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Murrdox wrote:
. In return, fix Kroot. Then Tau can't simply win games by sitting the majority of their force behind an Aegis Defense Line and using a few Crisis suits to maybe go get an objective or two.

I'm not arguing against any of your points but have you tried using backfield-outflank shenanigan Kroot blobs with the positional relay in the current codex? http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=19728

Stuff's fun

 Squidmanlolz wrote:
Has Tau-hate even existed since 5th ed?
Been playing since 4th and the only time I ever noticed 'Tau-hate' was during 5th.

Before I began playing there was a phenomena named "Fish of Fury" that got people furious
http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=9876

 Red Marine wrote:
MechWarrior was based off of a board game from the 80s. So theres some shade for the "not all giant robot stuff is asian" crowd. Then again theres mecha godzilla, which is older...

Anywho, just wait until the new tau codex drops. Then you'll definitely be that TFG play that-fething-army again. Especially if you have forgeworld. Seriously though, the idea of tau formations makes me lose sleep.

The point isn't that it's not Asian, as Tau draw from a lot of Asian cultures, it's that saying it's anime based is silly when it draws only faintly from it by virtue of the Mech Warrior images it was influenced by because those images were trying to fuse the mech warrior style with a hint of anime mecha style.

It's cool that Tau have all of these influences from China and even Japan, but it's absurd to say they're "anime" when their designer said he was influenced by Chinese foot soldiers and sci-fi Mech Warrior designs.

 ChiliPowderKeg wrote:

Murrdox wrote:
. In return, fix Kroot. Then Tau can't simply win games by sitting the majority of their force behind an Aegis Defense Line and using a few Crisis suits to maybe go get an objective or two.

I'm not arguing against any of your points but have you tried using backfield-outflank shenanigan Kroot blobs with the positional relay in the current codex? http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=19728

Stuff's fun

 Squidmanlolz wrote:
Has Tau-hate even existed since 5th ed?
Been playing since 4th and the only time I ever noticed 'Tau-hate' was during 5th.

Before I began playing there was a phenomena named "Fish of Fury" that got people furious
http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=9876

I think back then it was just the anime-stuff that people didn't like. The Fish of Fury was a good tactic but it was the only really power-gaming thing you could do with that codex unless you were clever with markerlights. Everything else was mediocre. That's why I don't mind the nerf on the Broadside's railguns so much; yes it got nerfed badly, but we now have really powerful units like Riptides to fall back on, as well as some HQ choices that are actually worth taking (remember the Ethereal who's best skill was dying?)

 ChiliPowderKeg wrote:

 Squidmanlolz wrote:
Has Tau-hate even existed since 5th ed?
Been playing since 4th and the only time I ever noticed 'Tau-hate' was during 5th.

Before I began playing there was a phenomena named "Fish of Fury" that got people furious
http://advancedtautactica.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=9876

I ran Fish of Fury early on when Tau were still fairly new and uncommon in my meta. It was a bit OP, but I didn't really receive "tau hate" from the locals. Nowadays people get a bit pissed when you bring two or more riptides, but even then I wouldn't say they hat the Tau as much as they hate the player for pulling that kind of cheese.

Tau are moderately powerful. I'd say the list is far from OP, though.

 master of ordinance wrote:
Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I can assure you that I don't play Tau, and I'm of the mind they're not overly powerful once you know how they work. You need four Markerlight hits to remove cover and boost a unit to BS5. Four. That's on average an 8-man Pathfinder team. Sure, it's cheap at 11ppm but it's also just eight guys in crappy armor. They'll test for running away after losing two guys. My SoB have never had any problems hunting down and killing Tau infantry - the suits are nasty but without ML support they too are just something to live through. Ofc, I use the utterly inconceivable tactic of having Dominion Squads outflank in Hflamer Immolators... It's sad to hear no other army has the luxury of delivering flamers into the midst of the enemy lines.

