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 gummyofallbears wrote:
All very good input!

I played a game today against Raven Guard.

It was a complete slaughter. I'm not sure if it was his terrible playing, or my amazing playing.

He was running a very typical RG list. The main scary thing was the Shadow Strike Kill team.

Pivotally, he decided to go second. He knew that I would castle up and bubble wrap if he went first, so he decided to either make me waste a turn or expose myself. However, I was able to pick off his scout squads turn one (they were so close due to scout +infiltrate) so his vanguard vets didn't have a set landing. One spent a few turns in reserves, and the other DH, but the way I was set up was that the VV could only get at most a venom before fighting my entire army.

He had quite a bit of board control by turn 2, but not much to bear against my army but bolters (still quite good against DE). Groestquerie did work. They killed an incredible amount of OBSEC tac marines, and the t6 paired with 6+ armour made his grav and bolters quite ineffective.

He was a very nice opponent, and a very good tactician (I've played against his Eldar numerous times) but I am still not sure why he didn't take first turn.

Most of the times I face against astartes, it's a blood bath. Their super physiology is no match for the poison. My first game with Dark Eldar was against my friend's Blood Angels. He used almost an identical list (1500) against my Space Wolves and he mopped the floor with me. In the game vs my Dark Eldar I think he was able to completely kill one unit. That was it. Maybe my luck vs them is just karma payback for all the power armor saves I have failed.

wrack tactics/usage?

 Gamerely wrote:

 gummyofallbears wrote:
All very good input!

I played a game today against Raven Guard.

It was a complete slaughter. I'm not sure if it was his terrible playing, or my amazing playing.

He was running a very typical RG list. The main scary thing was the Shadow Strike Kill team.

Pivotally, he decided to go second. He knew that I would castle up and bubble wrap if he went first, so he decided to either make me waste a turn or expose myself. However, I was able to pick off his scout squads turn one (they were so close due to scout +infiltrate) so his vanguard vets didn't have a set landing. One spent a few turns in reserves, and the other DH, but the way I was set up was that the VV could only get at most a venom before fighting my entire army.

He had quite a bit of board control by turn 2, but not much to bear against my army but bolters (still quite good against DE). Groestquerie did work. They killed an incredible amount of OBSEC tac marines, and the t6 paired with 6+ armour made his grav and bolters quite ineffective.

He was a very nice opponent, and a very good tactician (I've played against his Eldar numerous times) but I am still not sure why he didn't take first turn.

Most of the times I face against astartes, it's a blood bath. Their super physiology is no match for the poison. My first game with Dark Eldar was against my friend's Blood Angels. He used almost an identical list (1500) against my Space Wolves and he mopped the floor with me. In the game vs my Dark Eldar I think he was able to completely kill one unit. That was it. Maybe my luck vs them is just karma payback for all the power armor saves I have failed.

Typically the reverse is true. Frag cannons make such a mess of most DE units. It's also hard to shoot through 3+/5+++ with poison. I can assure you that if you played my BA, you'd lose more than one unit. You might still win, but it won't be easy for the DE.

Frag Cannons are cool. Also 8" range. Just ring your guys with a couple Raiders, and wait til they show up, let em hit the Raider a couple times and then get in and leave them in the dust, isolated and alone. =)

 eddesb wrote:
wrack tactics/usage?

I would rate Grotesquerie Formations among the best there are, and so I would never take Wracks over a Grotesqueri Formation; but we are assuming in this instance that you may not have Grotesques or don't want to buy them etc...

The Scalpel squadron is the lazy easy answer. its usefulness isnt trumpeted much, but just think about it for a moment: You can deploy nothing. Absolutely nothing. there is a real value to that.

