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Hello! A few weeks back I posted a few lists for feedback and am hoping to have my final list figured out for an upcoming Grand Tournament.

Its full ITC rules with ITC missions.

Here it is!

CaD

Herald of Nurgle, lvl 1, FNP loci (fecundity) doomsday bell 145

11 Blue Horrors 55
11 Pink Horrors 99
11 Pink Horrors 99

8 Screamers 200
5 Plague Drones, plague ridden (with greater reward for greater ether blade), rot proboscis 260

Heralds Anarchic

HoTz, lvl 3, disc, paradox 145
HoTz, lvl 1, disc, loci of conjurations, grimoire 125
HoTz lvl, 45 (sits with horrors)
HoTz lvl, 45 (sits with horrors)

Omniscient Oracles

Kairos 300
LoC, lvl 3, impossible robes, lesser reward (staff of change for that +2S), 2 greater rewards 330


That's 1848. The list starts with 24 warp charges before the die roll. We are using split and I have 20 or so extra blue horrors to split into and 12 brimstone horrors.



Is 5 plague drones good enough/worth it?




Here is the second list with the drones out. It has 22 charges which is still a ton!

CaD

HoTz lvl, 45 (sits with horrors)

11 Blue Horrors 55
11 Pink Horrors 99
11 Pink Horrors 99

7 Screamers 175

Chaos demon knight paladin, mark of khorne 425


Heralds Anarchic

HoTz, lvl 3, disc, paradox 145
HoTz, lvl 1, disc, loci of conjurations, grimoire 125
HoTz lvl, 45 (sits with horrors)


Omniscient Oracles

Kairos 300
LoC, lvl 3, impossible robes, lesser reward (staff of change for that +2S), 2 greater rewards 330


I could easily drop 1 of the 2 greater rewards on the LoC (I was just hoping for that FNP 4+ lol) and by changing the knight to an errant I can get an 8th screamer. Is that better?

No Grimoire? No Greater for the Nurgle Herald? I think the Plague Star needs to hit a little harder to justify the buy in. I'm all about the second Herald to accompany the Drones but that may be overkill in your experience. I just find that they do most of the damage and I like the extra shots at endurance, iron arm, and warp speed.

My take on it is below. You lose a little backfield durability, but get a much scarier star in return and stay in the same warp charge ball park(23 vs 24). You can always summon those pink horrors in.

+++ New Old Dub Star (Warhammer 40,000 7th Edition v2013) (1841pts) +++

++ Formation Detachment (Chaos Daemons: Codex v2003) ++

+ Formation +

········Heralds Anarchic
············Herald of Tzeentch [Disc of Tzeentch, Paradox, Psyker Level 3]
············Herald of Tzeentch [D6 Exalted Daemonic Reward, Disc of Tzeentch, Psyker Level 1]
············Herald of Tzeentch [Psyker Level 1]

++ Formation Detachment (Chaos Daemons: Codex v2003) ++

+ Formation +

········Omniscient Oracles [Kairos Fateweaver]
············Lord of Change [2x D6 Greater Daemonic Reward, D6 Lesser Daemonic Reward, Psyker Level 3, The Impossible Robe]

++ Combined Arms Detachment (Chaos Daemons: Codex v2003) ++

+ HQ +

········Daemonic Heralds
············Herald of Nurgle [D6 Greater Daemonic Reward, Psyker Level 2, The Doomsday Bell]
············Herald of Nurgle [D6 Greater Daemonic Reward, Greater Locus of Fecundity, Psyker Level 2]

+ Troops +

········Blue Horrors [11x Blue Horrors]

········Pink Horrors of Tzeentch [11x Pink Horrors]

+ Fast Attack +

········Plague Drones of Nurgle [6x Plague Drones, Rot Proboscis]

········Screamers of Tzeentch [8x Screamers]

Ugg yes if you point it out 1 of the heralds on the screamers has the grim! Forgot to list it!

I'd put the grim in the Screamers. It's safer in there what with being jetbikes and being able to get a 2++ rerollable.

Haha darn me! I meant screamers! Maybe I shouldn't play chaos lolz


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do you like the second list?

To answer your questions in the OP I think 6 drones is the sweet spot in a list like this

You think the drone version is better than the chaos demon knight? He is so sweet when buffed with the grimoire.

Hard for me to say really. I think they both have their strengths. The thing that bothers me about the knight is that you really want the Grimoire on him but doing so leaves your Screamers rather vulnerable. I think it comes down to preference really. If you do go with the drones, strongly consider the second Herald. The extra 115 points turns your already 450 point investment into much more of a threat with the possibility to be much more durable as well.

Those are some good points and much to consider.

I tend to like drones as a summoned unit since 9 t5 shrouded wounds is so good. I never seem to get much damage wise from them and sometimes the getting "strung out" is a real pain. So dumb GW didn't give them a drone to ride as an option!

 Icelord wrote:
Those are some good points and much to consider.