Spetulhu wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I can assure you that I don't play Tau, and I'm of the mind they're not overly powerful once you know how they work. You need four Markerlight hits to remove cover and boost a unit to BS5. Four. That's on average an 8-man Pathfinder team. Sure, it's cheap at 11ppm but it's also just eight guys in crappy armor. They'll test for running away after losing two guys. My SoB have never had any problems hunting down and killing Tau infantry - the suits are nasty but without ML support they too are just something to live through. Ofc, I use the utterly inconceivable tactic of having Dominion Squads outflank in Hflamer Immolators... It's sad to hear no other army has the luxury of delivering flamers into the midst of the enemy lines.

Crappy armor compared to what? Space Marines? yeah it is, but compared to my Orks its awesome. And with my armies lack of Anti Cover weapons I am usually hard pressed to remove those little blighters.

Pathfinders only have 5+ (as useless as ork armour against most basic weaponry). It's FWs that have 4+.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Pathfinders only have 5+ (as useless as ork armour against most basic weaponry). It's FWs that have 4+.

So what if Pathfinders "only have 5+"?

They're meant to be equivalent to Eldar Rangers, which are 5+ with Camo Cloaks.

 Tinkrr wrote:

 Red Marine wrote:
MechWarrior was based off of a board game from the 80s. So theres some shade for the "not all giant robot stuff is asian" crowd. Then again theres mecha godzilla, which is older...

Anywho, just wait until the new tau codex drops. Then you'll definitely be that TFG play that-fething-army again. Especially if you have forgeworld. Seriously though, the idea of tau formations makes me lose sleep.

The point isn't that it's not Asian, as Tau draw from a lot of Asian cultures, it's that saying it's anime based is silly when it draws only faintly from it by virtue of the Mech Warrior images it was influenced by because those images were trying to fuse the mech warrior style with a hint of anime mecha style.

It's cool that Tau have all of these influences from China and even Japan, but it's absurd to say they're "anime" when their designer said he was influenced by Chinese foot soldiers and sci-fi Mech Warrior designs.

GW's designers are mostly middle-aged men, aren't they? (Who by the way seem reasonably well-read and educated -- "anti-agapic elixirs" lol). They are not the anime-watching demographic.

Whereas a lot of GW customers are teenagers or early-20s, who are the anime-watching demographic.

GW customers are reading their own interests into the designers.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Pathfinders only have 5+ (as useless as ork armour against most basic weaponry). It's FWs that have 4+.

So what if Pathfinders "only have 5+"?

They're meant to be equivalent to Eldar Rangers, which are 5+ with Camo Cloaks.

What? That has nothing to do with what I was talking about.

I assumed that, as gahz was comparing PF armour to SMs, he thought they had a 4+, like FWs, when they have a 5+. I was not saying whether they were good or bad, whether the armour was adiquite or not, just that their armour is merely 5+. There's no argument to be made here, it's simply a fact, pathfinders have 5+ amour. I'm not sure what you are trying to prove?

Jaxler wrote:
Most of the arguments I see are either about tau being too noble bright, being animie inspired or about them being OP and annoying to play against. Most of which I feel aren't exactly grounded in realty or are based off older versions of the game or Tau lore. I'll admit I'm a little biased as a guy who plays tau and finds Japanese history interesting, but most of the stuff people complain about usually seems a little ignorant to me, especially when it's the same complaints I've seen be put out over and over without any facts or arguments to back it up. I also wish the people who complain about tau being "weebo trash" would realize that just because something takes inspiration from eastern culture doesn't mean it takes inspiration from eastern pop culture. Also, when people still call tau OP even after necrons space marines and eldar have gotten their new codexes It makes me roll my eyes a little. I really feel tau don't deserve the disproportionate amount of spite and loathing that they get.

