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2015/11/16 04:45:16
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
Orlanth wrote: Where is this leprechaun dream of 'forced to quit the field'?
Railing against "Fenians" before, now "leprechauns"? If all you have are bigoted statements you have already lost.
Actually its a comment about your believe anything Irish Nationalists say mentality as seen before.
You don't realise it, the dogmatised rarely do, but you are unable to look at The Troubles rationally. Its a common occurance amongst those whose history of Ireland is separated from reality by several thousand miles, a few generations and many tales over pints. The sort of nonsense that made the USA one of major global donor states of terrorist funding back in the 80's and before.
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/11/16 04:51:51
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
This makes it sound like you're arguing over the exact percentage Islam contributes to the unrest in the ME rather than whether or not it does.
...
Problem has variables X, Y, and Z. You can focus exclusively on X, and completely ignore Y and Z, but it just means you're not really solving the problem and possibly don't even understand it.
Also note that when I say 'related' I didn't say 'contributes.' Islam for example is related to the issues some ME countries have with Nationalism, but only in so far as such countries identify Islam as core to their national identity in the same way many western states once identified with Christianity.
On the other hand, Islam does contribute to Class Inequality in many ME countries. The marriage and inheritance practices of many of these countries are very related to the popular Islamic beliefs of the region and have created a social dynamic were very powerful (and very large) family groups end up consolidating a lot of wealth among themselves. But in such case, is Islam really the problem. It's not like class inequality is unique to the ME. The ME isn't even the worst in the world on the subject (looking at you India!). In such case, Islam isn't the problem, so much as a mechanism creating the problem. It could easily be a dozen other things. We don't exactly need Islam here in the west to fuel class inequality.
The argument I'm making is the difference between ignorant superficiality and critical analysis.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
LordofHats wrote: Stoning was never very popular in the West. We much preferred burning at the stake
Indeed. Although it wasn't nearly as common as some people might make it out to be. Witch Hunts were extremely rare with only a small handful of documented cases. Even during the fabled Inquisition they weren't extremely common, total numbers of people executed during the Inquisitions is actually pretty low(only 3-5 thousand at most). Most people got away with relatively minor punishments.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
However there was a lot of torture, and the lesser punishments were often anything but minor..
The main problem with Inquisitors is the fear they generate. England had it less bad than most other European countries. There was a witch hunt, and a Witchfinder General, but his reign of terror did not last long, and he murdered relatively few women, but his investigations caused a climate of fear amongst women nationwide. Mostly because women (and most others) knew the justifications for accusation were bogus and this knew they were unsafe even if they were not witches.
Point is a witch hunt need find precious few victims to have a very widespread and enormously damaging societal effect.
Guerrilla movements count on this, the more you search for terrorists the more you alienate the culture they come from and the easier it is to recruit more terrorists.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/11/16 05:10:59
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/11/16 05:07:58
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
True, but there really is no comparison with what is happening in the Middle East right now.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
To be fair, I think beheading is the all time human favorite method of execution. Lacking chemistry, electricity, and gunpowder, it's the most efficient option
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
There are an astonishing number of methods to decapitate someone.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
awwhahaha. How I miss the old Red vs Blue. First season was the best.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Grey Templar wrote: True, but there really is no comparison with what is happening in the Middle East right now.
The analogy holds directly.
How do you find ISIS sympathisers and activists amongst a minority population?
- By scrutinising them.
How do you scrutinise them without infringing on privacy and human rights?
- With extreme difficulty and a much lowered chance of detecting murderous scum.
Read between the lines here. As the article explains Emwazi was one the way to radicalisation in 2009 according to an MI5 professional, and that his excuse that he was being forced into radicalisation was just an attempt to shirk responsibility for his own moral fall.
Cage said it had released the transcripts in a bid to support its claim that Emwazi was not a militant before the security services “harassed and intimidated” the Londoner, a suggestion that some will regard as risible.
It does raise questions as to whether some people join ISIS or similar movements due to a perception of mistreatment. Jihadists will certainly want to paint that picture and it can be an effective tool to rile impressionable people, especially converts, into extremism.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
LordofHats wrote: To be fair, I think beheading is the all time human favorite method of execution. Lacking chemistry, electricity, and gunpowder, it's the most efficient option
Its not very efficient because its very messy and needs clean up. Hanging issfar more efficient.
As for the favourite execution method, I would say forced starvation is. Deliberate cutting off of food and water supplies with the intent to kill is the historically most favoured method of 'executing' people. Working in the salt mines while dying is an optional extra.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/11/16 05:33:16
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2015/11/16 07:55:56
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
We need to stop pretending that these attacks have nothing to do with Islam. We need to stop pretending that anyone who uses the phrase 'Islamic terrorism' is somehow a bigot or, more inaccurately, a racist (ignoring the fact that 'Muslims' aren't a race, but whatever...).
But don't take my word for it. Take the word of a Muslim, who perhaps has a far better perspective on this than any of us idiots:
Apologies if that took a while to load wrote:“I want to thank well-meaning non-Muslims who, in the wake of these attacks, have emphasised that they have been carried out by a small, twisted minority. A terrorist’s goal is to sow hatred and discord, and by not giving in, you are defeating their plans.
But I want to say that as a Muslim, I wish that we weren’t so quick to emphasise that this has nothing to do with us. While I personally have never killed anyone and none of my friends and family have ever resorted to violence, radicalism has everything to do with Islam. And the failure to address that out of a well-intentioned commitment to tolerance is making the problem worse.
