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Title says it all. What are the pros and cons of each? I'm trying to figure which one to equip my scions with.. but can't understand why anyone would choose plasma or melta, or the pros and cons of both other than the explodes on a one for plasma.

Melta still has a use in today's meta for popping tanks and SHV.

I personally feel Grav made Plasma obselete.

They are completely different.
BA assault squad drop pod, I'd go melta.
CSM termis, I'd go combi-plas, as aside from assaulting from a dreadclaw or LR, there is no reliable way to get within that 6".
Havocs, I like 1 squad of each (in rhinos).

It completely depends on the unit and what niche you need filling.

Scions, I'd say plasma synergises better with ap3 lasguns as those expensive lasguns don't want to be wasted by firing at vehicles.

Poly Ranger wrote:
They are completely different.
BA assault squad drop pod, I'd go melta.
CSM termis, I'd go combi-plas, as aside from assaulting from a dreadclaw or LR, there is no reliable way to get within that 6".
Havocs, I like 1 squad of each (in rhinos).

It completely depends on the unit and what niche you need filling.

Scions, I'd say plasma synergises better with ap3 lasguns as those expensive lasguns don't want to be wasted by firing at vehicles.

Now see this is what I was getting at. Plasma has -1 strength of melta, -1 ap, but gains rapid fire and 12". Melta also, of course, has the melta special rule. Some would argue the deepstriking (majority of the time) unit would benefit more from meltaguns anyway. I really can't make up my mind.

If the unit will be DSing most of the time, melta is probably the best option, especially if it has other weapons that can threaten vehicles.

If it's a dedicated anti-infantry unit, I'd go plasma instead.

I like fielding "Cypher's Fallen" 3 Chosen squads.. 1 has 5 meltas, 1has 5 plasma, 1 has 5 flamers.....
All those squads scare the crap out of at least 1 of the enemy units.......
Too bad they're CSM Chosen and die super easy though... they all bring a threat against the right matchup though.

Well, if it's dedicated anti-infantry, Flamers are pretty effective and cheaper. Melta's best for heavy armor. Plasma's generally for light armor or Monstrous Creatures. This is, of course, coming from someone who plays an army without access to Grav. But, in general, it's nice to have choices. There's no one weapon that's always going to be better - it's going to depend on your opponent's Faction and how they run it. If you only want a squad or two, and you are trying to keep budget tight, get 3-6 models, build 1 or 2 with each special weapon, and you can swap them in and out of a large squad (or take two squads, each specializing in something different).

For scions bring melta. At least then you can nail tanks. Plasma doesn't really fit a niche. Most things with a 2+ are slow enough to avoid.

Yeah it's tough. If DSing I'd probably be more inclined to go Melta, plas can still work and can threaten more but you really need to ensure they're able to turn up mid to late game to either get a good angle on rear armour or catch a tough unit out in the open...

D

Both have their roles and uses.
Meltas vs. heavily armored tanks, say LR.
Plasma vs. heavily armored units, like Termies, and vs. MCs.

Grav has taken the purpose of Plasma. Melta is the better choice now most of the time.

-Better Tank-killing
-Assault so you can assault said tank with bombs or grenades
-No Gets Hot
-I believe it is cheaper in certain Codices, like Tempestus.

It depends on the target. Plasma is better against anything that's not a vehicle, and Melta is better against heavily armoured vehicles. Against low armour vehicles, Plasma would probably edge it, as it has two shots, but I have no idea of the maths on that. Build them to take out a type of target and try and stick to it

Edit- And grav has only really taken its place in certain match ups

For me it is Plasma-Guns all the way.
Part of ti is My META, I am the only one that brings Land Raiders.
Part, Melta-Guns have a 12" Range, 6" if you want to kill armor.
I have seen Drop-Melta end up out of range of their intended Target and it can be hard to get within 6" to make the best use of them. The 7"-12" range were Melta are just ok, Plasma is in their 'Sweet Spot.
I can 99% of time Drop my Plasma within Rapid Fire range of the side or rear armor of a vehicle and with 6-7 shots [Grey Hunters 2x Plasma-Guns, 1x Combi-Plasma and sometimes a Plasma Pistol I should be able to cripple if not outright kill most thing in the opening volley. 3-4 Pods filled with the same can cripple the right army.

My other favorite use is with a Command Squad with an Apothecary and 4 Plasma-Guns or 4 Combi-Plasmas. that is 8 Plasma Shots that have the same affect from 1'-12" reliably. Or 4 out to 24".

 Anpu42 wrote:
For me it is Plasma-Guns all the way.
Part of ti is My META, I am the only one that brings Land Raiders.
Part, Melta-Guns have a 12" Range, 6" if you want to kill armor.
I have seen Drop-Melta end up out of range of their intended Target and it can be hard to get within 6" to make the best use of them. The 7"-12" range were Melta are just ok, Plasma is in their 'Sweet Spot.
I can 99% of time Drop my Plasma within Rapid Fire range of the side or rear armor of a vehicle and with 6-7 shots [Grey Hunters 2x Plasma-Guns, 1x Combi-Plasma and sometimes a Plasma Pistol I should be able to cripple if not outright kill most thing in the opening volley. 3-4 Pods filled with the same can cripple the right army.