People hate Tau.....that's why you keep hearing it. It's not about how good they are competitively, it's that they're really f-ing annoying. You can't see it because you play Tau...you're one of those guys! Let me ask a few questions:

Is your army fully painted? Or are you rocking the 3 Colour minimum? Gotta get those competitive models on the board fast!

Have you ever, in a fit of joy grabbed your opponents model with your greasy fingers to remove it from play? This is a tau/ Eldar thing that seems to happen to me a lot.

And finally what percent of games do you win against your friends? Are you contempt to concede half the games you play? Or do you win 80 percent of the time and still play like its the championship game of the world on those20 percent games where your opponent is ahead?

I mean you can't say that ALL Tau players are like this....I understand that. But I'll tell you that it's been my personal experience. And I know I'm not the only person. It takes a certain type of person to relish in the idea of endlessly Kiting you opponent, taking 2 shooting phases and 2 movement phases. Sadistic nerds with an agenda.....

 master of ordinance wrote:
Kanluen, youve made a great arguement but this is getting no where. Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I like to think of myself as unbiased towards either Imperial or Tau since I play both (Elysian Drop Troops being my first and favorite army) but im sorry your argument is flawed. You claiming he has no case, seriously the same could be said of you clearly ignoring all the nasty stuff that Imperial armies get by creating specific scenarios to justify your arguments, sorry Imperial Armies are much more nastier then Tau for several reasons (some im sure have been mentioned but im just making a list):

-Imperial Guard get orders to Ignore cover with anything, and before you say "they have to take a leadership check" wow add a 35pt. Commissar for LD9, problem solved.
-Imperial Guard have access to an insane amount of armor 14 vehicles, actually this is been one of the best counters to my Tau from Imperial Guard players.
-Elysian Drop Troops (my army) show up with over x10 flyers at 2000pts. even Tau will struggle.
-Space Marine Skyhammer Assault Formation, nothing needs to be explained here.
-Insane amount of Grav spam that renders my Riptides and Crisis Suits useless.
-Mechanicum Grav Kataphrons, 18 30 inch Grav Cannon shots that can easily be boosted to BS7 with your mandatory HQ.
-Psychic Power shenanigans
-Imperial Knights
-Skitarrii in Drop Pods, this list is just dirty
-And in regards to above the amount of shenanigans you guys can pull with allies, literally having access to over half the units in the game. This is continuously ignored as a "strength" for some reason when this topic comes up but im sorry, we have access to it so it fits perfectly into the argument.

We could go back and forth on the list making and pointing out things but as mentioned (the one thing i agree with) approaching it with a tit for tat argument is not getting us anywhere. However for everything you try and say Tau has that is so "overpowered" there is something equivalent or worse in the Imperial arsenal so your argument is just as flawed as you claim Kanluen's is. And no one said that Tau were not a good army, all that has been said from what I can see is that Tau players find it silly and ridiculous how other players, Imperial players in particular (in my personal experience on here and playing games) complain on how "overpowered" Tau are and ignore all the nasty stuff they can field.

 gmaleron wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Kanluen, youve made a great arguement but this is getting no where. Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I like to think of myself as unbiased towards either Imperial or Tau since I play both (Elysian Drop Troops being my first and favorite army) but im sorry your argument is flawed. You claiming he has no case, seriously the same could be said of you clearly ignoring all the nasty stuff that Imperial armies get by creating specific scenarios to justify your arguments, sorry Imperial Armies are much more nastier then Tau for several reasons (some im sure have been mentioned but im just making a list):

-Imperial Guard get orders to Ignore cover with anything, and before you say "they have to take a leadership check" wow add a 35pt. Commissar for LD9, problem solved.
-Imperial Guard have access to an insane amount of armor 14 vehicles, actually this is been one of the best counters to my Tau from Imperial Guard players.
-Elysian Drop Troops (my army) show up with over x10 flyers at 2000pts. even Tau will struggle.
-Space Marine Skyhammer Assault Formation, nothing needs to be explained here.
-Insane amount of Grav spam that renders my Riptides and Crisis Suits useless.
-Mechanicum Grav Kataphrons, 18 30 inch Grav Cannon shots that can easily be boosted to BS7 with your mandatory HQ.
-Psychic Power shenanigans
-Imperial Knights
-Skitarrii in Drop Pods, this list is just dirty
-And in regards to above the amount of shenanigans you guys can pull with allies, literally having access to over half the units in the game. This is continuously ignored as a "strength" for some reason when this topic comes up but im sorry, we have access to it so it fits perfectly into the argument.