1. Power From Pain is turn based. thus going second and deploying nothing gives your army more time to "power up".

2. The Scalpel Squadron itself is not incredibly impressive as even a Dual Venom averages 4 wounds per round, before saves, and therefore two of them isn't likely to knock a unit out NOR get the First Blood point. However, you ARE going to be able to challenge a couple objective points in theory if its an ITC mission (in which objectives are scored at the top of your round). They are fast enough that instead of shooting you can ensure they are simply out of sight until the cavalry arrive. In normal Maelstrom missions where objectives are scored as you score them, the Scalpel Squadron is quite useful for taking those objectives without over committing too much of the force. In normal 40K missions, the Scalpel Squadron cant score anything really, but their usefulness against Monstrous Creatures is pretty good. 8 saves to a StormSurge for example should yiled two wounds to get the party started, although to be honest, with only two targets, interceptor is more likely to get you killed than yield those wounds. Still, other targets of the monstrous type wont appreciate the early chipping against which they can do little to stop.

3. Wracks in the more general sense: If you want them to WORK as inexpensive versions of Grotesques, they actually are good at their job. They are tough, they have poison, as well as can carry a Rending melee weapon which is great against armored targets, allowing the unit to actually affect one in a pinch. it won't be great but its better than nothing, and is probably the ideal weapon for the unit to carry.

Wracks can also carry the Hexrifle. This is a very underrated weapon. I originally had a force that employed six Wrack units, plus the haemonculous to accelerate their Power From Pain chart. I was sporting the hexrifles, as many as i could take, firing from Lance armed Raiders. they essentially formed a preliminary "gun line" whose job was to soften the enemy while assault elements could get into position. Of course the Wracks themselves were a second tier assault element. themselves. This was when they were scoring units so I wouldn't do it now. However, I cannot begin to tell you how many times the Hexrifles paid dividends against "big things". Imagine a Trygon Prime popping up shooting and then getting leveled by limited Sniper Fire and you get the idea. Or in another case, watching a WraithKnight get butchered the same way with a bit of luck (well a lot of luck but I'll take it). The point is, the Hexrifle is a unique weapon that sees almost no use. The Ossefactor takes its place in most lists as a more all around good weapon, and relies less on the shenanigans of the Hexrifle. Ossefactors are probably the ranged weapon i would recommend in general. The Hexrifle beckons to me frequently though, when I think about playing Wracks again.

4. In assault from Raiders, they are likely to be fearless by the time they get involved. They are at least reliable damage dealers. A unit of ten is throwing 31 poison attacks (or 27+ 4 rending as the case may be) after they fire their ossefactors. Their value is T4 and Fearlessness, allowing you to tie the enemy up where you need them to be. In objective missions you need that and fortunately, these guys provide it perhaps better and at a more reasonable price than other options like wych's. Most Dark Eldar will crumble and fall back against serious melee opposition (the type you would see in shooty armies, in any event). If all you need is to stop an enemy for a round (and maybe more), these guys can do it. I wouldn't take them in small units. I would take 10 at a time. Trust me when I say that a 6+/5+ Fnp with T4 attached is really not so bad when it comes to lasting long enough and dealing damage enough to let people know they were there. The min/max's variety of units people often employ at tournaments mean they have a middling shot at winning some of those fights through sheer tenacity. They can pile in on fallen FMC's, they can trap fast moving units that you need to keep "over yonder" and Raiders deliver them nicely. Other than the Scalpel Squadron, use Raiders to transport them to the fight.

I think just one unit of them, aimed at the heart of a unit you can't afford to allow to move too freely would be a good target. I dont know that you would need more than one unit of them, One nice thing is that they aren't likely to be the "priority target" among the sea of possibilities. They will often get to do "their thing" and wont be seen as nearly the threat other units will be (In part because its simply true)

I dont know what I can add, but the main thing is to direct them right at the thing you need to stall. The Raider they are in us just a distraction, and they are just a tenacious stumbling block. Still, they are pretty good at it.

So I know DE fliers suck... but I had a lultastic game with them Sunday night.

