Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Trying for almost mono-Tzeentch Demons/CSM...



10 units can throw down Smite.

Helturkey x2 + Maggie aggressively moves forward for 1st turn assaults.

Tzherald supports the TzDP/Helturkeys for +1 STR (do they stack???) smiting and treason!

Thoughts?

ooof that nurgle DP.. whaa?

Nice. Make sure those Heldrakes are Tsons to benefit from Magnus.

And yes the Heralds & DPs will benefit the Heldrakes and Magnus, as will the Changeling.

Just keep in mind for the Heralds that they add +1S to the models characteristic, so weapons with set S will not be affected (so no S7 Baleflamer)

-

 Galef wrote:
Nice. Make sure those Heldrakes are Tsons to benefit from Magnus.

And yes the Heralds & DPs will benefit the Heldrakes and Magnus, as will the Changeling.

Just keep in mind for the Heralds that they add +1S to the models characteristic, so weapons with set S will not be affected (so no S7 Baleflamer)

-

Yup... Helturkeys Tsons too... that's what made me think of bringing an escort of 2 'turkeys with Maggie. I think'll it'll work nicely.

Also, with all those meat up front, I *think* I'd be okay moving the Heralds behind them as they'll likely not be targetable in the initial rounds.

not sure where you want hide your Dp's, if you are using demons DP's i m afraid to say you ll be shoot down easily, maybe with 3 units assaulting 1st turn you might have a chance i m not sure about it. Then i really dont understand why use a N Dp it cant take any advantage by changeling or heralds... Remember move princes/heralds behind MAgnus/drakes wont make them not targetable, termies or IG/GK have tons of nasty "deep striking" units can wreak havocs on your Princes/heralds

 blackmage wrote:
not sure where you want hide your Dp's, if you are using demons DP's i m afraid to say you ll be shoot down easily, maybe with 3 units assaulting 1st turn you might have a chance i m not sure about it. Then i really dont understand why use a N Dp it cant take any advantage by changeling or heralds...

Demon DPs aren't for hiding... For Tzeentch DP, I think I like the buff to inv save and the extra wounds. I'm not sure an army full of CSM DP is any better, since that REALLY forces your opponent to focus fire on the closest one. On the flip side, an all CSM DP can force your opponent to spread out the shooting as the nearest one is only targetable, but that forces YOU to strategically spread out... and I'm not sure I like this tactic yet. So, I'm going all Demon DP for now to see how playtesting goes.

Nurgle DP is: a) it's a nice nurgly painted model and b) I need a DP model and don't want to proxy and c) His name is Leroy, so it's his job to f'up my list. Besides, this guy's job is to play the nusiance role with the Heldrake and Maggie...

obviously you have no idea how much firepower some lists can shoot out (tau, IG; some marines lists for example), only thing i can say is try against a competent player/competitive list, 2 extra wounds and a 4++ save arent better than be not targettable. Btw i like your list

 blackmage wrote:
obviously you have no idea how much firepower some lists can shoot out (tau, IG; some marines lists for example), only thing i can say is try against a competent player/competitive list,

I play against competitive lists all the time... (it's practically all I play ).

2 extra wounds and a 4++ save arent better than be not targettable.

'Tis why I'm play testing this...

Btw i like your list

Wait till you see my Dinobots™ lists!

may i ask which lists you played against?
I play too a flying circus but it's pretty different than your so im interested in feedbacks, ty.

 blackmage wrote:
may i ask which lists you played against?
I play too a flying circus but it's pretty different than your so im interested in feedbacks, ty.

Haven't played this list yet... but, I played something similar that was all over the place (all 4 gods DP, hodgepodge of units).

This list seems more streamlined and at least attempts to take advantage of Maggie's buffs and the herald.

I won against Riptide/Stormsurge list... those guys don't scare me anymore. I'm more afraid of massed battlesuits (lots of missiles and railguns).

I also won against AM with IK list. The Changeling is gold here... worth way more that 100pts. DP tore through the AM tanks and rest of his list.

I did play against an ork horde list, which I lost with my unoptimized DP list. Hoping dual Heldrake can be more effective against horde lists. If not, I may drop 'em to spam out flammers (I have 9).

So, the things I'm looking for is how effective all-Deamon DP is compared to all-CSM DP. Next, how useful Heldrake are (especially 1st assaults) or if I need to add higher damaging output (ie, flammers).

The potential I see for Deamon / CSM list is that they have tools to at least be competitive when playing the missions. I think it's just a matter of learning the other races' tactic and learn to counter it.

Since I'm still learning the new rules and figuring out the meta... I like to throw in a "Leroy Jenkins" unit just to playtest... I may swap out the Nurgle DP for a Thirster in the future.

yes but then you played CSM DP's or was demons DP'S? that for me is the key. Just another point.... Magnus ability to re roll 1 for inv saes, wont work on demons DP's they are not thousand sons

what i played was

Magnus

battalion
2x CSM (thousand sons) DP's wings double talon
herald on disk with staff
3x15 horrors (14 brim 1 blue)
7 flamers

battalion
2 CSM DP's as above
changeling
3x15 horrors as above
4 exalted flamers.
I could switch CSM princes for demons DP's just i feel be not targettable is a nice option, but again maybe demons DP's might help Magnus survive giving more targets to the enemy.Then i dont know but only 4 attacks at 3+ with just ap -1 aren't so scary.

I do not think Chaos Daemons, Such as A herald of TZ, will benefit Magnus, Magnus does not have Both Tzeentch and Daemon in his Faction Keywords. All Daemons in the Daemon entries have Tzeentch Daemon in their Faction Key words.
The Daemon in the Chaos Space Marine Entries, as well as Magnus, have Daemon in their normal Key Words.

Could be wrong.

Tsilber wrote:
I do not think Chaos Daemons, Such as A herald of TZ, will benefit Magnus, Magnus does not have Both Tzeentch and Daemon in his Faction Keywords. All Daemons in the Daemon entries have Tzeentch Daemon in their Faction Key words.
The Daemon in the Chaos Space Marine Entries, as well as Magnus, have Daemon in their normal Key Words.

Could be wrong.

When a rule calls out keywords, they do not require them to be faction keywords. So if an ability needs a unit to have keyword: <Daemon>, it does not matter if that keyword is a faction keyword or not. It only matters that the unit has the keyword. So yes, Magnus being a <Tzeentch Daemon> will benefit from a nearby Herald of Tz.

-

 Galef wrote:

Tsilber wrote:
I do not think Chaos Daemons, Such as A herald of TZ, will benefit Magnus, Magnus does not have Both Tzeentch and Daemon in his Faction Keywords. All Daemons in the Daemon entries have Tzeentch Daemon in their Faction Key words.
The Daemon in the Chaos Space Marine Entries, as well as Magnus, have Daemon in their normal Key Words.

Could be wrong.

When a rule calls out keywords, they do not require them to be faction keywords. So if an ability needs a unit to have keyword: <Daemon>, it does not matter if that keyword is a faction keyword or not. It only matters that the unit has the keyword. So yes, Magnus being a <Tzeentch Daemon> will benefit from a nearby Herald of Tz.

-

Makes sense to me! ( This means Magnus can be affected by a boon spell also?) Nice..

Does a CSM DP of tzeentch gains ephermal form?

casdark wrote:
Does a CSM DP of tzeentch gains ephermal form?

No, but being able to hide behind non-characters is a much better defense than a 4++ =/