We could go back and forth on the list making and pointing out things but as mentioned (the one thing i agree with) approaching it with a tit for tat argument is not getting us anywhere. However for everything you try and say Tau has that is so "overpowered" there is something equivalent or worse in the Imperial arsenal so your argument is just as flawed as you claim Kanluen's is. And no one said that Tau were not a good army, all that has been said from what I can see is that Tau players find it silly and ridiculous how other players, Imperial players in particular (in my personal experience on here and playing games) complain on how "overpowered" Tau are and ignore all the nasty stuff they can field.

I don't understand why you are saying that Kataphrons can get boosted up to BS7. They get Canticles, which effectively makes them twin-linked. Are you refering to that?

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Pathfinders only have 5+ (as useless as ork armour against most basic weaponry). It's FWs that have 4+.

So what if Pathfinders "only have 5+"?

They're meant to be equivalent to Eldar Rangers, which are 5+ with Camo Cloaks.

Except, pathfinders do not have Camo Cloaks.
Or any other form of defense, at all.
They got a T3, Sv5+ as their only form of defense, that's basic guardsman level.
Anyone who ever has a problem of eradicating these from a distance-is doing something wrong with his list.

Alcibiades wrote:
I don't understand why you are saying that Kataphrons can get boosted up to BS7. They get Canticles, which effectively makes them twin-linked. Are you refering to that?

I might be getting Skitarii and Mechanicum mixed up, was pretty sure though Mechanicum had BS boosting shenanigans as well, if im wrong that's my bad . Either way doesn't hinder their ridiculous damage output, have watched way to many units get obliterated turn one by a mere 165pt. unit.

 Ghazkuul wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I can assure you that I don't play Tau, and I'm of the mind they're not overly powerful once you know how they work. You need four Markerlight hits to remove cover and boost a unit to BS5. Four. That's on average an 8-man Pathfinder team. Sure, it's cheap at 11ppm but it's also just eight guys in crappy armor. They'll test for running away after losing two guys. My SoB have never had any problems hunting down and killing Tau infantry - the suits are nasty but without ML support they too are just something to live through. Ofc, I use the utterly inconceivable tactic of having Dominion Squads outflank in Hflamer Immolators... It's sad to hear no other army has the luxury of delivering flamers into the midst of the enemy lines.

Crappy armor compared to what? Space Marines? yeah it is, but compared to my Orks its awesome. And with my armies lack of Anti Cover weapons I am usually hard pressed to remove those little blighters.

It's five plus armor dude.

EVERYTHING in the ork armory is AP5.

 gmaleron wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:
I don't understand why you are saying that Kataphrons can get boosted up to BS7. They get Canticles, which effectively makes them twin-linked. Are you refering to that?

I might be getting Skitarii and Mechanicum mixed up, was pretty sure though Mechanicum had BS boosting shenanigans as well, if im wrong that's my bad . Either way doesn't hinder their ridiculous damage output, have watched way to many units get obliterated turn one by a mere 165pt. unit.

Mechanicus can get Skitarii Doctrina Imperatives (which can raise BS to 7) through the war cohort formation.

Otherwise they're stuck with twin-linking their grav cannons. So BS 4.5, about.

But yeah grav-cannon Destroyers have jaw-dropping damage output against anything that is 2+ or 3+.

