New to 40k: Is Dark Vengeance worth it to start a Chaos army?

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**sdp80**

Hi all, I'm new to 40k - never played it and have no models. With 8th edition the local club has some interest in playing and I would like to get involved. I've decided to go with a Chaos army (predominatly space marines with perhaps some of the other chaos models eventually) and just wondering what the best way to start playing is in terms of initial outlay of cost.

I came across the dark vengeance box and although it is old now the Chaos models still look pretty cool, and price seems reasonable I also though I could convert the dark angels bikes into Chaos marine bikes? My question goes out to people much more knowledgeable than me, with all this in mind would the box set be worth getting? Are there any other alternatives to it such as the start collecting set but you don't get as many models?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

**CynosureEldar**

Yes it is. Very much so.

You can convert all of the models to chaos equivalents, except two, and those two can be converted into other chaos models. Definitely get some sharps and low grit sandpaper tho, as the SM models have pesky Dark angel stuff all over them. Don't get used to the snap fit models either, a normal box is much more pose able.

First things first - pick up the Chaos index in your local store, and, if you can get it for like $5, the 7th CSM rulebook. The Index because it has all your rules and units, and [[[[[if you can get it cheap, do NOT buy for more then like $7]]]]] the 7th codex for painting purposes. The index does not have the background of your army, or the color schemes, or what the models even look like. The Codex does. Ignore the rules in the codex, they are outdated as of a month ago.

Note: even tho the templates, and the scatter die in the box are no longer used, hold onto them. Gameworkshop may change the game to use them again, or if you decide to pick up shadow war Armageddon, you will need them. You can probs try to sell the mini rulebook on ebay, (its also outdated and trust me, 7th sucks) but don't expect much $ back for it.

**sdp80**

Thanks for your quick reply - will pick it up then. After the box set what models do you suggest you add to it to expand the army?

**SpaceOstrich**

I did exactly this about a year ago, so from experience, yes, but be prepared for what you're getting into.

Firstly, if you have any interest in doing an army of/including Fallen, this is basically a perfect set, but I know that may not appeal to you (it didn't for me). As you're new, a good search on a wiki of you're choice might be in order to explore that avenue.

Your second option is to do what I did, taking the chaos minis as they are and converting some/all of the dark angels. I can tell you that you will probably get a fair amount of mileage out of most of the chaos stuff, particularly the Lord, and with the exception of the cultists (for me at any rate) they're a joy to paint. I converted the bikes, and while it's challenging for a beginner it is certainly manageable. I actually ended up painting the rest of the box as dark angels because I like them too, but a lot of them might be easier/harder to do.

As for where to go from there, I suppose it depends what subset of chaos you are interested in!

I hope this helps. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask, though I may not have a clue depending on which direction you're going in.

**mrhappyface**

CynosureEldar wrote:
You can convert all of the models to chaos equivalents, except two, and those two can be converted into other chaos models..

Out of curiosity, which two models do you speak of?

**SpaceOstrich**

mrhappyface wrote:
CynosureEldar wrote:
You can convert all of the models to chaos equivalents, except two, and those two can be converted into other chaos models..

Out of curiosity, which two models do you speak of?

I'd imagine he means the two special characters, though the librarian would look great as a sorcerer as far as I can see...

**mrhappyface**

SpaceOstrich wrote:
mrhappyface wrote:
CynosureEldar wrote:
You can convert all of the models to chaos equivalents, except two, and those two can be converted into other chaos models..

Out of curiosity, which two models do you speak of?

I'd imagine he means the two special characters, though the librarian would look great as a sorcerer as far as I can see...

The sorceror I've seen converted many times but I can see why the chapter master would be a pain to convert. Though not impossible, hmmm... Now I'm getting the urge to give the chapter master a go at converting him (I've already accidently broken his 'ears' so what the hey).

**cinnabar**

mrhappyface wrote:
CynosureEldar wrote:
You can convert all of the models to chaos equivalents, except two, and those two can be converted into other chaos models..

Out of curiosity, which two models do you speak of?

One of them is probably the tac marine with the plasma cannon as chaos doesn't have access to those.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Unless you want to play Nurgle, the DV box is a great way to get into chaos, especially because the helbrute and chosen with CCWs are much better in 8th than they were in 7th. As others have mentioned, you can convert the DA models. Now that Fallen are included in CSM index, you're even better off.

**Hatachi**

The cultists, chaos lord, and chosen models are some of the coolest looking chaos undivided models that GW has ever put out. The loadouts on the chosen are a bit wonky, but if you buy some bits you can convert them over to a loadout you like better. Or heck, if you aren't worried about competitiveness, the base loadout looks cool.

**dosiere**

On a positive note, I think the wonky loadouts work a bit better in 8th edition. They are some really cool models.

**Voss**

Honestly I'd recommend against it, at least until the codex comes out.

The cultists are bizarrely limited, the helbrute has one of the worst weapon setups possible, and the chosen aren't really what you'd build for anything.

If, after the codex comes out and you fins that the armies you're writing up will benefit from the contents, then fine. But as is.... it isn't actually that useful a box once you start thinking load outs rather than bodies.

**CynosureEldar**

SpaceOstrich wrote:
mrhappyface wrote:
CynosureEldar wrote:
You can convert all of the models to chaos equivalents, except two, and those two can be converted into other chaos models..

Out of curiosity, which two models do you speak of?

I'd imagine he means the two special characters, though the librarian would look great as a sorcerer as far as I can see...

Yes.

dosiere wrote:On a positive note, I think the wonky loadouts work a bit better in 8th edition. They are some really cool models.

The loadouts are... interesting. The nice part about 40k, is that as your collection expands, you can replace the weird stuff. My friend got a DV box ages ago, (he didn't convert the DA models) and now has 6k+ of Chaos. He still uses everything but the two 'leaders' of the cultists, and they still see play sometimes.

Now, when I bought it, I converted my happy little butt off. Cleaning off the shoulderpads probably sucks the most, but its so satisfying to have a small army that you made. Get the actual chaos models going, if only so you can start playing low power games.

All in all, have fun. You want more spiky bits? break out the green stuff. Skulls? Man, you can get baggies of those. Horns? Go nuts. Make those models your models. Don't worry too much about getting it right the first time either. If, in a year, you don't like the paintjob, just find your self some paint remover and/or a rattle can. I've redone some of my Eldar models 4 times now.

**455_PWR**

Yes!

Dark angels squad can be used as cyphers fallen. Terminators and bikes can be easily converted. Then you get a chaos chosen squad, an optimal load out hellbrute, cultists, characters, etc.

Hell of a deal if you use everything.

**CynosureEldar**

sdp80 wrote:
After the box set what models do you suggest you add to it to expand the army?

You have to kinda feel out what models you want. If you need some direction, try to keep your army in one of the detachments. Probably Battalion detachment, to start. You will have the three troops (converted SM, and cultists), and the two HQs (Choas lord and Asipring champ), so go nuts filling out the rest.