Vash108 wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
One hurdle Gates might have a hard time overcoming is that he's an atheist. If opinion polls are to be believed, atheists are always the least trusted demographic.

How much the US has evolved beyond the Presidential religious litmus test is an open question.

It is used against Athiest in all branches and levels of Government. Hell, down south a lot of us don't want to let it known we are Atheists because we could lose out jobs.

 jasper76 wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
One hurdle Gates might have a hard time overcoming is that he's an atheist. If opinion polls are to be believed, atheists are always the least trusted demographic.

How much the US has evolved beyond the Presidential religious litmus test is an open question.

It is used against Athiest in all branches and levels of Government. Hell, down south a lot of us don't want to let it known we are Atheists because we could lose out jobs.

It's clear from the DNC hack that members of the Clinton campaign were considering attacking Sanders as an atheist.

I live in the South-ish (West Virginia) so I am keenly aware of the discrimination atheists face in everyday life.

It's probably the only reason I ever talk about being an atheist anymore, just so religious can see that we atheists are just normal people, not devil-worshippers or bogeymen.

I think the attitude is slowly changing for the better, FWIW.

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree it is to Clinton's credit that she never played the atheist card against Sanders. FWIW, she would have lost my support if she had.

 Breotan wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree it is to Clinton's credit that she never played the atheist card against Sanders. FWIW, she would have lost my support if she had.

Did she ever need to play the religion card? She had the Clinton Political Machine working for her and Sanders was never a real threat anyway. Not shooting yourself in the foot is something that should be expected, not something that surprises you. Now how to teach that to the Republicans...

 Breotan wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree it is to Clinton's credit that she never played the atheist card against Sanders. FWIW, she would have lost my support if she had.

Did she ever need to play the religion card? She had the Clinton Political Machine working for her and Sanders was never a real threat anyway. Not shooting yourself in the foot is something that should be expected, not something that surprises you. Now how to teach that to the Republicans.

 whembly wrote:
I'm surprised there isn't more outcry of the DNC hacks...

Here... we have foreign actors trying to influence our elections.

Regardless of your political leanings... this should piss you off.

infinite_array wrote:

 whembly wrote:
I'm surprised there isn't more outcry of the DNC hacks...

Here... we have foreign actors trying to influence our elections.

Regardless of your political leanings... this should piss you off.

At this point it doesn't matter. Everyone who cares, cares. Everyone who doesn't, doesn't. Especially when the situation is basically:

US Intelligence Agencies: We're pretty sure it was Russia, and this is what we told the candidates.

Clinton: I believe it was Russia, which agrees with the information given to me by US Intelligence Agencies.

Trump: It wasn't Russia. Who says it was Russia? Maybe there were no hacks.

 whembly wrote:
I'm surprised there isn't more outcry of the DNC hacks...

Here... we have foreign actors trying to influence our elections.

Regardless of your political leanings... this should piss you off.

 Vash108 wrote:

 Breotan wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree it is to Clinton's credit that she never played the atheist card against Sanders. FWIW, she would have lost my support if she had.

Did she ever need to play the religion card? She had the Clinton Political Machine working for her and Sanders was never a real threat anyway. Not shooting yourself in the foot is something that should be expected, not something that surprises you. Now how to teach that to the Republicans...

Because there is no GOP Political machine and Faux News doing just as much damage.

 Breotan wrote:
Can we please have a "do over" for the Republican primaries?

 jasper76 wrote:

 whembly wrote:
I'm surprised there isn't more outcry of the DNC hacks...

Here... we have foreign actors trying to influence our elections.

Regardless of your political leanings... this should piss you off.

It does piss me off. Trumps call for the Russian Federation to hack even more was infuriating, astonishing, indeed treasonous IMHO. And Trump's connections to Russia and his admiration for Putin I've said numerous times is the #1 reason no-one should vote for him. I've been pounding he keyboard over this since Page 1 of this iteration of the US politics thread. Even been accused of "eternal hatred of the Russian" over it.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

So gimme a cookie, dammit!

Spoiler:

 Breotan wrote:
Can we please have a "do over" for the Republican primaries?