Alcibiades wrote:

 gmaleron wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:
I don't understand why you are saying that Kataphrons can get boosted up to BS7. They get Canticles, which effectively makes them twin-linked. Are you refering to that?

I might be getting Skitarii and Mechanicum mixed up, was pretty sure though Mechanicum had BS boosting shenanigans as well, if im wrong that's my bad . Either way doesn't hinder their ridiculous damage output, have watched way to many units get obliterated turn one by a mere 165pt. unit.

Mechanicus can get Skitarii Doctrina Imperatives (which can raise BS to 7) through the war cohort formation.

Otherwise they're stuck with twin-linking their grav cannons. So BS 4.5, about.

But yeah grav-cannon Destroyers have jaw-dropping damage output against anything that is 2+ or 3+.

Nope. Cohort gives canticles to everyone, not imperatives.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, for the record, how many points are 3 grav cents? They shorter range but 2+ armor as opposed to 4+.

the_scotsman wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:

 gmaleron wrote:

Alcibiades wrote:
I don't understand why you are saying that Kataphrons can get boosted up to BS7. They get Canticles, which effectively makes them twin-linked. Are you refering to that?

I might be getting Skitarii and Mechanicum mixed up, was pretty sure though Mechanicum had BS boosting shenanigans as well, if im wrong that's my bad . Either way doesn't hinder their ridiculous damage output, have watched way to many units get obliterated turn one by a mere 165pt. unit.

Mechanicus can get Skitarii Doctrina Imperatives (which can raise BS to 7) through the war cohort formation.

Otherwise they're stuck with twin-linking their grav cannons. So BS 4.5, about.

But yeah grav-cannon Destroyers have jaw-dropping damage output against anything that is 2+ or 3+.

Nope. Cohort gives canticles to everyone, not imperatives.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, for the record, how many points are 3 grav cents? They shorter range but 2+ armor as opposed to 4+.

Convocation then? The one that requires a unit of everything from both codexes. Not the one with the Knight.

Edit: I'm wrong, cohort does give you one turn of imperatives for cult mech. Good thing that formation is a minimum of around 2200 points and gives you one squad of grav servitors.

Alcibiades wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:

 Red Marine wrote:
MechWarrior was based off of a board game from the 80s. So theres some shade for the "not all giant robot stuff is asian" crowd. Then again theres mecha godzilla, which is older...

Anywho, just wait until the new tau codex drops. Then you'll definitely be that TFG play that-fething-army again. Especially if you have forgeworld. Seriously though, the idea of tau formations makes me lose sleep.

The point isn't that it's not Asian, as Tau draw from a lot of Asian cultures, it's that saying it's anime based is silly when it draws only faintly from it by virtue of the Mech Warrior images it was influenced by because those images were trying to fuse the mech warrior style with a hint of anime mecha style.

It's cool that Tau have all of these influences from China and even Japan, but it's absurd to say they're "anime" when their designer said he was influenced by Chinese foot soldiers and sci-fi Mech Warrior designs.

GW's designers are mostly middle-aged men, aren't they? (Who by the way seem reasonably well-read and educated -- "anti-agapic elixirs" lol). They are not the anime-watching demographic.

Whereas a lot of GW customers are teenagers or early-20s, who are the anime-watching demographic.

GW customers are reading their own interests into the designers.

Tau suits share the blocky shapes of Japanese 1980s mechanical design in comics and animation. FASA (Mechwarrior/Battletech - RPG, miniatures) used those designs and most of the GW designers were in their teens and twenties back then. Westernized Japanese animation like Robotech and Transformers were also pretty popular back then in the UK.

I agree that modern anime is unlikely to be an influence. Current mecha designs have been radically different since Evangelion and share little with the retro Tau style. In addition Gundam didn't catch on in the west outside of die hard anime circles before the 2000s.

