Fear the Walking Dead *SPOILER ALERT* (season 2 starts on pg 11)

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**Hulksmash**

chaos0xomega wrote:
Hulksmash wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
North is still a desert, just a slightly shorter one. Shut off the water from high north and middle Cali reverts to desert in days.

Not quite true, Ventura and Santa Barbara counties along the coast are generally quite livable and in no way considered a desert even with northern water cut off (though they would take a hit now with the silted up rivers). That said it's pretty much the situation between the ocean and the mountains (which is a narrow band) in California, it's also a highly populated one.

In regards to the "military is evilz" I don't think they'll go this route. They were careful to not present it that way in TWD. Most military (or former military) have actually been shown in a pretty positive light. All evidence we've seen is that the military was trying to help until everything fell apart.

I expect it'll be more along the lines of silly bravado and over confidence on the part of the military and a "responding to late" theme. They'll get swallowed up. I mean reasonably the issue is that it's one of the most densely populated metros in the US so anything but a careful plan of how to handle a million+ zombies is something that isn't super likely to work. Especially when the government can't be seen just whole sale slaughtering people who from a distance seem fine. We've already seen that turn into a riot in this episode.

Since the government is keeping it all under wraps it can't respond in the way it would need to to be effective. At least I hope that's the direction it takes. I feel like the national guard are mostly being called in for mass riots and won't really know what's going on at the lower levels.

Do you not remember Season 1 of TWD when they show what happened to Rick in the hospital and why he didnt become Zombie Food, courtesy of Shane? The military decided to pull out/abandon the hospital, and in the process lined up patients against the wall and filled them with holes?

Yeah, about that.

Which actually finally shows the reasonable approach to the catastrophe in my opinion. That's not representing the military poorly, that's people finally realizing what they need to do to survive.

Also I don't remember that the Gov. in the show took over from soldiers but it has been a few years since woodbury so I could be wrong.

Guess we'll see in two weeks

**Shadow Captain Edithae**

In the show, Woodbury was abandoned when the Governor arrived. In the comic continuity however, the Rise of the Governor novels established that the Governor arrived at Woodbury and found it under a reign of terror by a couple National Guardsmen. The Governor snapped when...

Spoiler:

The Governor then killed the leader of the National guardsmen and intimidated the others into falling in line. And the town elected the gun toting mad man as Governor.

Philip and nine other survivors holed themselves up in apartment for an unspecified amount of time, before moving out, picking up new group members along the way, and eventually coming upon the abandoned Woodbury. As they secure the town and settle in (whilst their size continues to increase), Philip establishes a leadership role and is branded the nickname "The Governor".

http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/Philip_Blake_%28TV_Series%29#Pre-Apocalypse

**Hulksmash**

Ah, good. So I wasn't crazy. In the TV show it wasn't brought up. That's good at least

**Chute82**

anybody read the zombie survival guide by Max Brooks? I had the book until somebody broke into my locker at work and stole it ( they also stole my George Foreman grill, umbrella, and deep fryer). Great book.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zombie_survival
Back on topic

The show is alright so far, some things as other have mentioned could need some fixing. Hopefully this week we can see the reaction from the national guard, police and other first responders.

**Kanluwen**

chaos0xomega wrote:

Do you not remember Season 1 of TWD when they show what happened to Rick in the hospital and why he didnt become Zombie Food, courtesy of Shane? The military decided to pull out/abandon the hospital, and in the process lined up patients against the wall and filled them with holes?

Yeah, about that.

I've not really watched a whole lot of TWD, but wasn't it the case that it was soldiers doing it--not actual orders to do so?

And absolute truth be told, I can't think of anything more logical to do. If the military was pulling out and abandoning the hospital, that's a whole huge buffet that's pretty helpless but potentially able to become a threat to you down the line.

