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 djones520 wrote:
Not a fan of these rules. They reek of 40K power creep coming into the game, and that is not cool in my book.

You may want to read the basic army list of Space Marine Legion if you think this unit is out of scope.

I'm interested in this unit. I just don't have a clue how it may be utilized.. and if it's worth the points. Already own a warhound. or should I just get another warhound

It's reasonably pointed, but I wouldn't call it overpowered. There are a lot of big scary things in 30k, and a lot of hard counters.

It doesn't ignore cover. Damage from blasts can be mitigated with transports and spreading units out.

Being so tall/big can help get line of sight to get more shots per game, but it also provides a line of sight to you. A team of sicaran venators hunting the non-shielded side armor would worry me. It's relatively useless if it has to snap shot.

captaincaine24thfoot wrote:
It's reasonably pointed, but I wouldn't call it overpowered. There are a lot of big scary things in 30k, and a lot of hard counters.

It doesn't ignore cover. Damage from blasts can be mitigated with transports and spreading units out.

Being so tall/big can help get line of sight to get more shots per game, but it also provides a line of sight to you. A team of sicaran venators hunting the non-shielded side armor would worry me. It's relatively useless if it has to snap shot.

Those 36" range Venators? This things weapons double that range, and they'd carve the Venator's in half with a single round of fire.

Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

 Wulfenone wrote:
Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

Can't. It's a Lord of War choice for Questoris, or Mechanicum. Legion's can't bring it.

 djones520 wrote:

 Wulfenone wrote:
Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

Can't. It's a Lord of War choice for Questoris, or Mechanicum. Legion's can't bring it.

You are correct sir. My stupidity.

 djones520 wrote:

 Wulfenone wrote:
Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

Can't. It's a Lord of War choice for Questoris, or Mechanicum. Legion's can't bring it.

Per the new Red Book, they can via a War Machine Detachment.

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

 djones520 wrote:

 Wulfenone wrote:
Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

Can't. It's a Lord of War choice for Questoris, or Mechanicum. Legion's can't bring it.

Per the new Red Book, they can via a War Machine Detachment.

If you're talking about the Leviathan Force Org, then Iron Hands would no longer be his primary detachment. He would be playing Mechanicum or Questoris Knights with Iron Hands allies.

Can someone could explain to me the price of the Acastus. It is the same size than any other knight but twice the price?

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

 djones520 wrote:

 Wulfenone wrote:
Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

Can't. It's a Lord of War choice for Questoris, or Mechanicum. Legion's can't bring it.

Per the new Red Book, they can via a War Machine Detachment.

If you're talking about the Leviathan Force Org, then Iron Hands would no longer be his primary detachment. He would be playing Mechanicum or Questoris Knights with Iron Hands allies.

He is talking about a War Machine Detachment which takes up a Lord of War slot in any list, including Legiones Astartes.

 hellpato wrote:
Can someone could explain to me the price of the Acastus. It is the same size than any other knight but twice the price?

Same size? Not quite...

 djones520 wrote:

 hellpato wrote:
Can someone could explain to me the price of the Acastus. It is the same size than any other knight but twice the price?

Same size? Not quite...

those I found tell me something else for the size... !!!

 hellpato wrote:
those I found tell me something else for the size... !!!

Uh, not really. The picture you posted clearly shows that the new knight is significantly taller than any of the others and a lot bulkier. What makes you think that it isn't?

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 em_en_oh_pee wrote:

 djones520 wrote:

 Wulfenone wrote:
Other then the looks. Is this thing worth fielding as a freeblade knight? I want to attach to my iron hands primary detachment. I mean it's got pretty substantial firepower in my opinion.

Can't. It's a Lord of War choice for Questoris, or Mechanicum. Legion's can't bring it.

Per the new Red Book, they can via a War Machine Detachment.

If you're talking about the Leviathan Force Org, then Iron Hands would no longer be his primary detachment. He would be playing Mechanicum or Questoris Knights with Iron Hands allies.

He is talking about a War Machine Detachment which takes up a Lord of War slot in any list, including Legiones Astartes.

Correct! This seems to fit nicely into that slot, so even Spehss Mahreens can toss this big sucker on the table. Good move by FW purely from a sales POV.

 Peregrine wrote:

 hellpato wrote:
those I found tell me something else for the size... !!!

Uh, not really. The picture you posted clearly shows that the new knight is significantly taller than any of the others and a lot bulkier. What makes you think that it isn't?

The size of the Cerastus. The way the picture is taken, the Cerastus look taller and larger from the Acastus who look bulker.

 djones520 wrote:
those I found tell me something else for the size... !!!

Congrats, you found an old picture. The Porphy was first shown at a scale that was similar to a Cerastus, FW later decided to upscale it. You'll find pictures online of both versions; Forge World isn't lying to you about the size of the version they sell

Has anyone played with this knight ? Or proxyed the rules , curious to see how it performs.

locarno24 wrote:
Really? Compared to a turbolaser armed warhound, is it really that bad?

-Turbo-laser equipped warhound is 255 points more (literally 50% higher base cost than the Acastus Knight).
-The warhound has nothing to protect it except 2 void shields that get shot down by anything str6 or higher. It doesn't get an ion shield, and it doesn't get pseudo ITWD,
-The warhound has only 1 more hp (big woop)
-The warhound is BS4 vs Acastus' BS5
-The warhound gets 2 weapons vs. the Acastus' 5 weapons.
-The warhound is WS3, and if I recall only gets like 1 or 2 attacks, Acastus is WS4 and gets 3 base attacks.
-No Occular Augmetics Rule

And if you still think that the warhound has much better fire power, remember that:
-D weapons only get deathblows on a 6
-Turbo laser's aren't TL, unlike the Acastus Knights cannons, so much more reliable accuracy from the Acastus Knight
-2 AC's/LC's and the carapace weapon firing at BS 5 more than make up for any gap in the firepower of the arm weapons.