Some third edition releases like Catachans, Necrons, Tau and Tyranids were more more sci-fi rather than science fantasy and all borrow elements from major movie properties like Alien, Predator, Starship Troopers and Terminator. The Tau suits and military in general heavily resembled the power armored mobile infantry from Heinlein as well which ironically would make them just as much Space Marines as their imperial counterparts.

the_scotsman wrote:

 Ghazkuul wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I can assure you that I don't play Tau, and I'm of the mind they're not overly powerful once you know how they work. You need four Markerlight hits to remove cover and boost a unit to BS5. Four. That's on average an 8-man Pathfinder team. Sure, it's cheap at 11ppm but it's also just eight guys in crappy armor. They'll test for running away after losing two guys. My SoB have never had any problems hunting down and killing Tau infantry - the suits are nasty but without ML support they too are just something to live through. Ofc, I use the utterly inconceivable tactic of having Dominion Squads outflank in Hflamer Immolators... It's sad to hear no other army has the luxury of delivering flamers into the midst of the enemy lines.

Crappy armor compared to what? Space Marines? yeah it is, but compared to my Orks its awesome. And with my armies lack of Anti Cover weapons I am usually hard pressed to remove those little blighters.

It's five plus armor dude.

EVERYTHING in the ork armory is AP5.

Except that unless im playing against the world dumbest Tau player, or had a board where we agreed to zero terrain (which would bone me harder then him) those pathfinders will be sitting in 4+ ruins. Also what Ork weapons have AP4? the weapons that DO have AP4 or less are usually our higher strength weapons that were trying to wreck vehicles with or are range 24 or less, or close combat weapons. And the only common AP4 weapon that has the range to feth up Pathfinders is the Deff Gun S7 Ap4 which again I would rather be shooting at higher priority targets then T3 models. 1 unit of lootas would have to give up shooting a higher priority unit to negate the Pathfinders armor and as I said above THEY ARE ALWAYS IN COVER if they aren't then the Tau player failed already. a unit of 10 lootas rolling 2 shots a piece = 20 shots, 6 - 7 will actually hit and 5-6 will wound statistically. So yeah if they are in the open HOORAY we did something, if they are in cover then only 3ish die.

You can have terrain that isnt ruins you know. I've had to put my foot down on this several times. Also, some battles would take place in clearings.

bob82ca wrote:

Jaxler wrote:
Most of the arguments I see are either about tau being too noble bright, being animie inspired or about them being OP and annoying to play against. Most of which I feel aren't exactly grounded in realty or are based off older versions of the game or Tau lore. I'll admit I'm a little biased as a guy who plays tau and finds Japanese history interesting, but most of the stuff people complain about usually seems a little ignorant to me, especially when it's the same complaints I've seen be put out over and over without any facts or arguments to back it up. I also wish the people who complain about tau being "weebo trash" would realize that just because something takes inspiration from eastern culture doesn't mean it takes inspiration from eastern pop culture. Also, when people still call tau OP even after necrons space marines and eldar have gotten their new codexes It makes me roll my eyes a little. I really feel tau don't deserve the disproportionate amount of spite and loathing that they get.

People hate Tau.....that's why you keep hearing it. It's not about how good they are competitively, it's that they're really f-ing annoying. You can't see it because you play Tau...you're one of those guys! Let me ask a few questions:

Is your army fully painted? Or are you rocking the 3 Colour minimum? Gotta get those competitive models on the board fast!

Have you ever, in a fit of joy grabbed your opponents model with your greasy fingers to remove it from play? This is a tau/ Eldar thing that seems to happen to me a lot.

And finally what percent of games do you win against your friends? Are you contempt to concede half the games you play? Or do you win 80 percent of the time and still play like its the championship game of the world on those20 percent games where your opponent is ahead?

I mean you can't say that ALL Tau players are like this....I understand that. But I'll tell you that it's been my personal experience. And I know I'm not the only person.

I don't see what your point is; I could just as easily copy-paste that and replace "Tau" with "[strong codex of the month]"

It takes a certain type of person to relish in the idea of endlessly Kiting you opponent, taking 2 shooting phases and 2 movement phases. Sadistic nerds with an agenda.....

