and her uniquely realistic bust at the Egyptian Museum of Berlin, served as co-regent to King Akhenaten, her husband, and may have been a pharaoh after his death. That means the contents of her tomb, if it exists, would be just as fantastic as Tutankhamum’s — perhaps even more fantastic.
Tutankhamun is believed to have only ruled for nine years, taking power only as a young boy. His remains show that he was a frail child, with buck teeth and a pronounced overbite. Thanks to rounds of royal inbreeding, he had a club foot and could only walk with a cane.
His reign was overshadowed by much more prominent pharaohs who came before him, including Ramses II, Khufu and his father Akhenaten. Still, the magnificence of the treasures found in his tomb has made it one of the most celebrated archaeological finds in the world. His famous gold funeral mask — which mysteriously depicts him more femininely than other pharaohs — is considered one of the most recognized artifacts ever.
But there’s another aspect of Egyptian archaeology that’s captured the public beyond the treasures: a mystical ancient religion, drenched in symbolism and striking imagery of the afterlife.
The gold mummy covering the body of Tutankhamun lies in the tomb of the king in the Valley of the Kings in Luxor, Egypt. (Asmaa Waguih/Reuters)
Burial customs for Egyptians were elaborate ways to ensure immortality after death, which is why bodies were preserved through mummification and laid in tombs with their riches and belongings. Their organs were removed and preserved separately in jars, and families were expected to bring food to the tombs after the burial.
There are rumors of the “Pharaoh’s Curse,” which brings bad luck to those who disturb the tombs. Twelve members of Carter’s team that opened Tutankhamun’s tomb died within seven years, including the Earl of Carnarvon, who financed the excavation, the New York Times reported in Carter’s obituary in 1939.
Carter himself died of lymphoma in his home in London, but the stories were enough to dissuade the superstitious Benito Mussolini from accepting a mummy as a gift.
There’s also the bizarre story of Dorothy Louise Eady, who served as a researcher at the Department of Egyptian Antiquities. Eady, better known as Omm Sety, openly believed that she was an ancient Egyptian priestess in a past life who had been reincarnated in the modern age.
Her beliefs, detailed in a number of biographies, were supposedly awakened in her after falling down stairs at 3 years old. She grew up dreaming about her experiences in ancient Egypt, and eventually moved to Egypt to become close friends with a number of prominent archaeologists. She made a number of Egyptological discoveries based on what she said were memories, not research.
At one point, she reportedly said she knew where the tomb of Nefertiti was located based on a conversation in another life with a pharaoh, according to a biography titled “Omm Sety’s Egypt.”
“It’s in the Valley of the Kings, and it’s quite near to the Tutankhamun tomb,” she said, according to the biography. “But it’s in a place where nobody would ever think of looking for it. And apparently it is still intact.”
Eady died in 1981 at the age of 77.
2015/08/12 14:19:39
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
The last think we need is Hawass tearing up the place on his celebrity schedule.
That prima donna doesnt have the patience for real archeology but wants milestones of excavations timed for his showcased arrivals on sites. His ego has fethed up a lot of digs.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 14:26:17
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
d-usa wrote: Maybe we can get Geraldo to report live from the excavation site!
I dont understand the reference, and googling 'Geraldo' listed some celebrities but nothing that linked.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 15:49:58
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
d-usa wrote: Maybe we can get Geraldo to report live from the excavation site!
I dont understand the reference, and googling 'Geraldo' listed some celebrities but nothing that linked.
Geraldo RIvera....
He's a reporter who was kind of big (I guess?) in the 90s, he used to seemingly do everything from location. but now he's with Faux News, and has let the crazy come out.
2015/08/12 15:53:16
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
Orlanth wrote: The last think we need is Hawass tearing up the place on his celebrity schedule.
That prima donna doesnt have the patience for real archeology but wants milestones of excavations timed for his showcased arrivals on sites. His ego has fethed up a lot of digs.
Huh?
I think you'll need to expound on that a bit?
2015/08/12 15:54:34
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
n0t_u wrote: If he doesn't the raiders probably will now after hearing this if they get the chance.
I was thinking that myself. Saying out from the blue that there may be treasure behind a concealed wall in a known location is asking for some scum to enter the tomb with a C4 charge blow through and make a quick grab of any gold they find.
There need not actually be anything there for this to be trajic. The loss of the orginal tomb decor would be loss enough.
