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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/07 12:06:04
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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Hi All,
Just after some opinions from other 40k players
I had mny first game against necrons recently
I play a Khorne Daemonkin army and i think it is competative ... but never mind what I did i just could not take opposing nectons models off the board.
their "reanimation protcols" were ridicuoulolsy too strong and to put it bluntly wasnt fun
what are the general opinions on necrons?
Cheers Jonesy
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/09/07 12:08:27
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/07 17:53:29
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Boosting Ultramarine Biker
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Does this belong in intro?
Bloodthirsters, lots of them
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/07 21:17:57
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Irked Necron Immortal
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Bloodthirsters could work. I know a guy who runs a crapload of cultists and the big kill machine with an axe the size on a minivan. Its basically a bloodtoken farming list.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/08 11:22:42
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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probabbly doesnt belong in intor - apologies. Couldnt work out where to post properly,
Bloodthisters ithink would be targetted and shot off the board ? will give it a go
Lord of skulls? LOL ... will take a proxy model and see how it goes. never taken a Lord of War option before.
Cheers Guys
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/08 19:43:42
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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[DCM]
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I think this is a better home for your thread!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/08 21:50:25
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Screaming Shining Spear
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Ironically, Khorne Daemonkin is actually pretty good against Necrons. Focus on getting into CC with choppy units, win combat, force them to lower their leadership, and sweep them on Initiative. CC is the only truly effective answer against Necrons.
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~3000 (Fully Painted)
Coming Soon!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/08 21:56:53
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot
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Having played vs Khorne, I had real trouble with the demon dog things. THey were very fast and tied up my warrior blobs quickly and had a good invincible save vs my warscythes. Go dogs, like, 3 x 7 if you can.
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15k+
3k+
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/08 22:38:33
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Regular Dakkanaut
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Saying you don't want to field something because it will get shot is poor logic. Of course your units are going to get shot. Learn to maneuver and protect them.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 13:42:39
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker
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Necrons are like a blue control deck in magic. They hurt you by not being hurt themselves. You are actually in a good position as deamonkin as necron's melt in CC due to sweeping advance. Take your bumb rush units like khorne hounds and bloodthirsters, especially ones of inesesent rage, and drink the enemies tears.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 15:40:18
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Lol at all these people saying Necrons fold in CC.
(tell that to the Wraiths, Lychguard, Flayed Ones, Praetorians, etc).
Pro-tip: when giving new players advice, you may want to be a LITTLE MORE SPECIFIC.
To OP: what everyone SHOULD have been saying was, "Get into combat with SHOOTY Necrons" (ie. Warriors, Immortals, Destroyers). It's generally not a good idea to engage the choppy ones anymore, as they have all gotten pretty good.
(though Thisters should be safe from everything but a Wraith + Warscythe Lychguard hammer-anvil combo)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 15:47:40
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Krazed Killa Kan
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Honestly, everyone has trouble with necrons, largely due to their RP.
Moreover, as orks, I have had TONS of trouble with necrons, even in CC, even with just warriors.
I have probably 5+ personal anecdotes of nobz, multiple deff dreads, etc, etc, simply bouncing off of warriors. Anything worse than warriors I have even worse stories (warboss, nobz, wierdboy charging a nightbringer, lose combat, get sweeping advanced).
Necrons honestly a problem for just about everyone nowadays, and in my experience, CC is not nearly as effective as you'd hope.
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"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment." Words to live by. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 15:59:36
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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Much appreciated, thanks.
Crazy Jay - I wasnt clear, what I meant was taking a Bloodthirster sounds like good advice.
However, the problem is, it gets targeted and put out of action before I can use it to its full extent and thus and forced to rely on other units that cant get the job done.
Kap'n Krump - I can sympathise with you. But do you have fun playing necrons ?
I was informed by my oppent that necrons are fearless and thus immune from sweeping advances?
Skoffs - cheers for the English lesson lol .. never easy writing in your second language
cheers lads really appreciate it
Jonesy
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 17:47:43
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Ork-Hunting Inquisitorial Xenokiller
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Necrons are nowhere near fearless. They have Ld 10 across the board , but only the MCs / beasts are fearless.
They have 1 units of fearless infantry (jump)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 19:13:53
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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Damn it!
Hate people not playing by the rules ...
Right ... So engage his CC units with fodder and aim for his infantry with decent assault units of my own.
Easier said than done lol
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/09 19:14:37
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 19:17:01
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Loyal Necron Lychguard
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Nemesor Zahndrekh can make a unit Fearless, as can any other Warlord that gets Fearless or Zealot. That could be it as well.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 19:25:58
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Krazed Killa Kan
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Jonesyjones wrote:Much appreciated, thanks.