Yes, the agenda of playing with a different, more creative strategy than just 'sprint and chainsword'. They're obviously hiding something nefarious

 Ghazkuul wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

 Ghazkuul wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I can assure you that I don't play Tau, and I'm of the mind they're not overly powerful once you know how they work. You need four Markerlight hits to remove cover and boost a unit to BS5. Four. That's on average an 8-man Pathfinder team. Sure, it's cheap at 11ppm but it's also just eight guys in crappy armor. They'll test for running away after losing two guys. My SoB have never had any problems hunting down and killing Tau infantry - the suits are nasty but without ML support they too are just something to live through. Ofc, I use the utterly inconceivable tactic of having Dominion Squads outflank in Hflamer Immolators... It's sad to hear no other army has the luxury of delivering flamers into the midst of the enemy lines.

Crappy armor compared to what? Space Marines? yeah it is, but compared to my Orks its awesome. And with my armies lack of Anti Cover weapons I am usually hard pressed to remove those little blighters.

It's five plus armor dude.

EVERYTHING in the ork armory is AP5.

Except that unless im playing against the world dumbest Tau player, or had a board where we agreed to zero terrain (which would bone me harder then him) those pathfinders will be sitting in 4+ ruins. Also what Ork weapons have AP4? the weapons that DO have AP4 or less are usually our higher strength weapons that were trying to wreck vehicles with or are range 24 or less, or close combat weapons. And the only common AP4 weapon that has the range to feth up Pathfinders is the Deff Gun S7 Ap4 which again I would rather be shooting at higher priority targets then T3 models. 1 unit of lootas would have to give up shooting a higher priority unit to negate the Pathfinders armor and as I said above THEY ARE ALWAYS IN COVER if they aren't then the Tau player failed already. a unit of 10 lootas rolling 2 shots a piece = 20 shots, 6 - 7 will actually hit and 5-6 will wound statistically. So yeah if they are in the open HOORAY we did something, if they are in cover then only 3ish die.

... Again, pathfinders have a 5+ not a 4+. Fire warriors have a 4+.

How people have issue killing T3 models with a 5+ save (4+ IF they get cover potentially) that cannot move since Marker Lights are a Heavy Weapon is beyond me. Newsflash, if you kill the Pathfinders your neuter their entire army especially one that is over reliant on them...hint...hint!

bob82ca wrote:

Jaxler wrote:
Most of the arguments I see are either about tau being too noble bright, being animie inspired or about them being OP and annoying to play against. Most of which I feel aren't exactly grounded in realty or are based off older versions of the game or Tau lore. I'll admit I'm a little biased as a guy who plays tau and finds Japanese history interesting, but most of the stuff people complain about usually seems a little ignorant to me, especially when it's the same complaints I've seen be put out over and over without any facts or arguments to back it up. I also wish the people who complain about tau being "weebo trash" would realize that just because something takes inspiration from eastern culture doesn't mean it takes inspiration from eastern pop culture. Also, when people still call tau OP even after necrons space marines and eldar have gotten their new codexes It makes me roll my eyes a little. I really feel tau don't deserve the disproportionate amount of spite and loathing that they get.

People hate Tau.....that's why you keep hearing it. It's not about how good they are competitively, it's that they're really f-ing annoying. You can't see it because you play Tau...you're one of those guys! Let me ask a few questions:

Is your army fully painted? Or are you rocking the 3 Colour minimum? Gotta get those competitive models on the board fast!

Have you ever, in a fit of joy grabbed your opponents model with your greasy fingers to remove it from play? This is a tau/ Eldar thing that seems to happen to me a lot.

And finally what percent of games do you win against your friends? Are you contempt to concede half the games you play? Or do you win 80 percent of the time and still play like its the championship game of the world on those20 percent games where your opponent is ahead?

