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I never see ion hammerheads, but for 125 points they seem like pretty cheep and effective marine killers, and the three str 7 shots seem to make it not completely useless against vehicles or multiwound models.

Any opinion on ion heads?

I use them all the time in an armored interdiction cadre, effectively twin linking the blasts is solid.

Most marine armies will not be happy to see a ton of ap3,

They're useful, but Riptides do their job better...

As gameandwatch said, in an AIC they shine

IonTide:
-AP2
-Access to Interceptor
-2+ Armor/5++(access to 3++), easy Toe-in Cover Save
-Jet Pack move (access to 4d6 Boost)
-Access to Feel No Pain (5+)
-Not a Vehicle

IonHead
-65 points cheaper if you run both lean and mean
-AP3
-Immune to small arms fire, up to and including Scatter Lasers (when positioned correctly)
-Easy access to +1 Cover Save, although not super cheap
-Can easily be swapped out to a Skyray for list changups. Conveniently the Skysweep and Armored Interdiction have the same number of minimum hulls in both Formations. With a little help from magnets, you can swap one out for the other if you want a change.

For the cost of 2 IonTides you could get 3 IonHeads. Both offer one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range. Both are effectively board spanning shots. Range is an often overlooked tactical advantage, and the Tau have problems hitting outside 36". You won't be using Markerlights at this range, but who cares? You wouldn't have been even firing if you took something other than an Ion in question, Railgun, Pulse Driver, or Skyray. You rarely see anything but the Riptide or Stormsurge function at this range (very few people I have seen take Railsides), and this is one of their unique qualities, in this Codex.
If you see Gladius often or just have a meta with lots of 3+ armor, IonHeads should do well. Disruption Pods and Conquer of Cities/Night Attacker Warlord Traits can net you an easy 2+/3+ Cover Save, without Jinking. This will be nice against Grav, and with that kind of shooting range, Immobilized doesn't really hurt as much.
Is the Riptide version better? Yes. But you can spam tanks, do well, and still have friends in casual games with the Hammerhead. Plus you can get them super cheap on eBay if you are patient and keep your eyes open. I snagged 6 Tau Tank chassis vehicles of different sorts for less than $100. A few magnets later and each can be a Devilfish/Skyray/Hammerhead (either flavor). Not the best, but an easy block of points on a budget.

 Plainshow wrote:
one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range.

really? It is one of our Codex's strengths. When most forces in the game have a range of 12"-24" and are only really decisive in melee, our ranges of 30"+ are a good balancing factor; it is where most of our effectiveness lies.

OP: try with Longstrike. But don't glue the turret options on, that way you can swap them out on the fly. The front weapons are less important, considering the only real options are SMS or drones.

 carldooley wrote:

 Plainshow wrote:
one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range.

really? It is one of our Codex's strengths. When most forces in the game have a range of 12"-24" and are only really decisive in melee, our ranges of 30"+ are a good balancing factor; it is where most of our effectiveness lies.

OP: try with Longstrike. But don't glue the turret options on, that way you can swap them out on the fly. The front weapons are less important, considering the only real options are SMS or drones.

With the big exception of pulse rifles, Imperial weapons generally outrange their Tau equivalents. Autocannons vs. missile pods, for instance. Heavy bolters vs. burst cannons. Crisis suits generally operetate in the 12"-18" range bracket ideally.

 Plainshow wrote:
IonTide:
-AP2
-Access to Interceptor
-2+ Armor/5++(access to 3++), easy Toe-in Cover Save
-Jet Pack move (access to 4d6 Boost)
-Access to Feel No Pain (5+)
-Not a Vehicle

IonHead
-65 points cheaper if you run both lean and mean
-AP3
-Immune to small arms fire, up to and including Scatter Lasers (when positioned correctly)
-Easy access to +1 Cover Save, although not super cheap
-Can easily be swapped out to a Skyray for list changups. Conveniently the Skysweep and Armored Interdiction have the same number of minimum hulls in both Formations. With a little help from magnets, you can swap one out for the other if you want a change.