Kap'n Krump - I can sympathise with you. But do you have fun playing necrons ?
I was informed by my oppent that necrons are fearless and thus immune from sweeping advances?
I honestly can't say that I do. I mean, losing is one thing, but watching my entire army fail to kill my opponent's basic infantry, much less anything actually powerful, is just not fun. About the only fun I have is getting to add another absolutely broken, unfair necron anecdote to my pile of them.
I mean, I've had 20 nobz charge 20 warriors and LOSE combat. That's not really fun in my book.
As for fearless, necrons don't have a whole lot of fearless, oddly enough, other than their canoptek units (wraiths, scarabs, spyders). If you can ever manage to kill necrons in CC, unlike me, then it is totally possible to sweeping advance most necron units. IIRC, praetorians, lychguard, and flayed ones are the only non-canoptek fearless units necrons have. I was very surprised to learn even overlords don't have fearless, though I think it's a warlord trait.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/09 19:27:09
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment." Words to live by. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 19:35:26
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Kap'n Krump wrote:Honestly, everyone has trouble with necrons, largely due to their RP.
Moreover, as orks, I have had TONS of trouble with necrons, even in CC, even with just warriors.
I have probably 5+ personal anecdotes of nobz, multiple deff dreads, etc, etc, simply bouncing off of warriors. Anything worse than warriors I have even worse stories (warboss, nobz, wierdboy charging a nightbringer, lose combat, get sweeping advanced).
Necrons honestly a problem for just about everyone nowadays, and in my experience, CC is not nearly as effective as you'd hope.
Orks have probably the easiest time against Necrons. Massive blobs of Boyz for tarpitting and access to really cheap S8 AP3 weapons. PK help too, but you need Boyz to mitigate the wounds.
In general, like any army, chop the shooty, shoot the choppy.
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YMDC = nightmare |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 20:13:27
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Ork-Hunting Inquisitorial Xenokiller
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Kap'n Krump wrote:Jonesyjones wrote:Much appreciated, thanks. Kap'n Krump - I can sympathise with you. But do you have fun playing necrons ? I was informed by my oppent that necrons are fearless and thus immune from sweeping advances? I honestly can't say that I do. I mean, losing is one thing, but watching my entire army fail to kill my opponent's basic infantry, much less anything actually powerful, is just not fun. About the only fun I have is getting to add another absolutely broken, unfair necron anecdote to my pile of them. I mean, I've had 20 nobz charge 20 warriors and LOSE combat. That's not really fun in my book. As for fearless, necrons don't have a whole lot of fearless, oddly enough, other than their canoptek units (wraiths, scarabs, spyders). If you can ever manage to kill necrons in CC, unlike me, then it is totally possible to sweeping advance most necron units. IIRC, praetorians, lychguard, and flayed ones are the only non-canoptek fearless units necrons have. I was very surprised to learn even overlords don't have fearless, though I think it's a warlord trait. Praetorians , Canopteks, and C'tan are fearless. Lych / flayed ones aren't . 20 nobs losing to 20 warriors is straight up bad dice. (60 attacks - 30 hits - 20 wounds - 5 dead (assuming decurion) ) (20 attacks - 10 hits -5 wounds - ~4 dead without eavy armor / PKs)
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/09 20:15:12
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/09 20:55:42
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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Yeah... Same here really.
:/
Best games this far have been against imperials ... Space marines, inquistor armies and the good old imperial guard.
All decent and individual style of play ... And all beatable ... That's what makes it fun.
(Despite loosing a zerker champ to a guardsman Sgt in a challenge ... But we can look back at that and laugh another time ...)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 09:09:38
Subject: Re:Trouble with Necrons
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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As others have said, with a strong cc army like khorne, you have the potential to sweep necron units, and therefore bypass a lot of those OP reanimation rolls.
That said, don't listen to people when they say necrons just fold to cc, that is theory from previous editions. With the new RP rolls, necrons are very durable even in cc.
Khorne dogs should be able to handle the non-cc units, but should be careful of flayed ones and other cc units.
I think the best way to deal with flayed ones, if they are unsupported by a character without a scythe, would be to tie them up with a dreadnought/maulerfiend/soulgrinder.
If they do have a scythe in there then they are much more of a problem. Automatically Appended Next Post: As others have said, with a strong cc army like khorne, you have the potential to sweep necron units, and therefore bypass a lot of those OP reanimation rolls.
That said, don't listen to people when they say necrons just fold to cc, that is theory from previous editions. With the new RP rolls, necrons are very durable even in cc.
Khorne dogs should be able to handle the non-cc units, but should be careful of flayed ones and other cc units.
I think the best way to deal with flayed ones, if they are unsupported by a character without a scythe, would be to tie them up with a dreadnought/maulerfiend/soulgrinder.