I mean you can't say that ALL Tau players are like this....I understand that. But I'll tell you that it's been my personal experience. And I know I'm not the only person. It takes a certain type of person to relish in the idea of endlessly Kiting you opponent, taking 2 shooting phases and 2 movement phases. Sadistic nerds with an agenda.....

I've got my army painted in like 8-12 colors depending in what I use for detailing, and I've gotten most of my army painted. I tend to not net list the op gak I can and because of this I'm not exactly winning 80% of the time. I don't touch other people's stuff and I most certainly don't concede half of the time. I'm not a sadistic feth, I'm just a guy who wanting to play the army that does something logical and brings a gun to a sword fight. Also tau look a lot better than space marines IMO which is also a large part of why I chose to run them.

But if you think I've some sort of unholy plan to ruin your fun whilst I twiddle my cliche Saturday cartoon villain mustache than you must be true right?

Jaxler wrote:
Most of the arguments I see are either about tau being too noble bright, being animie inspired or about them being OP and annoying to play against. Most of which I feel aren't exactly grounded in realty or are based off older versions of the game or Tau lore. I'll admit I'm a little biased as a guy who plays tau and finds Japanese history interesting, but most of the stuff people complain about usually seems a little ignorant to me, especially when it's the same complaints I've seen be put out over and over without any facts or arguments to back it up. I also wish the people who complain about tau being "weebo trash" would realize that just because something takes inspiration from eastern culture doesn't mean it takes inspiration from eastern pop culture. Also, when people still call tau OP even after necrons space marines and eldar have gotten their new codexes It makes me roll my eyes a little. I really feel tau don't deserve the disproportionate amount of spite and loathing that they get.

Yeah you are right man, ignoring cover save isnt a big deal at all in warhammer 40k...

 Ghazkuul wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

 Ghazkuul wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 master of ordinance wrote:
Sadly this is one of those Tau players whom dosnt like to admit just how powerful Tau are.

I can assure you that I don't play Tau, and I'm of the mind they're not overly powerful once you know how they work. You need four Markerlight hits to remove cover and boost a unit to BS5. Four. That's on average an 8-man Pathfinder team. Sure, it's cheap at 11ppm but it's also just eight guys in crappy armor. They'll test for running away after losing two guys. My SoB have never had any problems hunting down and killing Tau infantry - the suits are nasty but without ML support they too are just something to live through. Ofc, I use the utterly inconceivable tactic of having Dominion Squads outflank in Hflamer Immolators... It's sad to hear no other army has the luxury of delivering flamers into the midst of the enemy lines.

Crappy armor compared to what? Space Marines? yeah it is, but compared to my Orks its awesome. And with my armies lack of Anti Cover weapons I am usually hard pressed to remove those little blighters.

It's five plus armor dude.

EVERYTHING in the ork armory is AP5.

Except that unless im playing against the world dumbest Tau player, or had a board where we agreed to zero terrain (which would bone me harder then him) those pathfinders will be sitting in 4+ ruins. Also what Ork weapons have AP4? the weapons that DO have AP4 or less are usually our higher strength weapons that were trying to wreck vehicles with or are range 24 or less, or close combat weapons. And the only common AP4 weapon that has the range to feth up Pathfinders is the Deff Gun S7 Ap4 which again I would rather be shooting at higher priority targets then T3 models. 1 unit of lootas would have to give up shooting a higher priority unit to negate the Pathfinders armor and as I said above THEY ARE ALWAYS IN COVER if they aren't then the Tau player failed already. a unit of 10 lootas rolling 2 shots a piece = 20 shots, 6 - 7 will actually hit and 5-6 will wound statistically. So yeah if they are in the open HOORAY we did something, if they are in cover then only 3ish die.

Didn't read the reply at all, huh. So they're T3 units with LD 7 and 5+ armor. Shoot them, with anything (why would you need AP4? Do you think AP works on cover?) and they'll die.