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Are there any SM chapters you look across at the board at and think "ah shizzle." XD

White Scares. Everything gets Hit&Tun and Khan makes the entire army scout

Ultra Marines have a very versatile ability with the combat doctrines that allow certain units getting rerolls.

Raven guard with Jump pack unit buffs and shrouded turn 1 generally stops the alpha strike to an extent.

Salamanders getting FnP against all Flamers attacks and all characters get Mastercrafted weapon.

Iron Hands with FnP everywhere and IWND on vehicles.

Imperial fists with bolter drill rerollin 1s to hit for all bolter weapons.

All can have their good effect as a force multiplier.

I personally like white scars and Raven guard

 rawne2510 wrote:
Ultra Marines have a very versatile ability with the combat doctrines that allow certain units getting rerolls.

Raven guard with Jump pack unit buffs and shrouded turn 1 generally stops the alpha strike to an extent.

Salamanders getting FnP against all Flamers attacks and all characters get Mastercrafted weapon.

Iron Hands with FnP everywhere and IWND on vehicles.

Imperial fists with bolter drill rerollin 1s to hit for all bolter weapons.

All can have their good effect as a force multiplier.

I personally like white scars and Raven guard

*Looks at Blood Angels chapter tactics* *sniffles*

BA don´t have any chapter tactics. This is why they don´t lose anything when joining other space marine units

 rawne2510 wrote:
BA don´t have any chapter tactics. This is why they don´t lose anything when joining other space marine units

We get furious charge, vanilla have a special way of implementing chapter tactics since they're trying to be like 8 chapters s at once.

Imperial Fists

White Scars are leagues better than all the other vanilla Chapters. The only ones coming closest I'd say are Iron Hands and mayyyyyybe Ultramarines.

This is coming from a Salamanders player

Tank hunter allows to save on antitank and bolter drill allows your tacticals to be worth a damn. Dealing about 2.32 wounds to 1.95 wounds of regular tacticals against someone with a marine stat line and about 0.8 wounds to a plague marine.
And having a 50% more chance of glancing most vehicles this economy allows to buy more anti deathstar stuff. I guess.

sushi2001 wrote:
Tank hunter allows to save on antitank and bolter drill allows your tacticals to be worth a damn. Dealing about 2.32 wounds to 1.95 wounds of regular tacticals against someone with a marine stat line and about 0.8 wounds to a plague marine.
And having a 50% more chance of glancing most vehicles this economy allows to buy more anti deathstar stuff. I guess.

Bolter Drill is also great for Sternguard as they can take advantage of those AP3 bolter rounds with a lot less risk of killing themselves from gets hot while also having an increased rate of hitting.

 kirotheavenger wrote:

 rawne2510 wrote:
BA don´t have any chapter tactics. This is why they don´t lose anything when joining other space marine units

We get furious charge, vanilla have a special way of implementing chapter tactics since they're trying to be like 8 chapters s at once.

Yes but in no game situation are they considered Chapter tacitcs. So they don´t get lost when joining a unit of WS who lose all their buffs. the same goes for DA and SW.

I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

White Scars will probably be the scariest as they really have the ability to blitz their opponent and if they don't want to go with that option I think some how they can outflank.

Gorgon Chain(IH) and the Hunters Eye(WS) are two of the top relics. I play my Marines as Salamanders when I don't want to be OTT.

I run a Fists successor, everyone brings up the re-rolling but end up forgetting the rest.

Reroll 1s for bolt weapons - is better now that it applies to sternguard ammo too. Somewhat dulled by the fact that a lot of the more fun bolter platforms are already twin-linked anyway. Its biggest benefit is making troops (specifically, tacticals) feel like less of a tax. If you have a lot of tactical marines (whether they're in tac or dev squads) the Fists tactics are great for them and aren't limited to a turn.

Everybody forgets though that in addition to giving tank hunters to the devastators, your entire army gets the same benefit against buildings, which will serve well in your one and only battle where someone brings a building.

I like Ultramarines. When you absolutely must land some hits, the doctrines do work. "If i don't kill X this turn i'm going to lose. DOCTRINES!" But if I had it to do over again i'd play white scars. I would lose Tigurius, which is a huge loss if you're rolling for cheesy powers, but what you gain passively across your entire army is nice.

sushi2001 wrote:
Tank hunter allows to save on antitank and bolter drill allows your tacticals to be worth a damn.

Bolter Drill is nice, and Tank Hunter would be too if Grav Cannons hadn't made actual antitank weapons obsolete.

 digital-animal wrote:
I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

Maybe I'm not overly familiar with IH, but outside of your deathstar chapter master since when is a 6+ FNP better than a 4+ RP?

 kingbobbito wrote:

 digital-animal wrote:
I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

Maybe I'm not overly familiar with IH, but outside of your deathstar chapter master since when is a 6+ FNP better than a 4+ RP?