I remember old treasure hunt books popular in the 70s which laid a trail to real buried treasure. One set of false leads led to a cemetary and the local vicar had to threaten to sue the publishers after too many people started digging up the place, and even after the publishers complied and conformed that the treasure was not buried in that cemetary, or any other, speculative digging persisted.
Pointing out the location of rumoured buried treasure in a historical tomb is not only a violation of good archeological principle , but also of common sense, all for the discovery 'kudos' or more accurately notoriety of the idiot who made the claim.
The Egyptian authorities have no choice now but to investigate the claim, and even if the site is proven void the tomb is still at risk from this point onward.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 16:00:40
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
d-usa wrote: Maybe we can get Geraldo to report live from the excavation site!
I dont understand the reference, and googling 'Geraldo' listed some celebrities but nothing that linked.
He is probably referring to the time Geraldo was reporting from AL Capones grave I think... or was it vault... I forget...
Yeah. There was a big ruckus over finding Al Capone's hidden vault where he supposedly hid a lot of his cash.
When they finally opened it all they found were some empty bottles of booze.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Orlanth wrote: The last think we need is Hawass tearing up the place on his celebrity schedule.
That prima donna doesnt have the patience for real archeology but wants milestones of excavations timed for his showcased arrivals on sites. His ego has fethed up a lot of digs.
Huh?
I think you'll need to expound on that a bit?
Hawass sped up a dig on a royal site forcing the sarcophagus to be opened, not when the US archeolgoical team were ready but when he was scheduled to appear fro the opening.
archeology is not to be sped up, normally it takes several months to go through a site. In the original Howard expedition the actually cataloguing and recovery took place over several years. Noone was impatient to go from the first room to the second, there was no time schedule for opening the sarcophagus or anything else, it took the time it took. This is how it was supposed to be done.
There was a documentary on a particular dig on National Geographic channel, and while it laid no finger at Hawass if you watch it you can see the absent damnation. The dig team worked at their own pace, the pace determied by the conditions and what they discovered. They weren't any way near ready to just pop the sarcophagus, but were told that on a certain date Hawass would be there, backed up bty the media to do just that. Of course this also meant that the opening itself wasn't carried over a course of several hours, a pace similar to what you might expect from bomb disposal, but was a case of in came the crane, off came the lid before the media got too impatient and then Hawass stepped in front of the camera to tell everyone how important he is and what an authority he is.
I will try and find a link to the program so you can watch it for yourself. The critique of Hawass is very subtle, and unless you understand the methodology of the science of archeology you are likely to miss it. But then National Geographic are not fools.
Franky Hawass is an egotist and is damaging to his profession a bit like the guy who did the random press release about where Nefertiti is buried, or for that matter Tony Robinson. Robinson make Hawass look like a professional, and to some extent that is true, Hawass does know his stuff, and I think he cares deeply about Egyptology, but his ego gets in the way of the science too much.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 16:11:07
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
d-usa wrote: Maybe we can get Geraldo to report live from the excavation site!
I dont understand the reference, and googling 'Geraldo' listed some celebrities but nothing that linked.
He is probably referring to the time Geraldo was reporting from AL Capones grave I think... or was it vault... I forget...
Yeah. There was a big ruckus over finding Al Capone's hidden vault where he supposedly hid a lot of his cash.
When they finally opened it all they found were some empty bottles of booze.
That's the one.
It was a two(?) hour prime time special, reporting live from the location where they were cracking open Al Capone's vault. The medical examiner was there in case they recovered the dead bodies of his enemies, and the Treasury Department was also on location to recover whatever cash and treasures he had hidden away in his secret vault. The nation watched with bated breath as Geraldo and his mustache narrated the entire event live and on location.
Concluding in the opening of the vault and the revelation that it contained some trash, and nothing else.
2015/08/12 16:25:58
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
Orlanth wrote: The last think we need is Hawass tearing up the place on his celebrity schedule.
That prima donna doesnt have the patience for real archeology but wants milestones of excavations timed for his showcased arrivals on sites. His ego has fethed up a lot of digs.
Just so you know, sarcophagus opening are normally done in 'operating theatre' conditions.
And....
The egotistical dick at work. This particular 'team' was no better than tomb robbers.