**Shadow Captain Edithae**

Kanluwen wrote:
chaos0xomega wrote:

Do you not remember Season 1 of TWD when they show what happened to Rick in the hospital and why he didnt become Zombie Food, courtesy of Shane? The military decided to pull out/abandon the hospital, and in the process lined up patients against the wall and filled them with holes?

Yeah, about that.

I've not really watched a whole lot of TWD, but wasn't it the case that it was soldiers doing it--not actual orders to do so?

And absolute truth be told, I can't think of anything more logical to do. If the military was pulling out and abandoning the hospital, that's a whole huge buffet that's pretty helpless but potentially able to become a threat to you down the line.

Yeah, it was probably more a case of trying to contain outbreaks by eliminating people who've been exposed to the virus. At this point, it probably still hadn't been discovered that everybody was already infected so quarantine was futile, or if the CDC had discovered it, then they'd been unable to communicate that discovery to the military. Communication was breaking down, everybody was panicking (Military and Police included), soldiers would have started taking things into their own hands rather than wait for orders.

In Ep 3 of FTWD, the Military is not yet at that stage of complete panic and breakdown in the chain of command. By Ep 4, perhaps.

**Hulksmash**

A good episode. Really highlighted why people would have trouble at first dealing with fresh zombies since unless there is evidence of wounds that could have killed them they still look like your loved one and are moving.

Loved the fact that they are so fresh that birdshot just bounced off the skull from relatively close on that first shot. The wobbly plane in the background at the end was a nice touch to show it's starting to come apart.

**Frazzled**

Indeed. I liked how there were zombies doing there thing in the middle of the mob riot, and how the power keeps going on and off. I also like the barber shop dad. He's a survivor, at least until his wife eats him.

The whole "you know how I feel about guns" thing was funny. Even in LA, lots of people have guns.

**ScootyPuffJunior**

"Oh good, the military is here. Everything is fine now" -said no one intelligent ever in a movie/TV show

I thought it was an awesome episode. I'm really interested to see how what looks to be martial law will play out. If Lord Acton was correct when he said, "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely," I have a feeling things are about to get worse.

**pretre**

Frazzled wrote:
He's a survivor, at least until his wife eats him.

I imagine since they have mentioned where he is from a couple times, it figures a bit into it. El Salvador has definitely had their moments of utter fethin' chaos.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, my wife and I were talking about the end and preview. Looks like the military is 'sealing the noose', starting outside and moving their way in. Is it possible we'll see a major engagement as they try to take back downtown?

**Frazzled**

ScootyPuffJunior wrote:
"Oh good, the military is here. Everything is fine now" -said no intelligent ever in a movie/TV show

Shawn of the Dead actually. It was awesome.

I thought it was an awesome episode. I'm really interested to see how what looks to be martial law will play out. If Lord Acton was correct when he said, "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely," I have a feeling things are about to get worse.

Yea but I really don't need that. We're like days from the usual riot situation. Guard units haven't historically gone off the deep end there. PoPo, well thats a different story.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Also, my wife and I were talking about the end and preview. Looks like the military is 'sealing the noose', starting outside and moving their way in. Is it possible we'll see a major engagement as they try to take back downtown?

That would be an AWESOME WWZ scene. Arclight missions on zombie hordes! Not sure if they have the budget though.

**gorgon**

pretre wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
He's a survivor, at least until his wife eats him.

I imagine since they have mentioned where he is from a couple times, it figures a bit into it. El Salvador has definitely had their moments of utter fethin' chaos.

Yeah, you can see where things are going to go. It's easy for him to call Travis weak now, but when his wife turns...

I liked the episode, but kinda groaned a little at the end with the 'escape-thwarted-because-of-the-consequences-of-not-doing-something-that-you-should-have-done' situation. It's very much a WD 'thing', but I feel like perhaps the writers go to that well a little too often. The other possibility in my mind as they drove off was that their vehicles would break down one block away (another primary WD 'thing').