For the cost of 2 IonTides you could get 3 IonHeads. Both offer one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range. Both are effectively board spanning shots. Range is an often overlooked tactical advantage, and the Tau have problems hitting outside 36". You won't be using Markerlights at this range, but who cares? You wouldn't have been even firing if you took something other than an Ion in question, Railgun, Pulse Driver, or Skyray. You rarely see anything but the Riptide or Stormsurge function at this range (very few people I have seen take Railsides), and this is one of their unique qualities, in this Codex.
If you see Gladius often or just have a meta with lots of 3+ armor, IonHeads should do well. Disruption Pods and Conquer of Cities/Night Attacker Warlord Traits can net you an easy 2+/3+ Cover Save, without Jinking. This will be nice against Grav, and with that kind of shooting range, Immobilized doesn't really hurt as much.
Is the Riptide version better? Yes. But you can spam tanks, do well, and still have friends in casual games with the Hammerhead. Plus you can get them super cheap on eBay if you are patient and keep your eyes open. I snagged 6 Tau Tank chassis vehicles of different sorts for less than $100. A few magnets later and each can be a Devilfish/Skyray/Hammerhead (either flavor). Not the best, but an easy block of points on a budget.

I feel like you didn't mention a few important things. One, being that if you run the formation with 3 hammerheads it lets you fit in a shyray, which is more than nice. They're also more accurate than a riptide in this formation. It's also worth noting that the real price for a riptide is usually about 220 points (5 for ion and 35 for fnp) I will not doubt that a riptide is better though, especially with the advent of the monstrosity that is riptide wing.

 Jaxler wrote:

 Plainshow wrote:
IonTide:
-AP2
-Access to Interceptor
-2+ Armor/5++(access to 3++), easy Toe-in Cover Save
-Jet Pack move (access to 4d6 Boost)
-Access to Feel No Pain (5+)
-Not a Vehicle

IonHead
-65 points cheaper if you run both lean and mean
-AP3
-Immune to small arms fire, up to and including Scatter Lasers (when positioned correctly)
-Easy access to +1 Cover Save, although not super cheap
-Can easily be swapped out to a Skyray for list changups. Conveniently the Skysweep and Armored Interdiction have the same number of minimum hulls in both Formations. With a little help from magnets, you can swap one out for the other if you want a change.

For the cost of 2 IonTides you could get 3 IonHeads. Both offer one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range. Both are effectively board spanning shots. Range is an often overlooked tactical advantage, and the Tau have problems hitting outside 36". You won't be using Markerlights at this range, but who cares? You wouldn't have been even firing if you took something other than an Ion in question, Railgun, Pulse Driver, or Skyray. You rarely see anything but the Riptide or Stormsurge function at this range (very few people I have seen take Railsides), and this is one of their unique qualities, in this Codex.
If you see Gladius often or just have a meta with lots of 3+ armor, IonHeads should do well. Disruption Pods and Conquer of Cities/Night Attacker Warlord Traits can net you an easy 2+/3+ Cover Save, without Jinking. This will be nice against Grav, and with that kind of shooting range, Immobilized doesn't really hurt as much.
Is the Riptide version better? Yes. But you can spam tanks, do well, and still have friends in casual games with the Hammerhead. Plus you can get them super cheap on eBay if you are patient and keep your eyes open. I snagged 6 Tau Tank chassis vehicles of different sorts for less than $100. A few magnets later and each can be a Devilfish/Skyray/Hammerhead (either flavor). Not the best, but an easy block of points on a budget.

I feel like you didn't mention a few important things. One, being that if you run the formation with 3 hammerheads it lets you fit in a shyray, which is more than nice. They're also more accurate than a riptide in this formation. It's also worth noting that the real price for a riptide is usually about 220 points (5 for ion and 35 for fnp) I will not doubt that a riptide is better though, especially with the advent of the monstrosity that is riptide wing.

Troof, even as a Tau player I feel like riptide wing was a step too far, less for double shotting main guns, more for the double shotting ripple fired SMS. 16 shots per tide that ignore line of sight and cover, in one shooting phase is just crazy. If it even was just the +1 BS, and reroll nova, it would STILL be very good

It is true what was said about range, though it would seem range would be our strength, most tools used in the Tau arsenal do work best at the 18-24" range (crisis suits, kheels, any infantry) Even what I would call the best tool in Tau, the SMS is only 30" range. It is nice with HHs to deploy at the back edge, across from scatbike spam, and give NO craps.