3 void ravens
3 razorwings (had to borrow some crimsons, GW is still out of stock)
4 venoms w/ 5 kab each
18 reavers



The planes...the planes! They *all* came in turn 3. It was a thing of beauty . While they didn't do a hellova lot on their own, the psychological effect was undeniable. Flight of the damn valkyries -- it just rattled the gak out of my opponent for some reason. Voidravens drew damn near all the fire, leaving the reavers to roll up and charge (mmmm....cluster caltrops and HoW) the gunlines from the flanks.

Oh, and dropping 12 sets of missiles in a single turn from the razorwings hurt like hell...and that voidbomb is no joke. Unfortunately, the dicegods hated my darklance shots :|

 ncshooter426 wrote:
So I know DE fliers suck... but I had a lultastic game with them Sunday night.

3 void ravens
3 razorwings (had to borrow some crimsons, GW is still out of stock)
4 venoms w/ 5 kab each
18 reavers



The planes...the planes! They *all* came in turn 3. It was a thing of beauty . While they didn't do a hellova lot on their own, the psychological effect was undeniable. Flight of the damn valkyries -- it just rattled the gak out of my opponent for some reason. Voidravens drew damn near all the fire, leaving the reavers to roll up and charge (mmmm....cluster caltrops and HoW) the gunlines from the flanks.

Oh, and dropping 12 sets of missiles in a single turn from the razorwings hurt like hell...and that voidbomb is no joke. Unfortunately, the dicegods hated my darklance shots :|

I use a Voidraven bomber quite regularly and no opponent I face likes it when it shows up. I just have one and its enough to attract a lot of attention. I never jink it, I just give it the 5+ shield and dare them to hit me. Its done so much damage in my assault based army that you just cant beat it really. It and the Ravagers combine to doa fair amount of damage to soften up the big uns. takes a lot longer than I'd like given the unreliability of lances but it is what it is. The more aggressive the enemy tyhe better the bomber performs.

Martel732 wrote:


Typically the reverse is true. Frag cannons make such a mess of most DE units. It's also hard to shoot through 3+/5+++ with poison. I can assure you that if you played my BA, you'd lose more than one unit. You might still win, but it won't be easy for the DE.

Yeah, dark eldars are similar to orks, they don't care how many would remain alive at the end of the battle, players should focus on scoring points. Both armies work well when they have expendable units, they both have paper transports and no decent saves but they can be very fast and field a lot of units, that's the key with armies like these ones. I've won games with less than 30 points of my list alive in the battlefield.


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 Jancoran wrote:


The Scalpel squadron is the lazy easy answer. its usefulness isnt trumpeted much, but just think about it for a moment: You can deploy nothing. Absolutely nothing. there is a real value to that.

The scalpel squadron is not extremely easy to play as you need a list that can afford to be put into reserves but played correctly is very nice, those wracks can also gain D3 victory points if they get first blood, so it's a very tactical unit. Not very powerful of course but it allow the dark eldar to play in a way that could harass many opponents, especially the all shooting lists and the ones with many deep striking units like drop pods that are forced to arrive in an empty table.

" I've won games with less than 30 points of my list alive in the battlefield."

That's usually how I win as well. BA are a bit like power armor DE without assault transports.

I use a Voidraven bomber quite regularly and no opponent I face likes it when it shows up. I just have one and its enough to attract a lot of attention. I never jink it, I just give it the 5+ shield and dare them to hit me. Its done so much damage in my assault based army that you just cant beat it really.

You and your Voidravens...I don't know who you're playing, but they need some serious education on how the game works if they consider a 160-pt unit rocking 2 lance lascannons a mortal threat. It's one of the few units that make Tau flyers look worthwhile. Compare it to a Hornet; is being a flyer and an extra strength worth 80 pts? Alternatively, compare it to a Crimson Hunter. Is losing 2 S8 AP2 shots worth 20pts (duh)? The Voidraven is just another sad case of GW thinking that bombs are a devastating attack worthy of many extra points, when the reality is that you most often are much better off with another gun.