 BigWaaagh wrote:

 Breotan wrote:
Can we please have a "do over" for the Republican primaries?

The barbarians got through the gates, too late now. How happy is John Boehner now!? Best exit ever.

 Breotan wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 Breotan wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree it is to Clinton's credit that she never played the atheist card against Sanders. FWIW, she would have lost my support if she had.

Did she ever need to play the religion card? She had the Clinton Political Machine working for her and Sanders was never a real threat anyway. Not shooting yourself in the foot is something that should be expected, not something that surprises you. Now how to teach that to the Republicans...

Because there is no GOP Political machine and Faux News doing just as much damage.

Actually, no, at least not as you mean it. The GOP political machine supported Bush, FOX backed Cruz, and the grass roots gobbled crazy pills like they were M&M's. There was no way they could do any significant damage to anyone except themselves (and boy did they do it).

Sigh... can we please have a "do over" for the Republican primaries?

 Vash108 wrote:

infinite_array wrote:

 whembly wrote:
I'm surprised there isn't more outcry of the DNC hacks...

Here... we have foreign actors trying to influence our elections.

Regardless of your political leanings... this should piss you off.

At this point it doesn't matter. Everyone who cares, cares. Everyone who doesn't, doesn't. Especially when the situation is basically:

US Intelligence Agencies: We're pretty sure it was Russia, and this is what we told the candidates.

Clinton: I believe it was Russia, which agrees with the information given to me by US Intelligence Agencies.

Trump: It wasn't Russia. Who says it was Russia? Maybe there were no hacks.

Thats the thing that really chaps me. I am pretty sure he was briefed. His ties to Russia and this garbage raise a few flags.

“Spend a few hours every week studying American history, human nature, and economic theory. Start with “Economics in One Lesson.” Then try Keynes. Then Hayek. Then Marx. Then Hegel. Develop a worldview that you can articulate as well as defend. Test your theory with people who disagree with you. Debate. Argue. Adjust your philosophy as necessary. Then, when the next election comes around, cast a vote for the candidate whose worldview seems most in line with your own.”

 Vaktathi wrote:

 Breotan wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

 Breotan wrote:

 jasper76 wrote:
I agree it is to Clinton's credit that she never played the atheist card against Sanders. FWIW, she would have lost my support if she had.

Did she ever need to play the religion card? She had the Clinton Political Machine working for her and Sanders was never a real threat anyway. Not shooting yourself in the foot is something that should be expected, not something that surprises you. Now how to teach that to the Republicans...

Because there is no GOP Political machine and Faux News doing just as much damage.

Actually, no, at least not as you mean it. The GOP political machine supported Bush, FOX backed Cruz, and the grass roots gobbled crazy pills like they were M&M's. There was no way they could do any significant damage to anyone except themselves (and boy did they do it).

Sigh... can we please have a "do over" for the Republican primaries?

Honestly...who would they put forward that would really have a chance? They had 16 candidates, and I dont think any would win a general election. Any republican capable of doing so is detested and villified by the Republican base at this point, leaving only the crazies able to make it through a primary.


Who would do better? Rubio? He came off looking like a well crafted animatronic muppet but he's having problems holding onto a seat he's incumbent to. Jeb? Despised by the base and saddled with his brothers legacy. Kasich? He only looked moderate next to the crazy crazies, and has little personal charisma. Certainly not a Cruz, Christy or Cain. Fiorina, Santorum, Graham, etc? Romney might have been competitive against Clinton, but he was almost a pariah within the party after the last election.


I dont believe the GOP is capable of fielding a candidate than can pass muster with the base and win a general election. Inherently, the platform of the Republican base is fundamentally diametrically opposed to the requirements of a candidate acceptable to the larger nation.

 jasper76 wrote:
Rand Paul was OK... I at least would have considered him.

 Vaktathi wrote:
He has much the same problems as his father and the 3rd party candidates. They sound great, refreshingly sane, creative and reasonable on many issues until you all of a sudden hit a Derpwall of total insanity on some great big show stopping fundamental

 whembly wrote:


Trump is losing bad in Utah!!!

