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"And really, if you can't deal with a T6/W5 3+/5++ creature, then the problem is not your codex, but requires a look in the mirror...
"

It's never just one thing, though, is it? It requires 17ish BS 4 grav gun shots to kill this thing. And that's with no cover. With cover, it's 25 shots. I think it's pretty safe to say that most BA lists can't get than many grav shots on this guy without being shot to death or assualted before they can fire.

So what you're saying is you can't deal with the current Skarbrand?

Honestly, the reason I wouldn't want him as a GC is Stomp. Moving 12" would be fine, FNP would be fine. Poison resistance would be seriously annoying, but far from the end of the world - it'd be a bigger problem for Tyranids than anyone else, since drowning the big Daemons in venomous Hormagaunts is one of the better ways to kill them now.

jade_angel wrote:
So what you're saying is you can't deal with the current Skarbrand?

Honestly, the reason I wouldn't want him as a GC is Stomp. Moving 12" would be fine, FNP would be fine. Poison resistance would be seriously annoying, but far from the end of the world - it'd be a bigger problem for Tyranids than anyone else, since drowning the big Daemons in venomous Hormagaunts is one of the better ways to kill them now.

I forgot about stomp.

Does the current Skarbrand have FNP? Because if so, I'd say yes, BA can't handle him at all.

No, not currently unless you buff him with psychic powers. He's basically just a buffed-up Bloodthirster whose wings don't work. The fact that he's slower than a standard Bloodthirster is why a lot of folks don't like him.

jade_angel wrote:
No, not currently unless you buff him with psychic powers. He's basically just a buffed-up Bloodthirster whose wings don't work. The fact that he's slower than a standard Bloodthirster is why a lot of folks don't like him.

That makes him significantly easier to kill, then. GMC automatically giving FNP is actually pretty huge.

He's the easiest Mc in the codex to kill. He's really quite useless. Martel, despite your negativity about BA, I think you would find that he is wayy easier to handle than you'd expect. I think you should try using him against BA someday (not cc only BA) and see if you can get any use out of him. Or just plaY against him and judge his effectiveness then.

He's pretty darn useless right now, and certainly pales compared to other similar choices in the same codex.

AncientSkarbrand wrote:
He's the easiest Mc in the codex to kill. He's really quite useless. Martel, despite your negativity about BA, I think you would find that he is wayy easier to handle than you'd expect. I think you should try using him against BA someday (not cc only BA) and see if you can get any use out of him. Or just plaY against him and judge his effectiveness then.

He's pretty darn useless right now, and certainly pales compared to other similar choices in the same codex.

He's actually on a level of usefulness lower than Warptalons...

And yet, he's supposedly the biggest, meanest, craziest, most psychotic out of control killing machine of ALL of Khorne's Bloodthirsters. Somehow. (but not really!)

He hits like a truck - if he ever *gets* there.

jade_angel wrote:
He hits like a truck - if he ever *gets* there.

Warptalons hit pretty hard too, but at least they can 'get there'.

Skarbrand's only hope currently to ever see combat is to DS him off of a Khornate icon that's within ready assault range of the enemy, and then pray he doesn't get smoked in the enemy shooting phase. (or else that the enemy doesn't simply run out of his assault range, which isn't hard to do!)

Haha exactly, it's so easy for your opponent to neutralize him entirely, even without killing him. He isn't even threatening. Just move away. If you have to, feed him a little unit... but you shouldn't have to. And his flamer weapon is sooooo useless because you want him in combat, you don't want to reduce your random charge range at all. The only time it's useful is against 20 man csm blobs or gaunts, the former you don't see anymore and the other is absolutely not who skarbrand should be fighting.

I've used him 3 times, got into combat with a unit of scouts because my opponent dictates who fights him. Then he dies after consolidating, making perhaps 40-50 of his points back.

The other games he was dead turn 2 directly after deep striking.

A cc unit has to be very durable to even work now. Skarbrand needs a boost but perhaps not exactly GC status. It's not a l2p thing either... he just cannot be used well.

By contrast, a Daemon Prince with wings is still a reasonable threat, even without using psychic dickery, just because of 12" moves...