Just to add to the list of Warhound features: it is immune to Haywire, can never be locked in assaults though and grants Fearless to friendly models within 24".

Also, it is WS 2 and only has one attack, at initiative 4 though.

 BrookM wrote:
Just to add to the list of Warhound features: it is immune to Haywire, can never be locked in assaults though and grants Fearless to friendly models within 24".

Also, it is WS 2 and only has one attack, at initiative 4 though.

Warhound only grants fearless to Mechanicum models within 24" . Thanks a lot for the correction on the attacks, WS, and initiative though.

Forgot about the immunity to haywire which is pretty nice, but considering it has no access to armoured ceramite or flare shields to my memory, it's stuck with nothing but 2 void shields to protect it against a plethora of melta, ordnance, sunder, armourbane, D weapons, and other high power melee weapons that make it's AV14 almost meaningless for a 750 point model. Really nice that it can't get stuck in meelee though.

I need to clarify: I don't think the Acastus is anywhere near the level of "OMG THIS MODEL IS SO OP FW PLZ NERF ASAP". I just think it's a bit undercosted, which considering the rules are experimental, isn't entirely unexpected.

I think armoured ceramite and / or flare shields available to all Knights would break the game too much for some. I'd gladly pay through the nose for armoured ceramite myself, it's that one thing I can't leave home without when facing off against my regular Tau opponent.

 BrookM wrote:
I think armoured ceramite and / or flare shields available to all Knights would break the game too much for some. I'd gladly pay through the nose for armoured ceramite myself, it's that one thing I can't leave home without when facing off against my regular Tau opponent.

Magaera, Styrix and Atropos all have Ionic Flare Shields. That is part of why they are so dirty!

I is clearly a balance choice why FW kept AC from Knights. They need to have at least one weakness!

Indeed, that's why I specified with "all", as some already have some form of flare shielding, quite a nice one at that, given that it's not fixed to the frontal arc unlike the regular version.

My Porphyrion is slowly taking form, can't wait to have it all painted up. Just need to decide whether or not to keep the rear part of the carapace opened or closed.

Then it's off to find an opponent willing to face off against it. Though seeing as it can be taken in the Lord of War slot of any Heresy-era army.. it will go nicely alongside my Solar Auxilia for sure, beats taking a Baneblade variant all the time.

 BrookM wrote:
Indeed, that's why I specified with "all", as some already have some form of flare shielding, quite a nice one at that, given that it's not fixed to the frontal arc unlike the regular version.

My Porphyrion is slowly taking form, can't wait to have it all painted up. Just need to decide whether or not to keep the rear part of the carapace opened or closed.

Then it's off to find an opponent willing to face off against it. Though seeing as it can be taken in the Lord of War slot of any Heresy-era army.. it will go nicely alongside my Solar Auxilia for sure, beats taking a Baneblade variant all the time.

Open. Let the enemy see what is in store for them!

What I don't get is... why would this thing exist fluff-wise? It's as big as a warhound titan (MAYBE a bit smaller) from all the pictures I can see. I can see why its existence is justified points-wise, as there is a big gap between the point cost of a knight and a warhound, but fluff wise why would they bother? The resources this thing would consume would probably be about the same and there's not a big enough gap between it and a warhound fluff-wise IMO.

I feel like FW should have made the model about the size of a cerastus maybe, and just stated it's higher point cost and better stats are because it's a more advanced version and harder to produce than a cerastus but not near as much as a warhound.

The Collegia Titanica and the Questoris Familia are completely different beasts though.

chrispy1991 wrote:What I don't get is... why would this thing exist fluff-wise? It's as big as a warhound titan (MAYBE a bit smaller) from all the pictures I can see. I can see why its existence is justified points-wise, as there is a big gap between the point cost of a knight and a warhound, but fluff wise why would they bother? The resources this thing would consume would probably be about the same and there's not a big enough gap between it and a warhound fluff-wise IMO.

I feel like FW should have made the model about the size of a cerastus maybe, and just stated it's higher point cost and better stats are because it's a more advanced version and harder to produce than a cerastus but not near as much as a warhound.

Nope. Just get right out of here with logic, bro. This is the Grimdark and trying to justify which type of giant robot is best is the way of madness!

BrookM wrote:The Collegia Titanica and the Questoris Familia are completely different beasts though.

Fluff-wise, truth. And this is the absolute largest possible Knight and the Warhound is the smallest possible Titan. That is why they are close to the same size.

Personally, I'm happy with my big Knight, means I don't need to rely on those meddling cogboys for big gun support.

The Porphyrion may be more sophisticated on some levels though, as a single noble is in charge of the machine, whereas the Warhound has a crew of four (princeps, two moderatii and an enginseer), plus a pair of servitors hardwired into the weapon stations.

Orrrrrrr the noble is just that much more of a badass, operating everything on his / her own without the meddling of others.

 chrispy1991 wrote:
And if you still think that the warhound has much better fire power, remember that:
-D weapons only get deathblows on a 6
-Turbo laser's aren't TL, unlike the Acastus Knights cannons, so much more reliable accuracy from the Acastus Knight
-2 AC's/LC's and the carapace weapon firing at BS 5 more than make up for any gap in the firepower of the arm weapons.

But remember, the turbolasers don't have to roll to penetrate and do D3 HP instead of just one. Against the high-AV targets that you want to use a unit like this to kill the Warhound is putting out ~4x the firepower on average, even without counting 6s on the D-weapon table (which you're fairly likely to get with four shots). The knight looks like a good unit, sure, but when you need the biggest targets dead you bring a Warhound.