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Think that there will be options for resin/metal versions too?

 Elbows wrote:

 Swabby wrote:
You know, beyond the total instability of the project creator and their unsavory business connections, and the complete mess of all connected prior crowdfunding I am having a hard time even wanting to back this because the miniatures really just do not look good.

I genuinely thought they would be putting a better product forward, but these look really good for 10-15 years ago, not the market today.

Remember, as I understand it, these are single-piece (or maybe two piece) board game minis. Sadly they won't be proper wargame miniatures etc.

Hearing that it almost makes me hope it's manufactured by Prodos

Man, this is all reminding me that somewhere in my parents' attic is a box of metal Rifts miniatures dating back to the 90s. Some of them even painted!

Whatta ya know, they still sell 'em: http://palladium-store.com/1001/category/Miniatures.html

Might be a safer bet if you're really dying for a Glitter Boy miniature. Although I admit: at the very least, I'll be keeping an eye on this Kickstarter.

Those Dead Boy minis don't seem bulky enough to me. They're scaled like humans with armored skin rather than guys in protective armor.

ubik2000 wrote:
Man, this is all reminding me that somewhere in my parents' attic is a box of metal Rifts miniatures dating back to the 90s. Some of them even painted!

Whatta ya know, they still sell 'em: http://palladium-store.com/1001/category/Miniatures.html

Might be a safer bet if you're really dying for a Glitter Boy miniature. Although I admit: at the very least, I'll be keeping an eye on this Kickstarter.

Those were terrible, I barely remember them.

 Albertorius wrote:
Hm, those Deadboys are... well, the prototypes exists and are mostly correct, that's something. Other than that I must say that they are kind of underwhelming. I think I'd be better of getting some more Eisenkern stormtroopers, maybe with a head swap.

I do like the grackle and the cyborg, though.

Yeah, they struck me as odd too but when I took a closer look they seemed accurate to the art. I suspect they just didn't age well combined with translate well to the different medium of miniatures. I still prefer the original Dead Boy look to the current style they introduced during the Coalition Wars series. The same goes for iirc some SAMAS art they previewed. So far for me, the glitter boy and red borg are my favorites.

At the time they were all I ever wanted, but yeah, in hindsight, not great. Did they really think there was a burning need for not one, but TWO packs of "Damaged Skelebots"?

Pretty sure I had them both.

want to put in some words or have questions before the project goes live? then go to his fishing for compliments or comments, but mostly compliments since anything negative will be deleted:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rogueheroes/1874668638?token=d9276b98

I was never into Rifts, and tbh I'm one of those who got burned on RTT, but what's the appeal here? These look like any generic mid-90s sci-fi minis.

I mean I guess being KS it's only for those who are fans but as an outsider there's no real draw.

 ScarletRose wrote:
I was never into Rifts, and tbh I'm one of those who got burned on RTT, but what's the appeal here? These look like any generic mid-90s sci-fi minis.

I mean I guess being KS it's only for those who are fans but as an outsider there's no real draw.

also you forgot too mention there is also a 2 year wait for the game to be delivered.

A boardgame in the RIFTS world is the appeal.

The apparent negative would be PB's apparent deep interest and involvement here.

Add that to their track record on Robotech RPG Tactics, and...

Like most of the 90's Palladium stuff, Rifts launched with the fantastic artwork of Kevin Long (later accused of stealing money from Palladium or some such? - the accuracy of such now called into question since we're talking about Kevin Siembeda...a thief himself)

This kind of stuff struck a cord w/ teenagers like myself. Still love some of the Rifts stuff (the universe was crap, and the game was worse)













Kevin Long's art (often derivative, but what isn't?) was really damn cool looking and made for some damn cool looking units.

 Alpharius wrote:
A boardgame in the RIFTS world is the appeal.

The apparent negative would be PB's apparent deep interest and involvement here.

Add that to their track record on Robotech RPG Tactics, and...

on a side note me thinks Carmen plans to truck in product and ship it from say like Palladium, problem is they have been getting stricter on the border about things like that and he will have to pay sales taxes and such on the product, since just recently an artist from Canada got stopped and was refused entry over her comic books and art work she had in her car.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/canadian-comic-artist-refused-entry-us-comic-book-convention-996465

The prototype page, if it remains as is, fills me with underwhelming.

First off, content numbers (which isn't definitive, but is what it is) is pretty low vs other games.

Funding goal is reasonable ($100K), but stretch goals are being started out high (+50K gets an upgraded rulebook, woo.).

Initial box doesn't have several of the models that have been used for promotional purposes. Sure, I can understand wanting stretch goal materials, but neither the Glitterboy or the Lizardman thing are on the initial release. Other than the Borg (?) thingy, those are the three big things to be on the board. And with what looks to be a 50K SG, it needs to fund big to get those in the mix.

Pricing is pretty off too. If you miss out on the EB's, the big pledge saves you all of $2.

As Alpharius mentioned on a different thread, the addons being craploads of PB stock doesn't help with the whole separation argument. Shipping also indicates that they'll likely be shipping from within the US ($12-$15), possibly at a cheaper rate than they will from Canada ($10-$20). So there's that.

Having a completion date of 25 months is probably a good thing, but it does indicate that the game isn't that close to completion. There's only so much contingency time you need if it's properly managed.

There's just too many questions and sketchiness involved here. I think it will fund, but as Asterios mentions, barely funding is probably going to be significantly worse for Carmen (and the backers) than not funding at all. Depending on the stretch goals value and cost, unless he skimps on quality significantly, I think he's needing ~300K to break even, without cost overruns. And that's not taking into account the money he's declared as already sunk into the project so far.

I didn't know Kevin Long was involved in a "Crisis Of Treachery (X)" with Palladium!