My other favorite use is with a Command Squad with an Apothecary and 4 Plasma-Guns or 4 Combi-Plasmas. that is 8 Plasma Shots that have the same affect from 1'-12" reliably. Or 4 out to 24".

Sounds like you meta has no superheavies. Which makes it a 5th/6th ed meta.

I think plasma is distinctly inferior to grav and melta in terms of meta-counters at this point.

Martel732 wrote:

 Anpu42 wrote:
For me it is Plasma-Guns all the way.
Part of ti is My META, I am the only one that brings Land Raiders.
Part, Melta-Guns have a 12" Range, 6" if you want to kill armor.
I have seen Drop-Melta end up out of range of their intended Target and it can be hard to get within 6" to make the best use of them. The 7"-12" range were Melta are just ok, Plasma is in their 'Sweet Spot.
I can 99% of time Drop my Plasma within Rapid Fire range of the side or rear armor of a vehicle and with 6-7 shots [Grey Hunters 2x Plasma-Guns, 1x Combi-Plasma and sometimes a Plasma Pistol I should be able to cripple if not outright kill most thing in the opening volley. 3-4 Pods filled with the same can cripple the right army.

My other favorite use is with a Command Squad with an Apothecary and 4 Plasma-Guns or 4 Combi-Plasmas. that is 8 Plasma Shots that have the same affect from 1'-12" reliably. Or 4 out to 24".

Sounds like you meta has no superheavies. Which makes it a 5th/6th ed meta.

I think plasma is distinctly inferior to grav and melta in terms of meta-counters at this point.

Well currently I am the only one that really fields any. We also set up our games in advance so we know if someone is going to bring any, though we don't know what is coming, just that there will be one or more showing up.

"We also set up our games in advance so we know if someone is going to bring any"

That is allowing you to skew your list plasma heavy. You would be a sad panda if you brought your plasma heavy list against triple IK with no warning. I personally would never tell you what's in my list ahead of time. Not that it really helps with BA.

Martel732 wrote:
"We also set up our games in advance so we know if someone is going to bring any"

That is allowing you to skew your list plasma heavy. You would be a sad panda if you brought your plasma heavy list against triple IK with no warning. I personally would never tell you what's in my list ahead of time. Not that it really helps with BA.

That is one of the big differences between our and you META's. The idea is for both side to have a chance in a Game. Something Like a Knight can change everything, I know the first time I pull one out the Guard player could do nothing to it while it rampaged though 1/3 of his army (Arjac's Shield Brother took out the other third, but that is a different story). He did not have fun that say. That goes against how we like to play so we like to give the other warning if we are going to do things like pull out a Knight, Stompa or lots of flyers so the other guy can come up with some sort of 'Defense', it is not like we are post list, though we do that some times.
As a side note, If I Pod my Plasma SPAM list, it actually does well vs Knights because I can usually pull off side or rear armor. I Also have enough Plasma Cannons to easily Glance one to death in a few turns with my Plasma Armed Sternguard getting involved.

"He did not have fun that say."

My opponents don't seem to give a feth about my fun level. On my model count. Which they prefer to be zero.

"As a side note, If I Pod my Plasma SPAM list, it actually does well vs Knights because I can usually pull off side or rear armor. I Also have enough Plasma Cannons to easily Glance one to death in a few turns with my Plasma Armed Sternguard getting involved."

I don't believe that this would work against a list that contained both screening units and some IK. Pure IK, maybe.

" The idea is for both side to have a chance in a Game"

Ideally in a conflict, one prefers to maximize ones's chances of winning said conflict.

Martel732 wrote:
"He did not have fun that say."

My opponents don't seem to give a feth about my fun level. On my model count. Which they prefer to be zero.

That is why I would play in your META once and only Once.

"As a side note, If I Pod my Plasma SPAM list, it actually does well vs Knights because I can usually pull off side or rear armor. I Also have enough Plasma Cannons to easily Glance one to death in a few turns with my Plasma Armed Sternguard getting involved."

I don't believe that this would work against a list that contained both screening units and some IK. Pure IK, maybe.

This why I like Plasma over Melta. With Melta you can put a 12" safety Bubble around a target and they become "Immune" to Melta, as 13"-24" I can still use my Plasma and just ignore the 'Bubble Wrap' for the first Volley.

" The idea is for both side to have a chance in a Game"

Ideally in a conflict, one prefers to maximize ones's chances of winning said conflict.

In real War Yes, but we are just pushing little army men around the table to have fun and I am sorry, but if my opponent is not having fun, I Am Not.

