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i know it seems kinda far fetched, but the idea of boycotting GW goods or at least the threat of it could do something to the company. i know there are probably better chances of ducks ruling the food chain than having a substantial number of people to actually affect something, but hey a boy could dream. this petition would be like a pamphlet and it tells them to respect their gamers and be like the other companies that actually go to their events that their community actually does. and the main reason for this was because i witnessed by second favourite race go to Please don't bypass the language filter like this. Reds8n

A petition to achieve what, exactly?

What is it that you want to change?

Like all the other ones that didn't actually accomplish anything?

It's not bad enough for this to work yet.

What is the point of the petition? What are you trying to get changed?

I sent an email about my disappointment with the Ork supplement rules and how they do not encourage me to buy new product. Pointed out some things that worked in other releases that encouraged me to purchase. Stated a few things I want to buy more of but don't because of the rules, and pointed out the struggle of playing Orks when the material being put out feels second rate and that there is little creativity and excitement in the Ork releases lately (again comparing to other releases like Tau or Space Wolves). This was sent to customer service with the hopes that this or at least the spirit of the message will be past along. Importantly I focused on being constructive with my criticism and not threatening/demanding but simply stating how I as a consumer am responding to this supplement (no desire to buy more Ork stuff).

Honestly I think a well written email/letter will have far more impact than a petition as its easy to add a name to a list but its another thing to personally write a message to the company expressing a concern and what you are looking for from GW as a consumer. My goal in this isn't to get them to "buff Orks" but to not associate lack of sales response to being unpopular but that Orks do have passionate fans but that the rules releases are not encouraging us to purchase things because the rules aren't good.

I think GW is not listening. They have generally a different view of the game as their customer.

goal for petition is to show that their gamers actually want some decent stuff for their money, as in how come tau and space marines get new models with their new updates but not orks or AM? also tau have been updated twice and in that same time chaos and sisters have not. the main villians have not had their proper codex since 3rd

 -v10mega wrote:
goal for petition is to show that their gamers actually want some decent stuff for their money, as in how come tau and space marines get new models with their new updates but not orks or AM? also tau have been updated twice and in that same time chaos and sisters have not. the main villians have not had their proper codex since 3rd

The release schedule of codex updates is one of the secrets of GW we couldn't decipher yet.

GW makes a lot of it's money from new players joining the hobby. Boycotting won't do much if they just replace customers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Vankraken wrote:
I sent an email about my disappointment with the Ork supplement rules and how they do not encourage me to buy new product. Pointed out some things that worked in other releases that encouraged me to purchase. Stated a few things I want to buy more of but don't because of the rules, and pointed out the struggle of playing Orks when the material being put out feels second rate and that there is little creativity and excitement in the Ork releases lately (again comparing to other releases like Tau or Space Wolves). This was sent to customer service with the hopes that this or at least the spirit of the message will be past along. Importantly I focused on being constructive with my criticism and not threatening/demanding but simply stating how I as a consumer am responding to this supplement (no desire to buy more Ork stuff).

Honestly I think a well written email/letter will have far more impact than a petition as its easy to add a name to a list but its another thing to personally write a message to the company expressing a concern and what you are looking for from GW as a consumer. My goal in this isn't to get them to "buff Orks" but to not associate lack of sales response to being unpopular but that Orks do have passionate fans but that the rules releases are not encouraging us to purchase things because the rules aren't good.

That's exactly what I did. Made a point how it seems so little effort went into the faction, explained where they went wrong and offered suggestions that would tempt me from my money, stated I was disappointed in them and wouldn't be supporting this purchase.

^ if you added a subject they probably skipped it

Tried this once when the Australian prices skyrocketed. Did jack squat because GW concluded that we weren't buying because obviously the rules were constricting us with the FoC.

A much better idea is if we just mass-email their inbox with repeated complaints about high prices and crappy rules. And even then there's a good chance they'll misconstrue it.

Vote with your wallet. Its the only language they understand.

Sorry only money persuades a company. If other companies are making money over gw then they listen. If SM and tau sell then their business model is good. They are there to make money. Not bring back sisters of battle. Think of sports teams. When the product sucks people quit going so coaches get fired and new ideas are tried. If you don't like it write them and say you aren't buying anymore but flipping to flames of war. If other gaming sites aren't making money either then gw can just say it's the economy.