It is hard to compare it to a riptide, a riptide is VERY good, and VERY tough, but also nearly 100 points more expensive. Both platforms are vulnerable to grav (HH likely more so), riptides are hurt by bolters, HH are generally only hurt by S7 or higher, riptides have higher survivability, HH are immune to LD attacks and being swept in CC(or locked up and unable to fire)

Though both mobile, long range shooting platforms, they just occupy very different roles/ playstyles. And I cannot emphasize enough, the AI cadre is BEASTLY. That 12" bubble of twin linked, placed every turn is just SO good, I wouldn't say more so, but especially for the skyray with 1 time use weapons. In that formation, it is the only time that I use seeker missiles on my HHs, cause they are twin linked.

 gameandwatch wrote:

 Jaxler wrote:

 Plainshow wrote:
IonTide:
-AP2
-Access to Interceptor
-2+ Armor/5++(access to 3++), easy Toe-in Cover Save
-Jet Pack move (access to 4d6 Boost)
-Access to Feel No Pain (5+)
-Not a Vehicle

IonHead
-65 points cheaper if you run both lean and mean
-AP3
-Immune to small arms fire, up to and including Scatter Lasers (when positioned correctly)
-Easy access to +1 Cover Save, although not super cheap
-Can easily be swapped out to a Skyray for list changups. Conveniently the Skysweep and Armored Interdiction have the same number of minimum hulls in both Formations. With a little help from magnets, you can swap one out for the other if you want a change.

For the cost of 2 IonTides you could get 3 IonHeads. Both offer one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range. Both are effectively board spanning shots. Range is an often overlooked tactical advantage, and the Tau have problems hitting outside 36". You won't be using Markerlights at this range, but who cares? You wouldn't have been even firing if you took something other than an Ion in question, Railgun, Pulse Driver, or Skyray. You rarely see anything but the Riptide or Stormsurge function at this range (very few people I have seen take Railsides), and this is one of their unique qualities, in this Codex.
If you see Gladius often or just have a meta with lots of 3+ armor, IonHeads should do well. Disruption Pods and Conquer of Cities/Night Attacker Warlord Traits can net you an easy 2+/3+ Cover Save, without Jinking. This will be nice against Grav, and with that kind of shooting range, Immobilized doesn't really hurt as much.
Is the Riptide version better? Yes. But you can spam tanks, do well, and still have friends in casual games with the Hammerhead. Plus you can get them super cheap on eBay if you are patient and keep your eyes open. I snagged 6 Tau Tank chassis vehicles of different sorts for less than $100. A few magnets later and each can be a Devilfish/Skyray/Hammerhead (either flavor). Not the best, but an easy block of points on a budget.

I feel like you didn't mention a few important things. One, being that if you run the formation with 3 hammerheads it lets you fit in a shyray, which is more than nice. They're also more accurate than a riptide in this formation. It's also worth noting that the real price for a riptide is usually about 220 points (5 for ion and 35 for fnp) I will not doubt that a riptide is better though, especially with the advent of the monstrosity that is riptide wing.

Troof, even as a Tau player I feel like riptide wing was a step too far, less for double shotting main guns, more for the double shotting ripple fired SMS. 16 shots per tide that ignore line of sight and cover, in one shooting phase is just crazy. If it even was just the +1 BS, and reroll nova, it would STILL be very good

It is true what was said about range, though it would seem range would be our strength, most tools used in the Tau arsenal do work best at the 18-24" range (crisis suits, kheels, any infantry) Even what I would call the best tool in Tau, the SMS is only 30" range. It is nice with HHs to deploy at the back edge, across from scatbike spam, and give NO craps.

It is hard to compare it to a riptide, a riptide is VERY good, and VERY tough, but also nearly 100 points more expensive. Both platforms are vulnerable to grav (HH likely more so), riptides are hurt by bolters, HH are generally only hurt by S7 or higher, riptides have higher survivability, HH are immune to LD attacks and being swept in CC(or locked up and unable to fire)

Though both mobile, long range shooting platforms, they just occupy very different roles/ playstyles. And I cannot emphasize enough, the AI cadre is BEASTLY. That 12" bubble of twin linked, placed every turn is just SO good, I wouldn't say more so, but especially for the skyray with 1 time use weapons. In that formation, it is the only time that I use seeker missiles on my HHs, cause they are twin linked.

