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Hi Dakka, need your help with a list to counter Tau specifically (trying to chew through their units/take out MCs with TWC). Here's what I have so far:

HQ

WGBL - Thunderwolf, Armour of Russ, Power Fist, Wolf Claw
180 points
Rune Priest - Bike, Runic Axe, ML2, Runic Armour *rolling on Divination*
130 points

Troops

15 Blood Claws - 1PF, 1 Melta, 1 Flamer, Stormwolf with Heavy Bolters
435 points
10 Grey Hunters - 2 Meltas, Drop Pod
195 points

Fast Attack

6 TWC - 2PF+SS, 3 more SS
365 points
6 TWC - 2PF+SS, 2 more SS
350 points

Heavy Support

Long Fangs - 1 Lascannon (split firing), 4 ML, WGPL with Termie Armour
195 points

Total - 1850pts

How does that look so far? I don't exactly know what I'm doing here but this is just from what I've picked up from various Dakka posts so far

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

You really need an explanation behind not taking Champions of Fenris.

Storm wolf is dead weight. Grey Hunters will die for sure. Better spend these points elsewhere by taking TWC Iron Priests or just plain Servitors.

Pack in more Psykers, ally with something that has H&R like DA and your Loadout on WGBL is mean. Just take a fist and a shield, maybe a re-roll talisman.

 cabal_therapy wrote:
You really need an explanation behind not taking Champions of Fenris.

Storm wolf is dead weight. Grey Hunters will die for sure. Better spend these points elsewhere by taking TWC Iron Priests or just plain Servitors.

Pack in more Psykers, ally with something that has H&R like DA and your Loadout on WGBL is mean. Just take a fist and a shield, maybe a re-roll talisman.

I don't know anything about the Champions of Fenris supplement, why is it so much better?

I also thought the Stormwolf would be great as it's an assault vehicle and can unload that big unit of blood claws within charging range as soon as it comes on. Why is it not good here? Surely it's good to have air superiority?

I could swap out the WGBL for another rune priest on bike but the way I have WGBL he can tank and also take all comers in assault.

I need a little guidance here haha, I'm pretty new to Wolves

 13045273 wrote:

 cabal_therapy wrote:
You really need an explanation behind not taking Champions of Fenris.

Storm wolf is dead weight. Grey Hunters will die for sure. Better spend these points elsewhere by taking TWC Iron Priests or just plain Servitors.

Pack in more Psykers, ally with something that has H&R like DA and your Loadout on WGBL is mean. Just take a fist and a shield, maybe a re-roll talisman.

I don't know anything about the Champions of Fenris supplement, why is it so much better?

I also thought the Stormwolf would be great as it's an assault vehicle and can unload that big unit of blood claws within charging range as soon as it comes on. Why is it not good here? Surely it's good to have air superiority?

I could swap out the WGBL for another rune priest on bike but the way I have WGBL he can tank and also take all comers in assault.

I need a little guidance here haha, I'm pretty new to Wolves

Champions of fenris lets you run all TWC, so it's very popular right now and would be effective against tau as they are very weak in CC

You don't want to unload the wolf claws the turn they come on because they can't assault until the next turn and that will leave them vulnerable tau shooting. They need the protection of the transport until they are ready to assault. In this situation, a land raider crusader may be better. Also, since the tau flyers suck, you're not likely to face one so air superiority may not be that important. Tau can also have a lot of interceptor so watch out with your reserves.

I wouldn't drop the WGBL, I would drop the rune priest and switch him out for ulrik as you need him to escort your blood claws. At the very least you need a wolf priest with that unit. One psyker isn't going to help your army much.

On a side note, I would run you TWC in small units. Maybe even squads of three. Tau excellent at wiping out units like TWC especially since they can now combine their shooting with the new hunter cadre. The smaller the units, the more target you give your opponent forcing him to break up his shooting. TWC will tear through tau, but only if you get to them. MSU helps you make sure some of them make it.

It's so much better because you have +1 WS on your Wolf Guard and have mandatory Elites+bonus Elites slots.
Read your own books!

Storm Wolf starts in Reserves, meaning it's probably never where you want it.
It's gun is decent but not as oppressive as it has to. Also trying to disembark from flyer is crap. All this together and you have a flyer that fails to do whatever you want it to.
It gets hit by pretty much everything - you mentioned Tau, piece of cake for them - and its payload is not rewarding. 15 Bloodclaws are derpsquad : bunch of AP- hits with WS 3, and that's it. Next to nothing if you try to hit 2+ armor.