Biggest waste of time ever.
Why do people actually think this will do anything when a thread like this pops up after every change or rumored change that hits the market?
Might as well write a petition to nature asking the air to smell fresher, you'll have the same odds of a response.

More fool them - it's my money at the end of the day. If they aren't providing what I want (ie usable rules that can compete with what they have already put out) and they don't listen to what I have to say, I am under no obligation to give them anything.

Vote with your wallet mate, it's the only real power in a capitalist society. If you don't like what they are making, move on. If you don't want to do that and preferred your last codex (I haven't used my ork army since the current codex came out, so I sympathise) play using your last codex and accept that your player base will shrink to those who will indulge it.

Petitions and emails won't get past customer services, the design team won't see them so they won't get your point across.

I buy from them because I like what they make, and it's really easy to get a game (both opponent wise and time wise). If at any point that enjoyment stops, time to look elsewhere.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Tried this once when the Australian prices skyrocketed. Did jack squat because GW concluded that we weren't buying because obviously the rules were constricting us with the FoC.

A much better idea is if we just mass-email their inbox with repeated complaints about high prices and crappy rules. And even then there's a good chance they'll misconstrue it.

Crappy rules? I guess GW as a miniature making company that wants to sell miniatures to collectors sees rules as a mere service to the customers.

I've been voting with my wallet for years now.

GW concluded that I'm not buying more new stuff obviously because I was being restricted by the old Army compositions. And points costs. And obviously I'm only buying the old stock because I haven't seen their new, higher priced new stock. Clearly removing these from Fantasy would make me buy more, right?

They don't care what customers think or want mate, kirby thinks you'll buy any crap he puts out.

hobojebus wrote:
They don't care what customers think or want mate, kirby thinks you'll buy any crap he puts out.

Kirby's not running things day to day anymore, I'd have thought the discounted Start Collecting bundles, reinstatement of SG, new board games with long desired minis included etc should have been an indicator of that?

Anyway, @OP, it's been done,

https://www.change.org/p/games-workshop-limited-refocus-your-business-model-on-the-sale-of-a-game-and-support-of-a-gaming-community-vice-the-pure-sale-of-collectible-miniatures

It didn't work.

However, people ARE voting with their wallets, revenue has been falling for several years, and that is generating change in the right direction, more of an effort to produce a more playable wargame and less of a mongrel RPG is one the last things I'm waiting on to really declare that they've started moving the right way. (And start buying again.)

hobojebus wrote:
They don't care what customers think or want mate, kirby thinks you'll buy any crap he puts out.

Indeed, have a look at all the products they offer us at a daily basis. From miniatures, to BL books and compendiums up to App games and to merchandise.

Ah yes, just like every other petition to GW that worked!
Remember how a bunch of people bought Sisters models in "protest" and try to make GW update Sisters? Remember how well that worked?

 Blacksails wrote:
Vote with your wallet. Its the only language they understand.

A thousand times this, pity so many people can't simply understand it.

 Azreal13 wrote:

hobojebus wrote:
They don't care what customers think or want mate, kirby thinks you'll buy any crap he puts out.

Kirby's not running things day to day anymore, I'd have thought the discounted Start Collecting bundles, reinstatement of SG, new board games with long desired minis included etc should have been an indicator of that?

Anyway, @OP, it's been done,

https://www.change.org/p/games-workshop-limited-refocus-your-business-model-on-the-sale-of-a-game-and-support-of-a-gaming-community-vice-the-pure-sale-of-collectible-miniatures

It didn't work.

However, people ARE voting with their wallets, revenue has been falling for several years, and that is generating change in the right direction, more of an effort to produce a more playable wargame and less of a mongrel RPG is one the last things I'm waiting on to really declare that they've started moving the right way. (And start buying again.)

He's still on the board he's just no longer CEO, the board is full of his yes men and the new CEO was his CFO.

He's mealy stepped back a little so when the company goes belly up he can blame the new guy.