If they do have a scythe in there then they are much more of a problem.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/11 09:09:59
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 09:33:20
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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Cheers Big Blind Bill
so a tactics overhaul completely then
out of intest what are the Fleshounds AP attacks ? doesnt say in the codex ... am i missing something ? or is it AP - ?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 09:56:30
Subject: Re:Trouble with Necrons
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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They don't have an ap value.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 10:49:23
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Road-Raging Blood Angel Biker
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Maybe look to see if there is any template stuff you can get them with too, things that will inflict as many wounds as possible against any given unit to minimise the percentage of wounded models reanimating.
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"For The Emperor and Sanguinius!"
My Armies:
Blood Angels, Ultramarines,
Astra Militarum,
Mechanicus |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 12:27:21
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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flamers any good for killing the ir CC units ?
got bogged down fighting wraiths and scarabs
3++ save on the wraiths and reanimation on failed saves was just ridicuoulisy stupid
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 13:33:21
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Rampaging Carnifex
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Jonesyjones wrote:flamers any good for killing the ir CC units ?
got bogged down fighting wraiths and scarabs
3++ save on the wraiths and reanimation on failed saves was just ridicuoulisy stupid
The scarabs are easy to kill with either strength 6 (instant death) or template weapons (they are swarms so they take double the wounds from templates). If you have a strength 6 template weapon then you can annihilate the whole unit removing 2 bases per wound.
Wraiths on the other hand only go down to volume of fire. Don't worry about the AP of your weapon... unless of course you're hitting them with Strength D. A bloodthirster can take on Wraiths.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 13:38:43
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant
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Slaphead wrote:Maybe look to see if there is any template stuff you can get them with too, things that will inflict as many wounds as possible against any given unit to minimise the percentage of wounded models reanimating.
What do you mean by this? Any wound gets to reanimate besides D and removes from play. It doesn't matter if it is a flamer or not.
That said, AP4 templates can be useful against crons if you are expecting lots of warriors/flayed ones.
Edit: got bogged down fighting wraiths
Most things in the game has a hard time vs wraiths. Even if they don't kill you, they are likely to hold whatever is fighting them for a long time.
Normal wraiths are tough, ones with RP rolls are insane.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/11 13:41:17
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 13:54:50
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Road-Raging Blood Angel Biker
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Big Blind Bill wrote: Slaphead wrote:Maybe look to see if there is any template stuff you can get them with too, things that will inflict as many wounds as possible against any given unit to minimise the percentage of wounded models reanimating.
What do you mean by this? Any wound gets to reanimate besides D and removes from play. It doesn't matter if it is a flamer or not.
That said, AP4 templates can be useful against crons if you are expecting lots of warriors/flayed ones.
Edit: got bogged down fighting wraiths
Most things in the game has a hard time vs wraiths. Even if they don't kill you, they are likely to hold whatever is fighting them for a long time.
Normal wraiths are tough, ones with RP rolls are insane.
I meant that template weapons have a good chance of getting a higher number of wounds on a blob of warriors or scarabs. I know they still get reanimate protocols, but was thinking that they would need to pass more of them in one go this way and thus meaning they will fail more of them. That was my thinking behind it anyway
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/11 13:55:23
"For The Emperor and Sanguinius!"
My Armies:
Blood Angels, Ultramarines,
Astra Militarum,
Mechanicus |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 13:56:44
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Flamers against Scarabs? Yes!
Flamers against Wraiths? Not really.
Flamers against everything else CC? Well, if it's heavy flamers, then it'll toast Flayed Ones. Otherwise, not so much. Automatically Appended Next Post: Zimko wrote:The scarabs are easy to kill with either strength 6 (instant death) or template weapons (they are swarms so they take double the wounds from templates). If you have a strength 6 template weapon then you can annihilate the whole unit removing 2 bases per wound
Uhh, didn't the FAQ say it was either/or, but not both?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/09/11 14:00:24
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 14:04:30
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Been Around the Block
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so against wraiths
take a couple of 10 man chaos marines with a hevy bolter ?
and some forgefiends?
get as many shots in ? would that work ?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/09/11 14:08:44
Subject: Trouble with Necrons
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Screaming Shining Spear
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Jonesyjones wrote:so against wraiths
take a couple of 10 man chaos marines with a hevy bolter ?
and some forgefiends?
get as many shots in ? would that work ?
You can't shoot Wraiths to death. They're T5 2W with a 3++ and 4+ Res Protocols in a Decurion. The only way to beat them is to get the charge off on them with either a serious CC hammer unit or a massive tarpit to tie them up.
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~3000 (Fully Painted)
Coming Soon!
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