ISIS is a Muslim organisation, and it is an Islamic problem. Let me say it again to be perfectly clear. ISIS is a Muslim organisation, and they are a cancer at the heart of Islam. And the problem will not go away until Muslims confront that.
ISIS attackers scream ‘Allah hu’akbar’ during their attacks.
ISIS recruits cite Qur’anic verses as justification for the rape and enslavement of women.
ISIS soldiers kill archaeologists, gay men and women, and people who refuse to convert to Islam because they are blasphemers.
There are no Christians in ISIS. There are no Buddhists, Jews, Pagans, Taoists, Houngans, Catholics, Wiccans, Hindus or even Scientologists in ISIS. ISIS is a Muslim organisation and they kill in the name of Islam.
So don’t say that ISIS aren’t ‘true Muslims’ or that they are ‘not really Muslims’. Like any large organisation, ISIS exists in a spectrum.
You have the aimless, restless teenager who never amounted to anything in his life and traveled to Syria because he can’t find a job and doesn’t know if the Qur’an is to be read from left to right or right to left. But you also have pious professionals, businessmen, and academics who read their Qur’an cover to cover, pray every day, were seduced into radicalism, and truly believe that the Islamic State’s goal of conquest is a noble one. The so-called ‘Caliph’ Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi has a doctorate in Islamic studies.
So if you feel that Muslims are being oppressed or killed in Muslim countries, I expect you to also be just as outraged by ISIS. Because they have killed more Muslims in Iraq, Syria and Jordan than the entire US army.
They have done more damage to the name and reputation of Islam than any Western nation. ISIS is Islam’s biggest enemy, not the US, not Israel or France or Germany or the Russians.
We have to own the problem. We have to admit that this is a religious problem, and we need to renew our commitment to a secular country which treats all religions equally. I have believed in the importance of secularism all my life, and with every day that passes that belief grows stronger. Religion is no way to govern a nation. Not any religion, and not any nation.
ISIS is not America’s problem, nor the British, nor the French. ISIS is not Syria or Iraq’s problem. ISIS is a problem for Muslims. And if you can’t admit that, you’re not really a good Muslim either.”
H.B.M.C. wrote: We need to stop pretending that these attacks have nothing to do with Islam. We need to stop pretending that anyone who uses the phrase 'Islamic terrorism' is somehow a bigot or, more inaccurately, a racist (ignoring the fact that 'Muslims' aren't a race, but whatever...).
Nice strawman you've built for yourself there.
Taking issue with a sweeping generalization like "Muslims are the problem" is completely different from thinking Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with Islam.
Linked article is great though for making the point I have been making every time this issue comes up and someone inevitably jumps to "how terribad those Muslims are we should purge them" comments. Does this mean I won internets?
Just read page 1. Not much time to read, but I wanted to say this:
My sympathies for the people affected, the families affected, and the french nation in general. Also my sympathies for true muslims. There is nothing wrong with believing, and being framed because of a minority who have their own twisted culture and liken themselves to innocent people who have faith in their god is just horrible.
2015/11/16 08:16:39
Subject: Re:bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
Yes these attacks are to convey the IS ideology. I am not a religious man, but with these terrorist organizations that have their thinking set in the middle ages i am all for an eye for an eye.
(although i mean destroying the organisation and not the innocents, but also fill the power vacuum so that some other organisation fills the void in a few years.)
LordofHats wrote: Exactly what has been the popular opinion concerning the Syrian Civil War in France? Maybe it's been mentioned before, but I missed it.
You mean, before ISIS ? Most of us supported the rebels.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/11/16 08:42:40
Scientia potentia est.
In girum imus nocte ecce et consumimur igni.
2015/11/16 08:45:04
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
Not exactly. We were still supporting those who fought Assad for their rights in Syria, but most forgot about them to focus on ISIS. Until recently our military goals were : Destroy ISIS and get Assad out of power.
Scientia potentia est.
In girum imus nocte ecce et consumimur igni.
2015/11/16 08:58:50
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
Now would seem to be a time to consider the practicality of removing Assad, which is unfortunate. The guy is a tosser and it would be really nice to have him gone.
Gonna need to put thought in that one. Total douche and turd decision.
Tribalism/Oligarchy
Extreme Class Inequality
Horrible dependence on Oil for economic development
Their selection of Hats is lacking
Political corruption
Some extreme cases of nationalism and racism
Some of these things are related to Islam, some of them aren't, but either way, saying "Islam is the problem" is ignorance.
This is correct. Also, to say "Islam" is the problem is an insult to all our Islamic members.
Remember Rule no.1
Also keep away from calling Irish people leprechauns.
LordofHats wrote: To be fair, I think beheading is the all time human favorite method of execution. Lacking chemistry, electricity, and gunpowder, it's the most efficient option
Are we discounting starvation?
2015/11/16 09:21:17
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
LordofHats wrote: To be fair, I think beheading is the all time human favorite method of execution. Lacking chemistry, electricity, and gunpowder, it's the most efficient option
Are we discounting starvation?
Starving a person to death takes up space and time.
Burying them alive on the other hand, kill two birds with one stone. Especially if you get them to dig their own grave.
DS:90-S+G+++M++B-IPw40k03+D+A++/fWD-R++T(T)DM+ Warmachine MKIII record 39W/0D/6L
2015/11/16 09:37:51
Subject: bad news, Suspected Terror Attack in Paris. (again :( )
Ahtman wrote: If there isn't a cute hashtag does it really warrant any feigned interest? How can one pretend to do something online if there isn't a hashtag?!
Change your facebook profile picture obviously.
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