I tend to like drones as a summoned unit since 9 t5 shrouded wounds is so good. I never seem to get much damage wise from them and sometimes the getting "strung out" is a real pain. So dumb GW didn't give them a drone to ride as an option!

No doubt they are a fantastic summon. The damage issue is why I strongly advocate for two ML2 Heralds with the drones. If you roll Iron Arm with one of them you opt for the Balesword. Swinging at S8 Ap2 with instant death scares the pants off just about anything with a Wound characteristic. Even if you don't, they pack enough S6 AP2 attacks to keep you out of too much trouble especially with the possibility of warp speed, Enfeeble and endurance thrown in the mix.

And as to the conga thing, I know it can be a pain and I can't tell you how many times I have wished they could ride drones too.

Seems like youre leaning towards the knight. If youre more comfortable with that, go with it. It's a solid list. Should be a little faster to play as well which I know I always need help with as daemons.

I appreciate the advice!

Which knight list? The one above or modified with 1 LoC greater reward instead of 2, an extra screamer and the errant?

Id keep the reward and paladin. Armorbane/Fleshbane can be clutch as well as +1W/IWND.

Sounds good man! Thanks!

I was running a double cad with knight for a while which had 17 charges. It with oracles and anarchic no need for 4 troops and gained 5 charges!

Ok so for those of you (asto_nomicon) who had helped me I just wanted to report my list results.

I ended up with the knight version of the list.

I took 3-2 at the GT and 11th overall. Not too bad!

Thanks for the help!

I lost to tau round 1... with chaos renegade allies!
I won round 2 verse white scars/skyhammer
I won round 3 against chaos renegades with 2 knights
I won round 4 against new CSM nurgle Decurion
I lost round 5 against chaos demons with skyhost

All in all a good event and decent showing!

Sounds great!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Tau and regenades wow .. so many guns

It was 5 riptide riptide wing, 8 pirahnas in the formation, and a crap load of mortars/earthshakers with ordinance tyrant... It was umm GROSS! lol

I actually could have won but got pretty unlucky when my knight with a 3++ died to rending (failed 7 of 13...) and then the LoC took a wound and failed his leadership which killed him.

Not a bad showing at all! That first list just sounds disgusting. What was the composition of that last Daemons list? I know Skyhost has become quietly popular for competitive daemons. I saw one list that won a GT in Atlanta I believe, that was a barebones Tally Band and two barebones Skyhosts for some insane MSU daemon corrupting


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also were there any instances in which you thought: "man I wish I had plague drones" or were you happy with the knight

No. He knight was a beast. Verse the 2 knight renegades he had 1 knight invis. I had no choice but to charge it (I was down to 3 hill points) and with the bonus attacks we traded knights. 6 hp invis enemy for mine. Worth it! Note worthy that his other knight died that turn to a combined d shot from kairos and the loc! 5 hp and I finished him with other powers.

He also had the oracles formation but 2 loc. 1 of the Sky host was a 6 man with a herald in it. He kept the 8 3 mans in deepstrike reserve and used oracles to reroll their reserves. I killed a loc before he could do it. Didn't lose till the last turn. Lost by 1 objective.

Here is what I have been running:

Prepping for Adepticon so only two sources

Daemon Cad
Fateweaver
Nurgle Herald ML 2 Bell Lesser Reward
Nurgle Herald ML2 Locus of FNP Lesser Reward
11 Blue Horrors
3 Nurglings
8 Screamers
6 Drones Rot Probiscus
Prince of Tzeentch ML 3 2 Greater, 1 Lesser Reward Robe

Heralds
Tzeentch ML 3 Disc Grim
Tzeentch ML 3 Disc Paradox
Tzeentch ML 1


Can't afford to take the drone champ unless I drop a drone
23 warp charges

I think you really need to champ forbthat extra greater and a greater eterblade. You need the ap2

I think he's right. I'd find the points to squeeze greaters for the Heralds too. So that's 45 points altogether that you need I believe? I'd drop either 2 ML from the grim Herald or 1 ML and a Screamer


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anecdotal evidence in support of greaters for Nurgle Heralds:

Sometimes there are really juicy targets for a bale sword and you just gotta hope you get Iron Arm. I was playing a game in a tournament against a pretty standard competitive Eldar list (Scat Bikes, Hornets, Double Inferno Lance Knight, Warp Spiders) so I took the Balesword on a Herald that rolled Iron Arm. Turn 2 I Enfeeble the knight, Cast Iron Arm and go for a charge. WK swings and punks one Drone. Herald does three ID wounds and I roll 2, 2, and 3 for my D3 wounds. Dead Knight. He still beat me but the look on his face was priceless.