The Scalpel Squadron is an interesting case. The crafty tactician in me wants to think it's useful, but Grotesques are just so much better, especially when they're in a Grotesquerie. They're not much good as a harassment unit because they can't really kill anything. They're also fragile as hell, so tarpitting is out of the question. Those facts mean they're going to need a helping hand to GET first blood rather than BE first blood. Again, ramming a Grotesque-filled Raider down you're opponent's throat is just plain better.

He obviously doesn't play me or anyone else like me, because most of my lists don't a gak about the voidraven, or most other flyers for that matter. There are a few exceptions, but the voidraven is not one of them.

MilkmanAl wrote:

I use a Voidraven bomber quite regularly and no opponent I face likes it when it shows up. I just have one and its enough to attract a lot of attention. I never jink it, I just give it the 5+ shield and dare them to hit me. Its done so much damage in my assault based army that you just cant beat it really.

You and your Voidravens...I don't know who you're playing, but they need some serious education on how the game works if they consider a 160-pt unit rocking 2 lance lascannons a mortal threat. It's one of the few units that make Tau flyers look worthwhile. Compare it to a Hornet; is being a flyer and an extra strength worth 80 pts? Alternatively, compare it to a Crimson Hunter. Is losing 2 S8 AP2 shots worth 20pts (duh)? The Voidraven is just another sad case of GW thinking that bombs are a devastating attack worthy of many extra points, when the reality is that you most often are much better off with another gun.
.

I dont use that version of the bomber that you just described. i really dont think my opponents need an education. i think you need one in the definition of "vacuum". As in, the Bomber works well because it is in the assault based list, not in a vacuum. The few units that are free to fire at it when it shows up aren't generally the ones I worry about most. those have been wrapped up in hugs.

So while I can understand that when you attempt comparisons, you can find things to gripe about, the thing is, it unloads a whole lot of AP 2 blasts and it can keep up the torrent for a couple of really nice rounds. 2+ armor is one of the more annoying things to crack, especially when assigned to certain models. Reserving something just long enough to tie the less imposing stuff up so you can unload on the rest with the Bomber and Ravagers works well. Surrounded by melee units, they have to really do some math in their heads at that point as to whether they want to take a pot shot...or take their chances against the melee horse,. Not so cut and dry. Failure means they are out on the open and i can shoot them again.

2 STR 8 AP 2 blasts, a STR 6 AP 2 blast and then a STR 9 AP 2 large blast from one gun boat is no small thing. You can say it is. It isn't. doing it twice is also cool. Getting a third round of it off? It does work. They nuke the broadsides in one round and in the next they bomb the Crisis team, the other crisis team and the fellows standing in their vicinity. it carves up a lot of stuff. and if you can angle it right, you can take limited shots on interceptor. again because the units you most fear are embroiled in combat or stuck far behind their own lines in order to avoid the charge to the extent possible which means limited numbers in range when it chooses its target. All in all, very satisfying.

I drop it out in some games to make a little room for things but its pretty much a favorite of mine now. 11 armor would be a lot nicer..grqanted...

2 STR 8 AP 2 blasts, a STR 6 AP 2 blast and then a STR 9 AP 2 large blast from one gun boat is no small thing.

That's sort of true. The first turn it's on the board is potentially great, but you're paying 220pts for that great turn. Small blasts are unreliable at best and depend on your opponent tightly grouping his high-armor targets (i.e., playing poorly) for effect.

Speaking of Broadisdes, 2 will intercept the Voidraven off the board before it even gets to do anything, but even if you get your wonderful shooting off, I'm sure your opponent will be happy to sacrifice a single Broadside (because not many people run more than 1 in a unit, as far as I can tell) to your glass almost-cannon. It'll promptly vanish the next turn. I'm sure you'll say you'd just have the intercepting units already tied in combat or whatever, but hopefully everyone else knows that likely won't be the case.

