Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 kodos wrote:

 Mr. Burning wrote:

And who would this be? I am a committee of one already! With enough traction I could get my rules accepted as the defacto go to for 40k. Implausible but not impossible.

How do I trust this group? what if the group falls out? What if they do not have the time or energy - Its almost like writing a ruleset or something for one of the hobbies largest and most well known games. If they cannot be bothered, what then? I mean they are not getting paid to do something which full time paid staff cant even get right.

While this is not the questions here, finding and building up a team is a difficult task.
And of course the team fall out and have no time and energy any more.

Same can happen to all bigger events. Ever thought of the idea that Nova Open is just skipped 1 week before it should start because the guys who organise it falls out?

So there are people out there who want to write rules for the game they love and they do it for free in their spare time.

We have organised big Warhammer tournaments in the past, a group of 3 people was working about 4 months each year to get the tournament rules (restrictions, army balance, mission design, play testing) while another 5 -10 people did the organising, build terrain and tables etc.
If there would be no one out there who would waste his time for this and actually know what he is doing (and do a better job than those who get paid by GW) big Events with their own rules would never be possible

And games like Blood Bowl have shown that this is also possible for rules

 jreilly89 wrote:
Yes, let the community write the rules, NOTHING COULD GO WRONG HERE.
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/apr/17/boaty-mcboatface-wins-poll-to-name-polar-research-vessel

You are just angry because "It’s bloody cold here" didn't make it

I dont know.

Ruling on rules is a lot less contentious than a group deciding on a whole new set of rules for the community to follow.

BB and Epic support post the plug being pulled stemmed directly from existing rules with enhancements for sure.

Personally I would like to see a totally new core, a new start from the ground up able to support skirmish as well as large scale battles. I expect 8th to be more of the same and that a community led approach would stick with the 30 year old rpg lite base we already have - which keeps the same set of issues that writers would have to fight with but is familiar to the majority of the player base.

I'm happy with the current edition.

I say just work to tweak points and let the rules stay what they are. A simple spreadsheet with updated points and go.

 DarknessEternal wrote:
I'm happy with the current edition.

Ehh... There's definitely improvements that could be made however.

And in regard to the comment on the community writing the rules, look at 9th Age, that was community made and is doing really well.

 Mr. Burning wrote:


I dont know.

Ruling on rules is a lot less contentious than a group deciding on a whole new set of rules for the community to follow.

BB and Epic support post the plug being pulled stemmed directly from existing rules with enhancements for sure.

Personally I would like to see a totally new core, a new start from the ground up able to support skirmish as well as large scale battles. I expect 8th to be more of the same and that a community led approach would stick with the 30 year old rpg lite base we already have - which keeps the same set of issues that writers would have to fight with but is familiar to the majority of the player base.

Indeed. My own rewrite is intended as a patch on 7th edition with a view to making a more overhauled version afterwards. The logic being that players are more likely to accept a big change if the designer had already demonstrated that they can handle small updates well.

Rather than nominating a committee, I think players would be better served looking through the various threads where designers are already working on this and simply start playing and supporting which ever design they like best.

In other words, if you're not satisfied with the game at present, start providing your input to folks like myself and lanrak.

I voted "Yes". I would volunteer to help with a codex rewrite. Orks (aka Fungoids or whatever) would be an easy first. Only minor tweaks would really turn them around meaningfully. No significant point changes.

Similarly, Eldar, with as much ire and spite as those immortal spce pansies get, some minor changes could dial them back without affecting game play that much.

Tau, which I play wouldnt be something i would take on. I just have trouble with them, and would be too forgiving I think.

I play marines, who doesnt. But this would probsbly be the faction/codex/suppliments/IA with which to start. Itwould allow a near universal familiarity for point cost basis etc.

Regarding the BRB rules, some minor language tweaks and highly specific grammar is all that is needed.

Gents, this is a very very complex game that we argue about. But really... thats part of the fun isnt it?

Whatever the case, I will be ok with betatesting or writing or whining, but its high time to take it to open source. Let GW accomplish their mission of being a model company. Love their stuff... truely... but jesus some things are blatantly out of sync and broken. Lets fix it.... together.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PM me if you want help.

 Mr. Burning wrote:

Ruling on rules is a lot less contentious than a group deciding on a whole new set of rules for the community to follow.

BB and Epic support post the plug being pulled stemmed directly from existing rules with enhancements for sure.

Personally I would like to see a totally new core, a new start from the ground up able to support skirmish as well as large scale battles. I expect 8th to be more of the same and that a community led approach would stick with the 30 year old rpg lite base we already have - which keeps the same set of issues that writers would have to fight with but is familiar to the majority of the player base.

I have seen a lot of fan rules now and talked to some of the authors.
The projects of a patched version of 5th or 6th more or less with the appearance of the new official Edition others have their focus only on a specific part of the game (most of them skirmish) and are now not really related to 40k any more.
I was part of a team which was writing a patched 6th edition for tournament play but with GW's own version of the patched rules some from the team did not want to continue at all while others start working on a patched 7th.

This was the main reason why I got to the conclusion that a fan Patch/FAQ/Errata will never work without writing a new rulebook from scratch. You need something independent from GW to base your work on.
BB got a first edition from GW that never really changed and was the perfect base. For 40k the situation is different, but it still can be done.

Zustiur wrote:

Rather than nominating a committee, I think players would be better served looking through the various threads where designers are already working on this and simply start playing and supporting which ever design they like best.

In other words, if you're not satisfied with the game at present, start providing your input to folks like myself and lanrak.

But in this case you will more likely get in such situation:

 Mr. Burning wrote:
What if they do not have the time or energy - Its almost like writing a ruleset or something for one of the hobbies largest and most well known games. If they cannot be bothered, what then? I mean they are not getting paid to do something which full time paid staff cant even get right.

At least here this is one reason why such fan rules are never taken into account. If only one guy is doing it, there is no guaranty that it will ever be finished or maintained.
If there is a group, the work will most likely continue even if the original author is gone.