And while I think it's quite realistic that Travis and others in this world might not be eager to put down walkers -- thinking they could be saved or somesuch -- I kinda feel like Travis is holding it together a little TOO much, perhaps? He's already seen a bunch of really freaky gak in the past 24 hours, and yet his next door neighbor is merely 'sick'? Not wanting to put her down, fine, but he seems slow to accept that there's even a threat to his family by having Susan growl at them through the fence. I dunno.

But then maybe this is planned and it's kind of a facade on Travis's part that will crack later. Madison, on the other hand, seems to be 'getting it'. And more than ever I think Nick can be their team MVP if he can just get himself clean. Liza and Daniel both seem like handy people to have around too.

Again, I did like the episode, so my issues were definitely in nitpick territory.

**Frazzled**

Again we have to remember, in their world, there aren't zombies. This is just one step beyond crazy riot.

The guard/ PoPo coming in is the natural step to restore order. If riots and/or a superrabies outbreak had hit they would quarantine and then try to start putting areas back under control.

The plane wiggling was cool.

**Hulksmash**

Personally I was expecting either a quarantine line or just so much traffic they couldn't get out of the LA basin when they waited till morning. The instant they didn't get out during the night they were done.

I love that Nick went immediately to "our neighbors have a gun, let's take it" and then went looking to break into neighbors houses most probably for his fix.

I don't think we're going to get a "military is evil" bit on this. I don't think they have time. We've only got 4 episodes left till the end of the season. I do think we're going to get conflict with the military when they grab the tweaking Nick who is going thru withdrawls because his movements aren't much different from the zombies when you watch him. But I very much got the vibe of people doing their jobs from the military.

**Frazzled**

Except for the dude pronouncing they are all saved, and the one buttstroking someone with his rifle.

Am I the only one hoping the addict gets a severe lead injection but knowing he's safe?

**Hulksmash**

Frazzled wrote:
Except for the dude pronouncing they are all saved, and the one buttstroking someone with his rifle.

Am I the only one hoping the addict gets a severe lead injection but knowing he's safe?

Those were in the previews. So I'm going to wait for context in the show. Imagine some of the things Rick or Carol has done without context

As far as Nick goes I actually like the character so far (and the actor playing him seems solid). I'm more inclined for the Stepdad to go at the moment but some off hand comments make me wonder if he's not a budding badass.

"You know how I feel about guns" could easily be a I don't like them just because I can use them and "Do you know how many times I've broken my nose" doesn't indicate a sedate life before he went into teaching.

I guess we'll see. Overall I'm enjoying the show. Especially the harder time with fresh zombies and the presentation of how the numbers could grow is interesting. Not sure they could reach critical mass in the amount of time being shown but then again I don't expect the National Guard to be out in force in less than 12 hours either

**chaos0xomega**

Right now I'm waiting for the revelation that Daniel Salazar/El Salvador has already experienced a zombie outbreak in the past.

**Frazzled**

Now that would be unexpected.

**chaos0xomega**

Really? I don’t think so, I mean, the dude (and to a lesser extent his wife) is the only one who seems to have any clue as to whats going on and how bad the situation is, more than can conveniently be explained by ‘he was an anti-government guerilla during the El Salvadorian Civil War’. Beyond that, I feel like that’s becoming a new trope in zombie fiction, the most notable example of which I can think of is the revelation in World War Z (the film anyway) that Israel had advanced warning of the outbreak years (decades?) before it occurred because of vague intelligence reports & rumors coming out of the Indian bush. I’ve seen similar played out in other less memorable zombie works (you know, the kind of crap you find on discount at Barnes & Noble, alongside all the Game of Thrones and 50 Shades knock-offs), at this point I would be surprised if TWD/FTWD *didn’t* go along with that.

**Frazzled**

We shall see. it would have had to have been some time ago, as they own the barbershop and appear to have been here multiple years. both the father and daughter speak English.

Also if he wacked the one zombie, why would he have stayed if he knew what they were.

**chaos0xomega**

well, like he said, 'its already too late'.