This argument is just like the one you have for Stealth Suits and decked-out Pathfinders. One time they produced an extraordinary result, so they must be great! They're garbage units, and while I'm all for bucking trends and trying new things, sometimes everyone agrees that a unit sucks for a reason - or many reasons, as in this case.

I really wish DE flyers got vector dancer like the craftworlder.

Yes, it sucks to get shot by this thing, but it sucks a lot more to get shot by 220 pts of scatterbikes. So...I'd rather see the voidraven.

Also, if you blow the initial reserve roll, you start losing relevance to match outcome.

MilkmanAl wrote:

2 STR 8 AP 2 blasts, a STR 6 AP 2 blast and then a STR 9 AP 2 large blast from one gun boat is no small thing.

That's sort of true. The first turn it's on the board is potentially great, but you're paying 220pts for that great turn. Small blasts are unreliable at best and depend on your opponent tightly grouping his high-armor targets (i.e., playing poorly) for effect.

Speaking of Broadisdes, 2 will intercept the Voidraven off the board before it even gets to do anything, but even if you get your wonderful shooting off, I'm sure your opponent will be happy to sacrifice a single Broadside (because not many people run more than 1 in a unit, as far as I can tell) to your glass almost-cannon. It'll promptly vanish the next turn. I'm sure you'll say you'd just have the intercepting units already tied in combat or whatever, but hopefully everyone else knows that likely won't be the case. .

But it will. So. Theres that. You saying it wont happen is fine, though inaccurate. enemies that threaten it will be in melee or it will be too far to matter oooor...it will have done its job and its death will be of some but not great consequence compared to the fire it absored. Either way is fine. I am quite familiar with my army. Me sitting and worrying about the worst case scenario that miiiiight happen is one thing I could do. Another more intelligent thing I can do is to recognize that no plan was ever prefect (yours included), but that this plan works far more frequently than it doesn't. That is, after all, the true measure of its usefulness and Im not in the habit of going out of my way to find ways to lose, am I?

I'm not suggesting that shooty versions of the Dark Eldar take a bunch of them either. Read me in context. I don't even take a bunch of them, What I told you is that in my army, it works grea. Using my tactical perspective, I win so many more games than i lose with it and no amount of postulating will change the final scoreboard. I could use something else also. You're right, i could. But the alternative is essentially two more Ravagers which comes with a Kabalite tax which hurts the rest of the list. Why bother when I can unleash more efficacy from it than from the Ravagers and soak more fire than they can? It's simple enough math.

In other lists, it may not be advisable. ESPECIALLY primarily shooty lists where the enemy is essentially unpressured by a true melee front and is able to go weapons free all the time.




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Martel732 wrote:
Yes, it sucks to get shot by this thing, but it sucks a lot more to get shot by 220 pts of scatterbikes. So...I'd rather see the voidraven.

Also, if you blow the initial reserve roll, you start losing relevance to match outcome.

Reserves are always a risk. less so in recent Editions but absolutely a fair point. If i "relied" on the VoidRaven Bomber in a real way, that would be a big issue. As iti s, I don't rely on it so much as it simply provides the answer to a problem that i CAN solve otherwise but would prefer that it did it for me first. That difference is important. the more you RELY on something for your strategy to work, the more you start to have to hedge within the list. Hedging costs points and there is a line as anyone who uses Reserves heavily (and i do) can tell you.


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 gummyofallbears wrote:
I really wish DE flyers got vector dancer like the craftworlder.

Why do we not? Ugh. We should so totally have gotten that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Martel732 wrote:
He obviously doesn't play me or anyone else like me, because most of my lists don't a gak about the voidraven, or most other flyers for that matter. There are a few exceptions, but the voidraven is not one of them.

Everything a Blood Angel wields cares about STR 8 and STR 9 AP 2 blasts. Just saying. =)

You'd be surprised how much I don't care about my own units at this point. Again, I'd rather one bomber drop one blast than have them spammed from Eldar or IG.