"This why I like Plasma over Melta. With Melta you can put a 12" safety Bubble around a target and they become "Immune" to Melta, as 13"-24" I can still use my Plasma and just ignore the 'Bubble Wrap' for the first Volley. "

But you'll never do enough damage single-tapping plasma guns.

Martel732 wrote:
"This why I like Plasma over Melta. With Melta you can put a 12" safety Bubble around a target and they become "Immune" to Melta, as 13"-24" I can still use my Plasma and just ignore the 'Bubble Wrap' for the first Volley. "

But you'll never do enough damage single-tapping plasma guns.

That is what the rest of your army is for, beside I know this is not a solid tactic or anything, but I have good luck with my Plasma. I can usually inflict one or two HP with one or two Plasma Guns vs AV12. Combine that with my other 11 Plasma Cannons I can usually take down a 5-8 AV13 HP Super Heavy in 2-3 turns.
Now if I am facing a Imperial Knight Army out comes my Knight, 2x Malicor's and Shadow-Sword and we just call it a 28mm BattleTech game.

" in 2-3 turns. "

Assuming you aren't tabled by then.

Martel732 wrote:
" in 2-3 turns. "

Assuming you aren't tabled by then.

And if I am not?

If you have not notice I am a Glass Half Full kind of guy.

 Anpu42 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
" in 2-3 turns. "

Assuming you aren't tabled by then.

And if I am not?

If you have not notice I am a Glass Half Full kind of guy.

I personally find that 3 turns is far too long to let a super heavy run around the table and squish my expensive elite infantry. Or frag them with huge templates. Ideally, I want the super heavy gone in one turn with melta. With your math, if your plasma cannons start dying, then you might never kill it.

Martel732 wrote:

 Anpu42 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
" in 2-3 turns. "

Assuming you aren't tabled by then.

And if I am not?

If you have not notice I am a Glass Half Full kind of guy.

I personally find that 3 turns is far too long to let a super heavy run around the table and squish my expensive elite infantry. Or frag them with huge templates. Ideally, I want the super heavy gone in one turn with melta. With your math, if your plasma cannons start dying, then you might never kill it.

And if they have good 'Bubble Wrap' your Melta is worthless.

Wargamescon and BAO were won by a list which laughs off melta and laughs off grav, but has a healthy respect for plasma, Daemons.

I've had good success running Spawn stars in the current meta. I laugh off melta and grav shots with ease, but my hardest matchup is plasmaguns on bikes.

That's why the situation is only idealized. However, non-drop pod melta on fast platforms or mechanized platforms has the luxury to let the game develop a turn and then go after the super heavy. From multiple directions if necessary.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

DarthDiggler wrote:
Wargamescon and BAO were won by a list which laughs off melta and laughs off grav, but has a healthy respect for plasma, Daemons.

I've had good success running Spawn stars in the current meta. I laugh off melta and grav shots with ease, but my hardest matchup is plasmaguns on bikes.

When in doubt, play the meta. If you can. Lucky me, my BA are weak to all three! Hooray!

DarthDiggler wrote:
Wargamescon and BAO were won by a list which laughs off melta and laughs off grav, but has a healthy respect for plasma, Daemons.

I've had good success running Spawn stars in the current meta. I laugh off melta and grav shots with ease, but my hardest matchup is plasmaguns on bikes.

I like Plasma-Guns on Bike, they even work with my Swiftclaws.

I think it also depends on how much Plasma is out there too. My Plasma SPAM list as 33+ Plasma Weapons on it. Not many armies I have encountered do well against it.

 Anpu42 wrote:

DarthDiggler wrote:
Wargamescon and BAO were won by a list which laughs off melta and laughs off grav, but has a healthy respect for plasma, Daemons.

I've had good success running Spawn stars in the current meta. I laugh off melta and grav shots with ease, but my hardest matchup is plasmaguns on bikes.

I like Plasma-Guns on Bike, they even work with my Swiftclaws.

I think it also depends on how much Plasma is out there too. My Plasma SPAM list as 33+ Plasma Weapons on it. Not many armies I have encountered do well against it.

That's significantly less firepower than I take on week in and week out. I think I'd be fine.

Martel732 wrote:

 Anpu42 wrote:

DarthDiggler wrote:
Wargamescon and BAO were won by a list which laughs off melta and laughs off grav, but has a healthy respect for plasma, Daemons.

I've had good success running Spawn stars in the current meta. I laugh off melta and grav shots with ease, but my hardest matchup is plasmaguns on bikes.

I like Plasma-Guns on Bike, they even work with my Swiftclaws.

I think it also depends on how much Plasma is out there too. My Plasma SPAM list as 33+ Plasma Weapons on it. Not many armies I have encountered do well against it.

That's significantly less firepower than I take on week in and week out. I think I'd be fine.

I though Blood Angles were crap?