About WGBL, my concern was Armor of Russ - a lackluster relic - and a Wolf Claw that doesn't do anything but you pay for it nonetheless.

For TWC to be effective there is to be two things : Hit and Run shared and some defensive Psypower like Invisibility or Sanctuary. Adding a White Scars Bike Conclave is a perfect example of how you cover both these weaknesses.

That's pretty much it. I'm not an expert in Space Wolves but I know a thing or two. To be honest, they are in fact a two-trick pony if you want to be competitive, so I'm not really far

Edit : guy on top of me got some good points. MSU TWC is a good way to beat Tau. But you want that Runepriest to buff your team - Endrurance is awesome.

 cabal_therapy wrote:


guy on top of me got some good points. MSU TWC is a good way to beat Tau. But you want that Runepriest to buff your team - Endrurance is awesome.

But thats the problem with the librarian/runepriest when not brought in numbers or in a conclave, He may not even roll the spells he needs and then hes sunk all those points into a useless addition to the TWC. Plus, if he does use MSU, the one ruin priest will only be able to buff 2 of the squads max, and thats if he rolls the powers he needs and enough WC to cast them. I think it's too situational. The whole point of the MSU is to keep the units cheaper to mitigate their loss which is very probable as they are charging toward the tau lines. One ruin priest isn't going to make a big difference. OTOH, if he is intent on running the blood claws, the wolf priest is pretty much a requirement to make sure they are at their best. Even at WS 3 they get 60 attacks on the charge. That's gonna do something even against 2+ armour. Add the PE from the wolf priest and they can be pretty hard hitting. I feel like the Wolf priest just synergized better with what he has. If he were to go with CoF and run all TWC then I would go ruin priest but I would add more than one. Two minimum.

You certainly have a point there. Thumbs up!

give the leader a shield and frost axe on thunderwolf mount?

Wolfstar. Profit.

Take an allied attachment of DW. Give the HQ beacon angelis.
Take 1 squad of DW veterans for troops.

Take an inquisitor.
Give him a plasma syphon.
Attach him to the veterans.

Attach the DW HQ to any deepstrike or pod unit in your main force.

Attach any star of units you wish to the DW veterans.

Deepstrike or pod the unit the DW HQ is attached too into the Tau lines. Use the beacon to bring the veterans anywhere within 6". The plasma syphon will cause all plasma weapons in 12 " to shoot at BS 1. If you pinched the Tau by their board edge they will have nowhere to run. Murder them all.

Champions is a supplement.
Company of the Great Wolf is the FOC.
Company requires one HQ and two Elites rather han two HQs and two Troops.

Most people like to spam Thunderwolf mounts.

Before Libby Conclave came out variations on this were the bee's knees.

HQ
Wolf Lord with Thunderwolf Mount, Wolf Claws or Kraken Blade
Rune Priest with Runic Armour, Bike and Sanctic Daemonology
Rune Priest with Runic Armour, Bike and Sanctic Daemonology

Elites
Iron Priest with Thunderwolf Mount and Cyberwolves
Iron Priest with Thunderwolf Mount and Cyberwolves

Fast Attack
3x TWC TH/SS
3x TWC TH/SS
3x TWC TH/SS

Roll for Sanctuary on Sanctic Daemonology on the Rune Priests, gather the ICs together in a TWC unit and walk across the field with 2++ Invulnerable saves, kill anything that gets in the way with Force Weapons, AP2 Swords and Thunderhammers. Use the leftover units to draw fire away from the killy squad until it's too late.

When does it work?
When your opponent has spammed big stuff.
When your opponent panics and tries to run.
When your opponent is running a hoard.

When does it fail?
When your opponent has MSU and doesn't panic.
When your opponent has a modern deathstar.
When your opponent uses a Clexus Assassin.
When your opponent uses Sisters of Silence.

If you want a super competitive list just spam thunderwolves and the wulfen murderpack.