Martel732 wrote:
You'd be surprised how much I don't care about my own units at this point. Again, I'd rather one bomber drop one blast than have them spammed from Eldar or IG.

Oh I think I am abundantly well informed on your discontent. Hehehe.

Give that list a try (after you proof it for errors, since Im not actually a BA player) and do a batrep. that would be fun.

Every time i pick up my Dark Eldar for a while i am reminded how fun they are. If you can find that same love for your army. the wins and losses won't matter as much. Just know that the Dark Eldar offer you no mercy. Best to die before we arrive...

I've been having some fun with Leilith. She is incredibly fragile, but man its hilarious to see her eat entire squads

StevetheDestroyeOfWorlds wrote:
I've been having some fun with Leilith. She is incredibly fragile, but man its hilarious to see her eat entire squads

Lelith is hand painted across my Fighter jet. It looks pretty cool. She is kind of a beast but you're right: she needs an escort, thats for sure.

MilkmanAl wrote:

2 STR 8 AP 2 blasts, a STR 6 AP 2 blast and then a STR 9 AP 2 large blast from one gun boat is no small thing.

That's sort of true. The first turn it's on the board is potentially great, but you're paying 220pts for that great turn. Small blasts are unreliable at best and depend on your opponent tightly grouping his high-armor targets (i.e., playing poorly) for effect.

Speaking of Broadisdes, 2 will intercept the Voidraven off the board before it even gets to do anything, but even if you get your wonderful shooting off, I'm sure your opponent will be happy to sacrifice a single Broadside (because not many people run more than 1 in a unit, as far as I can tell) to your glass almost-cannon. It'll promptly vanish the next turn. I'm sure you'll say you'd just have the intercepting units already tied in combat or whatever, but hopefully everyone else knows that likely won't be the case.

This argument is just like the one you have for Stealth Suits and decked-out Pathfinders. One time they produced an extraordinary result, so they must be great! They're garbage units, and while I'm all for bucking trends and trying new things, sometimes everyone agrees that a unit sucks for a reason - or many reasons, as in this case.

All those units firing on the raven are ones not firing on the swarms of reavers about the rollup their exhaust pipes.


Want to deal with the tau ignores cover shenanigans? 36 feth yo railguns reavers. Channel your inner Spider, and just mass assault them. MSU is the ONLY way to counter the cheese. Anyone taking fliers is doing so for fun - and with DE, you never take just one of anything. Fliers? 3 each, find the points (*cough* lehman *cough*)

The issue with DE is that Tau and Eldar are simply shenaniganed up to the point of absurdity. Right now, I'm even granting Tau as being less cheesy than Eldar (Ynari). DE should be the ultimate speed freak, drugged up, stabby force out there. I expect to roll in full throttle and either oraface destroy, or be wiped. There is no middle ground

The voidraven suffers from (other than bloated USR and mechanics) being overcosted, and against it's own fluff. Somehow a friggin *stealth bomber* is better at shooting other fliers than bombing things.


Amazing how, in the fluff, the damn thing can't even be tracked until its too late -- yet in current builds, it's just another flier with gak armor -- and absurd missile upgrade costs. Don't even get me started on the fresh-faced Tau's tech -- It's better than the humies, but should be a friggin joke compared to Eldari. They've got guns older than their entire race


Voidravens (IMHO) should have nightshields by default, that extra 40pts worth of missiles for free, and AV11 to keep the bolter bitches at bay. Maybe even ditch the single use bomb, swapping out it's missile blast system for cluster warheads (like the Xiphon has). I can live with the lack of vector dancer (even though it's stupid as gak not to have it on the razorwing or voidraven....Thanks writers) on it if they'd just make her the evil skybitch she's supposed to be.

This is why the rebalance of units in 8th is so desperately needed. I'm all for taking penalties of lack of defenses, but I better make up for it in strait up brutality....and I don't want to fight cheese with cheese anymore. I hate that.