I'm of the opinion that riptide wing is the worst kind of formation. No tax, rewards you for bringing the models you want, and rewards a monobuild army and spamming gak. It's a tool for fitting more riptides into any list. I think this formation should of never existed, or at least should of had some form of tax. Right now it's not just broken op, it's unfun too. This is comming from someone who owns 3 riptides.

Jaxler wrote: I feel like you didn't mention a few important things. One, being that if you run the formation with 3 hammerheads it lets you fit in a shyray, which is more than nice. They're also more accurate than a riptide in this formation.

I'm sure I missed more than a few! The Skyray is very a very potent part of that equation, you are right. When discussing the IonHead in an Armored Interdiction Cadre, the Skyray can offer quite a bit. Forget the normal long range Turn 1 Seeker barrage the Skyray can deliver, in an Hunter Contingent those Networked Markerlights really shine. Ap3 will almost always want 2 Markers to Ignore Cover, and as you said the AIC is already very accurate, so the Skyray works perfect here. Coordinating Firepower for two BS5 Networked Markerlights is pretty sweet.

Jaxler wrote:It's also worth noting that the real price for a riptide is usually about 220 points (5 for ion and 35 for fnp)

I think both Hammerheads and Riptides can bloat up quickly in points with wargear (I guess this can be said for most of the Tau Codex), so I left both as basic as possible. I don't know if I have ever seen a Riptide without EWO, so that is always factored in when I think about price. I leave the Stim Injector off mine, but that's only because if my Riptides are getting shot at, all my Markerlights and my Commander are dead, and the game is already over. If one of my Riptides is assaulted, it's most likely going down if it didn't Nova for a 3++. Usually I want my units, even the Riptides, to fall in assault, just so I can get a clear shot in my subsequent turn. I have tried using a Riptide with Stims and a 3++ as a tarpit, but for so many points, it feels like a waste.
I know Disruption Pods and Sensor Spines are both popular takes on Tau vehicles. I have been using Disruption Pods on at least one vehicle per Squadron with my Ghostkeel Wing, and getting a 2+ cover, without Jinking, very frequently.
For me comparing the 190 IonTide to a 125 IonHead is about right, YMMV.

 carldooley wrote:

 Plainshow wrote:
one thing that is seriously lacking in the Tau Codex: Range.

really? It is one of our Codex's strengths. When most forces in the game have a range of 12"-24" and are only really decisive in melee, our ranges of 30"+ are a good balancing factor; it is where most of our effectiveness lies.

I would agree that most small arms and special weapons of the other factions are not as far reaching as ours, but Tau don't really worry about those too much. When it comes to trading heavy and superheavy weapons hits, Tau start having problems. Factor in other heavy weapons on very mobile platforms (mainly Scatbikes, lets be honest) and they are more mobile and better at JSJ with a 12" base move. Much of this, I think, stems from Markerlights limiting Tau weapons effective range, even the almighty Ion Accelerator is not that scary when you can take cover saves. Couple that with most Markerlight platforms being highly susceptible to a great deal of other Factions >36" ranged weapons, and you can get nailed where it counts (BAM, right in the Markers) before getting to exploit the mid range. Employing a different past 36" game can be helpful. Taking more AP3 shots is a way to go, and certainly is not friendly to Scatbikes. It won't help if your problem is a Rapid Fire Battlecannon, but a Gladius will be hurting.

Jaxler wrote:I'm of the opinion that riptide wing is the worst kind of formation. No tax, rewards you for bringing the models you want, and rewards a monobuild army and spamming gak. It's a tool for fitting more riptides into any list. I think this formation should of never existed, or at least should of had some form of tax. Right now it's not just broken op, it's unfun too. This is comming from someone who owns 3 riptides.

I am in total agreement. How can anyone look at that and say 'It's totally fine, people will love playing against that.'?