 Kilkrazy wrote:

 Vash108 wrote:

infinite_array wrote:

 whembly wrote:
I'm surprised there isn't more outcry of the DNC hacks...

Here... we have foreign actors trying to influence our elections.

Regardless of your political leanings... this should piss you off.

At this point it doesn't matter. Everyone who cares, cares. Everyone who doesn't, doesn't. Especially when the situation is basically:

US Intelligence Agencies: We're pretty sure it was Russia, and this is what we told the candidates.

Clinton: I believe it was Russia, which agrees with the information given to me by US Intelligence Agencies.

Trump: It wasn't Russia. Who says it was Russia? Maybe there were no hacks.

Thats the thing that really chaps me. I am pretty sure he was briefed. His ties to Russia and this garbage raise a few flags.

It is standard procedure for the presidential candidates to receive that kind of security briefings since soon after the election one of them is president and actually has to make decisions based on facts.

For 27 years, I’ve been in Donald Trump’s crosshairs.

I’m a member of the Central Park Five, a group of teenagers imprisoned for a brutal sexual assault in Central Park in 1989. When we were arrested, the police deprived us of food, drink or sleep for more than 24 hours. Under duress, four of us falsely confessed. Though we were innocent, we spent our formative years in prison, branded as rapists.

During our trial, it seemed like every New Yorker had an opinion. But no one took it further than Trump. He called for blood in the most public way possible. Trump used his money to take out full-page ads in all of the city’s major newspapers, calling for the reinstatement of the death penalty in New York.

During that time, our families tried to shield us from what was going on in the media, but we still found out about Trump’s ad. My initial thought was, “Who is this guy?” I was terrified that I might be executed for a crime I didn’t commit.

Thirteen years later, in 2002, we were exonerated. Matias Reyes eventually confessed to the rape and was definitively linked to the victim by his DNA. New York paid us $41 million in 2014 for our false imprisonment.

Trump has never apologized for calling for our murder. In fact, despite all evidence to the contrary, he’s still convinced that we were guilty. When the Republican nominee was recently asked about the Central Park Five, he said, “They admitted they were guilty.” In a statement to CNN’s Miguel Marquez, Trump wrote, “The police doing the original investigation say they were guilty. The fact that that case was settled with so much evidence against them is outrageous. And the woman, so badly injured, will never be the same.” It’s further proof of his bias, racism and inability to admit that he’s wrong.

When I heard Trump’s latest proclamation, it was like the worst feeling in the world. I felt as if I couldn’t breathe. Since I was 15, my life has never been my own. I had no control over what happened to me. Being in the spotlight makes me wary and self-conscious again. I am overwhelmed with a nagging fear that an overzealous Trump supporter might take matters into his or her hands.

Doing something simple like picking up dinner for the family or going to the aquarium takes on a whole new wrinkle. I’m always looking over my shoulder, keeping an eye out for people who stare too long. Like a soldier always on high alert, I feel as if I can never enjoy myself fully, with all of the adrenaline that comes with that. It’s a scary feeling.

In some ways, I feel like I’m on trial all over again. Like Trayvon Martin and Mike Brown, young men who were killed and then crucified in the media, I know what it is to be a young black man without a voice. Even though we were found innocent by a court of law, we are still guilty in the court of public opinion. That brings a certain kind of stress.

I realize, too, that I’m not the only victim. Trump has smeared dozens of people, with no regard for the truth. And he has backed a “law and order” system that would systematically target minorities. Trump says he would like to re-institute practices like New York’s “stop and frisk,” a policy proven to be unconstitutional and unjust. When we hear that he is going to be a “law and order president,” a collective chill goes down the spine of those of us who have been the victims of this “law and order.”

Black people across America know that because of the color of our skin, we are guilty before proven innocent. As a result, sometimes we lose the best years of our lives. Sometimes we lose our actual lives. We must not let this man ascend to the highest office in the land when he has always proven that he lets neither facts nor humanity lead his steps.

 whembly wrote:
Man... it was some ancient time ago that this guy said that Russia is our biggest geopolitical foe:

Spoiler: