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The topic sort of says it, but I have been mucking with list building throughout my day as I look at what I bought, what I still need, etc...

I think the realization of how much I already own caught me off guard. Just those boxes of Uruk-Hai I picked up, in warbands of twelve, with Lurtz, Sarumon and Grima could easily be 500pts unto itself... which i've heard is a common game size for points-matches?

I'd love some people's thoughts on ideal game sizes which play to the systems strengths. What is your ideal small/medium/large game in terms of point cost, model count, and roughly how long of a game that yields?

Obviously named heroes quickly make point-costs soar, but even basic Captains saw me fielding, maybe 25-30 models at 500pts.

With how fast the game seems to play... and combats resolved... I just kind of imagined games would be 50-60 models per side.

Rohan is the average - you can get 7 Warriors and a Rohan Captain into 100 pts. Another way to look at it, you're getting two full warbands - 26 figures - into 300-point Rohan list, with lots of points left over to further upgrade the Heroes.


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NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
With how fast the game seems to play... and combats resolved...

I don't know if you'll find many who agree with this - SBG zooms into every combat on the board. The current edition is granular enough to take into account special attacks each figure may elect to make depending on the weapon they are using. Also, tactics are really important because of the way support and area of control works. Even a 300-point game can take a few hours if you are just starting out with the rules.

Makes sense, but every bat-rep between experienced players which I watch absolutely flies along. Rolling a small number of dice, not needing to consult any tables (bar the one easy to remember wounding one), and straight comparison of numbers seems to resolve them very quickly.

Obviously between good/competitive players making sure to account for things like "In the Way" when the position each model very precisely, etc... it can take longer. But I think I love that. I don't recall a game that has seemed more real/tactical in terms of individual model positioning, strategy, etc...

And to the rest of my questions? What do you feel common game sizes are?

Game sizes tend to range between 400-1000 points. As a rough general rule of thumb for a balanced army, you're usually looking at 12 models and a hero for every 200 points of the game. So for a 600 point force, most armies wouldn't have more than three full warbands if they're taking a range of model and hero types. If it was an elite army, it would probably be two warbands, and if it was a horde, you'd probably have five. But 3 would be the average at 600 points, 4 at 800, and 5 at 1000.

Great! A vague general rule like that is exactly what I was hoping for as a starting point.

So at what size of game, or when does one make room for the 120+ pt heroes?

On the one hand a 205pt Elrond sounds great, but at the expense of a whole warband? I can't imagine that even can be viable until 1000pts?

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Great! A vague general rule like that is exactly what I was hoping for as a starting point.

So at what size of game, or when does one make room for the 120+ pt heroes?

On the one hand a 205pt Elrond sounds great, but at the expense of a whole warband? I can't imagine that even can be viable until 1000pts?

I'd say at about the 600 point threshold. If you try it at 400 points, you're essentially restricting yourself to a single warband of decent troops and hero, or a naff warband and a half and a second naff hero. Either way, you're putting too many eggs in one basket, which can all go horribly wrong with just one or two bad dice rolls.

In LOTR, heroes are nice, but they're not godmods like in Warhammer. You can't give a hero an unbeatable rerollable 3+ ward save and watch him laugh off everything he gets hit with as he chops his way through the enemy. At the end of the day, most heroes are going to struggle to kill more than ten enemies before they run out of steam (or might/fate) and get cut down by sheer weight of numbers and logic of mathematics (that they're going to lose a fight or two eventually). The minute you run past the 100 point mark, your hero needs to be acting in a support capacity in some variety, and have a dedicated place in your attack plan/army composition in order to compensate for the inordinate amount of points he;s soaking up,

I definitely, even from reading their rules and profiles, can tell there aren't many one-man-army type heroes, nor would I want them to be.

I only ask because I imagine everyone loves seeing their favorite characters amongst all the fodder. :-)

You do get a lot of people taking stuff because they feel like it (I've never been to such a fluffy tournie as the GBHL one).

If you're looking at it with a slightly more competitive bent of mind though, the heroes you tend to see taken in the 100+ points bracket are the wizard spellcasters, ringwraiths on fell beasts, the twins, & the Kings Champion (and attendants).

Well seeing as my wife and I know maybe ONE other player in a one-hour drive distance, I would say we are planning to play much more for fun than we are worrying about competition.

Now if only we could find a few more of the essentials. I cleaned out my local game store, but even Ebay and GW are sold out of generic warriors like Wood Elves, Mirkwood Elves, etc...

I need a box or two of each... plus some more Durin's folk warriors, but most seem absolutely sold out. And that is taking into account kit-bashing my own generic Captains and such.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
I need a box or two of each... plus some more Durin's folk warriors, but most seem absolutely sold out. And that is taking into account kit-bashing my own generic Captains and such.

Just click on the "notify me". Most LOTR/Hobbit models that go out of stock come back into stock within a week or so. And the plastics will never go away - Adam Troke clarified that.