**gorgon**

I don't agree. TWD famously avoids getting into the origin, background, and particulars of the superbug, which is probably a good choice for keeping the story focused on the characters. I think Daniel's just a guy who's been through some bad gak and isn't afraid to act decisively based on what his gut tells him.

Regarding Travis, yeah...we might see the switch flip. He just seems to be trying TOO hard -- kinda irrationally, honestly -- to stay on an even keel and act like everything will be fine. He might be a guy with a past who's worked very hard to change himself and exercise extreme self-control.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

chaos0xomega wrote:
well, like he said, 'its already too late'.

For society, right?

**chaos0xomega**

Perhaps. The way I took it was more like "resistance is futile" rather than "the government is here for our guns".

**easysauce**

Frazzled wrote:
Again we have to remember, in their world, there aren't zombies. This is just one step beyond crazy riot.

The guard/ PoPo coming in is the natural step to restore order. If riots and/or a superrabies outbreak had hit they would quarantine and then try to start putting areas back under control.

The plane wiggling was cool.

yeah, I kept thinking "WTF anyone born after romero did his thing would know WTF is going on..."

but then you just have to treat it like watchmen, where its an alternative universe where super heroes/zombies are not comics or movies or anything, they are real.

I still cant decide if the level of denial is believable though, but it seems plausable, some characters "get it" and some might be able to get it, but simply do not want to accept what is happening.

They keep doing things like washing dished, taking out trash, playing monopoly ect trying to act normal.

Odd to say the least.

decent series though lets hope it developes well, I look forward to a real large conflict between the military and Z's as that is something most comics/shows just do not address very well. I think in real life a zombie outbreak would be laughable to contain, military can set up all kinds of traps the Z's just walk into, and they are less effective troops then cavemen with clubs, so #'s are not such a huge deal.

**Frazzled**

decent series though lets hope it developes well, I look forward to a real large conflict between the military and Z's as that is something most comics/shows just do not address very well. I think in real life a zombie outbreak would be laughable to contain, military can set up all kinds of traps the Z's just walk into, and they are less effective troops then cavemen with clubs, so #'s are not such a huge deal.

It is. Rabies breakouts are almost unheard of.
What would be dangerous is the whole...really dead people coming back, because that would be a constant low level societal threat.

But yes, TWD had one bit showing napalming sections of Atlanta. If they did something like that it would be excellent. (and not here's a few guardsmen that get taken down by a dozen zombies, thats low rent thats been done before).

**Shadow Captain Edithae**

EDIT: nevermind. Didn't notice that Frazzled already said this.

**Frazzled**

Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
EDIT: nevermind. Didn't notice that Frazzled already said this.

I will admit WWZ had some of that, and me likey. i'd love to see them pull a Yonkers from the book and substitute Hollywood Blvd.

**Hulksmash**

I could see that. I think they have the budget for it. This is a show that is riding the TWD high, only had a 7 episode season order, has already been picked up for season 2 and has been relatively conservative with the first 3 episodes spending. I think they've got the cash to do something big.

I do like how they are likely going to grow the season runs similar to TWD where they keep it shorter for better budgets/episodes to get you hooked and then do longer story arcs and seasons.

**Frazzled**

Would be nice. A lot could be done with sounds effects "over the horizon" looks.

Indeed, start off with lots of images of helicopters and the sounds of heavy weapons fire, artillery, and air strikes with the GGuys in the house looking out windows. Then have lines of vehicles (or the same around the block 7 times...) moving in to contain the attack or inversely support the advance. More noise, with firefights being heard. Have Aircraft flying right over the house firing away. Then have troops retreating and reforming a new position visible to the window, and starting to fire into unseen area beyond window. Show helicopters right overhead firing down major broadsides into area JUST BEYOND window and troops mad firing at same location. Our heroes break and run from the house right when the riot sized mass of extras from this episode's riot, now done up as zombies, break from the unseen position and hits the guard line like a wave with everything going to chaos.

**Shadow Captain Edithae**

The taking out the trash scene cracked me up.