All the above links are from seperate 'indidents' of rushed archeolohgy and are entirely seperate from the text exmple I had in mind. Hawass has fethed up more digs than I actually realised.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/12 16:32:01
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 17:03:36
Subject: Re:Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
I was under the impression that the KV35YL mummy had already been demonstrated through DNA evidence to be king Tut's mother. Which would strongly imply that it is the body of Nefertiti, and that her tomb has already been found.
I don't know how conclusive the DNA evidence is. As I understand it, there was probably a lot of inbreeding amongst the royal family (not unusual with royal families), which can lead to ambiguity regarding exactly how family members are related.
2015/08/12 17:09:02
Subject: Re:Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
There was indeed a lot of sibling marriages in the Egyptian royal families.
The identity of his mother is still not certain, other than it is that particular Mummy, but Nefertiti's corpse has yet to be identified. She might be the "Younger Lady" mummy or she might be somewhere else.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/12 17:09:47
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Grey Templar wrote: There was indeed a lot of sibling marriages in the Egyptian royal families.
The identity of his mother is still not certain, other than it is that particular Mummy, but Nefertiti's corpse has yet to be identified. She might be the "Younger Lady" mummy or she might be somewhere else.
I am not holding any breath, she might not have had a proper royal burial, or any royal burial might have been redacted andc exhumed by the Ra cult.
Nefertiti was the consort of Akhanaten, who tried to impose monotheism on Egypt. It more complex than that but the comment will do to explain why the cult of Ra went to great lengths after Akhenatens death to redact all memory of the dead king. The ancient Egyptians were masters of political revision and would go to great lengths to redact unwanted history. Akhenaten's tomb was unsealed and stripped by the Egyptian authorities themselves, and not tomb robbers in this instance, due to measures to redact the kings memory.
Ironically a lot of the efforts undergone to whitewash Akhwenatens reign helps preverse it in the current age. Temples from the time of Akhenaten were dismantled and rebuilt with the outside facing stones facing in and then resculpted with fresh pictograms. This has had the effect of preserving the original text and in some cases original paint.
Anyway a royal send off for Nefertiti might not have been any form of priority for the funerary priests of the time. We don't know where Akhenaten was reburied and Nefertiti likely followed him in celestial disgrace.
Could Nefertiti be buried in a side room of the tomb, possibly. Perhaps there are rooms there containing yet undiscovered treasures liked to Tutankhamun instead, which is as likely if not more.
I also forward the hypothesis that the tomb, which was hastily converted for a Kings use due to the untimely death of Tutankhamun was itself only part complete and part excavated doorways were plastered and sealed due to time pressures. It could well be that to additional rooms were intended, but never excavated and the plan to do so was cancelled on time constraints and the central room between was converted into the burial chamber.
Poor Tut, if theee are side chambers filled with remaining Ushabti and they are removed, who will be left to serve him wine, play music to him, or wave his fan to keep him cool in the afterlife? He enjoyed his funerary gear far longer than most of his kin, but its sad in a way if you think of all this through the eyes of his people.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 19:47:51
Subject: Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
My understanding is that in Ancient Egypt, Nefertiti wasn't that important. She's famous in the modern mind because of her Bust which is one of the most well known and distributed pieces of ancient Egyptian art.
In her own life, she was just some guy's mistress and no one really like that guy much. So would she have ever really been given her own tomb?
Everyone who was anyone in Egypt wanted a proper tomb with Ushabti and the right spells and a book of the dead. It was considered ok just to take all that painted onto your coffin, but the richer you were the more you wanted.
Grave gear wasnt just an ornament like the grave swords of European tombs, they had real religious significance. To be buried without them lowered your status in the afterlife.
You are right that Nefertiti is more well known to us that she was to Egypt, excepting people living in her time.
Akhenaten was very important though, even when considered along the three millenia of history of Egyptian dynasties.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/08/12 23:45:24
Subject: Re:Archaeologist believes he may have found remains of Nefertiti
I've seen fairly compelling arguments that Tut's sarcophagus, and his headpiece, were not originally intended for him, but for a woman. There are lots of little clues (and perhaps some big clues) that point to it having been repurposed. It makes you wonder who it was originally intended for, and whether they were occupying it at the time. If it were anyone else, I'd think it absurd that they would desecrate her tomb, but Nefertiti probably wasn't the most popular person given her religion. /wild speculation.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/12 23:49:24