I usually take the CAD instead, with something like that:

wolf lord, black death, storm shield, thunderwolf

3x8 grey hunters, melta, pack leader with combi melta, drop pod

5 twc, 3 shields, 1 thunder hammer (or powerfist + melta bomb)

4 twc, 2 shields (with the lord)

wulfen murderpack wth 2x5 wulfen (leader, 2 th/ss, 2 axes, 1 stormfrag autolauncher in each unit)

wyrdstorm brotherhood with 3 rune priests, one lv2 and 2 lv with grey hunters.

Sometimes I cut the pack leaders to stick some other storm shields and/or a couple of puppies for the lord. Alternatively I bring the third 5 man squad of wulfen dropping the psykers and some grey hunter.

Couple of things that are wrong so far.

Remember Tau have Photon Grenades, so no bonus attacks on the charge.

Also the Plasma Syphon doesn't work against Pulse Weapons. They are not defined as plasma weapons in the rule book. If you do want to insist that they are then watch as your opponent takes a Haemotrope Reactor and gives all his squads blast weapons.

Cheers

Andrew

Personally, at the moment I run Wolf Claw Strike Force for just about everything, been tampring with this

Ironwolves

Wolf Guard Battle Leader Storm Shield, Bolt Pistol.

Long Fang Ancient Flamer, Long Fang Heavy Bolter, Wolf Guard Pack Leader Combi-Flamer, Drop Pod Locator Beacon Deathwind Missile Launcher.

Blood Claws Flamer, Drop Pod Locator Beacon Deayhwind Missile Launcher.

Blood Claws, Rhino all vehicle upgrades.

Land Speeder, Multi-melta Typhoon Missile Launcher.

Land Speeder, Multi-melta Typhoon Missile Launcher.

Land Speeder, Heavy Bolter Typhoon Missile Launcher, Land Speeder, Heavy Flamer Typhoon Missile Launcher.

Land Speeder, Heavy Bolter Typhoon Missile Launcher, Land Speeder, Heavy Flamer Typhoon Missile Launcher.

Murderfang, Lucius Drop Pod.

Heralds of the Great Wolf.
Old Iron Priest, Thunderwolf Bolt Pistol 3x Cyber Wolves.
Wolf Priest, Bike Runic Armour.
Rune Priest, Runic Armour Mastery Level 2 Bike.
Preferred disciplines
- Sanctic Daemonology, Hammer Hands, Sanctuary.

Wyrdstorm Brotherhood
4x Runic Priest, Runic Armour, Mastery Level 2 Bike
Preferred disciplines
- Sanctic Daemonology, Hammer Hands, Sanctuary.
- Divination, Prescience, Foreboding, Forewarning.
-Tempestas, anything.

Gameplan against Tau.
Keep Rhino Blood Claws and double Land Speeder squads in Reserves.
Drop Murderfang and Long Fangs with WGBL on as many marker Drones as possible, burn them off.
Gather fast ICs into Heralds unit and head up field using relevant Psychic powers then running/turbo-boosting.
Open fire with single Land Speeders, dropping pie plates on Marker Lights - assuming there are any left - pie plate any other soft targets if there aren't.

Then we put down the MCs.

That's the plan anyway.

 AndrewC wrote:
Couple of things that are wrong so far.

Remember Tau have Photon Grenades, so no bonus attacks on the charge.

Also the Plasma Syphon doesn't work against Pulse Weapons. They are not defined as plasma weapons in the rule book. If you do want to insist that they are then watch as your opponent takes a Haemotrope Reactor and gives all his squads blast weapons.

Cheers

Andrew

Q: What counts as a plasma weapon for the Ulumeathi Plasma
Syphon? (p62)
A: All Plasma weapons, as well as Eldar missile launchers firing
plasma missiles, burst cannons, starcannons, all Tau pulse
weapons and any weapon described as using ‘plasma’ as its
effect or in its special rules.

Per FAQ.

Unless this has since been changed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
This is the most recent I could find. So I guess they removed pulse weapons from it.

Q: Can we get a clarification on what counts as a plasma
weapon for an Ulumeathi Plasma Syphon in Codex: Inquisition , please?
A: All plasma weapons as defined in Warhammer 40,000:
The Rules (plasma pistols, plasma guns and plasma
cannons), the secondary weapon of a combi-plasma,
and plasma grenades are all plasma weapons. Any other
weapon whose name has the word ‘plasma’ in it (such as
a Tau Empire plasma rifle) is also a plasma weapon for
the purposes of an Ulumeathi Plasma Syphon.