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I'm considering getting my hands on one of the starter formation bundles, the Start Collecting ones!

However, I'm not sure if they can be used without buying the Codex.
Does it give the rules and points for the units in it, as well as the dedicated formation, or is it just the formation and you need to buy the codex to get the rules for the things in the box?

If you're planning on playing you'll need the codex for the army. I believe that it just gives you formation rules.

So, I actually don't get the stats for the models in the box? Huh. So much for pick up and play.

Need the codex. The box includes a formation that you can legally field as its own detachment but it doesn't include the unit rules or points values.

Look into the Gamer Edition Codexes if you have a smart phone, tablet, or willing to print out the rules.

 Vankraken wrote:
Need the codex. The box includes a formation that you can legally field as its own detachment but it doesn't include the unit rules or points values.

Look into the Gamer Edition Codexes if you have a smart phone, tablet, or willing to print out the rules.

Okay, understood. Not quite sure as to the point of marketing that as something "which you can assemble and use right away in games of Warhammer 40,000", especially when it also requires the purchase of the codex, but no matter. Cheers guys/gals.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

 Vankraken wrote:
Need the codex. The box includes a formation that you can legally field as its own detachment but it doesn't include the unit rules or points values.

Look into the Gamer Edition Codexes if you have a smart phone, tablet, or willing to print out the rules.

Okay, understood. Not quite sure as to the point of marketing that as something "which you can assemble and use right away in games of Warhammer 40,000", especially when it also requires the purchase of the codex, but no matter. Cheers guys/gals.

The reason they are marketed as "which you can assemble and use right away in games of warhammer 40,000" is that normally an army requires (usually) 1 HQ and 2 troops choices. But because the bundles give you some diversity, they include a formation to field the contents as a legal 40k army. If you feel like they are not advertising this correctly I suggest you bring this to their attention.

It's pick up and play in the sense you have a legal formation. However like any game you need the rules. The amount of options that some armies have would have made it impractical to include stats and rules for everything. A Marine tactical Squad alone has 30 options or combos as an example.

It would be nice if the new starter boxes came with the codex, but for the vets looking to buy a new army its often an ebay item in the box.

I was looking at the upcoming Ork starter because you can always collect more boyz and nobz, but the deff dread is kinda iffy these days so I'm debating.

Also Considering you can get pretty every codex online for free with about a minutes worth of googling

HoundsofDemos wrote:
Also Considering you can get pretty every codex online for free with about a minutes worth of googling

Oh yeah, 1d4chan and even Battlescribe do fine jobs of that, it just has questionable morals.

GW has said they are a models company and I'll gladly buy their models for the most part. I think they make cool models for the most part. IF they don't want to be a book or game company, I will decline to give them money for those.

It doesn't help that when these bundles were first announced, a lot of people assumed that they WOULD be including rules data and were stating it as fact. There's a bit of misinformation out there now.

Personally I always thought that was a silly assumption.

Look at the Marine bundle for instance. You would need to include in addition to the unit data sheets themselves.

Warlord Table
Relic List
Marine Armory/Weapons Profiles
Chapter Tactics/ATSKNF/Combat Squads
Rules for all three Dedicated Transports since they are options for two units.

That's a lot of paper

HoundsofDemos wrote:Also Considering you can get pretty every codex online for free with about a minutes worth of googling

Sgt_Smudge wrote:

HoundsofDemos wrote:
Also Considering you can get pretty every codex online for free with about a minutes worth of googling

Oh yeah, 1d4chan and even Battlescribe do fine jobs of that, it just has questionable morals.

Keeping in mind, of course, that Dakka Dakka in NO WAY condones IP theft of any kind.

Ever.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

Oh yeah, 1d4chan and even Battlescribe do fine jobs of that, it just has questionable morals.

Battlescribe really doesn't. Lots of rules that aren't shown on the list and list building restrictions that it doesn't enforce.

We're proud of how useful Battlescribe is as a quick reference, but your codex is always authoritative and you should use it to build your lists.

HoundsofDemos wrote:
GW has said they are a models company and I'll gladly buy their models for the most part. I think they make cool models for the most part. IF they don't want to be a book or game company, I will decline to give them money for those.

As a miniature making company producing miniatures for collectors, the rule set(s) can be considered as a service of GW for the customer. But then the prices of the codices is much too high.

Wasn't just customers that were confused either. This was the first reply I got from GW Customer Services:

Thank you very much for your email.

All the Start Collecting boxes contain an exclusive Formation rules sheet that allows you to play straight away with the figurines provided. You will need to Codex if you want to include your figurines in other battles that are not covered by the exclusive formation sheet included in the Start Collecting kit.

Hope this helps.

Kind regards,

Severine
Customer Service

Not the clearest answer! So I queried again and got this response:

I'm sorry if there was any confusion. The formation datasheet included in the box allows you to play the units as that given formation, not rules for the units themselves.

For unit profiles, Weapons, Points costs, wargear options etc. you will still need the relevant codex.

We will pass this along and perhaps this will be made clearer on the website.

Kind regards

Owen Douglas

I still think it is a slightly odd description as so many other boxed sets and web bundles are playable out of the box as well but they don't state that in the descriptions on the website. The Blood Angels Battle force, for example, can be built as a Baal Strike Force, a CAD or an AD so is just as much playable out of the box.