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Hi everyone, I am new to Dark Eldar and had some thoughts I wanted to share. I have been reviewing the Dark Artesian formation, and recently found out that you can make units of 1-3 pain engines on their own.

Comparing 3 talos to a Dark Artesian (with WWP, 4+ FNP, Scissor Hands) which both are 360 pts, the 3 talos is significantly better combat wise.

Off the charge the damage output vs MEQ is 9 kills to 5.

So my question is: is the Dark Artesian really worth it? Is halving the damage output worth the 4+ FNP and the ability to DS and flame something with the ap3 flamer? I know the main reason for the formation is the -1 Ld, but that doesn’t really seem to be worth it.

Other peoples thoughts?

what makes the dark artisan nice is the fact you can ds in, since Talos on their own are really slow and will get gunned down way before they can do much of value.

The formation (if that haemonculus is also your warlord) allows for ones to be re-rolled on FnP too which is a nice bonus. Basically the Dark Artisan has certain advantages being saves and mobility, whether one is better than the other will come down to play style/opponents/rest of list. Personally I prefer the dark artisan as I don't feel 3 talos will actually get anywhere due to being so slow whereas a turn 2 drop in your enemies deployment zone can be game changing! The difference in the power from pain tables is also a plus for Dark Artisan as they are also a turn ahead due to the haemonculus.

The Dark Artisan is great because of the 4+ FNP from the Cronos, the DS from the Haemy and the possible leadership shenanigans (Armor of Misery or Covenite bonuses). The Talos group alone can put out more damage, sure, but they won't survive to do it - they'll only be a fire magnet, unless you use them to counter drop pods or deep strikers (which you can use the Dark Artisan for, as well).

As others have mentioned, the Talos group actually DOESNT have twice the damage output because 1-2 of the Talos wont make it to combat against a mildly competent opponent.

Ok, my assumption is that no matter what, this squad is going to get knocked out before it reaches combat. If we had just two talos in a squad, we save 1/3 the points and have the same "area denial" that these guys do so well. The addition of the Hemi only really gets you a turn of s3 flamer, then your squad gets obliterated by the mass firepower that you DS next to...

Actually the Dark Artisan should make it to combat. The 4+ FNP, re-rolling 1's makes the unit tougher than a WraithKnight. Even if it dies, it will take twice as much firepower to do it than 3 Talos, effectively taking that fire away from the rest of your army.

Also having the cronus as part of the dark artisan, it will give you a 4+ fnp. Which regular talos only have a 5+.

I would always prefer the Corpsethief Claw, personally. It has a very strong ability. It has the fortitude you wanted from FnP and it has a serious amount of "I don't like you very much" built into it. Don't let it get wrapped in combat with the new Dreadnoughts though. A unit of 2-3 Dreadnoughts will put a serious hurt on some Corpsethief claw action. hehehe.

jade_angel wrote:
The Dark Artisan is great because of the 4+ FNP from the Cronos, the DS from the Haemy and the possible leadership shenanigans (Armor of Misery or Covenite bonuses). The Talos group alone can put out more damage, sure, but they won't survive to do it - they'll only be a fire magnet, unless you use them to counter drop pods or deep strikers (which you can use the Dark Artisan for, as well).

You can't put Codex Dark Eldar relics on Haemunculous covens units.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Spyro_Killer wrote:
The formation (if that haemonculus is also your warlord) allows for ones to be re-rolled on FnP too which is a nice bonus. Basically the Dark Artisan has certain advantages being saves and mobility, whether one is better than the other will come down to play style/opponents/rest of list. Personally I prefer the dark artisan as I don't feel 3 talos will actually get anywhere due to being so slow whereas a turn 2 drop in your enemies deployment zone can be game changing! The difference in the power from pain tables is also a plus for Dark Artisan as they are also a turn ahead due to the haemonculus.

Talos/Cronos do not have Power from Pain.

The dark artisan formation has the added bonus of being the only hard to kill warlord DE have access to, which is a further point in it's favor.

Another thing going for the Dark Artisan formation is that it's a Stand Alone formation, so you don't have to waste a slot or pay a basic unit tax to use it (3 talos will cost you at least 1 HQ and 2 troops).

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Another thing going for the Dark Artisan formation is that it's a Stand Alone formation, so you don't have to waste a slot or pay a basic unit tax to use it (3 talos will cost you at least 1 HQ and 2 troops).

Wrong, you can take an allied detachment of dark eldar at the cost of one hq and one troop.

Thank you everyone, really appreciate the responses. Im still not convinced that the Artesian is the way to go (my main opponent being Crons), but clearly a few battles need to be had to see the relative usefulness of the two unit types.

DirtyDeeds wrote:

jade_angel wrote:
The Dark Artisan is great because of the 4+ FNP from the Cronos, the DS from the Haemy and the possible leadership shenanigans (Armor of Misery or Covenite bonuses). The Talos group alone can put out more damage, sure, but they won't survive to do it - they'll only be a fire magnet, unless you use them to counter drop pods or deep strikers (which you can use the Dark Artisan for, as well).

You can't put Codex Dark Eldar relics on Haemunculous covens units.

You're right, I forgot it was a Coven-specific formation. (I was thinking it could be taken as a base codex formation, mea maxima culpa)