Okay how about this

Daemon CAD
Fateweaver
Nurgle Herald ML 2 Bell Greater Reward
Nurgle Herald ML 2 Locus of FNP Greater Reward
11 Blue Horrors
3 Nurglings
8 Screamers
5 Drones Rot Probiscus Champ w/Greater Reward
Prince of Tzeentch ML 3 2 Greater, 1 Lesser Reward Robe

Heralds
Tzeentch ML 3 Disc Grim
Tzeentch ML 3 Disc Paradox
Tzeentch ML 1

1850 on the head

Damn good. Run that

swanson4969 wrote:
Okay how about this

Daemon CAD
Fateweaver
Nurgle Herald ML 2 Bell Greater Reward
Nurgle Herald ML 2 Locus of FNP Greater Reward
11 Blue Horrors
3 Nurglings
8 Screamers
5 Drones Rot Probiscus Champ w/Greater Reward
Prince of Tzeentch ML 3 2 Greater, 1 Lesser Reward Robe

Heralds
Tzeentch ML 3 Disc Grim
Tzeentch ML 3 Disc Paradox
Tzeentch ML 1

1850 on the head

Why not drop the DP for a LoC and run it & Fatey in the Oracles formation? I think that saves, like, 40pts and you get a much tougher FMC and loads of re-roll 1s.

-

I can only have two detachments plus I like the ability to roll on telepathy and biomancy with the prince. Fatey and the prince can both have shriek which combos nice with the bell

So I've been picking my brain tonight trying to come up with an alternate list using similar components to what was discussed in this thread and I came up with this:

DAEMONS CAD:

Fateweaver

Nurgle Herald: ML2, Greater, Grotti
Nurgle Herald: ML2, Exalted, Locus of FNP
Nurgle Herald: ML2, Greater

11x Blue Horrors
11x Blue Horrors
11x Blue Horrors

7x Plague Drones: Rot Proboscis, Plague Bringer w/ Greater

Daemon Knight Paladin of Khorne

HERALDS ANARCHIC:

Tzeentch Herald: ML2, Paradox
Tzeentch Herald
Tzeentch Herald


The big trade off here is Durability vs Damage Output with this list focussing on the latter. Don't get me wrong, it's still very hard to put a dent in, but it's not going to get any meaningful 2++ rerollables like something with a LoC and Screamer Star. HOWEVER, in this list you get two really scary units that are also more than passably tough. This is all theoryhammer, I imagine it goes something like this: if there are enough credible threats to the knight, Grimoire goes towards it. If there are enough ignores cover threats Grimoire goes to the drones. If there are enough of both then choose Grimoire wisely and hope you rolled Endurance (very good chance with 6 rolls from the Heralds and 1 from Fateweaver). Behind that, you've got 3 batteries (1 Herald per Blue Horror unit) generating a unit a turn at minimum with 23 WC to work with.

It combines the psychic potency, and most of the durability of all the previous lists while improving lethality. Downside is that it rolls all of that into two big units rather than three and it doesn't get the formation benefit of the Oracles.

Interesting I have a knight paladin of Tzeentch painted up that I am dying to use. My only question is do you have enough brimstone Horrors ready to go for the blues?

 astro_nomicon wrote:
So I've been picking my brain tonight trying to come up with an alternate list using similar components to what was discussed in this thread and I came up with this:

Spoiler:

DAEMONS CAD:

Fateweaver

Nurgle Herald: ML2, Greater, Grotti
Nurgle Herald: ML2, Exalted, Locus of FNP
Nurgle Herald: ML2, Greater

11x Blue Horrors
11x Blue Horrors
11x Blue Horrors

7x Plague Drones: Rot Proboscis, Plague Bringer w/ Greater

Daemon Knight Paladin of Khorne

HERALDS ANARCHIC:

Tzeentch Herald: ML2, Paradox
Tzeentch Herald
Tzeentch Herald

I like it, but I am not sure the 3rd Nurgle Herald is needed. You could drop him entirely and bump up the ML on the Tz Heralds
At the very least, you should trade a ML from a Nurgle Herald so that the Paradox Herald is ML3

-

 Galef wrote:

 astro_nomicon wrote:
So I've been picking my brain tonight trying to come up with an alternate list using similar components to what was discussed in this thread and I came up with this:

Spoiler:

DAEMONS CAD:

Fateweaver

Nurgle Herald: ML2, Greater, Grotti
Nurgle Herald: ML2, Exalted, Locus of FNP
Nurgle Herald: ML2, Greater

11x Blue Horrors
11x Blue Horrors
11x Blue Horrors

7x Plague Drones: Rot Proboscis, Plague Bringer w/ Greater

Daemon Knight Paladin of Khorne

HERALDS ANARCHIC:

Tzeentch Herald: ML2, Paradox
Tzeentch Herald
Tzeentch Herald

I like it, but I am not sure the 3rd Nurgle Herald is needed. You could drop him entirely and bump up the ML on the Tz Heralds
At the very least, you should trade a ML from a Nurgle Herald so that the Paradox Herald is ML3

-

Third Nurgle Herald is there so that I can keep the Grimoire nestled safely within the star rather than in a squishy unit of Horrors while retaining enough AP2 attacks to be a credible threat. I always want ML3 on the Paradox Herald as well but I also wanted as many rolls on Biomancy as possible to have the best chance at Endurance.

If I wanted to be risky though, I might give the grim to one of the Tzeralds and find 10 points for a greater on the last Nurgle Herald. That actually sounds appealing