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Hello everyone,

Every now and again I see people mentioning that the Horus Heresy has optional alternate rules for D weapons. I own both HH4 and the Taghmata Omnissiah Redbook.

Can anyone tell me where these alternative rules are located, or if I need a new book, why they left it out of the later books? All I can find on the Internet was the claim that they were in the Collector's Edition of HH3.

They are also in the first of the red books. Basically they become strength 10 along with a few other special rules.

IIRC S10, Ignores Cover, Sunder, Instant Death and causes D3+1 wounds/hullpoints for every unsaved wound/penetrating hit. Additionally successful invulnerable saves need to be rerolled.

 taemu_touhi wrote:
IIRC S10, Ignores Cover, Sunder, Instant Death and causes D3+1 wounds/hullpoints for every unsaved wound/penetrating hit. Additionally successful invulnerable saves need to be rerolled.

This seems to me to be pretty much exactly the same as D, just with more difficulty in penetrating AV14.

 KharnsRightHand wrote:

 taemu_touhi wrote:
IIRC S10, Ignores Cover, Sunder, Instant Death and causes D3+1 wounds/hullpoints for every unsaved wound/penetrating hit. Additionally successful invulnerable saves need to be rerolled.

This seems to me to be pretty much exactly the same as D, just with more difficulty in penetrating AV14.

I believe the heresy D-rules just make sure that it doesn't one shot kill other super heavies. Which rolling a 6 on the D table could do.

Also with the Ignores Cover USR, heresy-D weapons perform better against infantry.

They are also much better at killing MCs than 40k D weapons which do feth all except on a 6

Can't one shot a Primarch with them as well. Fulgrim wound up on the wrong end of my Wraithknight like that once...

Don't forget, those rules were written back when you had 6th edition D weapons. Which were nastier than they are now.

So the message I am receiving is that I don't have access to these rules in my books?

Sadface

To be honest, you're probably better off sticking with 7th Edition D-Weapon rules. The alternate Horus Heresy D-Weapon rules are modified from 6th Edition, Strength D was waaay stronger.

S10, Instant Death, Sunder, Ignores Cover, Successful Invulnerable Saves must be re-rolled, each unsaved wound does D3+1 Wounds/Hull Points is probably more powerful than the current D Weapon Chart. At least you can take cover saves and aren't forced to re-roll Invulnerable Saves on a 2-5 roll in 7th Edition.

 GoonBandito wrote:
To be honest, you're probably better off sticking with 7th Edition D-Weapon rules. The alternate Horus Heresy D-Weapon rules are modified from 6th Edition, Strength D was waaay stronger.

S10, Instant Death, Sunder, Ignores Cover, Successful Invulnerable Saves must be re-rolled, each unsaved wound does D3+1 Wounds/Hull Points is probably more powerful than the current D Weapon Chart. At least you can take cover saves and aren't forced to re-roll Invulnerable Saves on a 2-5 roll in 7th Edition.

It's the reason why the Stormsword has became so popular among Solar Aux Players, Since despite not being a D-weapon like the Shadowsword the StormSword Ignores Cover.

At least the 7th Edition D rules make the Ignores Cover superheavies worthwhile.

 KharnsRightHand wrote:

 taemu_touhi wrote:
IIRC S10, Ignores Cover, Sunder, Instant Death and causes D3+1 wounds/hullpoints for every unsaved wound/penetrating hit. Additionally successful invulnerable saves need to be rerolled.

This seems to me to be pretty much exactly the same as D, just with more difficulty in penetrating AV14.

Not a hell of a lot - Most Destroyer weapons are also primary weapons, so roll 2 dice, pick the best, and reroll if so inclined.

It's the reason why the Stormsword has became so popular among Solar Aux Players, Since despite not being a D-weapon like the Shadowsword the StormSword Ignores Cover.

In fairness, the 10" pizza delivery service probably has something to do with it as well. The Shadowsword is 'only' a 5" template, and it's perfectly possible to miss a squad or single vehicle with what's essentially a 400 point one-shot-per-turn gun.



I don't mind a shadowsword being ignores cover. A Volcano cannon is supposed to crack open a titan's sternum armour plate; cowering behind a small herbaceous border shouldn't really defeat it.
Of course, the 10" bellicosa volcano cannon round also being ignores cover is going to hurt a lot more, but then it's a freakin' warlord titan. It's primary armament pretty much should be "please remove that non-superheavy unit; I'll roll dice if you really want."

The most important things the 'Horus Heresy' Destroyer rules do is

(a) eliminate the "deathblow" result - where every so often you're just dead, regardless of what defences you have. This makes Destroyer weapons more predictable
(b) forces the reroll of invulerable saves - so you always get them, but the odds of them working are reduced. This makes knights massively easier to deal with with destroyer fire, and helps put titans back on top over knights without needing to load out with the maximum number of turbolaser barrels.