The Bomb is extremely useful. I would not get rid of that, ever. firing on two targets in a turn, on its own is excellent but then having that death rain be all kinds of AP 2 blasts? Even if you do argue that its cost is a little high, at the end of the build, where was I going to put 40 points that was SO much better at the tail end? The 40 points matter, don't misquote me on that, but only insofar as there was something absolutely critical to the build, at the end of the build, that you couldn't get. If you're in that situation, a lot of people go with the Fighter. Its legit to do that. I had nothing that added significantly to my build and so those 40 points would not have had much of a useful home. I couldnt fit another Grotesque, you WANT your Incubi to be a smaller unit because of the Rampage ability, so nothing to add there, the Beastpack is maxed essentially though i suppose i could add ONE member to it, Ravagers didnt need more upgrades, kabalites cant be bigger inside a Venom and arming them is almost pointless given the ranges. Really it comes down to whether I want to spend a bunch of points on my HQ. Thats what those 40 points would have done for me. I frankly don't see him doing much to improve upon the devastation his Grotesquerie bodyguard can already do, but sure...I could spend points there if I loved overkill that much.

You see the point. My list literally had nothing it truly needed for those points other than more anti-tank and in the Bomber you get both anti-horde and anti-tank and anti-TEQ. Ultimately it is the most effective choice for the list.

The build determines whether paying an extra 40 (your number) is actually much of a sacrifice.

Voidraven is overcosted compared to just about every other flier out there. When compared to our Eldar cousins, it's a massive issue. Most of that just stems from rules bloat and lack of solid writing/testing for DE. All the things that make the army what it should be aren't really there anymore -- it kept the glass, but lacks the punch.

The other issue with he voidraven is it's purpose. Single use bomb (which can scatter), and non-twinlinked lances. The missiles are stupid expensive, and while not required, means that once you drop your single ordnance you're now not hitting very hard. The lack of defenses is just painful. Does make a wonderful distraction carnifex though -- especially when run in multiples.

Oh, it only gets ONE bomb?

"Voidraven is overcosted compared to just about every other flier out there."

And fliers are, in general, overcosted because of the reserve tax.

Martel732 wrote:
Oh, it only gets ONE bomb?
.

Just the one my friend. Granted, it's a beast... but yep -- one time use. That's why I'd like to see it move into an actual bomber style platform -- capable of doing bombing runs each turn and dropping what amounts to airborn cluster caltrops (with the cluster warhead rule, that would be d3 on a pen for the dmg chart...WOOOOoOo).

 ncshooter426 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
Oh, it only gets ONE bomb?
.

Just the one my friend. Granted, it's a beast... but yep -- one time use. That's why I'd like to see it move into an actual bomber style platform -- capable of doing bombing runs each turn and dropping what amounts to airborn cluster caltrops (with the cluster warhead rule, that would be d3 on a pen for the dmg chart...WOOOOoOo).

It's a one-shot ion accelerator that can't be given ignores cover without DFTS.

Voidraven does give +2 to sexy though...so it's got that going for it.

Maybe in 8th we'll get some points for oozing cool

Agreed on that front. That's one awesome model. The whole DE range is pretty sweet, but their planes are hotness. It'd actually be a decently functional (and fairly costed) unit with unlimited bombs. If only.

It's a glorified Stuka lol.

So i got a new tactic for dark eldar. It's pricey but i killed a stormsurge with it on my first game using it.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/721533.page

Basically it's 500 pts but it killed his nearly 500 points stormsurge and considering all the firepower they threw out trying to kill the archon four-some it tanked a lot of the damage. My one complaint is hope you don't roll horribly and they don't roll super good (stomps and leadership). 2 of my archons failed a leadership at the worst time and i also failed fear at least once with them. Yes that's on a leadership 10. I swear half of my leaderships which were between 9-10 failed that game today.