All of our characters and vehicles gain It Will Not Die. The 6+ FNP is easily buffed to a 5++ or even a 4++ in some places. Imo, Necrons are still better at tanking hits but IH can definitely compete

 kingbobbito wrote:

 digital-animal wrote:
I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

Maybe I'm not overly familiar with IH, but outside of your deathstar chapter master since when is a 6+ FNP better than a 4+ RP?

With their detachment everyone gets an additional +1 to FnP and if you are within 12" of a character another +1

White Scars #1
Iron Hands / Ultramarines / Red Scorpions for #2
Everyone else in varying levels of #3.

In descending order.

1. White Scars
2. Ultramarine
3. Imperial Fists
4. Iron Hands
5. Salamanders
6. Ravenguard



The only caveat is if you run that silly Iron Hands deathstar/detatchment from Angels of Death, then they are more or less are tied for 1st by a new York mile ahead of the others.

Dantes_Baals wrote:
In descending order.

1. White Scars
2. Ultramarine
3. Imperial Fists
4. Iron Hands
5. Salamanders
6. Ravenguard



The only caveat is if you run that silly Iron Hands deathstar/detatchment from Angels of Death, then they are more or less are tied for 1st by a new York mile ahead of the others.

Black Templar are so bad they didn't even make the list

 kingbobbito wrote:

 digital-animal wrote:
I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

Maybe I'm not overly familiar with IH, but outside of your deathstar chapter master since when is a 6+ FNP better than a 4+ RP?

That's a good point, my thinking was that 3+ armor with a 5+ FNP from the Fist of Medusa Strike Force (+1 fnp when near an independent character, utilizing captains, chaplains and librarians to provide this buff) on most of your models I feel is quite durable and army wide IWND makes our characters hard to eliminate unless focused down on. Even without the command squad I feel they very durable. Perhaps saying more durable than Necrons may have been a bit much.

White Scars battle Companies.

Reanimation Protocols is a base of 5+ though right? 4+ is just the max.

 Marmatag wrote:
Reanimation Protocols is a base of 5+ though right? 4+ is just the max.

Yes.

White scars aren't as useful as allies if you already have Hit and Run and the Scout is actually a benefit from the Khan being Warlord rather than part of their tactics (so no good if they're only allies).

 Marmatag wrote:
Reanimation Protocols is a base of 5+ though right? 4+ is just the max.

I just assume any competitive necron list is running decurion, I'm not overly familiar with the tournament scene but that's the only way I've seen them run.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 rawne2510 wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:

 digital-animal wrote:
I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

Maybe I'm not overly familiar with IH, but outside of your deathstar chapter master since when is a 6+ FNP better than a 4+ RP?

With their detachment everyone gets an additional +1 to FnP and if you are within 12" of a character another +1

What's the extra +1 from? I thought it was just +1 near characters.

 kingbobbito wrote:

 Marmatag wrote:
Reanimation Protocols is a base of 5+ though right? 4+ is just the max.

I just assume any competitive necron list is running decurion, I'm not overly familiar with the tournament scene but that's the only way I've seen them run.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 rawne2510 wrote:

 kingbobbito wrote:

 digital-animal wrote:
I'm a little biased but Iron Hands durability makes them (I feel) more survivable than Necrons and more flexible.

Maybe I'm not overly familiar with IH, but outside of your deathstar chapter master since when is a 6+ FNP better than a 4+ RP?

With their detachment everyone gets an additional +1 to FnP and if you are within 12" of a character another +1

What's the extra +1 from? I thought it was just +1 near characters.

I think it's called Clan Raukaan, haven't picked it up yet beacause everyone says it slaughters the Iron Hands fluff.

The only thing thing they bitch about out if it really is Stronos and no Terminator Sergeants.

I think they changed how the clan companies worked a bit, too.k but the less companies/more Marines per company was always more of a salamander thing, even in the old Eye of Terror codex.

Imperial Fists Tactics are fun, but they aren't the most competitve. Vehicles are no-shows in most cases. Bolter Drill is only worth it with Sternguard (I run two full squads in Drop pods that combat squad for maximum effectiveness).

To be honest, they aren't even in the same magnitude as Iron Hands or White Scars. I wish they would replace Bolter Drill with Rapid Fire Drill and have it work on all Rapid Fire weapons instead of all Bolt weapons. We would lose out on Bolt Pistols and Heavy Bolters, but gain Plasmaguns.