I also love the art and the idea behind RIFTS - the ultimate mashup RPG.

Not sure if I'll pick this game up, but maybe the Savage Worlds version of RIFTS is worth a look instead?

And curiously enough, that's available here as an add on too...

It looks like less than an hour out, he's still futzing. When I first looked the Early Birds were $90 and $130 respectively. Now they're at $80 and $120 respectively (though the graphics still list the old price for the former.

He's mentioned only having 100 EB's available.

This has such potential for a train wreck.

A win for everyone, Carmen gets to quit his day job and live off the gRifts money for two years, Kevin gets to empty his warehouse of moldy books he can't sell and when people grumble in 2020 about getting nothing Kevvy and shoot the books out to grumbling backers. "Here, you heathens, have my old crap books to placate you while Carmen continues to learn the fine art of sculpting miniatures with chewing gum!"
Palladium suckered me once with the "Ninja Divsion Bait n' Switch" but never gain.

also this little addendum they said might hurt them funding a lot:

"By pledging to this Kickstarter project, you acknowledge and agree that the final look, materials and content of the rewards (and the project) are subject to change, and may differ substantially from what is presented while the Kickstarter project was active. We do not anticipate this to be the case, but we reserve that right."

can see it now, instead of plastic minis you get cardboard cut outs

also i'm curious how he can ship to Australia so cheap ? it cost me more then that to ship a book at times.

That's pretty much a standard disclaimer for miniature and boardgame stuff on KS these days.

And just smart to know going in in terms of anything shown as a render or 'resin master'.

 Alpharius wrote:
That's pretty much a standard disclaimer for miniature and boardgame stuff on KS these days.

And just smart to know going in in terms of anything shown as a render or 'resin master'.

yeah but when it leaves it open to they can send you cardboard cutouts and PDF rules and paper maps is just leaving Carmen open to a massive you know what storm.

And a familiar face has shown up in the pre-commentary.

"Wayne Smith Collaborator 4 minutes ago"

Umm... having a PB flunky participate is bad enough.

That he's got THAT tagline, is just icing on the cake of ludicrous.

also doesn't Carmen live in Canada? isn't his company in Canada? and yet it states it is in Michigan on the kickstarter, that is considered fraud and attempting to defraud me thinks.

Project is live:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rogueheroes/rifts-board-game/comments

 Elbows wrote:
Like most of the 90's Palladium stuff, Rifts launched with the fantastic artwork of Kevin Long (later accused of stealing money from Palladium or some such? - the accuracy of such now called into question since we're talking about Kevin Siembeda...a thief himself)

The first Crisis of Treachery had nothing to do with Kevin Long. I didn't hear the full story but he left long (no pun intended) before it and even worked for a short time in another indy RPG game (I chatted with him in the late 1990's about it at gencon) before moving onto apparently the videogame industry as a creative director. The next time I saw his name was in an interview for the art style on the xbox 360 wolfenstein game that he worked on.


On the prelim site, it looks like the address of the totally different pinky swear nothing to do with Palladium Canadian company is NOT in Canada but instead Livonia, MI only 13 miles away from palladium's town of Westland.. Anyone else suspect a palladium employee might live in Livonia and Carmen is using the address? I doubt they're renting an office there under the company name. From a quick google search of Palladium/Siembieda/Livonia, one of those paid info sites lists an old address of Kev's somewhere in Livonia as well in their free preview.

Asterios wrote:
also doesn't Carmen live in Canada? isn't his company in Canada? and yet it states it is in Michigan on the kickstarter, that is considered fraud and attempting to defraud me thinks.

Project is live:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rogueheroes/rifts-board-game/comments

Yeah, the suburb north of Westland (home of PB).

Also, I note he's still not corrected the EB price in the graphic, to match the pledge level.

Where can I read up on Kevin Long and this art/ money swiping business?

I loved Long's artwork back in the day, especially the main book's artwork. Very evocative. Ley Line Walker and SAMAS armor being two big standouts to my adolescent brain.

$33 suggested retail for 5 board game plastic dudes?!

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Where can I read up on Kevin Long and this art/ money swiping business?

I loved Long's artwork back in the day, especially the main book's artwork. Very evocative. Ley Line Walker and SAMAS armor being two big standouts to my adolescent brain.

You can't because Kevin Long had nothing to do with art/money swiping or the crisis to my knowledge. The crisis was some business/warehouse manager and NOT Kevin Long. The feeling that I got from chatting with him was that the Kevin's just had a falling out (although he was too professional to throw Kevin Siembieda under a bus when asked about what happened). I loved his art too and it was a big reason I was convinced to get into Rifts (specifically through Robotech as my first character was a VF-1 pilot in a rifts campaign).

and I have fired the first shot.

also on a side note I also reported said company to Kickstarter for something I noticed.

Wayne and Kevin on the team, but this is a totally separate company, I tell you!

 n815e wrote:
Wayne and Kevin on the team, but this is a totally separate company, I tell you!

Yeah, I know the word "collaborator" has a benign meaning, but there's a specific usage that comes to mind.

I saw Wayne post in the pre-commentary, but I wonder if either of those two are stupid enough to jump into the commentary with the backers.

Given that the last public comment from PB was two years ago, tomorrow (May 9th, 2015).

Also noted that all of the Deluxe EB's have sold, and 25 of the Standards have sold. Wonder what people who actually work for a living will think, with all EB's likely to be gone by end of business today.

There's also at least 20 backers who are pissing away $18 by backing Deluxe full price. The difference between Deluxe and Standard is $50. Getting it through Add-Ons is $52. So an FP Deluxe is $150. So an EB Standard + Add-Ons is $132. For the exact same content.