He's the majority shareholder which is why dividends have been so high and he's getting more cash by giving his wife 4 million to do a web site that anyone in the business you ask would cost 200k to 400k max.

the whole management is rotten and following kirby's lead.

Why bother? Most people just buy minis off eBay and Gumtree anyway. GW will listen once their sales drop low enough.

Mailing a good mail if Ghaz can be included as a warlord in the core could be something good.

 Árn_Templar wrote:
Why bother? Most people just buy minis off eBay and Gumtree anyway. GW will listen once their sales drop low enough.

Their model sales are down 15% their profits continue to drop they can't afford to pay out dividends without borrowing the money at what point is it supposed to be dire enough that they'll listen?

Because I think we passed that point a while back but the race towards the cliff continues unabated.

hobojebus wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:

hobojebus wrote:
They don't care what customers think or want mate, kirby thinks you'll buy any crap he puts out.

Kirby's not running things day to day anymore, I'd have thought the discounted Start Collecting bundles, reinstatement of SG, new board games with long desired minis included etc should have been an indicator of that?

Anyway, @OP, it's been done,

https://www.change.org/p/games-workshop-limited-refocus-your-business-model-on-the-sale-of-a-game-and-support-of-a-gaming-community-vice-the-pure-sale-of-collectible-miniatures

It didn't work.

However, people ARE voting with their wallets, revenue has been falling for several years, and that is generating change in the right direction, more of an effort to produce a more playable wargame and less of a mongrel RPG is one the last things I'm waiting on to really declare that they've started moving the right way. (And start buying again.)

He's still on the board he's just no longer CEO, the board is full of his yes men and the new CEO was his CFO.

He's mealy stepped back a little so when the company goes belly up he can blame the new guy.

He's the majority shareholder which is why dividends have been so high and he's getting more cash by giving his wife 4 million to do a web site that anyone in the business you ask would cost 200k to 400k max.

the whole management is rotten and following kirby's lead.

Blimey, so much unsubstantiated nonsense, where to start?!

The difference between Kirby being CEO and non-exec Chairman is huge, it's like the difference between the ship's captain and the purser. Kirby is now no longer responsible for the day to day running of the company, and there's good evidence that Rountree isn't the yes man you're assuming he is..

Kevin Rountree wrote: Problems will arise if the board allows egos and private agendas to rule. I will do my utmost to ensure that this does not happen.

Couple that with any of the easily observable steps taken in the year since Rountree took over which resemble the actions of a normal, sensibly run, company (diversification, expanding into more high volume market sectors, etc etc) and you have a good indication that he's doing things his way, and his way doesn't resemble Kirby's at all.

Neither is Kirby the majority shareholder. He's the largest individual shareholder, sure, but that's a completely different thing.

Undoubtedly GW has been run by Kirby, for Kirby, in recent years, but that's apparently not nearly as much the case any more, and what you're touting is not much more than unsubstantiated, out of date, vitriol.

By all means criticise GW, but do it in an informed, evidentially supported and current manner, otherwise when there's gak to legitimately be negative over, it's poorly thought out rubbish like this that gets used by the pro-GW crowd to dismiss it as "hate."




Automatically Appended Next Post:

hobojebus wrote:

 Árn_Templar wrote:
Why bother? Most people just buy minis off eBay and Gumtree anyway. GW will listen once their sales drop low enough.

Their model sales are down 15% their profits continue to drop they can't afford to pay out dividends without borrowing the money at what point is it supposed to be dire enough that they'll listen?

Because I think we passed that point a while back but the race towards the cliff continues unabated.

Down 15% on what? Models? Do you mean just models, if so where'd you get your info? Or do you mean revenue or profit?

They can afford to pay dividends without borrowing just fine, they did it once years ago, did you think it's regular practice for them?

Again, be critical, but get your facts straight.

hobojebus wrote:

 Árn_Templar wrote:
Why bother? Most people just buy minis off eBay and Gumtree anyway. GW will listen once their sales drop low enough.

Their model sales are down 15% their profits continue to drop they can't afford to pay out dividends without borrowing the money at what point is it supposed to be dire enough that they'll listen?

Because I think we passed that point a while back but the race towards the cliff continues unabated.

Where on Holy Terra did you get this information from?